NBA 2021-2022

Piratesoup said:
:lol:
I wish Luka had Troells social media game.
Gobert seems to rob everybody the wrong way, though. He's gotta be the most hated player among his peers in the NBA and nobody seems to know exactly why.
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I don't know about the players, but the time he played down Covid by rubbing every mic on the press room (mere days before the NBA shuts down because of Covid) was the time I started to think he's a bit of a cnut.

edit: it was 2 years ago today
 
giorno said:
Apparently the Nuggets are the best team in the league by rating with Jokic on the floor and the worst team in the league with him off the floor :lol:

He's having a better season than last year. But, also, he did win last year and Embiid kind of deserves it too...
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Jokic is clear MVP

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R'hllor said:
Dunno is that still the case but pts difference between him on/off the floor till recently was something like 20+ pts.
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It was definitely the case as of a month ago. Not sure now, but it wouldn't have moved much if it has at all.
 
giorno said:
It isn't though. Embiid has been the single most dominant and unstoppable player in the league, until the Harden trade he was carrying a rather middling supporting cast himself too, he's a ridiculous force at both ends of the floor. Jokic might beat him when it comes to advanced numbers, but only just, and the eye test says Embiid might be the best player in the world. Throw in Joker winning last year, and yeah. Embiid fully deserves the award. So does Jokic. And Giannis. Any of the 3 can win and it would be fair

Personally i'd give it to Embiid though. Nobody dominates like him


Nah. The nuggets are like 1 win behind and the sixers have the same record. Luka just doesn't have the body of work this season, the others have been monsters all season long, unlike him
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Articulate what you mean by dominates.

Jokic is the whole entire team at this point, he dominates every facet of the game - scoring, boards, play-making and defensively. You can easily argue that Jokic is a more dominant player because he controls the entire game for the Nuggets. That's not the case for Embiid.

This argument is akin to the Messi v Ronaldo stuff of yesteryear. Both players are offensive threats, but only one of them is the playmaker and distributor for their side. It's an entirely whole element of the game that Embiid doesn't have to worry about, whilst the Joker is easily one of the best few players in the league at it.

Jokic has more game winning blocks, plus he's leading in steals for big men and leading in tipped/deflected balls for big men.
 
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JPRouve said:
It's the all-NBA and defensive player of the years award competition. The NBA is probably the nastiest context when it comes to people hating on players that are against their favorites. Until Edwards made himself known for being laid back and joking around, a lot of people were hating on him because he wasn't Lamelo Ball and they only wanted Ball as the ROTY. You have many people hating on KAT due to the competition with Embid, you currently have people hating on Jokic due to the competition with Embid, the same applies to Giannis.

Actually I was watching this yesterday which kind of applies to some of them:

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Nick Wrong is an absolute clown. The clown doesn't watch Nuggets games and simply has a hard on for specific players, and that's it. A budget Skip Clueless.
 
Beasley was a possible target for the trade deadline and teams seemingly overlooked him. I wonder how many contenders are now regretting not buying low.
 
JPRouve said:
It's the all-NBA and defensive player of the years award competition. The NBA is probably the nastiest context when it comes to people hating on players that are against their favorites. Until Edwards made himself known for being laid back and joking around, a lot of people were hating on him because he wasn't Lamelo Ball and they only wanted Ball as the ROTY. You have many people hating on KAT due to the competition with Embid, you currently have people hating on Jokic due to the competition with Embid, the same applies to Giannis.

Actually I was watching this yesterday which kind of applies to some of them:

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didn't realise you watch Lo. Ever been in his Twitter spaces? I join sometimes
 
Stacks said:
didn't realise you watch Lo. Ever been in his Twitter spaces? I join sometimes
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No, I only read twitter. I get wound up by something almost every single times.
 
Voter fatigue is such a ridiculous notion. No one cares if you're bored of the same guy winning. If he deserves it, then he deserves it.
 
ZDwyr said:
Voter fatigue is such a ridiculous notion. No one cares if you're bored of the same guy winning. If he deserves it, then he deserves it.
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And shouldn't that be more relevant for Embiid? I seem to remember that he has been mentioned and lobbied as an MVP for several years which isn't the case for Jokic.
 
JPRouve said:
And shouldn't that be more relevant for Embiid? I seem to remember that he has been mentioned and lobbied as an MVP for several years which isn't the case for Jokic.
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Has he? I don't think so. I mean... Jokic literally won it last year.
 
Piratesoup said:
Has he? I don't think so. I mean... Jokic literally won it last year.
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Jokic winning it last year doesn't really go against the point made, in fact last year the argument in mainstream media including among voters was that Jokic was only their pick due to fitness, that Embiid was better but missing too many games which to me is ridiculous Jokic was simply better.

And Embiid has been considered as a legitimate MVP candidate for several years while Jokic hasn't. So talking about voters fatigue is a bit strange because Jokic is the new kid in the block not Embiid.
 
JPRouve said:
Jokic winning it last year doesn't really go against the point made, in fact last year the argument in mainstream media including among voters was that Jokic was only their pick due to fitness, that Embiid was better but missing too many games which to me is ridiculous Jokic was simply better.

And Embiid has been considered as a legitimate MVP candidate for several years while Jokic hasn't. So talking about voters fatigue is a bit strange because Jokic is the new kid in the block not Embiid.
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In 2020 Jokic got 9th place with 18 MVP voting points, Embiid got 0
In 2019 Jokic was 4th in voting with 212 points, Embiid was 7th with 49
In 2018 Jokic got 0 points and Embiid 4, good enough for 12th place.
In 2017 both got 0 points.

Going by that Jokic has been a more legitimate MVP candidate for quite a while.
 
Piratesoup said:
In 2020 Jokic got 9th place with 18 MVP voting points, Embiid got 0
In 2019 Jokic was 4th in voting with 212 points, Embiid was 7th with 49
In 2018 Jokic got 0 points and Embiid 4, good enough for 12th place.
In 2017 both got 0 points.

Going by that Jokic has been a more legitimate MVP candidate for quite a while.
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So in your opinion since 2018 Jokic has had more media talks and more lobbying than Embiid? Because that's the point of the conversation, it's not about who actually got more votes since that includes voters that are nowhere near mainstream media.
 
JPRouve said:
So in your opinion since 2018 Jokic has had more media talks and more lobbying than Embiid? Because that's the point of the conversation, it's not about who actually got more votes since that includes voters that are nowhere near mainstream media.
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I can't remember Embiid getting any MVP media attention until this season at all, he mostly got flak for not living up to his potential and "not dominating enough" and being injured way too often. So yes, Jokic got more hype in my opinion, as little as it was prior to last season.
 
Piratesoup said:
I can't remember Embiid getting any MVP media attention until this season at all, he mostly got flak for not living up to his potential and "not dominating enough" and being injured way too often. So yes, Jokic got more hype in my opinion, as little as it was prior to last season.
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That's surprising, I'm too lazy to tweak my search for beyond 18 months but as you can see it was already in the conversation on ESPN in two years ago.






 
ZDwyr said:
Voter fatigue is such a ridiculous notion. No one cares if you're bored of the same guy winning. If he deserves it, then he deserves it.
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Exactly, voter fatigue is really the dumbest thing.

I think it's robbed LBJ of multiple other MVP's.
 
Even during good times Timberwolves' historical mediocrity shines. They won 6 straight games for the first time since 2004. :lol:
 
If you think that Jokic got more coverage/attention last year and this year in mainstream media compared to Embiid and others, will tell you right now, you couldnt be more wrong. Majority of last season and this, he gets mentioned here and there but even then its not clean praise or showing proper respect, not to mention people like Nick W. with some absurd disrespected statements. Whole last year it was Jokic vs X, where X should win it, then X drops off, then its Jokic vs Y, Y should be or is in front, Y falls off, give next guy in line etc., it got really silly at the end with whole he won it only due other 20 players were injured, cherry on top with Nick saying how if he wins it, he would be worst MVP in last 40 years or something dunno.

Personally dont care that much when it comes to discussion, they have to create some bullshit to discuss about, also whole small market teams suffering for it, find it stupid but guess money is money. What i mind is when so called experts not presenting whole picture or talking some nonsense, like Steven A. for example claiming his MVP is Embiid, which is fine but his reasoning for it is that Embiid is doing everything as Jokic on the same level but his edge is athleticism, which is just laughable. Not only Jokic has more rebounds, better FG% and there is no universe where Embiid is on the same level as Jokic when it comes to assists and playmaking/passing ability.
 
Piratesoup said:
Has he? I don't think so. I mean... Jokic literally won it last year.
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Winning a vote has nothing to do with hype in the media etc. majority of voters arent main guys in mainstream circle that have their own shows, panels etc.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
It was definitely the case as of a month ago. Not sure now, but it wouldn't have moved much if it has at all.
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Think bench improved a bit with Cousins being backup center, until certain point, their bench was in deep minus every single game. Also dropping Campazo and giving that role to rookie Bones also improved things.
 
I will admit that I don't watch ESPN or FOX Sports because it feels like these clowsn crown a different MVP race leader more often than I change my underwear, so I guess you're right in that regard.
 
R'hllor said:
Think bench improved a bit with Cousins being backup center, until certain point, their bench was in deep minus every single game. Also dropping Campazo and giving that role to rookie Bones also improved things.
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It's been an interesting turn around for us, at one point we had arguably the deepest roster in the league (a few seasons ago). But have since gone on to shed some decent backup players and have a thin roster now.

Though once Maple Jordan and MPJ return we will have a nice rotation.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
It's been an interesting turn around for us, at one point we had arguably the deepest roster in the league (a few seasons ago). But have since gone on to shed some decent backup players and have a thin roster now.

Though once Maple Jordan and MPJ return we will have a nice rotation.
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Wiggins is Maple Jordan :nono:
 
R'hllor said:
If you think that Jokic got more coverage/attention last year and this year in mainstream media compared to Embiid and others, will tell you right now, you couldnt be more wrong. Majority of last season and this, he gets mentioned here and there but even then its not clean praise or showing proper respect, not to mention people like Nick W. with some absurd disrespected statements. Whole last year it was Jokic vs X, where X should win it, then X drops off, then its Jokic vs Y, Y should be or is in front, Y falls off, give next guy in line etc., it got really silly at the end with whole he won it only due other 20 players were injured, cherry on top with Nick saying how if he wins it, he would be worst MVP in last 40 years or something dunno.

Personally dont care that much when it comes to discussion, they have to create some bullshit to discuss about, also whole small market teams suffering for it, find it stupid but guess money is money. What i mind is when so called experts not presenting whole picture or talking some nonsense, like Steven A. for example claiming his MVP is Embiid, which is fine but his reasoning for it is that Embiid is doing everything as Jokic on the same level but his edge is athleticism, which is just laughable. Not only Jokic has more rebounds but there is no universe where Embiid is on the same level as Jokic when it comes to assists and playmaking/passing ability.
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That's exactly how I saw it and it was the same on podcasts. I don't care much about MVP and all NBA teams but I do believe that one of the reason certain players are disliked by the public or overlooked comes from how they are talked about within those awards conversations. Here you have Broussard doing a shameless 180 and there is an interview where he base his u-turn on durability but I can't find it.


 
cesc's_mullet said:
It's been an interesting turn around for us, at one point we had arguably the deepest roster in the league (a few seasons ago). But have since gone on to shed some decent backup players and have a thin roster now.

Though once Maple Jordan and MPJ return we will have a nice rotation.
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Right now if Jamal and MPJ come back 100%, that starting 5 looking solid, AG trade was really good, MPJ needs to improve his baby hands handling, personally not a fan of Barton, he has his moments but then he ruins it all with a force hype, making some stupid decisions. Bench would be decent, Boogie with double Greens, Zeke and Bones are at decent spot, Morris leading that bench is safe option etc.
 
JPRouve said:
That's exactly how I saw it and it was the same on podcasts. I don't care much about MVP and all NBA teams but I do believe that one of the reason certain players are disliked by the public or overlooked comes from how they are talked about within those awards conversations. Here you have Broussard doing a shameless 180 and there is an interview where he base his u-turn on durability but I can't find it.


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Yea its just bullshit noise thats annoying for me, everyone have their guy, which is fine just stop with the nonsense. In here they mocked ZL, not even acting proper and 2 months later...while nothing really changed when it comes to team standings etc.



 
R'hllor said:
Right now if Jamal and MPJ come back 100%, that starting 5 looking solid, AG trade was really good, MPJ needs to improve his baby hands handling, personally not a fan of Barton, he has his moments but then he ruins it all with a force hype, making some stupid decisions. Bench would be decent, Boogie with double Greens, Zeke and Bones are at decent spot, Morris leading that bench is safe option etc.
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Yet not a fan of Barton and have been wanting him traded for years now. Though credit to him, he's been better this season (largely due to Murray and MPJ being out). Ideally he'd be coming off the line as a scoring option.

Jokic + Boogie, Nnaji
Gordon + Green, Green
MPJ + Reed
Barton + Forbes, Rivers
Murray + Morris, Bones

An improvement at SG is needed, which would allow Barton to play SF off the pine.

On a side note - Morris is an underrated player. His assist to TO ratio is ridiculous. Hopefully we see a combo of Joker, Gordon, MPJ, Murray and Morris at some point.
 
Ok somebody needs to tell me why LeBron should build a squad. This roster is absolutely shambolic.
 
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