———Matic———
Herrera——Pogba
That midfield would be fecking excellent.
Herrera——Pogba
That midfield would be fecking excellent.
Nemanja Matic| BBC says deal agreed
- Thread starter Paxi
- Start date
- Status
It wasn't the same role though. He was essentially a dm sitting while Fabregas was given creative freedom and Oscar tracked back to make up for the vacancy in the centre (a major reason Mata wasn't trusted for the cam role). It was more of a 4-1-1-3-1 in reality. Since we have stronger and fitter players than Fabregas in Herrera and Pogba this wouldn't be necessary since they can both go box to box for 90 mins.
Pogba really isn't superep defensively, not bad I can say and can do it from times to times but definitely not superb and can't do it contiuously. Again if you want him to keep backtracing to support Matic in a 2 men midfielder then you'll get only about 60 or 70% from him on the offense. Pogba will only succeed in a 2 man midfield if the strict DMF can actually move, otherwise he'll be restricted a lot.
So, scoring one goal from a long range shot is considered to be a proof he can attack ?
Herrera and Matic won't be a 2 defensively minded midfielders all the team, nor will we create a block. Matic will be the strict DMF, with Herrera being a b2b supporting on both offense and defense while Pogba will be pushed more upfront.
And no United a DMF urgently in many games last and next season to cover space behind Herrera. Lack of any DMF sitting in front of the goal leads to Pogba and Herrera being drawn back while we're defending to cover the space in front of defense making building the attack when cutting the ball is very difficult as the whole team will be drawn back with them. If there's a strict DMF sitting in front of the defense, Pogba will remain mostly at the midfield line to push for the counter when we cut the ball and building our attack will be much easier than what we saw against big teams last season.
Are posters under the impression Matic is still playing the same level as he did when he first arrived back at Chelsea.
The summer has been Morata v Lukaku and Fabinho v Matic.
There is nobody in world football who's in a better position to judge these players since Jose has worked with all 4 on a daily basis
There is nobody in world football who's in a better position to judge these players since Jose has worked with all 4 on a daily basis
If you know better, why don't you take over from Mourinho!!!
I don't think Matic would ever have suited this Chelsea system, even at his peak. As @Dazzmondo pointed out to me above, the way he played in a 4-2-3-1 was always very much as a DM. The way Chelsea currently play is more similar to having two box to box mids.
In other words, he doesn't suit Chelsea's system because of the type of player he is (and always was) rather than because he has declined.
He was shite the season prior, and to be perfectly honest i actually thought his form had trailed off even before then, in the latter half of their title winning season under Jose, a few games towards the end that I caught he looked very underwhelming.
Looks like a mental block with him.
It seems the rail has gone cold on this one, even the Perisic one has went very quiet. Hopefully Woody has an ace up his sleeve and it's not Matic
You don't remember things correctly. That's not the player he always was, in the same way Carrick is not now the player he was. It's easier to look at Carrick now and completely forget he was a great box-to-box during his peak. You are doing the same with Matic. This current Matic is not a great match for Chelsea's system. But the younger one was.
Look at the info below. His total effect on the game has diminished. All the defensive contributions (tackles, interceptions, headers... even fouls and cards) have gone down, on top of distance covered though not shown here.
The redeeming feature is that he has improved the quality of his passing (more chances created while passing the ball less), but he gets to see less of the ball then he used to. He is basically turning into Carrick. He can play DLP, but in a midfield two he'll look worse year-on-year, like Carrick does. The idea some people have that he can replace Herrera in a midfield two next to Pogba is incorrect. Matic of 2012-2015 could, but not this one.
Still, the manager has basically conceded he's leaving. Surely that can't strengthen your position to the point you rinse us for 50m.
Because that's the system he played in when he won the league with Mourinho..
What could this possibly be down to? He's 28, how could he be physically shot?
I already responded to this
come on juventus, you got this. Please!
Dunno. He's 29 though (in 10 days, anyway). He's a very tall guy (6ft. 4", or 194cm) they tend to struggle with stamina and pace a bit sooner. More weight to carry around and more stress on the joints etc.
We're not really paying 50mill for him are we? he'll be 29 and looks half the player he formerly was, you could add 10mill on that and throw it at Spurs for Dier at 23, whom can do the 433 role and 4231 def mid + can play CB and RB as well, and who's career path is on an upward trajectory.
Theres only one way Matic will go and its downwards.
Theres only one way Matic will go and its downwards.
Rooney, torres, owen and lots of other players have deteriorated earlier than is typical. Not really paid enough attention to matic to really make a judgement on his individual case but shot at 28 is definately possible.
I can't see Mourinho using a 4231 if he got Matic, because you're then either having Herrera as an 8 and Pogba shoehorned in to a 10.
Surely it would be a 433 with Matic operation in a more disciplined role in a smaller area of the pitch (the centre circle and ten yards in front and behind) with Pogba and Herra providing more support as box to box midfielders.
Surely it would be a 433 with Matic operation in a more disciplined role in a smaller area of the pitch (the centre circle and ten yards in front and behind) with Pogba and Herra providing more support as box to box midfielders.
Juventus are not gonna pay nearly €60m for a 29yo DM. They are not idiots. If we pay that kinda of money Chelsea will sell and Juve will back off.
Well he's partnered Matic with Fabregas in the past.
He just gives us more options, we can play him in a 2 with Pogba or a 3 with Herrera.
You don't remember things correctly. That's not the player he always was, in the same way Carrick is not now the player he was. It's easier to look at Carrick now and completely forget he was a great box-to-box during his peak. You are doing the same with Matic. This current Matic is not a great match for Chelsea's system. But the younger one was.
Look at the info below. His total effect on the game has diminished. All the defensive contributions (tackles, interceptions, headers... even fouls and cards) have gone down, on top of distance covered though not shown here.
The redeeming feature is that he has improved the quality of his passing (more chances created while passing the ball less), but he gets to see less of the ball then he used to. He is basically turning into Carrick. He can play DLP, but in a midfield two he'll look worse year-on-year, like Carrick does. The idea some people have that he can replace Herrera in a midfield two next to Pogba is incorrect. Matic of 2012-2015 could, but not this one.
This is why stats can be dangerous. Sometimes it is misleading. Number of interceptions and tackles has gone down because now he has Kante and Luiz doing the job he used to do. Number of passes per game has gone down down due to less minutes per game. Per 90 minutes he is still the most influential Chelsea-player with more than 1500 min (only beaten by Azpi by a couple of passes).
In 2015 he lined up next to Fabregas in a 4231. Last season he lined up next to Kante in a 343 with David Luiz protecting Azpi and Cahill (part of the job he used to do infront of Terry and Cahill). It is only natural that he has fewer interceptions and tackles.
Last edited:
Yeah we'd spend 60m on a good kit man.
Hope we get him. He will strengthen our midfield, which is badly needed. All the morons hoping we fail to sign Mourinho's key targets need to have a word with themselves.
£50m. Jesus wept
The stats are per 90 mins buddy. And his stats were declining before Kante arrived too. Sometimes the stats are right as well.
Mourinho has made quite a few bad transfers in his career, every manager has. They've been listed numerous times on this forum. So we can like him as a coach and support him in many things, without approving of every transfer that he sanctions. And we don't need to have a word with ourselves about it.
Matic is a really really top player IMO and very underrated here. Much better than Bakayoko and I think we've wanted him for 2 years now.
I think if he does come, then everyone is going to really appreciate how good this guy is.
I think if he does come, then everyone is going to really appreciate how good this guy is.
Krychowiak is probably gettable for 20m and we spend 50m on Matic. 30m would be a fair price, but then complain about high prices.
I hope not. He's a decent player, but a stop gap. At £20~30m it'd be fine, but that is a serious fee even in this market.
Who signed some of the worst players I've ever seen play for United
When I read he's going to cost £50m!
Yeah, the negativity this window has been overpowering at times.
People saying he'd improve us, sitting at the base of 433, behind Pogba and Herrera, Yea i could see it working, but current Matic? in a 2man mid? that i don't see being a big success. For 50mill.. we'd be getting minimal value as he continues declining.
Dier is another obvious Mourinho target, Dier vs Matic, just the fact no Spurs fan on here wants to lose him and all the Chelsea fans on this board aren't bothered if we sign Matic (let alone for 50mill) tells you something.
Dier is another obvious Mourinho target, Dier vs Matic, just the fact no Spurs fan on here wants to lose him and all the Chelsea fans on this board aren't bothered if we sign Matic (let alone for 50mill) tells you something.
There's plenty of very good DMs with upward trajectories that can be had for that money. Or even equally experienced DMs for less.
It's seems that Mourinho is set on getting Matic from Chelsea though and doesn't care if we overpay. We can't blame it on either Ed or the market this one.
He's a SMOKESCREEN
I think 50m is too much but people are seriously underestimating how good he is.
Would be good for Pogba if we get Matic
Sigh.
The guy is 28 ffs. He's got 2-3 years at the very top of his game and for me, he's one of the best in the world at what he does. Have to say im also a big fan of Dier but Matic is already the very best and will be for a while still. I challenge anyone to name a better defensive midfielder for the team that is not Busquets.
- Status