If I am KD, I am staying at Golden State. They can offer him the most money, new arena in San Francisco and let's be honest, Silicon Valley is the hottest destination in the United States right now. I don't know why he would even consider going to a horribly run organisation like the knicks, when he has the chance to threepeat and go for a 4 peat next season with the warriors if they win it this year. I mean lebron, for all his accomplishments, still has not surpassed Jordan in the eyes of many. I don't know why KD has to go to New York to save his legacy. His legacy is already set. One of the greatest scorers of all time at high efficiency, one of the greatest small forwards of all time. Just continue racking up the rings.
NBA 2018-2019
- Thread starter altodevil
- Start date
Indeed. Just get more rings and FMVP, and there is a realistic chance for him to be remembered as the second greatest small forward of all time and a top 10 player. He won't ever reach MJ/LeBron greatness be it at Dubs or at Knicks, so I don't see what he gains with this move.
He's a bitch who ruined the league. His legacy would absolutely benefit from moving to a lesser team and winning a ring.
Winning a championship with Knicks would be really special.
But, my personal feelings aside and looking at it objectively Golden State does make a lot of sense. Especially considering the state Knicks are in and that people started to see him as a main man in GSW.
Would absolutely hate it though.
His legacy might get hurt if he goes to Knicks and get regularly knocked out in the 1st round of play-off. Either way, am pretty sure he doesn't move without another superstar going the same way.
But, my personal feelings aside and looking at it objectively Golden State does make a lot of sense. Especially considering the state Knicks are in and that people started to see him as a main man in GSW.
Would absolutely hate it though.
His legacy might get hurt if he goes to Knicks and get regularly knocked out in the 1st round of play-off. Either way, am pretty sure he doesn't move without another superstar going the same way.
Anyone else watch Game of Zones. The new episode is a doozy.
Exactly. People talking about legacy are just tired of Golden state's dominance. And I also think social media has magnified this frustration. I would have loved to see showtime and Shaq-kobe lakers and the Jordan bulls in the social media era. People would probably be saying that Jordan and Pippen are too overpowered and Pippen has to go to a separate team or something like that.
why do players keep falling for embiids pump fakes
i just started reading Sprawlball by Kirk Goldsberry and it rules. Interesting writing and the visual data is so cool. Here's a few of the charts in the first 10 pages alone. buy the book
In fairness alot of 3's are open shots while midrange shots are contested quite a fair bit of the time. Midrange will never die no matter what analysts say. Taking contested 3's is a recipe for disaster which is why so many teams struggle to close out games.
Can't be dead while we're watching Durant, Leonard and Butler do what they do. No team is winning the NBA title without that threat.its already dead
What does this even mean? All those guys are good to great three point shooters and excel at getting to the rim.
Unless you are making an extremely pedantic point about how its not dead because Kawhi made a mid range shot in the third quarter tonight then I really dont know what you are saying. It's a part of the game whose importance has severely diminished, like set shots, zone defense and the four corner offense.
The author (and i) think the pendulum has swung too far away from midrange. I'd like to see them move the line back because as much as I prefer the current aesthetic style to the 90s style, the analytics revolution isnt close to done. And I think spacing and shooting is good but we need to carve out as role for post play and midrange again. One of the suggestions was a 3 second rule in the corner three spots, just like the 3 second in the paint rule.
Now, that's just bullshit. Durant did a move unprecedented before and it rightly drew harsh criticism, both from the media and the fans.
It just showed that he was the first one to be so clever and rational. If I were him I would stay at GS hoping to win ring 4 and 5.
Financially it really makes no difference whether he stays or he goes. The difference is the fifth year on the contract (only GS can offer it), for the first four it’s largely immaterial.
If you consider endorsement opportunities that moving to NY and being main man there will give him, he’s probably going to make way more overall there than he would in Oakland.
He’s not staying there, fortunately. I would be really, really surprised if he did. I think he has even moved his business offices from SF to NY already.
Nah, it just showed he wasn’t competitive and confident enough to try and beat the best but would rather take an easy way out. He was 3-2 up on the same team and couldn’t close because he was totally garbage in the final minutes of that game 6, he was rightly criticized for that along with Westbrook and instead of trying to compete again he just decided he can’t care about competition and wants a free ring instead. It’s not a clever move.
There is a massive difference between Jordan, Kobe and what Durant did. Not comparable at all.
While I understand and agree with your general point, he tipped the scales massively, calling it "free ring" is a bit OTT. The man went and earned it for himself.
They didn’t create cap space and load up on picks for no reason. I think they will get a second superstar easily and that could be Kyrie. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they got AD as well. If they get a top 3 pick and offer it along with future picks and some young players, that could be the best offer NO gets.
Not really. Warriors were by far the best team in the league before he joined anyway, massively unlucky not to have won in 2016 where they probably chased 73 wins too hard. Without Durant. He became their best player but it’s not like they struggled without him. He struggled without them, not the other way around.
Nah, from a rational point of view he made the right choice. Won two rings and was two times finals MVP. That is pretty good and makes it a very clever move, because he has actually won things that matter: championships.
Now, if you look at it through an irrational lense (was he man enough to do it on his own and so on; did he do it the hard way; did he win win the title on one leg and only three fingers on the right hand) than you can find tons of arguments even against MJ not being that great because he had an immensely talented support cast. So you can argue against it endlessly if you think it's more important to appear confident, competitive, strong than actually win a title.
MJ spent his entire serious career with Chicago and won everything in sight with them while being by far the best player of that team.
If Durant stayed with OKC and had a winning team there nobody would call him a coward for sticking around and not looking for a challenge. Similar to as how Curry, Klay and Draymond get zero stick for playing for GS.
Every single top 30-40 NBA player would have won those titles with Warriors. If Durant wants to separate himself from the great and be considered as one of the best of all time, he absolutely has to show he can win it without joining a 73-win team. And he knows it as well, which is why he will move and which is why he has been so frustrated over the last two years with people refusing to consider him above LeBron and wouldn’t vote on him in the MVP ballots.
Good luck to KD for winning titles with Knicks, he will probably be like LeBron at the Lakers next season and watch the playoffs from home
Nah he won’t. They will get a second star to go with him, and either a very good draft pick (anyone in the top 3 will likely contribute immediately, and Zion could be immense) or trade young assets for a third player.
The East is also weaker than the West. I think a team of Durant, Irving and Zion would have a great chance to finish top. Replace Zion with Barrett or Culver and it’s still a strong one. Replace any of those young players with Anthony Davis and you are laughing and probably winning 65 games straightaway.
He bottled, couldn't close the series and then joined the best team in the world. The very same that beat him. It will always hang above his legacy. How hard is it (objectively and rationally) to understand why he will never get the recognition the other stars who have the rings have? Why is he even thinking about leaving and will probably leave? You could only see how much Lebron legacy elevated from winning the championship with Cleveland. And rightly so.
I already said that I have my suspicion about his move to a franchise like NY and out of the comfort zone in which he is at the moment. This is because I have my doubts about him actually leading the team on his own to a championship and that is why I expressed my doubts whether him leaving is the right move at this particular point in time. He already made that decision, might as well go on with it. But, the only way to fully silent his critics is to leave GS and at least make serious title push with another team.
MJ argument is absolute nonsense. He practically build that team, nurture Pippen from the start and even stopped his trade in later years. They got Dennis Rodman for Will Perdue because Rodman was crazy as feck and most teams didn't want him. He was also 34 at the time and the trade was considered as a massive gamble. Do you remember how good Perdue was? Exactly.
There is too much smoke and it will probably happen. And yeah, Kyrie is most likely as a second star. Think that Kawhi will go to Clippers especially if they lose this series to 76ers.
I didn’t think Sixers had much of a chance going against the Raptors here but they’ve absolutely annihilated them last night. If they win game 4 then it’s curtains I think, and Raptors don’t really seem too play well under pressure.
Kawhi will 100% leave if they exit now. I must say I am quite excited about him at Clippers, I am bound to travel to LA every now and then for the next few years for work and will definitely catch as many Clippers games as possible while there (great value compared to Lakers).
Kawhi will 100% leave if they exit now. I must say I am quite excited about him at Clippers, I am bound to travel to LA every now and then for the next few years for work and will definitely catch as many Clippers games as possible while there (great value compared to Lakers).
Agree totally. Seems Raptors are just bottlers through and through. Except Kawhi, he gone.
Never meant to say otherwise but a free ring makes it sound like he was on the bench and enjoying the ride to the title like Swaggy P
No, didn’t really mean that he did not contribute - only that without his contributions they were still likely going to win those titles. I don’t think we would have seen another repeat of 2016 Finals outcome with or without KD, but they would probably not be massive favorites anymore this year due to improvements from other teams.
I don't know if they were gonna be likely tbh. They have always been a bit fortunate even with KD, specially when their opponents injuries.
Cavs would not have won the 2017 one IMO. KD was far and away the best player in the first two games (including James), and was great in the third game including scoring that three-pointer. Don't see any way how Dubs would have won without him. Games 3 and 5 were extremely competitive, and in the first two games it was KD who made the difference.
Last year I think that they would have defeated Cavs if they reached the final, but probably Rockets would have stopped them. KD has been Dubs best player in finals/conference finals (bar the one against Spurs).
Last edited:
Its pointless to say "without Durant" unless you also say "with Barnes, Barbosa, Bogut, Speights and Rush".
They had them the previous season where they lost, and were losing 2-1 the season before that until both Love and Kyrie went out.
Cavs were better in 16-17 season than in the previous two IMO.
Cavs were better in 16-17 season than in the previous two IMO.
The Cavs winning was a major upset. If they play 10 times, Cleveland wins 2 or 3. If the Warriors brought back the same team and didnt get Durant they would still have rightly been favorites.
And yet they took 6 games to beat the Cavs without Kyrie and Love in '15(and game 5 was very competitive) and lost to them in '16
Honestly, i don't think the dubs would have even made the finals last two years without KD(assuming Zaza doesn't take out Kawhi)
The Kobe and Shaq Lakers took 6 games to beat the Pacers. The 08 Celtics went to 7 games against the Josh Smith Hawks. The 09 Lakers went to 7 in the second round. 2012 Miami went to 7 in the conference finals. 2013 Miami had 2 7 game series. 2014 San Antonio had a 7 game series in the first round, as a 1 seed.
Remove Shaw from Lakers and they don't win against Pacers. Remove Kobe in 09 and they don't win the title. Remove James in any year, and his team doesn't win the title.
Remove Durant from the Warriors, and they probably do win his titles with them. Key difference.
Since I'm obviously biased I'll try and be as objective as I can.
In 2014-15 I was really surprised that they won a Championship. Coming off the Jackson 50 win season I expected to make the playoffs and maybe win a round but winning 67 games and a Championship was totally unexpected as far as I was concerned. Draymond and Klay had just turned 25 with Draymond having his first year as a starter. Steph was just starting his superstar run. I was shocked.
In 2015-16 they blew it. They chased 73 games when Kerr told them not too and by the finals even though they were not exactly running on fumes they were pretty gassed. Even with all that, without Curry's injuries and Draymond's suspension like @Eboue I feel they would have won it and it was a surprise (to me) when they didn't.
In 2017-18 I felt they coasted through much of the second half of the season. Injuries didn't help but they seemed to be on auto pilot for much of the time. I think the Rockets made them work harder than they expected to have to, but once again I wasn't shocked that they won another title.
This latest year (for me) has been the oddest of the lot. IMLTHO this is the worst team since 2015 since it is so top heavy and their main back ups (Iguodala, Livingston are getting older, and David West, Zaza and JaVale McGee are gone). Even though they are 2-0 against the Rockets, if Houston can win game three I think the series is far from over. If the Dubs can split in Houston I think the Rockets are done since nobody loses a 3-1 lead
. As for the Conference Finals and Championship (if they make it), I don't think either Portland or Denver can knock them off in the West but I think any of the top 4 from the East could make it interesting.
In 2014-15 I was really surprised that they won a Championship. Coming off the Jackson 50 win season I expected to make the playoffs and maybe win a round but winning 67 games and a Championship was totally unexpected as far as I was concerned. Draymond and Klay had just turned 25 with Draymond having his first year as a starter. Steph was just starting his superstar run. I was shocked.
In 2015-16 they blew it. They chased 73 games when Kerr told them not too and by the finals even though they were not exactly running on fumes they were pretty gassed. Even with all that, without Curry's injuries and Draymond's suspension like @Eboue I feel they would have won it and it was a surprise (to me) when they didn't.
In 2016-17 after adding Durant I expected them to win. What people seem to forget though is that they had an awful lot of cap space at that point to bolster their 73 win team in other ways if Durant doesn't come. Obviously landing KD was the equivalent of winning the jackpot and the rest is history. With the extra cap money though, I think it is very possible they could have won a Championship without Durant. We'll never know!
In 2017-18 I felt they coasted through much of the second half of the season. Injuries didn't help but they seemed to be on auto pilot for much of the time. I think the Rockets made them work harder than they expected to have to, but once again I wasn't shocked that they won another title.
This latest year (for me) has been the oddest of the lot. IMLTHO this is the worst team since 2015 since it is so top heavy and their main back ups (Iguodala, Livingston are getting older, and David West, Zaza and JaVale McGee are gone). Even though they are 2-0 against the Rockets, if Houston can win game three I think the series is far from over. If the Dubs can split in Houston I think the Rockets are done since nobody loses a 3-1 lead
. As for the Conference Finals and Championship (if they make it), I don't think either Portland or Denver can knock them off in the West but I think any of the top 4 from the East could make it interesting.
Last edited:
There is no guarantee to the Zion thing and from most accounts it's a terrible draft apart from Zion. LeBron also believed that he was going to get big stars to help him but nothing came through in the end . Knicks are the last team in the world I would trust with anything serious