Nemanja Matic| BBC says deal agreed

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Yes, I think so, since Herrera and Pogba are better players. He'll start if we stick with a 4-3-3.

There's no chance Matic is being signed as backup.

If he's being signed it's because Mourinho wants to have a DM, something neither Pogba nor Herrera are. If Mourinho then plays with that DM (as you'd assume he would given he just signed one for a specific reason) then Matic will naturally start ahead of any non-DMs in that role.

The question is how often Mourinho will want to set up with that DM, as opposed to a system that doesn't require Matic to play. That might happen fairly regularly but obviously not so regularly that Mourinho was happy to go without a DM this summer.
 
This would be a good addition. It might not be the perfect shiny toy that the muppets want but it's an experienced,PL winning DM who Mouriniho obviously has faith in.
 
If this guy is our third and final signing at anything like £30m+ this will place will go into meltdown....

From my perspective there must be far better players available probably for less money.

Looking back I wonder if Jose's recent comment has come as he knew Matic was almost done as the third signing.

He's basically telling Inter we won't be held to ransom. If they do want to sell the player then they need to accept our latest offer, which seems to be a more than fair one. I wonder if we'll see one signing quite quickly following another now.
 
Wary of how useful he still is and definitely do not think he's worth the price quoted, i'd rather throw the lot at Dier or go for an alternative like Romeu.
 
50 million for a rotational player?

This is what baffles me.

Only thing I can think of is moving to a permanent 433, but as we know, Jose likes to change things up every now and then, and although it's only pre season, we looked pretty damn good in a 4231 system against City today.

All players are rotational though tbh, aren't they? Just some are more preferred than others. At least that's how I try and look at the squad. Premier League is so competitive, that to compete in Europe you pretty much have to have two teams.
 
If this guy is our third and final signing at anything like £30m+ this will place will go into meltdown....

From my perspective there must be far better players available probably for less money.
Exactly! We don't mind having him. But as a third and final option? That too for 50m? Not in this life time!
 
50 million for a rotational player?

This is what baffles me.

Only thing I can think of is moving to a permanent 433, but as we know, Jose likes to change things up every now and then, and although it's only pre season, we looked pretty damn good in a 4231 system against City today.

There's no chance Matic is being signed as backup.

If he's being signed it's because Mourinho wants to have a DM, something neither Pogba nor Herrera are. If Mourinho then plays with that DM (as you'd assume he would given he just signed one for a specific reason) then Matic will naturally start ahead of any non-DMs in that role.

The question is how often Mourinho will want to set up with that DM, as opposed to a system that doesn't require Matic to play. That might happen fairly regularly but obviously not so regularly that Mourinho was happy to go without a DM this summer.

I would imagine against better teams, like the top 6 or CL opponents, it will be a midfield 3 with Matic, as for the rest it would be a midfield 2. Matic would get plenty of minutes. Pogba's muscles injuries don't happen, if Mourinho has more options in his squad. He definitely would have liked to rotate more there.

@Walters_19_MuFc To be honest I didn't want to believe those reports about Mourinho's insistence on Matic and Perisic. For one because of their fees and on the other hand I thought there were/are cheaper alternatives, who are just as good or better. (I am not saying they are necessarily bad players)
 
If they manage to get £50m out of us I really do have to laugh. He's so far out the manager's plans he's not been taken on their fecking tour... How could they possibly fleece us for £50m :lol:
 
All players are rotational though tbh, aren't they? Just some are more preferred than others. At least that's how I try and look at the squad. Premier League is so competitive, that to compete in Europe you pretty much have to have two teams.

I don't think you can get away with converting it to a spectrum and simply saying "well they are all being rotated to some extent". Let me convert something else to a spectrum for fun. All the employees in a company are not equally important, but all are important to some extent, so let's use that to justify giving £300k salary to the receptionist. That's a spectrum of usefulness as opposed to a spectrum participation time.

The players that are more essential play more games and are more important than the others. Pogba, Lukaku, De Gea, Valencia, Herrera, Mkhitaryan are those players. When they are fit and the games are important, they'll play those games. Such would not be the case for Matic, since his entire position is being rotated in and out of existence. Thus spending £50m on a nearly 29yo that will only occasionally be used seems madness. At least spend it on someone we'll get more years out of. He's also not versatile to play any other position. Only the one we don't use in half our games.

I really can't fathom how of all the DMs out there we settled on Matic and are willing to pay £50m for him, more than what Chelsea paid for his 22yo replacement. It's not a position with short supply of players. Or one that is pivotal for us to function.
 
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I don't think you can get away with converting it to a spectrum and simply saying "well they are all being rotated to some extent". Let me convert something else to a spectrum for fun. All the employees in a company are not equally important, but all are important to some extent, so let's use that to justify giving £300k salary to the receptionist. That's a spectrum of usefulness as opposed to a spectrum participation time.

The players that are more essential play more games and are more important than the others. Pogba, Lukaku, De Gea, Valencia, Herrera, Mkhitaryan are those players. When they are fit and the games are important, they'll play those games. Such would not be the case for Matic, since his entire position is being rotated in and out of existence. Thus spending £50m on a nearly 29yo that will only occasionally be used seems madness. At least spend it on someone we'll get more years out of. He's also not versatile to play any other position. Only the one we don't use in half our games.

I really can't fathom how of all the DMs out there we settled on Matic and are willing to pay £50m for him, more than what Chelsea paid for his 22yo replacement. It's not a position with short supply of players. Or one that is pivotal for us to function.

Firstly, I'm not 'converting it to any spectrum', because that's (rotation) just what's actually happening. Secondly, equating Matic to the company secretary is a preposterous parallel. He's not coming here to serve the half time oranges. Furthermore, I already paid deference to the differing levels of importance players in our squad have.

Finally, the preoccupation with the fee is just something I don't understand. If Matic is the player which fits the manager's plans best - something only the manager himself can decide - then why should we worry how much he costs? That's for the club's accountants. United is an extraordinarily well run club financially, I reckon they will continue to be financially prudent. While on face value it doesn't seem great value for money to fans, at the end of the day what concerns me is what happens on the pitch.
 
£50m is very high. I think we could get it done for £40m tbh. Matic is a very good player. His age is the only concern but no doubt he'd improve us and if we can't get him for less than £50m, fair enough, better to just buy him. We badly need depth in cm and his positioning and passing are very good, which should allow Herrera and Pogba to offer much more going forward.
 
I have no problem with the club spending. But even 40m is too much to give to a rival for a player they no longer want.
 
If they manage to get £50m out of us I really do have to laugh. He's so far out the manager's plans he's not been taken on their fecking tour... How could they possibly fleece us for £50m :lol:
I don't think he was left behind because he's not in Conte's plans. More likely that Matic has had his head turned or simply wants out because of Bakayoko signing.

I would imagine that Conte would be glad to keep him if he accepted a reduced role. Not as though he doesn't fancy him since he played nearly every match for him last season.
 
I don't think this is a scouting issue. It's an issue that's caused by a new manager who's unfamiliar with the scouting team preferring to rely on his judgement. It's perfectly normal...we saw it with Moyes and LVG too.

Well whatever or whoever the cause the end result is still a breakdown in scouting.

There has to be a better, younger DM around for the reported fee.
 
I have no problem with the club spending. But even 40m is too much to give to a rival for a player they no longer want.

Pirlo was deemed not needed by Milan, Sneijder the same for Real. Sure Matic is not like the 2 mentioned, but saying that he is no good because Conte doesn't need him is not true.
 
Pirlo was deemed not needed by Milan, Sneijder the same for Real. Sure Matic is not like the 2 mentioned, but saying that he is no good because Conte doesn't need him is not true.

It's also reported that it's Matic who wants out and rejected contract extension.

Saying that hopefully we don't sign him.
 
Well whatever or whoever the cause the end result is still a breakdown in scouting.

There has to be a better, younger DM around for the reported fee.

It's been discussed on here for months and I don't think many names have emerged.

In any event apparently Jose wanted a player with PL experience. There aren't many options who fit Jose's criteria.

I know people often criticise managers who sign former players. I do think there is something to be said for a manager knowing exactly what he needs, however, and knowing exactly who can perform the role.

We have to trust Jose on this one as he has no margin for error. If he gets this transfer window wrong then I think his career is in big, big trouble.
 
Well whatever or whoever the cause the end result is still a breakdown in scouting.

There has to be a better, younger DM around for the reported fee.

As someone mentioned before, we might probably be looking to get someone with experience in both pl and working with Jose.
 
It's been discussed on here for months and I don't think many names have emerged.

In any event apparently Jose wanted a player with PL experience. There aren't many options who fit Jose's criteria.


I know people often criticise managers who sign former players. I do think there is something to be said for a manager knowing exactly what he needs, however, and knowing exactly who can perform the role.

We have to trust Jose on this one as he has no margin for error. If he gets this transfer window wrong then I think his career is in big, big trouble.

I'm not sure how anyone could know that. Nor does it fit with his signings so far. Only Lukaku having EPL experience.

Whilst we might struggle to come up with names you'd expect a club with a world wide scouting network to have that ability.
 
I think he would be really good in a 433 setup with Pogba and Ander

I think most games we play 4-2-3-1 as we would be the dominant team, with Mkhitaryan or Mata playing behind the striker. I think we should go for someone else for DM, he is slow (not pace slow, I mean slow on the ball) and for the player of his size he shrinks away from challenges.

I agree we need one more midfielder to play 4-3-3 but we should go for a better DM.
 
I'm not sure how anyone could know that. Nor does it fit with his signings so far. Only Lukaku having EPL experience.

Whilst we might struggle to come up with names you'd expect a club with a world wide scouting network to have that ability.

It was reported in relation to the defensive midfielder position. I think it might have been in a discussion about us not being interested in Fabinho. Matic and Dier have clearly been the targets. We weren't looking for names, Jose wanted someone he knew for the position.

Our scouting system is bringing us the likes of Bailly and Lindelof. Possibly Mhikitaryan.
 
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