Next permanent manager | Poll updated

[Telsim]

Poch had a good team, something his fans love to underplay, and he overachieved with them to some extent, that is also true... Achievement, yes, but hardly what I call impressive at the time. Until buying players was left to him at one point and he fell apart completely. I feel like there's a collective lapse in memory around here pertaining to his last couple of months. Spurs were a bottom-half table team when he was sacked. We are looking into getting a manager that was sacked by Spurs. And was then out of a job for a year. Christ, this is were we are at, aren't we?

 

[andersj]

The squad Poch inherited finished 4th 5th 6th 5th 5th. It was a Top 6 team not some relegation fodder that Poch had to transform into a top team.

He is a good coach, but just not good enough for a top team in my book. His time at PSG kind of proves that. If you think that coming to United who is also a circus at the moment and yet the outcome will be different then I have some bad news for you.

Chelsea with less net spend have 2 PL titles and a couple of cups. What has Poch have to show for his time at Spurs? A top 4 cup? And please don't give me the "Spurs is a small club" when he had the squad he did. The odd FA/League Cup should have been a bare minimum in addition to the Top4.

Great point, wonder how that happend?!

 

[thegregster]

The squad Poch inherited finished 4th 5th 6th 5th 5th. It was a Top 6 team not some relegation fodder that Poch had to transform into a top team.

He is a good coach, but just not good enough for a top team in my book. His time at PSG kind of proves that. If you think that coming to United who is also a circus at the moment and yet the outcome will be different then I have some bad news for you.

Chelsea with less net spend have 2 PL titles and a couple of cups. What has Poch have to show for his time at Spurs? A top 4 cup? And please don't give me the "Spurs is a small club" when he had the squad he did. The odd FA/League Cup should have been a bare minimum in addition to the Top4.

Spurs had a wage bill of around 120m. That was a huge limit on what Poch could do. Would Klopp or Pep have been able to win stuff if they were manager of Spurs? Not a chance.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

I think it’s bound to be Poch as he’s been talked about as a future Manchester United manager for years. That way it will appear that this is the culmination of some long term masterplan. Like most, I’d prefer Ten Hag but I doubt that he’s even on our radar. I could see him taking over from Pep.

 

[AneRu]

The same thing was parroted out when Moyes came here. He had an equally abysmal record against the Top 6, yet people believed that once he will inherit a top squad he will turn into serial winner.


Also with regards to wages: I don't understand this argument. Yes, Spurs pay less wages to their players, because they are a smaller team, hence nobody expects them to pay insane wages like we do.

I assure you that if we were to sign the entire Spurs XI, those wages would have double right there, because we are Manchester United and everyone knows we have money. Same with City, Chelsea and to a lesser degree with Liverpool.

The point I'm trying to make is that wages =/ talent. Peak Kane, Son, Vertoghen and Alderweireld were WC players. Alli, Trippier, Walker, Rose, Lloris were players that would have improved an XI for most Top6 sides. Let's not pretend that Poch was managing the equivalent of current Soton.

He had a really good squad and took a team that consistently finished 5th to consistently finishing 3rd. That's it.

Good points, Poch has had trouble in duels against the same teams and managers the United Fan base will demand that he face. Ole had a much better record for crying out loud.

The other mistake people are making is attributing Spurs' administrative competence to Poch, back in the day Spurs were smart enough to tie a lot of their young players to long contracts making then untouchable. They were paying submarket rates for WC players and though part of that can be attributed to the family atmosphere Poch helped create the credit belongs to whoever negotiated their contracts. Martial has probably earned more money than Kane to date, that can't be used to praise Poch because Kane has always been the better player so Spurs were always stronger.

All that wage ill tells us is that Levy was more competent than Woodward not that United were stronger than Spurs. United chose to spend huge wages on duds whilst Spurs paid pennies to superstars like Eriksen.

 

[We Need Another Rebuild]

The Poch praise for building that Spurs team is laughable

During the majority of his time they had Paul Mitchell as DOF

As when he left they signed Flop after Flop

He is a coach that took Spurs from an average position of 5th to 4th

For all his plaudits he never improved the mentality of that team, yes you can say it's Spurs but we have a squad full of players that have never won anything of significance apart from Ronaldo & De Gea and what makes you think he is gonna turn us into a winning machine?

He has famously said that Trophies only feed ego, Ole got slated for something similar

Yes he got to a Champions League final but bottled leaving out Kane for Moura who was the only reason they got there

 

[Longshanks]

The squad Poch inherited finished 4th 5th 6th 5th 5th. It was a Top 6 team not some relegation fodder that Poch had to transform into a top team.

He is a good coach, but just not good enough for a top team in my book. His time at PSG kind of proves that. If you think that coming to United who is also a circus at the moment and yet the outcome will be different then I have some bad news for you.

Chelsea with less net spend have 2 PL titles and a couple of cups. What has Poch have to show for his time at Spurs? A top 4 cup? And please don't give me the "Spurs is a small club" when he had the squad he did. The odd FA/League Cup should have been a bare minimum in addition to the Top4.

Pochs net spend over his time at at spurs was about 105m over the course of 5 seasons so about 20m net spend per season. Any manager that come before or after didn't even come close to achieving what poch did, he built a very good side that challenged for the very best honours. Something spurs hadn't done before for many years.

The side he took over was pretty average, some talent there but very inconsistent and definitely a bit weak mentally he took them to the very edge of success but unfortunately couldn't quite get them over the line.

The side he built was excellent but he began loose key players (dumbele, eriksen, trippier) that were not really replaced (18/19 they spent nothing, signed noone). Vertonghen and Alderwield were beginning to go past there best and injuries were catching up with them, and again he wasn't really backed to replace them.

Ultimately the side he built was neglected and began to fade and he wasn't given the resources or even the time to build another side. Levy gave him a bit spend the summer before he was sacked, but the writing was already on the wall and the chance of a smooth transition had already been missed.

He's no gaurentee of success poch (who is?) But his achievements at spurs should not be written off so easily, he punched well above there weight.

 

[andersj]

My preferred candidates are Potter and ETH. Or, if something happend at Chelsea that made it possible, Thomas Tuchel.

But I do think some go over the top in trying to discredit Pochettino, and I think they hurt their own credibility by doing that.

I think it is very rare for a club to punch above its weight consistently for several years. Spurs did that for four years. Before and after Pochettino they where probably exactly where they should be. Maybe Pochettino got incredible lucky, stumbled over a great team where all the talent where tied down with ling contracts. Maybe that was what happened at Southampton too. But it is not very likely in my opinion.

The comparison with Moyes is interesting. In my opinion, a bit of a difference is that Moyes did not manage to do it consistently with Everton. Most of the time, they performed just as you would expect them to

There is a few mayor question marks hanging over him. But that is also the case with any othe candidate. But yes, Poch is a boring choice.

 

[Cloud7]

I think it’s bound to be Poch as he’s been talked about as a future Manchester United manager for years. That way it will appear that this is the culmination of some long term masterplan. Like most, I’d prefer Ten Hag but I doubt that he’s even on our radar. I could see him taking over from Pep.

It’s the most underwhelming master plan ever Poch is a safe pair of hands who will no doubt have us in the top 4 every season but I find it tough to imagine us winning the league under him.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

I think those complaining about potentially getting Pochettino are going to be praying for him when they realize who United are really going to hire as the next permanent manager.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

I think those complaining about potentially getting Pochettino are going to be praying for him when they realize who United are really going to hire as the next permanent manager.

It's not you is it?

 

[Devil may care]

Free reign won't be given.




Definitely not going to happen.



That won't happen either.

I do agree with your plan, though.

So in other words we might as well give up, hiring Puppettino and keeping the board status quo will see us remain as an afterthought with Arsenal in the race for the 4th place cup.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

It's not you is it?

Worse. It'll be Ralf.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Worse. It'll be Ralf.

I was more worried it would be Brenton.

 

[Devil may care]

I think those complaining about potentially getting Pochettino are going to be praying for him when they realize who United are really going to hire as the next permanent manager.

Go on then?

 

[Offside]

The Poch praise for building that Spurs team is laughable

During the majority of his time they had Paul Mitchell as DOF

As when he left they signed Flop after Flop

He is a coach that took Spurs from an average position of 5th to 4th

For all his plaudits he never improved the mentality of that team, yes you can say it's Spurs but we have a squad full of players that have never won anything of significance apart from Ronaldo & De Gea and what makes you think he is gonna turn us into a winning machine?

He has famously said that Trophies only feed ego, Ole got slated for something similar

Yes he got to a Champions League final but bottled leaving out Kane for Moura who was the only reason they got there

He had Spurs finishing in the top 4 for 4 consecutive years, something that has never happened before. He had them finishing 2nd with 86 points, their highest in PL history and one of the highest ever for a second placed team. Stop spinning hillocks.

 

[Bebestation]

My biggest problem with Poch is that I personally found the CL final achievement he acheived a bit of a fluke.

I remember how Kane was injured and he used Lucas as a false 9 only because he had to and he ripped Ajax apart that night almost by surprise.

 

[Devil may care]

Worse. It'll be Ralf.

Is that it? I thought you were gonna say Moyes or Rodgers, I'd have no issue with one more season under Rangnick where has a chance to get some players in and really implement his style, if he fails no issue as he'll just go upstairs for the final year of his contract, where as if we hire the puppet it's going to be a minimum 3 seasons pissed away.

 

[We Need Another Rebuild]

He had Spurs finishing in the top 4 for 4 consecutive years, something that has never happened before. He had them finishing 2nd with 86 points, their highest in PL history and one of the highest ever for a second placed team. Stop spinning hillocks.

Congrats on awarding Poch the Top 4 Trophy

In his full seasons at Spurs he finished 5th, 3rd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th so one place up with an average of 3rd

What has record points total got to do with anything? Spurs have been bang average in the Prem

But did he win the league? They were never in a Title race and as soon as they were they bottled it

He got beat the season before by Leicester with a far weaker team bar Vardy, Kante & Mahrez then finished 3rd

What makes you actually think he is gonna do anything here apart from make us Arsenal under Wenger having a Top 4 trophy parade?

 

[Bilbo]

It's very odd how Pochettino has gone from the Cafe poster boy to Cafe whipping boy for no particular reason. Seems like Ten Hag fans are discrediting Poch unfairly in an attempt to champion their own preference. In reality the club are going to know a lot more about both of those guys than any of us, so we have to believe they'll end up choosing the man who looks the best candidate on paper. Whether that works out or not is another thing.

 

[Tarrou]

It's very odd how Pochettino has gone from the Cafe poster boy to Cafe whipping boy for no particular reason. Seems like Ten Hag fans are discrediting Poch unfairly in an attempt to champion their own preference. In reality the club are going to know a lot more about both of those guys than any of us, so we have to believe they'll end up choosing the man who looks the best candidate on paper. Whether that works out or not is another thing.

it’s not no reason is it? His Spurs stint ended with no trophies and the sack

 

[Bilbo]

it’s not no reason is it? His Spurs stint ended with no trophies and the sack

It was long after his sacking that people were praying for us to appoint him. I also prefer Ten Hag by the way, just find it weird the way that narratives shift over time.

 

[Devil may care]

It's very odd how Pochettino has gone from the Cafe poster boy to Cafe whipping boy for no particular reason. Seems like Ten Hag fans are discrediting Poch unfairly in an attempt to champion their own preference. In reality the club are going to know a lot more about both of those guys than any of us, so we have to believe they'll end up choosing the man who looks the best candidate on paper. Whether that works out or not is another thing.

Why does everyone assume people who don't want Puppettino, must have Ten Hag? There are other options, and why would we trust who this board appoint? They want him because he's easy to keep under the thumb, will do as he's told, keep his mouth shut and they hope get regular top 4 which is all they care about.

 

[Bilbo]

Why does everyone assume people who don't want Puppettino, must have Ten Hag? There are other options, and why would we trust who this board appoint? They want him because he's easy to keep under the thumb, will do as he's told, keep his mouth shut and they hope get regular top 4 which is all they care about.

Lot of assumptions here, which could only be credible if you had significantly more inside information than you could possibly have.

 

[Devil may care]

Lot of assumptions here, which could only be credible if you had significantly more inside information than you could possibly have.

Do you see any ambition in how the club moves? We desperately needed a midfielder in January, did nothing, same as we didn't address the forward situation. Puppettino is clearly having issues with Leonardo and the superstar players at PSG but keeps his council and keeps plodding on. No supposed top club would have allowed the Ole mess to go on as long as it did, but we did as he was the perfect 'see no evil, hear no evil' manager for the Glazers, same reason we didn't appoint Conte, I didn't want him because his football is the shits, but the board didn't want him because he has too much of a fiery personality and won't just be a lapdog as is seen at Spurs already, I mean the whole 'Proven' garbage used to justify hiring Puppettino applies much more to Conte who has won multiple league titles including the PL.

 

[AneRu]

My preferred candidates are Potter and ETH. Or, if something happend at Chelsea that made it possible, Thomas Tuchel.

But I do think some go over the top in trying to discredit Pochettino, and I think they hurt their own credibility by doing that.

I think it is very rare for a club to punch above its weight consistently for several years. Spurs did that for four years. Before and after Pochettino they where probably exactly where they should be. Maybe Pochettino got incredible lucky, stumbled over a great team where all the talent where tied down with ling contracts. Maybe that was what happened at Southampton too. But it is not very likely in my opinion.

The comparison with Moyes is interesting. In my opinion, a bit of a difference is that Moyes did not manage to do it consistently with Everton. Most of the time, they performed just as you would expect them to

There is a few mayor question marks hanging over him. But that is also the case with any othe candidate. But yes, Poch is a boring choice.

Same here, when I look at managers I look at how they are consistent with their style and whether that style can win in this era. For the guys who are available or we can make available I struggle to look beyond those two. Potter might have an issue with the superstar dressing room but if you remove Ronaldo I don't think there is any player who will challenge him. I want someone with a modern style and who has shown consistency in realizing that vision on the pitch.

At one time Poch had the hardest working teams but I think during his time at Spurs he got more and more pragmatic and eventually lost his edge. Something tells me he is on his way down, maybe he could state his case in Europe this season but everything about him screams yesterday's man. He could come here, do enough to earn top four every season and thus please the Glazer but he doesn't have the edge to take the next step and he will crumble like Ole did when a title challenge was asked of him.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

Is that it? I thought you were gonna say Moyes or Rodgers, I'd have no issue with one more season under Rangnick where has a chance to get some players in and really implement his style, if he fails no issue as he'll just go upstairs for the final year of his contract, where as if we hire the puppet it's going to be a minimum 3 seasons pissed away.

Ralf is the worst of the realistic appointments that we could make IMO. The results in the fixtures he's had have been appalling.

I do however think we'll get further in the CL than people expect, in spite of him, and then the Board will take the easiest and laziest option with open arms

 

[andersj]

Potter might have an issue with the superstar dressing room

I think this is a bit of a myth. If we have players in the squad who dont respect a manager (that is good) we have a problem and those players must leave.

I also actually think he seems like a great guy, something that usually works well with big egos too.

 

[AneRu]

Ralf is the worst of the realistic appointments that we could make IMO. The results in the fixtures he's had have been appalling.

I do however think we'll get further in the CL than people expect, in spite of him, and then the Board will take the easiest and laziest option with open arms

The base level Ralf started from has been really low but the improvement is visible. I think Ralf has done well but, a bit like Ole, has been let down by key players being in poor form because of all things to expect I don't think Ronaldo scoring only one goal in ten was one of them. That said I think keeping Ralf as manager next term will be simply kicking down the bucket on long term development of the first team.

We don't need Ralf in the dugout, we need him in the boardroom and having influence on strategic decisions concerning football.

I think this is a bit of a myth. If we have players in the squad who dont respect a manager (that is good) we have a problem and those players must leave.

I also actually think he seems like a great guy, something that usually works well with big egos too.

Yeah, that helps with establishing a connection with the players but I don't know if it will be enough if the said big egos need to be dropped or are having a hard time udjuating to their new level. Would Ronaldo accept being benched by Potter?

 

[Tom Van Persie]

I really don't want Ralf as manager for another season and if that happened then I would be very worried. He's better suited to being upstairs.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

 

[red woppit]

I think this is a bit of a myth. If we have players in the squad who dont respect a manager (that is good) we have a problem and those players must leave.

I also actually think he seems like a great guy, something that usually works well with big egos too.

Superstar players are still players, and will take to or not take to a new manager when they come in. A lot of it depends on how the training sessions go, whether they are interesting or boring, whether the new managers ideas are fresh.
Some players undoubtedly will not take to the new manager, and will get moved on, while others will adapt seamlessly.
I rate Potter highly, he appears to be an intelligent, forward thinking man, with good ideas, and also he is not the finished article and will still improve in various areas.
Yes, he doesn't have European match experience, but he is clever enough to learn, and adapt if required (Europa League would be ideal).
We buy players who are potentially great players, but why don't we do that with managers, do we not want to wait and develop a terrific squad in a couple of seasons time, instead of demanding that we compete for all the big trophies now, with disappointing results.

 

[AneRu]

Superstar players are still players, and will take to or not take to a new manager when they come in. A lot of it depends on how the training sessions go, whether they are interesting or boring, whether the new managers ideas are fresh.
Some players undoubtedly will not take to the new manager, and will get moved on, while others will adapt seamlessly.
I rate Potter highly, he appears to be an intelligent, forward thinking man, with good ideas, and also he is not the finished article and will still improve in various areas.
Yes, he doesn't have European match experience, but he is clever enough to learn, and adapt if required (Europa League would be ideal).
We buy players who are potentially great players, but why don't we do that with managers, do we not want to wait and develop a terrific squad in a couple of seasons time, instead of demanding that we compete for all the big trophies now, with disappointing results.

Spot on, let's take it this way; when Guardiola was managing Barca B he wouldn't have been considered good enough for United but 18 months or so later he was humiliating us on the biggest stage. Same with Klopp when he was starting out with Dortmund he wouldn't have been considered ready for United but we know what happened. The trick with players and managers lies in recognizing their greatness before everyone else.

The style Potter employs and the way he approaches big games against well resourced opponents shows that he can come in at United and hold his own. Give him the backing that was given to Ole and in three years you could have something special or something disastrous but in that even I don't think many could blame the club for trying. The challenge with United is that our squad imbalance makes our bottom level embarrassing such that when a manager fails we lose everything and we typically wait to act until the said managers cost us everything.

 

[Giggsy13]

Potter would flourish at a club like city or Liverpool where there is a good structure in place. When you have our club where the technical director is out on the touchline and Rangnick is confused to his role or you have a glazer yes man in Murtough “calling the shots”, he’s bound to fail.

 

[Devil may care]

Ralf is the worst of the realistic appointments that we could make IMO. The results in the fixtures he's had have been appalling.

I do however think we'll get further in the CL than people expect, in spite of him, and then the Board will take the easiest and laziest option with open arms

The easiest and laziest option is Puppettino, a guaranteed top 4 chasing ceiling without any pushback, Rangnick has already shown he's going to be open about what he needs. The results haven't been great but the football and shape of the team has improved, we've seen players like Sancho ad Elanga progress now we have an actual system, and he's popped the ego balloon on Rashford and Maguire. The points dropped recently have been down to terrible finishing, but then the board left him with only one striker and he's 37 years old and past his best, struggling with PL level football, and his only back-up is a 35 year old who only plays when he feels like it.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Potter would flourish at a club like city or Liverpool where there is a good structure in place. When you have our club where the technical director is out on the touchline and Rangnick is confused to his role or you have a glazer yes man in Murtough “calling the shots”, he’s bound to fail.

You can say the same about any manager though

 

[romufc]

The squad Poch inherited finished 4th 5th 6th 5th 5th. It was a Top 6 team not some relegation fodder that Poch had to transform into a top team.

He is a good coach, but just not good enough for a top team in my book. His time at PSG kind of proves that. If you think that coming to United who is also a circus at the moment and yet the outcome will be different then I have some bad news for you.

Chelsea with less net spend have 2 PL titles and a couple of cups. What has Poch have to show for his time at Spurs? A top 4 cup? And please don't give me the "Spurs is a small club" when he had the squad he did. The odd FA/League Cup should have been a bare minimum in addition to the Top4.

So his time at PSG proves he isnt good enough for a top team? PSG outplayed Real Madrid in the CL and are clear on top of the French League. So what makes a manager ready for a top team? I have seen you say you want ETH but he hasn't shown he can manage a top team.

Are you talking about the last 2 titles chelsea won? Because since their last title they have a net spend of 240m.

Poch might not have anything to show in terms of trophies but its a very simplistic take. Does that mean Di Matteo is a top manager because he won the CL?

 

[UnitedSofa]

Potter would flourish at a club like city or Liverpool where there is a good structure in place. When you have our club where the technical director is out on the touchline and Rangnick is confused to his role or you have a glazer yes man in Murtough “calling the shots”, he’s bound to fail.

....and you know Murtough is a "Yes Man" because?

Love how that term is thrown around here as some sort of criticism, you go and tell your boss to go fourth and multiply and see how far you get.

 

[Giggsy13]

....and you know Murtough is a "Yes Man" because?

Love how that term is thrown around here as some sort of criticism, you go and tell your boss to go fourth and multiply and see how far you get.

I do know that Murtough was clearly not best candidate for the role. If you think so, you’re certainly as deluded as your previous posts suggest.

 

[Champ]

I do know that Murtough was clearly not best candidate for the role. If you think so, you’re certainly as deluded as your previous posts suggest.

How so??