NBA 2018-2019

Series is over. It would take a monstrous fight back to come back from 3-1 down. Don't think any player in that team has the ability to single handedly flip the series. Bar KD but we all know that "calf" injury is a load of crock.

Congrats Toronto you just ended the dynasty.
 
MJJ said:
Err not sure I follow that logic.
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I'll try again. Let's assume KD doesn't join the Warriors in 2016. The Warriors would still be favorites to make the finals . Ditto for the Cavaliers.

In 2015 and 2016, those teams split the finals 1-1. It's a safe assumption that, all things being equal, they split the finals again 1-1, in 2017 and 2018.

But that's discounting the fact that the Warriors were going to upgrade on Harrison Barnes after his no snow in the 2016 Finals. A slight upgrade on Barnes would make them favorites to take the next 2 finals. Instead, they got KD. Which locked it in. But KD's addition made 3 titles certain, not 2. The Warriors without KD have 2 chips IMO. Possibly 3, although less likely.
 
SportingCP96 said:
Series is over. It would take a monstrous fight back to come back from 3-1 down. Don't think any player in that team has the ability to single handedly flip the series. Bar KD but we all know that "calf" injury is a load of crock.

Congrats Toronto you just ended the dynasty.
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huh
 
adexkola said:
I'll try again. Let's assume KD doesn't join the Warriors in 2016. The Warriors would still be favorites to make the finals . Ditto for the Cavaliers.

In 2015 and 2016, those teams split the finals 1-1. It's a safe assumption that, all things being equal, they split the finals again 1-1, in 2017 and 2018.

But that's discounting the fact that the Warriors were going to upgrade on Harrison Barnes after his no snow in the 2016 Finals. A slight upgrade on Barnes would make them favorites to take the next 2 finals. Instead, they got KD. Which locked it in. But KD's addition made 3 titles certain, not 2. The Warriors without KD have 2 chips IMO. Possibly 3, although less likely.
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You are assuming that warriors play the same without KD and the only variable is Barnes. KD was huge that series, was literally unguardable. From a psychological pov the cavs went from knowing this is a side they beat from coming back from 3-1 to how do we deal with KD. I think lebron was guarding him that series? Which must have affected his offensive performance as well.

If the cavs win in 2017, I don't see them losing in 2018. But too many hypotheticals to know for sure.
 
adexkola said:
I'll try again. Let's assume KD doesn't join the Warriors in 2016. The Warriors would still be favorites to make the finals . Ditto for the Cavaliers.

In 2015 and 2016, those teams split the finals 1-1. It's a safe assumption that, all things being equal, they split the finals again 1-1, in 2017 and 2018.

But that's discounting the fact that the Warriors were going to upgrade on Harrison Barnes after his no snow in the 2016 Finals. A slight upgrade on Barnes would make them favorites to take the next 2 finals. Instead, they got KD. Which locked it in. But KD's addition made 3 titles certain, not 2. The Warriors without KD have 2 chips IMO. Possibly 3, although less likely.
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Cavs would have beaten the Dubs without KD in 17, even with a decent replacement for Barnes.
 
MJJ said:
You are assuming that warriors play the same without KD and the only variable is Barnes. KD was huge that series, was literally unguardable. From a psychological pov the cavs went from knowing this is a side they beat from coming back from 3-1 to how do we deal with KD. I think lebron was guarding him that series? Which must have affected his offensive performance as well.

If the cavs win in 2017, I don't see them losing in 2018. But too many hypotheticals to know for sure.
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Barnes is a huge variable. The Cavs were leveraged out with no room to improve. With that, the series against GSW goes to 7, aided by Draymond's suspension in game 5, and Barnes shitting the bed. The fact that you had to go to psychological reasons proves my point. The Warriors had more bandwidth to improve than the Cavs.

This is all conjecture of course. But there is plenty of evidence that the Warriors were fine without KD. He didn't rescue them from some dark fate. This series doesn't change that.
 
adexkola said:
Barnes is a huge variable. The Cavs were leveraged out with no room to improve. With that, the series against GSW goes to 7, aided by Draymond's suspension in game 5, and Barnes shitting the bed. The fact that you had to go to psychological reasons proves my point. The Warriors had more bandwidth to improve than the Cavs.

This is all conjecture of course. But there is plenty of evidence that the Warriors were fine without KD. He didn't rescue them from some dark fate. This series doesn't change that.
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Using that same logic, lebron went to five games without kyrie and love so the next year when he had them both he would defeat the warriors in 5 games. But we both know it didnt happen that way.

They replace barnes the next season and the series wont be played the exact same way.
 
Harry190 said:
It'd be funny if Toronto wins, Kawhi departs and somehow, KD comes in.
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Personally, I'd rather keep Kawhi. He's completely changed this franchise (along with Masai) and he's such a talented and humble guy. If Raps win, I'd say he has a shout for best player in the world in 2019.
 
Kaos said:
I’m buzzing :D

Also, I hope I’m not tempting fate, but I find the DaMarcus Cousins situation hilarious. The guy pretty much spent $25 million to try and buy himself an easy ring, and it’s possible he still won’t have it, and to top it off he’ll be considered an injury prone player in free agency.

He played himself, could have easily got a max(ish) deal from several teams.
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He could barely get anyone to give him MLE. He was never getting more money.
 
MJJ said:
Using that same logic, lebron went to five games without kyrie and love so the next year when he had them both he would defeat the warriors in 5 games. But we both know it didnt happen that way.

They replace barnes the next season and the series wont be played the exact same way.
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It's ridiculous to assume that a team that won a title, won 73 games, and goes to 7 games in the finals against a team with LeBron James, needs KD to continue winning titles. If you are not assuming that, then we are on the same page. If you are assuming that, then we are on 2 different pages.
 
Eboue said:
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8708579_orig.jpg
 
adexkola said:
I get a personal preference, but saying he's not comparable is just silly.

Plus the Warriors have a title without KD. They need KD because they stripped all their depth to get him, but if he left and they got deep (don't max Dray), they'll be contenders. They only needed KD to be overwhelming favorites. That's not a legitimate need IMO. No team needs 2 MVPs.
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Curry is a great offensive player, perhaps even better than Kawhi although not in clutch moments. On defense there is several levels between them.

Curry will still go down as one of the best point guards ever, don’t get me wrong I rate him super high. Kawhi though, these playoffs will be legendary if they end up winning the whole thing.
 
adexkola said:
Barnes is a huge variable. The Cavs were leveraged out with no room to improve. With that, the series against GSW goes to 7, aided by Draymond's suspension in game 5, and Barnes shitting the bed. The fact that you had to go to psychological reasons proves my point. The Warriors had more bandwidth to improve than the Cavs.

This is all conjecture of course. But there is plenty of evidence that the Warriors were fine without KD. He didn't rescue them from some dark fate. This series doesn't change that.
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KD turned them from ‘maybe they can win the title again’ to ‘no way in hell anyone takes it from them’. They are beatable without him, they are borderline unbeatable with him.
 
Fridge chutney said:
Personally, I'd rather keep Kawhi. He's completely changed this franchise (along with Masai) and he's such a talented and humble guy. If Raps win, I'd say he has a shout for best player in the world in 2019.
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He is the best.

I hope he stays. There was a time I wanted him to go to Clippers but it would feel bad now if he did.
 
charlton66 said:
Thank you. That saves me a lot of trouble beating the same dead horse. Just for the record: Kawhi in a series where all his team mates are contributing is averaging 30.8/10.3/4.9. Steph is averaging 32.8/5.0/5.5 in a team that is clearly hobbled. If those numbers hold up and Toronto win the series Kawhi will be FMVP. If the Dubs somehow come back (unlikely at this point) Steph will win it. Once again people are beating Steph up for somehow not contributing in a final. He is averaging nearly 33 ppg for heavens sake in a series where Cousins, Looney, Iggy and Klay are clearly not at 100% and the Raptors have done pretty much everything they can to make sure that Steph is not the one that beats them.
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He had 47 in game 3 where he was their only offensive outlet. He was disappointing last night, a bit disappointing in game 1 and wasn’t good in game 2 either. He has basically had one good game all series so far, and it was the ultimate empty stats kind of game as they never stood a chance in that one. It was like typical Devin Booker scoring 55 in a game where they were losing by less than 10 for 3 minutes out of 48, it really did not matter.

Kawhi has been on a different planet so far. Curry has been a let down.
 
Sarni said:
KD turned them from ‘maybe they can win the title again’ to ‘no way in hell anyone takes it from them’. They are beatable without him, they are borderline unbeatable with him.
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You know how many teams are in that category every year? 3-4 at the most. That's not a bad state to be in. They are beatable, yet still great favorites, without him.

Sarni said:
Curry is a great offensive player, perhaps even better than Kawhi although not in clutch moments. On defense there is several levels between them.

Curry will still go down as one of the best point guards ever, don’t get me wrong I rate him super high. Kawhi though, these playoffs will be legendary if they end up winning the whole thing.
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Better offensive player than Kawhi, both on and off the ball.
 
adexkola said:
I'll try again. Let's assume KD doesn't join the Warriors in 2016. The Warriors would still be favorites to make the finals . Ditto for the Cavaliers.

In 2015 and 2016, those teams split the finals 1-1. It's a safe assumption that, all things being equal, they split the finals again 1-1, in 2017 and 2018.

But that's discounting the fact that the Warriors were going to upgrade on Harrison Barnes after his no snow in the 2016 Finals. A slight upgrade on Barnes would make them favorites to take the next 2 finals. Instead, they got KD. Which locked it in. But KD's addition made 3 titles certain, not 2. The Warriors without KD have 2 chips IMO. Possibly 3, although less likely.
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Maybe. I'd have OKC ahead of them though.
 
Sarni said:
He had 47 in game 3 where he was their only offensive outlet. He was disappointing last night, a bit disappointing in game 1 and wasn’t good in game 2 either. He has basically had one good game all series so far, and it was the ultimate empty stats kind of game as they never stood a chance in that one. It was like typical Devin Booker scoring 55 in a game where they were losing by less than 10 for 3 minutes out of 48, it really did not matter.

Kawhi has been on a different planet so far. Curry has been a let down.
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Let's start with your first statement where you tell me Steph was the only offensive outlet in game 3. If that is your way of saying his team mates couldn't hit water from a boat I've got to agree because the rest of the team were crap. As to the other games, he scored 34 points in game 1 and yet you tell me he was a disappointment. What do you want from the guy? Once again if his team mates had pitched in a little bit more that game could have been won too. Game 2 he was sick, can't be helped - it is what it is and last night 9-22 wasn't great but he had 27 points so it's not like he was awful. All in all, you must have tremendously high standards for Curry because I don't know too many players who can average 33 ppg and still be a let down.

As to Kawhi, his team mates have been great. Every one of them who play major minutes has pitched in it at some point. Yes he has had a great series but he's had a ton of help. I'll say this, if Steph and Kawhi switched teams this series would already be over and the Raptors would be World Champions. Curry is better offensively than Kawhi and the Dubs are already having trouble scoring. Switch them around and this one is done.
 
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charlton66 said:
Let's start with your first statement where you tell me Steph was the only offensive outlet in game 3. If that is your way of saying his team mates couldn't hit water from a boat I've got to agree because the rest of the team were crap. As to the other games, he scored 34 points in game 1 and yet you tell me he was a disappointment. What do you want from the guy? Once again if his team mates had pitched in a little bit more that game could have been won too. Game 2 he was sick, can't be helped - it is what it is and last night 9-22 wasn't great but he had 27 points so it's not like he was awful. All in all, you must have tremendously high standards for Curry because I don't know too many players who can average 33 ppg and still be a let down.

As to Kawhi, his team mates have been great. Every one of them who play major minutes has pitched in it at some point. Yes he has had a great series but he's had a ton of help. I'll say this, if Steph and Kawhi switched teams this series would already be over and the Raptors would be World Champions. Curry is better offensively than Kawhi and the Dubs are already having trouble scoring. Switch them around and this one is done.
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I'm with you 100% when it comes to Curry but this 'World champions' stuff needs to end.. please?

I know it's a thing over there but it just makes no sense, at all. It's a bit like if I were to declare myself King of Japan after I beat my friends in rock-paper-scissors when we decided who should get the next set of beers from the fridge. I may have won the game but declaring myself King of Japan because of it just makes me look silly.
 
charlton66 said:
Let's start with your first statement where you tell me Steph was the only offensive outlet in game 3. If that is your way of saying his team mates couldn't hit water from a boat I've got to agree because the rest of the team were crap. As to the other games, he scored 34 points in game 1 and yet you tell me he was a disappointment. What do you want from the guy? Once again if his team mates had pitched in a little bit more that game could have been won too. Game 2 he was sick, can't be helped - it is what it is and last night 9-22 wasn't great but he had 27 points so it's not like he was awful. All in all, you must have tremendously high standards for Curry because I don't know too many players who can average 33 ppg and still be a let down.

As to Kawhi, his team mates have been great. Every one of them who play major minutes has pitched in it at some point. Yes he has had a great series but he's had a ton of help. I'll say this, if Steph and Kawhi switched teams this series would already be over and the Raptors would be World Champions. Curry is better offensively than Kawhi and the Dubs are already having trouble scoring. Switch them around and this one is done.
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I don't mind Curry. He's obviously a fantastic player and I haven't seen enough of the Finals to really comment on his performances. It does seem like he gets afforded the injury excuse more than other superstars, however. Whenever he plays badly it's usually because he's sick, his ankle is playing up, he isn't 100% from a knee injury etc.
 
charlton66 said:
Let's start with your first statement where you tell me Steph was the only offensive outlet in game 3. If that is your way of saying his team mates couldn't hit water from a boat I've got to agree because the rest of the team were crap. As to the other games, he scored 34 points in game 1 and yet you tell me he was a disappointment. What do you want from the guy? Once again if his team mates had pitched in a little bit more that game could have been won too. Game 2 he was sick, can't be helped - it is what it is and last night 9-22 wasn't great but he had 27 points so it's not like he was awful. All in all, you must have tremendously high standards for Curry because I don't know too many players who can average 33 ppg and still be a let down.

As to Kawhi, his team mates have been great. Every one of them who play major minutes has pitched in it at some point. Yes he has had a great series but he's had a ton of help. I'll say this, if Steph and Kawhi switched teams this series would already be over and the Raptors would be World Champions. Curry is better offensively than Kawhi and the Dubs are already having trouble scoring. Switch them around and this one is done.
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So basically you are saying Steph has been so much better in this series than Kawhi that if you switched them, it would be over.

I do not agree with this at all, this is pure fanboyism. The only game Warriors have won was the one where Steph had the weakest game of all 4 (obviously because he was ‘sick’ as Steph cannot possibly have a bad game without an injury/sickness excuse).
 
charlton66 said:
Let's start with your first statement where you tell me Steph was the only offensive outlet in game 3. If that is your way of saying his team mates couldn't hit water from a boat I've got to agree because the rest of the team were crap. As to the other games, he scored 34 points in game 1 and yet you tell me he was a disappointment. What do you want from the guy? Once again if his team mates had pitched in a little bit more that game could have been won too. Game 2 he was sick, can't be helped - it is what it is and last night 9-22 wasn't great but he had 27 points so it's not like he was awful. All in all, you must have tremendously high standards for Curry because I don't know too many players who can average 33 ppg and still be a let down.

As to Kawhi, his team mates have been great. Every one of them who play major minutes has pitched in it at some point. Yes he has had a great series but he's had a ton of help. I'll say this, if Steph and Kawhi switched teams this series would already be over and the Raptors would be World Champions. Curry is better offensively than Kawhi and the Dubs are already having trouble scoring. Switch them around and this one is done.
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Boy you trippin
 
That's an absurd comment given how instrumental Kawhi has been at BOTH ends of the court as well as shown far better basketball IQ than Curry. No chance Raptors don't fall apart if they lose him.
 
Interesting stat: top 4 teams in the East have so far gone 6-0 at Oracle Arena this year, outscoring Steph and the Warriors by 18.7 points per game on average.
 
Sarni said:
Interesting stat: top 4 teams in the East have so far gone 6-0 at Oracle Arena this year, outscoring Steph and the Warriors by 18.7 points per game on average.
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They're just lucky that Steph had the sniffles in those games.
 
Seriously this is the second time someone has posted this in the thread even though it's obviously fake
 
Sarni said:
So basically you are saying Steph has been so much better in this series than Kawhi that if you switched them, it would be over.

I do not agree with this at all, this is pure fanboyism. The only game Warriors have won was the one where Steph had the weakest game of all 4 (obviously because he was ‘sick’ as Steph cannot possibly have a bad game without an injury/sickness excuse).
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I'm not saying that Steph has been better than Kawhi in this series at all. I said if you switched them the series would be over - there's a difference. Toronto has been great defensively of which Kawhi has been a part but if he wasn't there they would still be great defensively. Golden State on the other hand have struggled mightily to score because Toronto have concentrated on Curry (box and one, anyone) and challenged everyone else to beat them which they couldn't do. If you switched the two Toronto would be hurt a little defensively but because they are so good on that end of the floor anyway it wouldn't impact them severely. On the other hand if you took Curry away and put in Kawhi the Dubs already crappy offense in this series gets significantly worse.

Hence my rationale for why it would be over in Toronto's favor.
 
charlton66 said:
I'm not saying that Steph has been better than Kawhi in this series at all. I said if you switched them the series would be over - there's a difference. Toronto has been great defensively of which Kawhi has been a part but if he wasn't there they would still be great defensively. Golden State on the other hand have struggled mightily to score because Toronto have concentrated on Curry (box and one, anyone) and challenged everyone else to beat them which they couldn't do. If you switched the two Toronto would be hurt a little defensively but because they are so good on that end of the floor anyway it wouldn't impact them severely. On the other hand if you took Curry away and put in Kawhi the Dubs already crappy offense in this series gets significantly worse.

Hence my rationale for why it would be over in Toronto's favor.
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The only game Golden State won was he one where mighty Steph was shite, errrr sorry he was ill. No evidence that they would have lost if they had Kawhi instead of him that game, it’s actually very unlikely.
 
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