The reason he doesn't want to play in LA, I think, is because of Shaq. The same reason why LeBron did not want to move to Chicago because of Jordan. They kinda want to create their own legacy. They don't want to be in others's shadow. Its kinda sounds silly but whatever. Plus Howard will get more money from Adidas endorsements if he moves to Brooklyn. So ultimately he wants to move there for more money.
Nba 2011-2012
- Thread starter ha_rooney
- Start date
I hope he doesn't win a Championship.
Interesting about the Adidas involvement and getting more money from them if he goes to Brooklyn. It's not as if he'd be poor in LA and he'd have a better shot of winning a ring in LA than he does in Brooklyn, although I am a bit biased.
It's been the norm for years in the NBA. Look at contract legends like Jerome James and Alan Houston (the latter a very good SG but not worth 100m, the former a man that had a handful of decent playoff games and landed a ridiculous contract) to name but a few.
Adidas are calling the shots. He gets a big increase for going to the New York area. He's also afraid of not being able to live in Shaq, Wilt and Kareem's shadow, and has a case of "the man" syndrome. In LA, he'd win 2-3 titles in the next 3-5 years; in Brooklyn they might get one, if that.
Adidas have LA marketed with Kobe and Chicago with Rose but need a high-profile guy in NY, thus Howard has incentive to go there.
You are right, the players do get paid their full contract, I don't know what I was thinking. Which is only fair, I think, the player only signed for you because of the size of the whole contact, you shouldn't be able to lure a top player in with a deal and then change it later. Though maybe NBA teams should put more performance bonuses in those contracts, to protect themselves.
I didn't watch much basketball between 2002 and 2009, so Glen Robinson doesn't seem that long ago to me!
Ah Jermone James. Had one decent playoff series for the Sonic in a contract year and gets a huge deal. Back when people were way more desperate for a real center because you had to deal with Shaq. Now you don't have to deal with a top center on a top team, people aren't as worried.
Do NBA teams not have insurance that would pay the contract of someone like Houston, who was fantastic and was brought down by injuries? I think they do, so that one may not have been as bad.
That's funny, I think in the old days people wanted to play for at team that already had a tradition, to be chosen to 'follow in the footsteps' of some legend was an honor.
I read somewhere that insurance policies cover players with career-ending injuries and other criteria, so I would imagine Houston and Brand are paid through those policies. I have heard that's a big problem with Stoudemire if the Knicks want to trade him - that club is on the hook for his full contract as the insurer will not cover him with his injury history.
Speaking of big men, what has happened to the quality big man these days? Look back at the mid-90s: Shaq, Olajuwon, Ewing, Robinson, even Divac and Smits were class. Some very good big man in those days. Today it's just Howard and Bynum (the latter nowhere near the quality of the mid-90s big men, not at the moment but maybe in a few years).
I agree with all of them except Smits. I don't think he was class.
I'd take Smits over any other center today save Bynum and Howard. He was a very good player, shame he was stuck in Indiana his whole career (like Miller). However, he was a shit rebounder for such a big man.
Reports coming through about a tentative Howard deal:
In the proposed deal, Howard, Jason Richardson and Earl Clark would be sent to Brooklyn, and the Magic would receive the Nets’ Brook Lopez, Damion James, Sheldon Williams, Cleveland’s Luke Walton and three future first-round picks, sources said. Cleveland would receive Orlando’s Quentin Richardson, Brooklyn’s Sundiata Gaines, Kris Humphries (on a one-year guaranteed deal), a first-round pick and $3 million from the Nets. Brooklyn also would send (MarShon) Brooks to a fourth team to get them an additional first-round pick to send to the Magic.
In the proposed deal, Howard, Jason Richardson and Earl Clark would be sent to Brooklyn, and the Magic would receive the Nets’ Brook Lopez, Damion James, Sheldon Williams, Cleveland’s Luke Walton and three future first-round picks, sources said. Cleveland would receive Orlando’s Quentin Richardson, Brooklyn’s Sundiata Gaines, Kris Humphries (on a one-year guaranteed deal), a first-round pick and $3 million from the Nets. Brooklyn also would send (MarShon) Brooks to a fourth team to get them an additional first-round pick to send to the Magic.
Next year there is no draft lottery. Orlando will take them all..
I assume they are not all next year's draft picks..
It really was the golden age of centers, and each was absolutely amazing in their own way. Olajuwon was probably my favorite, it's great to see a guy so big be sooo smooth. Plus he's about the most pleasant person in the world. He lead the league in blocks twice, rebounds twice and shots once.
But Shaq was probably even better, for all his size he was extremely fast, and a very good passer of the ball out of a double team. Of course he had one of the best teams in history surrounding him, something Hakeem the Dream never had. He was also a two time scoring champion, unlike the rest, he also lead the league in shooting % 10 times.
Robinson wasn't as powerful as Shaq and wasn't as smooth as The Dream, he was a nice middle ground between the two, and harder working than either. He could score a ton of points, was the scoring champ in 93-94 with 2383 points, more than Shaq, Olajuwon or Ewing ever scored in a season. But it's very close, in his best season Ewing scored 2347, Shaq scored 2344 and Olajuwon scored 2184. Robinson lead the league in blocks twice, rebounds twice, fts made three times, fts attempted twice as well as the scoring title.
Ewing was an absolute beast, especially with his advent of the one step then two-footed jump move that used to be traveling until one day it wasn't. But that's a bitter Pacers fan talking, he was practically unstoppable, and no one ever covered themselves in sweat like Ewing. He lead the league in rebounds once.
Best season stats
Olajuwon: 27.8 pts [93-94], 14.0 re [89-90], 4.6 blk [89-90], .538% [84-85]
Shaq:......29.7 pts [99-00], 13.6 re [99-00], 3.5 blk [92-93], .611% [07-08]
Robinson: 29.8 pts [93-94], 13.0 re [90-91], 4.5 blk [91-92], .551% [90-91]
Ewing:.....24.2 pts [93-94], 12.1 re [92-93], 4.0 blk [89-90], .567% [88-89]
Career average
Olajuwon: 21.8 pts, 11.1 re, 3.1 blk, .512%
Shaq:......23.7 pts, 10.9 re, 2.3 blk, .582%
Robinson: 21.1 pts, 10.6 re, 3.0 blk, .518%
Ewing:.....21.0 pts, 9.8 re, 2.4 blk, .504%
Their career stats are well worth a look.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/olajuha01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/o/onealsh01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/robinda01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/e/ewingpa01.html
As much as I loved Rik Smits, I don't think he belongs in the same sentence as those 4. He lead the league in fouls once. He averaged 14.8 pts, 6.1 re, 1.3 blk on .507%. At 7'4" he never had a season where he averaged 8 boards a game, and only 1 where he averaged more than 7. That makes Brook Lopez look prolific. Though he got the most out of what he had, and he was crucial to the success of those Pacers teams.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/smitsri01.html
Word is Pacers will match Hibbert's offer.
The Pacers need to retain everyone from their current team to make a stronger run next season. They were sort of entertaining to watch when they went up against the Heat. They won't make the finals though.
What the Howard trade currently looks like:
Yeah, the Pacers will struggle to keep up with Chicago and Miami, and maybe even Brooklyn. But signing Hibbert was the only thing to do.
The summer league started today. Jared Sullinger had 20 points on 6-12 shooting for the Celts, 6 boards in 24 minutes, and no fouls. Also for the Celts Dionte Christmas had 10 pts, 10 boards and 4 assists as a 6-5 guard out of Temple, on 4-9 shooting. E'Twaun Moore had 16 points on 6-16 shooting and 4 assists in 29 minutes.
They beat OKC, who started Perry Jones III for 16 points on 7-17 shooting and 8 boards in 29 minutes. Reggie Jackson, 2nd year guard out of Boston College, had 19 on 7-15 shooting, 2 assists and 4 TOs. Lazar Hayward, coming into his 3rd year out of Marquette, had 18 on 4-14 shooting [9-9 ft] with 9 boards in 37 minutes.
Tyshawn Taylor had 17 points on 5-13 for the Nets, with 6 boards, 3 assists and 4 turnovers in 29 minutes. Rookie Carlton Scott of Notre Dame had 18 on 6-9 in 18 minutes with 6 boards.
Center Kyle O'Quinn, who led Norfolk State to upset #2 Missouri in the first round of the NCAA tournament this year, had 16 points on 8-10 shooting with 4 boards, 2 blocks and 3 TOs in 30 minutes. 1st round pick Andrew Nicholson had 24 points on 8-16 shooting [8-12 ft] with 10 boards, 2 blocks, 2 assists and 6 fouls in 32 minutes.
The summer league started today. Jared Sullinger had 20 points on 6-12 shooting for the Celts, 6 boards in 24 minutes, and no fouls. Also for the Celts Dionte Christmas had 10 pts, 10 boards and 4 assists as a 6-5 guard out of Temple, on 4-9 shooting. E'Twaun Moore had 16 points on 6-16 shooting and 4 assists in 29 minutes.
They beat OKC, who started Perry Jones III for 16 points on 7-17 shooting and 8 boards in 29 minutes. Reggie Jackson, 2nd year guard out of Boston College, had 19 on 7-15 shooting, 2 assists and 4 TOs. Lazar Hayward, coming into his 3rd year out of Marquette, had 18 on 4-14 shooting [9-9 ft] with 9 boards in 37 minutes.
Tyshawn Taylor had 17 points on 5-13 for the Nets, with 6 boards, 3 assists and 4 turnovers in 29 minutes. Rookie Carlton Scott of Notre Dame had 18 on 6-9 in 18 minutes with 6 boards.
Center Kyle O'Quinn, who led Norfolk State to upset #2 Missouri in the first round of the NCAA tournament this year, had 16 points on 8-10 shooting with 4 boards, 2 blocks and 3 TOs in 30 minutes. 1st round pick Andrew Nicholson had 24 points on 8-16 shooting [8-12 ft] with 10 boards, 2 blocks, 2 assists and 6 fouls in 32 minutes.
How will the Pacers be able to retain Granger and West when maxing out Hibbert? The latter two will be seeking massive contracts soon, so that's about 50m tied into three players. Add in 10-12 additional players to fill out the roster and they're facing a huge payroll. I can't imagine Indiana being able to afford a luxury tax penalty in the future years. So one if not both of Granger and West will be on their way out in the near future and the Pacers are left with nothing. It's a dangerous move IMO.
Btw, that trade above does not benefit Orlando at all. A bunch of scrubs. Draft picks in the high-20s. It's amazing how these owners spent the summer of 2011 crying about salaries and players colluding to join forces and yet here are three clubs aiding one club in amassing a Big Five so to speak. Dan Gilbert groveled to the commish and fellow owners about the Paul trade to the Lakers and got that nixed. Now he's aiding a Howard-to-Brooklyn trade. Oh but wait... Cleveland gets a player they covet (and can sign as a FA, weird) and some cash! They weren't getting anything from the Paul to Lakers trade. Oh the hypocrisy.
Ridiculous.
Btw, that trade above does not benefit Orlando at all. A bunch of scrubs. Draft picks in the high-20s. It's amazing how these owners spent the summer of 2011 crying about salaries and players colluding to join forces and yet here are three clubs aiding one club in amassing a Big Five so to speak. Dan Gilbert groveled to the commish and fellow owners about the Paul trade to the Lakers and got that nixed. Now he's aiding a Howard-to-Brooklyn trade. Oh but wait... Cleveland gets a player they covet (and can sign as a FA, weird) and some cash! They weren't getting anything from the Paul to Lakers trade. Oh the hypocrisy.
Ridiculous.
Perhaps Gilbert thinks that by getting Howard to the Nets, he may be able to stop Bron-Bron winning another ring? I don't see why the Cavs would have any interest in seeing Howard land up in Brooklyn, as you say MrMarcello, it's very hypocritical from Gilbert to help facilitate this trade given his issues with the CP3 to LAL move.
@SportsCenter: "You never want to play for the other team but at the same time, there's really no true loyalty in sports" - Steve Nash.
Great quote that.
Great quote that.
I'm assuming that, besides Lopez, those players have one year contracts and are only there for those contracts expire at the end of the season.
As far as the Pacers finances, the internet says the luxury tax threshold this season was 70 mil, which is the important limit as beyond it you pay out. The salary cap is around 58m, but if I understand correctly that's not really important, there is no monetary penalty for being above it.
Last season Granger was paid 13m, West 10m, Hansbrough 3m, George 2.5m, Collison 2.3m, Pendergraph 1.5m, Plumlee 1m, Stephenson 800K, Johnson probably the same, for 34.9m. Those may increase a bit for next season, I'm not gonna try to look them up. Hibbert is getting 14.5m average and Hill 8m, for a grand total of 57.4m.
I think Collison's deal goes up to 3m, and he will have to be resigned for more like 8m when he's up for contract, but still that's a fair bit of wiggle room. And the luxury tax threshold is likely to rise above 70m as it's gone up nearly every year.
Granger has passed his prime it seems from his stats, unless he has a fantastic season in his contract year I would guess he can be signed for the same or less, I wouldn't expect him to be in great demand. I quite like West, but we overpaid to get him when we were average as teams often have to do to get that extra quality player, as a pretty good team I think we could lure in another PF around the same quality for around the same price.
The Cavs won't be competing with the Nets anytime soon, and they're giving him 3 million dollars, that's probably all he cares about in this case.
Even without Cleveland's help the Nets were still going to be the team offering Howard the best deal, I don't see him going anywhere else.
You have to wonder why Howard signed that opt-in agreement last spring, he could be a free agent right now. Or is it about getting the 5th year in a sign and trade with Orlando? I believe that's what LeBron did with Cleveland, he was technically traded so he could get the extra year.
Hakeem at his best ruled them all.
What the Howard trade currently looks like:
fecking joke of a deal.
I wonder who Orlando will take with that 31st round pick.
Knicks reportedly giving 38 year old Camby a 3 years deal...
Knicks reportedly giving 38 year old Camby a 3 years deal...
He is a good backup to have.
Rarely.Yeah, but a 3 years deal? The only thing I can see there is that it's a sneaky way of paying him more but spreading it out over and extra year for the sake of the luxury tax. Surely they don't expect him to be as good at 41 as he is now?
I can't even name a player I've seen play at 40.
The D12 circus continues with Cleveland now out of the trade talks as the 3rd team and Orlando also now speaking to other teams. Although it seems a move to LA is dead.
Meanwhile, Blake Griffin has taken timeout from dunking to agree a five-year contract extension. Apparently it's worth $95 million which isn't too bad.
Meanwhile, Blake Griffin has taken timeout from dunking to agree a five-year contract extension. Apparently it's worth $95 million which isn't too bad.
Really, you know there is this one player who is known as the greatest of all time! He goes by the name of Jordan, Michael Jordan!
Yeah a fair few have gone into their 40's. But seeing so many 3 year deals this year is crazy, Nash, Kidd, Duncan, Garnett, Allen, Camby is kind of odd. But fitness levels are higher now for longer so all of them should be able to do a job fulfilling them, all are solid deals.
Lance Stephenson had a terrific game for the Pacers against the Thunder in their 2nd summer league game, with 28 points on 10-14 shooting with 7 assists in 34 minutes. As a 6'5" point guard with good speed he's a handful on offense, he can drive and pull up or take the step back 3, I enjoyed the bit of the game I watched, he was going really hard and so was Reggie Jackson the PG for the Thunder.
John Stockton's son is playing for the Jazz, he had 5 assists today to go with 31 pts from 2nd year man Alec Burks, the 12th pick last year.
John Stockton's son is playing for the Jazz, he had 5 assists today to go with 31 pts from 2nd year man Alec Burks, the 12th pick last year.
Rashard Lewis has signed with the Heat according to ESPN. Another good addition to their roster.
I'm sure he was one of the highest paid players in the NBA at one point, but apparently he will not be earning much in Miami and instead, like Allen, he has agreed to join for a lower salary on the basis that he has a great chance of winning an NBA championship.
I'm sure he was one of the highest paid players in the NBA at one point, but apparently he will not be earning much in Miami and instead, like Allen, he has agreed to join for a lower salary on the basis that he has a great chance of winning an NBA championship.
Stockton was still pretty good at age 40, as was Kareem and (Karl) Malone.
Apparently the Hawks have entered the Howard saga. He's from there but don't think he's mentioned a desire to join them. Not sure what they would have to give up for him, definitely Horford.
If they can keep Smith, Teague, and whomever else in such a scenario they could build a good team with Howard. But I think the crybaby will whine his way to Brooklyn inevitably.
Apparently the Hawks have entered the Howard saga. He's from there but don't think he's mentioned a desire to join them. Not sure what they would have to give up for him, definitely Horford.
If they can keep Smith, Teague, and whomever else in such a scenario they could build a good team with Howard. But I think the crybaby will whine his way to Brooklyn inevitably.
Lakers are back in it with regards to getting Howard.
http://content.usatoday.com/communi...iers-out-of-picture-bobcats-in/1#.T_zdtY7Ui-E
http://www.latimes.com/sports/laker...-dwight-howard-talks-20120710,0,5073282.story
http://content.usatoday.com/communi...iers-out-of-picture-bobcats-in/1#.T_zdtY7Ui-E
http://www.latimes.com/sports/laker...-dwight-howard-talks-20120710,0,5073282.story
What are the chances of Lakers getting Howard? I would love it, Nash Kobe and Dwight all together.