NBA 2019-2020

SportingCP96 said:
Also a young Derrick Rose (MVP season Rose) was absurd.

Most athletically gifted PG ever. Think Russel Westbrook but much better.

We didn’t even get to see his prime either which is a true shame.
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Pre-Injury Baron Davis at UCLA was close.
 
Is Kawhi dropping out of people's top 5 players in the league because of how well the Raptors are doing without him? Personally I think he is a top 5 player, easily.
 
RobinLFC said:


Surprised about that.
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is it just me or have they worded that poorly? I'm assuming they're only talking about game-winning buzzer beaters but the way they've worded it makes it sound otherwise which would obviously make it false as I remember Curry draining one from his own half v Memphis years ago and I'm sure there's others.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Is Kawhi dropping out of people's top 5 players in the league because of how well the Raptors are doing without him? Personally I think he is a top 5 player, easily.
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The Raptors still aren't getting much attention whilst the Clippers are getting tons, still. I don't think anyone would underrate Kawhi like that. If anything, all of the negative attention's on Paul George.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Is Kawhi dropping out of people's top 5 players in the league because of how well the Raptors are doing without him? Personally I think he is a top 5 player, easily.
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LeBron, Giannis, Curry, Durant, I'd have over him. I'd say he's in that next tier of absolute superstars just below those, with Harden, Lillard, Davis, Paul, ...

Pink Moon said:
is it just me or have they worded that poorly? I'm assuming they're only talking about game-winning buzzer beaters but the way they've worded it makes it sound otherwise which would obviously make it false as I remember Curry draining one from his own half v Memphis years ago and I'm sure there's others.
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Yeah think they indeed mean game-winning buzzer beaters!
 
RobinLFC said:
LeBron, Giannis, Curry, Durant, I'd have over him. I'd say he's in that next tier of absolute superstars just below those, with Harden, Lillard, Davis, Paul, ...
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Kawhi's biggest plus is that he can offer a ton of value on both ends of the court. He can get you buckets by himself whilst being a defensive menace. Whilst he doesn't necessarily get 30+ points every game, he will get you big pluses just from his solid 1-on-1 defending and good rebounding. For me, that'd put him up there at the top tier; the only reason he doesn't get their attention is because he was a bit of a late bloomer.
 
Kawhi suffers from the Duncan syndrome - he's great(at like anything he wants to be great at) without the flash, guys boring, now a meme for being robotic and has no real brand. Yeah he's worse than Duncan... says it all that he brought Toronto some long awaited sporting joy and a music artist was the bigger face of it.
 
Zen said:
Kawhi suffers from the Duncan syndrome - he's great(at like anything he wants to be great at) without the flash, guys boring, now a meme for being robotic and has no real brand. Yeah he's worse than Duncan... says it all that he brought Toronto some long awaited sporting joy and a music artist was the bigger face of it.
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He's kinda like Scholes in that respect; he goes about his business and doesn't seek the limelight like some of the other players would.
 
Zen said:
says it all that he brought Toronto some long awaited sporting joy and a music artist was the bigger face of it
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Inaccurate. I get your point but in Canada and the NBA, it was the season and summer of Kawhi.
 
mazhar13 said:
He's kinda like Scholes in that respect; he goes about his business and doesn't seek the limelight like some of the other players would.
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Great comparison.

On an aside, I think Boston could really be a big hurdle for the Raptors. Not sure they will make it past the second round. Hardest matchup in the east.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Inaccurate. I get your point but in Canada and the NBA, it was the season and summer of Kawhi.
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Right; I forgot how much commotion there was when Kawhi came to Toronto for contract negotiations. A large group of people took time off of work to go to the building where the Raptors were meeting him.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Great comparison.

On an aside, I think Boston could really be a big hurdle for the Raptors. Not sure they will make it past the second round. Hardest matchup in the east.
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I fully agree, though I'd argue that the matchup is closer than it seems. The one deciding factor between us is the number of turnovers on our end and the lack of defensive rebounds. Besides that, our FG% is better, so it's not like our shooting goes out the window against them. We just need to take better care of the ball against them, which is not easy against the Celtics.
 
What are you all talking about - Kawhi’s been regarded as the best player in the NBA by a lot of people since last year’s playoffs. At worst top 3.

Him being boring has also become a meme on its own, so you can’t even say that about him anymore.
 
Scarecrow said:
What are you all talking about - Kawhi’s been regarded as the best player in the NBA by a lot of people since last year’s playoffs. At worst top 3.

Him being boring has also become a meme on its own, so you can’t even say that about him anymore.
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That depends on who you ask. Kawhi's definitely up there (even for me), but I think people are starting to take it for granted rather than give it more attention.
 
mazhar13 said:
That depends on who you ask. Kawhi's definitely up there (even for me), but I think people are starting to take it for granted rather than give it more attention.
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That’s because we had 10 months of regular season which is Harden / Giannis territory. He’ll have a couple vintage playoff games and everyone will jump back on the train.
 
Scarecrow said:
That’s because we had 10 months of regular season which is Harden / Giannis territory. He’ll have a couple vintage playoff games and everyone will jump back on the train.
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That's if Paul George doesn't grab more of the headlines.
 
Scarecrow said:
That’s because we had 10 months of regular season which is Harden / Giannis territory. He’ll have a couple vintage playoff games and everyone will jump back on the train.
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I was never off the train. Top 3/4 for me. I think that the Raptors would be clear favourites if he had stayed.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Great comparison.

On an aside, I think Boston could really be a big hurdle for the Raptors. Not sure they will make it past the second round. Hardest matchup in the east.
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Are the Raptors even considered favorites in that matchup? I mean, what they’ve done, and are still doing, this season has been very good. But I feel the Celtics have a much higher ceiling than Toronto. But I guess Raptors have a higher floor than the Celtics, which can prove to be the key.

When is Hayward back?
 
Scarecrow said:
That’s because we had 10 months of regular season which is Harden / Giannis territory. He’ll have a couple vintage playoff games and everyone will jump back on the train.
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Well you can't just be off your game / take time off due to "load management" every year during the regular season, then turn up in the playoffs and expect people to rate you as a top 3 player. The regular season counts too. Sure enough it pays off if you win multiple rings going by that strategy, but if Dallas dumps them out he'll have had quite a terrible season for his standards.

There's no way I have him over Giannis LeBron or Durant.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Inaccurate. I get your point but in Canada and the NBA, it was the season and summer of Kawhi.
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It was very much tongue in cheek - and he was a bigger deal that he was because well, he was a free agent and courted as a finals MVP. You'd never see Jack get the attention Drake did compared to the superstar on the court from the sporting town - even in Tinseltown. I know Drakes a Degrassi king and all, but it was a bit crazy.
 
@RobinLFC Not necessarily disagreeing, but how can we even have Durant (and Curry) in the rankings/discussions at this point in time? They’re both in a limbo right now, and should at the very least have big asterisks next to their names. They’ve both been out for a year. A year is a very long time. If they come back and do as well as they did pre injury it’s all good of course, but especially with KDs injury that’s not a given at all.
 
The Rockets are in trouble here. OKC finally ditched Adams(who's offensively inept) and matched them in going small. Finding it easier to defend now and Dort has Harden in his pocket which means they can't collapse the defence. They're just putting up bad 3's at this point. Luckily for the Rockets Dort has 5 fouls.
 
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Someone asked what I meant by Harden being poor in the clutch, this is exactly what I mean.
 
SportingCP96 said:
In fairness too Luka he is the most talented player to ever come out of the Euro League.

What he was doing at 18 years of age literally dominating the euro league has never been seen before.

As I said before as long as he stays healthy he will pass Dirk.
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Found these old articles about Luka at age 17-18. The last one does a comparison with a similar aged LBJ.

I recall hearing the greatest teenage talent was Lew Alcindor but that was a different era by far, and there is the legend that was Earl Manigault.

https://www.theringer.com/2017/7/20/16077958/nba-draft-luka-doncic-real-madrid-f534e7428bf6

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20668236/there-never-nba-draft-prospect-slovenia-luka-doncic

https://us.blastingnews.com/opinion/2017/09/luka-doncic-the-next-great-nba-european-002008005.html

https://deanondraft.com/2017/02/03/is-luka-doncic-the-best-prospect-ever/
 
MrMarcello said:
Found these old articles about Luka at age 17-18. The last one does a comparison with a similar aged LBJ.

I recall hearing the greatest teenage talent was Lew Alcindor but that was a different era by far, and there is the legend that was Earl Manigault.

https://www.theringer.com/2017/7/20/16077958/nba-draft-luka-doncic-real-madrid-f534e7428bf6

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20668236/there-never-nba-draft-prospect-slovenia-luka-doncic

https://us.blastingnews.com/opinion/2017/09/luka-doncic-the-next-great-nba-european-002008005.html

https://deanondraft.com/2017/02/03/is-luka-doncic-the-best-prospect-ever/
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He won Euro League MVP at 19 which is just unheard of.

Not Dirk, Not petro, Not sabonis, none of these guys managed that and all 3 of them IMO are pioneers of euro league players in the NBA. Luka to me just feels different...Kid is really really special.

Yeah Kareem is arguably the greatest college player ever.

In terms of teenage Phenoms though I guess you can say Luka is to the the European game what LeBron was to the American one in terms of teenage phenoms.

Though Lebron was a better teenager than Luka IMO but that is no knock on Luka at all.
 
Skåre Willoch said:
@Sarni
I’m not disagreeing with anyone, really. And I really like Dame, great player.

I see the arguments about all the usual suspects being better, especially when looking at the entire season. And that’s fine. Luka is 21, and I don’t think anybody seriously think he’s the best PG in the league just yet. But he’s 21, and that’s what makes him so unreal and maybe even unprecedented (he’s European, he’s a PG, not physically unique, etc.). I honestly don’t think there’s been a 21 year old performing at this level since LeBron.
I reckon he’s already _one of_ the very best players in the league, but ranking them all is a very difficult task, and probably wrong no matter what I end up with. And sure, I’ll probably rank him outside the top 5 as well.
But if Luka keeps going with this career trajectory, he’ll be pretty high up on the pyramid when all is said and done.
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I would take Luka over Dame and I’m a Portland fan.
 
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