Theoretically possible, realistically no.
Zubac, Morris and Powell are enough to make the trade salary wise I think, don't think Jazz would accept that though.
NBA 2021-2022
- Thread starter elmo
- Start date
Zubac, Morris and Powell are enough to make the trade salary wise I think, don't think Jazz would accept that though.
Yep. Gobert, Brogdon and Hield to Lakers, Westbrook & Mitchell to Indiana, Haliburton, picks and whatever else you need to match to Utah
Nice try Lakers fan, no one wants Westbrook, not even Indiana
Just saw, Wolves might be interested.
Gobert in Dallas would give them what they had in Chandler (but much better) during the championship run. No clue if they're interested let alone could make it happen.
Would you do Wiggins + Wiseman + future first round picks for Gobert?
Suns just kicking everyone in the dick these days. Draymond and these boys gonna just be booting each other in the balls back and forth if it comes down to it
Who else did the Suns kick in the balls. Still shaking my head at Crowder, never have liked how he sticks his legs out on 3 pointers.
I would love someone more tech savvy than I to put the “football to groin” Simpsons sound over it
Kicking people in the balls is so last year. Draymond's one two salvo - smack 'em in the head with one hand and throw them to the ground with the other is much more effective.
Kleber lucky he’s not paralysed. McGee…
Suns just outclass the Mavericks and they are a bad matchup on top of it. Can't see this series go beyond 5 games.
@elmo Sarver really not gonna pay Ayton?!?!??!
Agreed. Mitchell especially has no right to be in that Booker/Tatum conversation anymore.
I'd be driving down to the Pelicans and offering Mitchell for the majority of those Lakers picks plus one or two of the young guys on that team (obviously not Zion or Ingram).
For Gobert, Id be looking at Simmons, the Nets would do that deal in a heart beat and if he is serious about returning next season, then you're getting an DPOY candidate who is also arguably a top 5 playmaker in the league. And playing in a small market in a favourable media city, it could allow him to fulfil his potential. If the Jazz just want to tank then they should turn towards GSW and try to work a deal that lands them Kuminga who looks like he could be a stud.
Two problems: I don't think any team wants to gamble on Simmons right now until he's proven he can even step on a basketball court, and there is no way in hell the Young Socialite would be cool with getting traded to Utah of all places. He can't even get over his mental block (or whatever) to play with KD and Kyrie in New York City. Now imagine how he'd react if the team told him he's about to get shipped to Salt Lake City.
Regarding him being a Top 5 playmaker: In transition offense, yes. In half court offense - i.e. playoff basketball - he becomes a total liability because opponents flatout don't guard him anymore. Him passing the ball and crowding the dunker spot for the rest of the possession isn't playmaking, it's a detriment.
Turns out I have Covid! It finally got me
Hope everything turns out OK. I got it last September, but tbh would never have known it if my wife hadn't insisted I got tested.
They cannot trade Gobert for a player who may never play another game in the league.
I think we'll match whatever offer he gets so that's not an issue.
However Sarver's definitely going to cheap out sooner or later and I'm not sure how long our window can last when we still have to pay Ayton, Cam Johnson and CP3's eventual contract renewal.
I'm genuinely intrigued by that one because it's pretty clear that on the court Gobert isn't the issue, he isn't even an issue. While I realize that it will sound terrible but the issue is every else including the coaching staff because Gobert is the only doing his job at a high level and with consistency, offensively he is open on almost all possessions but ignored by the ball handlers when he used to be a high rate "shooter"/dunker.
If a team like the Raptors get Gobert, they will be extremely difficult to score on and their ball handlers aren't dumbasses.
It's pretty clear cut that Gobert is the only reason why they're a playoffs team, once Gobert is gone the Jazz are basically the Wizards. Can score, can't play defense and they will be irrelevant.
Gobert's lack of offense is basically the same argument people have for Ayton's lack of production on the offensive end in his rookie year. Most bigs (aka everyone but Jokic) can't create their own shots off the dribble and they'll need their guards to pass the ball to them in the paint. They're not going to magically get points if your guards decide to look for their own shot and shoot a contested jumper.
Get rid of Mitchell and just let Conley run the point with specific instructions to feed Gobert. CP3 basically fed DeAndre Jordan lobs till he fooled everybody into thinking DeAndre's a good player who deserves a max.
I don't see anyone beating the Suns tbh. They're too complete and too as a team in the West. Not even GSW
I hope so. Paul really deserves his ring. But I think GSW are more of a challenger than you make them out to be. Their incredibly experience at that level alone makes them very dangerous.
That last sentence.
But I agree with you, I'm not exaggerating when I say that the Jazz's defense looks like the worst of the Wolves defense over the past 10 years, it makes no sense that they are not statistically the worst defense in the league. Interestingly I feel that they also shares a bad side of the Wolves which is that when they share the ball, they are almost unstoppable but for some reason they periodically decide to not share it which has been even more common for the Jazz this year.
Since Snyder isn't a new head coach and knows this set of player, I don't know if the best thing for the Jazz is to trade Mitchell/Gobert, the solution could also be to fire the head coach and bring someone that is going to lean on this team's identity which is mobile shooters with a towering center. The logic would be for them to force half court situations on both ends, harass opponents on defense without switching too much since Gobert has no business defending the perimeter, on offense they should share the ball, move a lot and use Gobert in PnR, lobs and screens, the last point is important because for all the criticism that Gobert get on offense he is an excellent screener.
Why I don't trust GSW is because Curry is a bit unreliable with his shooting at times qnd that's understandable considering how he is defended
Green can lose it and get himself suspended, Klay is a bit of a unknown but he can still hit big big shots. Poole is the key for them, if he can sustain a high scoring then they have a chance
The Suns seem more reliable, offensively and defensively. I don't like Chris Paul but he is one hell of a player and whose career deserves a ring
If Bucks win today then I will be putting big money on them winning the title
Gobert can only finish on dunks, layups and pullbacks. Ayton maybe doesn't have a bag yet, but he can score from further out, back people down in the post, score from the elbows and generally punish mismatches
As seen in game 1, playing small ball against Ayton isn't really a viable strategy, unlike with Gobert. That said, get good perimeter defenders and people willing to throw him lobs and small ball lineups wouldn't be such a problem for Gobert
The way your frame it is wrong, you make it sound like Gobert is the one being targeted when teams go small, when they in fact target the complete lack of perimeter defense from the other 4 players and also the fact that they are relatively small. Playing small ball against Suns isn't a viable strategy because they arguably have the best set of perimeter defenders in the league. For teams that can it's a very good idea to drive and kickout when you reach Gobert because no one is going to prevent you from driving and no one is going to mark your teammates on the outside.
If anything the Suns should be a good example of how you can use a true rim protector with relatively small players around him. Both Gobert and Ayton need little help inside and ideally they don't have to find themselves defending the perimeter often, with or without help. The other option would be to defend like the Bucks where Lopez doesn't defend the perimeter with too much aggression in fact they dare you to beat them with threes and deny the inside. The Jazz do neither of these things, they don't defend the perimeter and they leave Gobert alone inside, he is generally enough of a menace but when you reach the playoffs, you face the best offenses in the league, you can't have a one-man defense, the other players have to provide something.
Gobert does struggle when he has to move all the way out to the perimeter, not so much on the ball as he can hold his own against most players except the fastest guards, but on rotations. Ayton is a lot more mobile and doesn't struggle as much. But the key difference is Gobert is unlikely to get feeds on the inside to punish smaller defenders, he still relies on on ball initiator to drive into the paint and throw him lobs
Ayton is quite simply much more of a problem to deal with on small ball lineups than Gobert because of his offence
He shouldn't have to move all the way out to the perimeter, that's in itself pure idiocy, there shouldn't be a defensive scheme that expects him to do it a meaningful amount of time. It's like suggesting that a guard struggles in the post against bigs. Ayton struggles against guards on the perimeter as do every single actual centers in this league and Gobert is far from the worst in that department.
And all centers at the exception of Jokic and to a far lesser extent KAT heavily rely on ball initiators to feed them, it's a none issue and we are talking about a 15 ppg defensive player who is ignored by his playmakers, on top of his points and offensive rebounds, he is also their main screen setter. So Gobert is not really a liability offensively, he is also not a liability defensively during the playoffs. The liability of the Jazz is the same liability that they have during the regular season which is inconsistent playmaking and terrible perimeter defense.
And I have to ask at which point people to convinced themselves that it was a good argument to say that a true center can't hold the perimeter against the fastest guards, the best wing defenders can't do it either? It's a common yet incredibly dumb point.
I'm not saying Gobert is a liability. I'm saying Ayton is a much bigger problem for small ball lineups
Also how dare you forget this season's MVP
Also how dare you forget this season's MVP
You wrote this:
So you definitely suggested that he was a liabilty which is wrong the issue is the absence of even passable perimeter defenders, to the point where Gobert often has to cover both the wing and the paint. And Ayton isn't a problem from small ball lineups, Paul, Crowder and Bridges are a problem for small ball because you could arguably make the point that they are the best defenders in the league in their position. Ayton has far less to deal with than Gobert in particular when it comes to small ball.
Uh? No. Pretty clear what i said was Gobert's struggles against small ball lineups came down to his teammates more than him
Fair enough but that's not clear even in that post. You are essentially saying that the Jazz's struggles against small ball aren't down to Gobert?
I' saying Gobert's struggles against small ball come down to the Jazz doing a piss poor job of helping him on defence and using him to punish smaller defenders on offence. Gobert can be a perfectly useful player against small ball, just not on this jazz team
That said, Ayton is just plain better against small ball
CP3 already got his contract renewal, he's signed for the next 3 seasons that will take him to age 40 IIRC. But ya, real concern about if and when Sarver will do Sarver things.
Giannis is scary though. If Boston/Miami's defense cannot stop him, I don't know how anyone in the West can do so. And I also think that those three teams have the best defenses in the league.
Grizz going very physical here.