Moyes So Far!

Status
Not open for further replies.
A lot of people here seem to have completely forgotten about how dire our actual performances were in league last season just because we won the league. You simply can not undermine the fact that RVP bailed us out on numerous matches last season and our playing style was as bad or even worse then. Even SAF has been struggling to fix our team's issue with tempo and creativity so to expect someone new to come and turn it around in a couple of months does not make sense.

Having said that, just blindly giving a manager time will not ensure success. It's also laughable that some people are ready to accept our team finishing outside of top 4, while we may not have the best of the squads we surely are not that bad. A competent manager will be able to get us to finish easily in Top 4 even during a transition phase. While it's good to back your manager, there also needs to be some constructive criticism. Let's not forget that SAF recommended Sven last time around so we also need to be open to the possibility of having gotten the wrong guy.

If half a season has passed and we are still playing Young on a poor form over players like Kagawa or Adnan or Zaha and there is no clear progress in our style of play irrespective of results then Moyes will need to be under some pressure but not right now.

A lot of us have good feeling about Moyes but all of that at the moment is just emotions, hopefully soon there will be some facts to support these emotions.
 
Revan said:
If we sign Messi and he has 5 shit games, we wouldn't be going mad, because we know what he can do. If we sign Milner and he has 5 Milner performances then we would go mad because looking at his past we don't have anything to suggest that he'll ever become that great for us. Yep if Milner starts playing like Messi we would be very excited, but if Milner plays like Milner, well there isn't much to hope for.
Click to expand...


That's one player not one man making thousands of decisions for and because of 25 other men and more, just to add though if we sign Messi and he plays 5 bad games I can all but guarantee we would see posts that he could be finished/over the hill.

Edit:Can I change "finished/over the hill" to Moyes isn't using him correctly :rolleyes:
 
Brophs said:
A P.R. manager? I think he just needs to hire himself a how-the-feck-do-I-stop-the-'fans'-jumping-every-word-I-pissing-well-utter manager.

Or, as a bit of balance, what's being said in public is an attempt to manager the ridiculous expectations of supporters.

Yeah, four games ought to do it when you're trying to take over the biggest job in football, from a manager who had been there for 26 years and players who, in many cases, had been playing under him for years. It takes time to get your message across. Plus the players are basically getting off easily on this, when many of them have let Moyes down. Did Moyes' system cause Rio to get too square to Amalfitano at the weekend and let him run through? Did it stop Valencia doing his job and tracking back in the derby? I'm sure some of the fault is Moyes', but he's trying to shape his team in his image. It takes time.

No one gives a feck what the world thinks. This isn't X Factor. We don't all get a vote. He and his team around him have forgotten more than every one of us internet dickheads. He picks the team he thinks will get results. That's what happens when you hire a Moyes, who needs to have absolute authority over the club in an attempt to build another dynasty, instead of someone like Ancelotti, who just manages what's in front of him and takes his payoff down the line. Broadly speaking, I'd like to see Kagawa play more often. But if he doesn't fit Moyes' system, or he doesn't fancy him as a player, so be it. Better players than him have been and gone.

This is just nonsense.

If we lost a couple more games you'd have turned on him within the month. You post isn't exactly reeking of balance.

Possibly not. But to repeat, we're barely a couple of months into the season. How many managers could come in and immediately improve a Fergie team? It takes time, patience and allowing the manager to impose his ideas in the way he wants to. If he fails after that, then that's his issue. However anyone with a bit of sense knows we're miles from that point.
Click to expand...


Just on the bolded point, I think Moyes needs to keep more tight lipped, SAF had the press sown up, he fecked them off the minute they crossed the line and rightly so. I think Moyes is actually enjoying the attention right now and once the initial excitement has died down I think he will start to treat the press with the contempt they often deserve.
 
gasmanc said:
There's a lot of assumption in there mate, we don't know he would have signed Thiago we don't even know if he will be as good as he's hyped to be yet.
While I agree that Guardiola did exceptional things at Barcelona I would ask where is that creative juggernaut now ? Pep left the club when it was at the very peak of it's powers and we had the misfortune to come up against it for Europe's top prize but Messi,Xavi,Iniesta and the like where freaks, something we rarely see like our own group of "kids" in Becks,Scholes etc. I am not here to argue Pep's talent as a coach as we all know what he is capable of but Barca are now hitting the transfer market to bolster their own squad.
We may well have approached all of these top "branded" managers but perhaps our transfer policy turned them off, if I make my own assumptions here then possibly the board saw what Moyes can do on a limited budget and saw the perfect replacement for Ferguson and the perfect way to have our club make maximum return from minimum outlay (there is a thread regarding Fergusons final years).

We would all love to have a fashionable name in charge buying the best players and playing expansive attacking football but rather than making assumptions on what who would have done differently and of course predicting the future of the current manager then why not let it all unfold before casting judgement so early. No good will come off this negativity and it will merely serve to damage the club.
Click to expand...



Why wouldn't we? Even a retard can see that we need creativity in CM, something Thiago would have provided. Thiago's minimum release clause was ridiculously low, the player espects Pep and Thiago's agent happens to be Pep's brother. Honestly, this would have been a deal that not even Woodward could feck up.

Guardiola would have been interested in United, anyone would unless they have signed a deal with another big club or his club has had an unbelievable season (ex Klopp). As I said before I've got nothing against Moyes and I hope that he can step from being a mid EPL table manager that he's currently is. However I find it pretty hard to believe that he was chosen because of what he did during his career. His 'amazing feats' may have landed him a job with Newcastle or if he's lucky Spurs not Manchester United.
 
devilish said:
Two decades are a long time in football and things change. Take a look at this side. We once had some of the best wingers ever. Now we've got Nani, some promising kids and two one trick ponies. In midfield we had the best defensive midfielder of his era and one of the most creative midfielders ever. Now we've got a good DM and some random big guy whose more renowned for his aerial ability and his work with his elbows then for his vision, creativity and technique. Teams change and therefore the approach must change.

I agree with much of your posts and my point is to add another point (which is addressed to Manchester United as a whole INCLUDING the fans). We have some promising kids around HOWEVER we're light years away from the top European sides, whom, unlike us, have the HUMILITY to keep on adding top players to their squad in a bid to remain on top. Its time to get off our high horse and admit it. The franchise may be the best in the world however the squad certainly doesn't reflect that and in terms of players we're not the most attractive club there is. Once we stop with this 'United the best club in the world', 'No one can replace Ryan Giggs/Paul Scholes' and 'players would die to come here' BS then we can start rebuilding this side.

The strategy of buying mid EPL table club player signings in a bid to contain the spending has failed. Players like Young, Valencia and Fellaini may be great in keeping the fort in the EPL but they won't outclass Bayern or Barcelona. Its time for some brave decisions and some real investment. Id say cut the dead wood, give a chance to youths and invest the money on top quality players who would really make a difference in our squad.
Click to expand...

I agree with this. Not so long ago we had one of the best first 11 out there - with Stam, Smikes, Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Ole etc. However we had a thin squad at the time, the quality of the squad players was not great.

Now and since Ronaldo left and Scholes, Giggs, Rio, Vidic, Evra and Carrick aged now we struggle in the quality of our first 11. We have much better squad now and better depth, however the quality in the first eleven is severely lacking compared to the likes of Real, Barca, Bayern, Chelsea, City even Dortmund.

One has to be said, with this team last year we won the title and nearly took out Real in the CL.

In all those years one thing was constant - Fergie. Many were questioning his choices and his tactical nuisance over the years but the fact is he won titles with like 4 different teams that he build himself.

Now we have a champions team, but lack the quality in so many positions. Also Moyes has to cope with Rooney and his ego this year, to find his position on the pitch, to know the players, even to experiment to try to rotate the squad and to implement his ideas and tactics.

This takes time, so he will receive it. Yes I don't think he had the quality when he was appointed. He's not a winner and unlike Fergie who at the time won titles with Aberdeen, he has not shown the same. Even Martinez, his replacement has won the FA Cup last year with a relegation team.

However he needs time to grow and establish himself, we all knew what was going to happen when Fergie leaves - 1-2-3 years maybe we won't win anything as we have to accommodate to life after Fergie, and Moyes will bring stability at the time to the club.

Even if we finish outside the top 4(which I doubt will happen) Moyes will keep his job IMO. However the Board or whatever happened in the Summer has to give him the funds to create his own team and buy some quality next summer to give him the opportunity to challenge for the title next year.

The only worrying thing at the moment is our style of play or the lack of it, but I guess it will change after another 5-6 games...
 
devilish said:
Why wouldn't we? Even a retard can see that we need creativity in CM, something Thiago would have provided. Thiago's minimum release clause was ridiculously low, the player espects Pep and Thiago's agent happens to be Pep's brother. Honestly, this would have been a deal that not even Woodward could feck up.

Guardiola would have been interested in United, anyone would unless they have signed a deal with another big club or his club has had an unbelievable season (ex Klopp). As I said before I've got nothing against Moyes and I hope that he can step from being a mid EPL table manager that he's currently is. However I find it pretty hard to believe that he was chosen because of what he did during his career. His 'amazing feats' may have landed him a job with Newcastle or if he's lucky Spurs not Manchester United.
Click to expand...


Why, then? Why was he given the job?
 
Ole's_toe_poke said:
An interview on David Moyes. Interesting read all round.

http://thebusbybabe.sbnation.com/20...hester-united-scouting-staff-management-style


Does sound like he is an obsessive when it comes to player scouting and analysis. Will certainly explain why he wasn't perhaps prepared to take a risk on certain players this summer without watching them.

Maybe he keeps mentioning "getting to know the players" all the time because he likes to be extremely thorough.
Click to expand...

Fits in with what Simon Kuper wrote about his set-up at Finch Farm. I'm more than happy to give Moyes time. He's a good manager and will sort things out. Time & patience is needed though!

The way Moyes works, you can only judge him over that medium-term, when he's had a couple of transfer windows
Click to expand...
 
People make it out as though Fergie left the team in a flawless state. We were champions fair enough, but over-reliant on one player who happened to get injured early this season, while his replacement ended last season requesting a transfer.

The central midfield issues were also to be addressed by Fergie before he left, if he really planned for his successor (who had a tough enough job succeeding him as United manager) to be successful straight away
 
He's not being forceful enough in my opinion. He had a proper presence about him at Everton. I think he's, slightly understandably, standing on ceremony a bit so far.
 
This is it, I think. He's definitely been a bit tentative. The size of the club etc would have pretty much the same affect on every new manager, bar Mourinho and his ego.

He'll find his feet and fingers crossed by the end of next years summer window, we'll have a better idea of what Moyes can do. Although it is a World Cup year which can make the market a bit loopy so hopefully we get in early.
 
Thisistheone said:
This is it, I think. He's definitely been a bit tentative. The size of the club etc would have pretty much the same affect on every new manager, bar Mourinho and his ego.

He'll find his feet and fingers crossed by the end of next years summer window, we'll have a better idea of what Moyes can do. Although it is a World Cup year which can make the market a bit loopy so hopefully we get in early.
Click to expand...

Unlikely, no worldie will sign with us before seeing where we end up at the end of the season. Based on our transfer form, we will probably be very active, openly so, and chase them all into new homes before the WC. Yaaay!

I'm not being negative, it just struck me reading your post. We will, won't we?
 
antohan said:
Unlikely, no worldie will sign with us before seeing where we end up at the end of the season. Based on our transfer form, we will probably be very active, openly so, and chase them all into new homes before the WC. Yaaay!

I'm not being negative, it just struck me reading your post. We will, won't we?
Click to expand...

It's to do with Ed Woodward as well. I'm right behind Moyes but I have no faith in Woodward until he proves otherwise.

But by early I just meant before the world cup kicks off just to avoid a price hike in a player who performs well. E.g. Hernandez price would have doubled if we'd waited tilafter his World Cup 2010.
 
Ramshock said:
Wondering how many on here have said publicly or thought at least that they would rather have Martinez. I bet theres a few
Click to expand...

I said I'd have preferred Martinez. Not so sure now. I've warmed to Moyes because he will definitely be given the time he needs, and I like knowing he will be our manager for the long term. It's hard to find that assurance in football.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Why, then? Why was he given the job?
Click to expand...


Moyes had always worked under a tight budget without ever complaining. I doubt that he had ever asked ridiculous money in terms of salary either and he was at the end of his contract. I believe that such things are pretty much appreciated in a club whose not exactly renowned for going on spending sprees.
 
What surprises me the most from those quickest to criticise Moyes, is that they now place a level of expectation upon Moyes that they didn't expect from SAF!

So for those claiming expectations have dropped, have they really? They certainly don't seem to have dropped upon Moyes. The demands upon him have increased. The expectation upon the club seems to have dropped only because Moyes is apparently not providing everything the fickle fan is demanding, or it becomes instant proof he is not upto the job. Completely ignoring the fact that SAF did'nt fulfill much of the same criteria for a far longer period.

In 2 months Moyes has to somehow strengthen a midfield that SAF failed to strengthen in 6 years. On top of that Moyes has to also win the big crunch games whilst playing free flowing football. If he sets up to keep us tight, he is labelled scared and negative, yet when he plays an attacking line up, he was naive for leaving our aging defence exposed. It seems no matter what he does, little consideration is being given for the issues he has inherited, nor the fixtures he has had to face in only the first few games. It stinks of an agenda to me, those who don't think he is the man for the job, taking every opportunity to reinforce that biased opinion upon everybody else.
 
What amazes me even more is how quick some people are to dismiss a side that won the league last season as a side with a lot of issues somehow incapable of challenging anymore.

Expectations have stayed the same, don't exaggerate. If we'd gone on the same run under Ferguson people would have been disappointed too although obviously no one would ever think that he weren't up for the job.
 
devilish said:
Moyes had always worked under a tight budget without ever complaining. I doubt that he had ever asked ridiculous money in terms of salary either and he was at the end of his contract. I believe that such things are pretty much appreciated in a club whose not exactly renowned for going on spending sprees.
Click to expand...

Yes and that's why our owners gladly let him spend £27.5m on a single player without selling anyone in his first transfer window. Seems legit.
 
Sarni said:
Yes and that's why our owners gladly let him spend £27.5m on a single player without selling anyone in his first transfer window. Seems legit.
Click to expand...

27m arent alot of money in todays football. Even arsenal spent more then that. Another big stumbling block that needs to be considered is the salary. I am sure that Fellaini fall right within our salary cap.
 
devilish said:
27m arent alot of money in todays football. Even arsenal spent more then that. Another big stumbling block that needs to be considered is the salary. I am sure that Fellaini fall right within our salary cap.
Click to expand...
Fine, we employed Moyes because he's used to working on a tight budget. We should have picked some manager from League Two, they work on even tighter ones. Or even better - I'd recommend Smuda from Wisła Kraków, he doesn't have any money to spend at all. Foolish us, we didn't research our options properly.
 
apotheosis said:
What surprises me the most from those quickest to criticise Moyes, is that they now place a level of expectation upon Moyes that they didn't expect from SAF!

So for those claiming expectations have dropped, have they really? They certainly don't seem to have dropped upon Moyes. The demands upon him have increased. The expectation upon the club seems to have dropped only because Moyes is apparently not providing everything the fickle fan is demanding, or it becomes instant proof he is not upto the job. Completely ignoring the fact that SAF did'nt fulfill much of the same criteria for a far longer period.

In 2 months Moyes has to somehow strengthen a midfield that SAF failed to strengthen in 6 years. On top of that Moyes has to also win the big crunch games whilst playing free flowing football. If he sets up to keep us tight, he is labelled scared and negative, yet when he plays an attacking line up, he was naive for leaving our aging defence exposed. It seems no matter what he does, little consideration is being given for the issues he has inherited, nor the fixtures he has had to face in only the first few games. It stinks of an agenda to me, those who don't think he is the man for the job, taking every opportunity to reinforce that biased opinion upon everybody else.
Click to expand...

It's not about that though. People would have been able to understand it had we performed poorly and not won one of our big games. As it is, we didn't win one out of the three, and only scored one consolation goal in the process. Fergie would have been criticised for those results, but obviously people would have had more faith in him because of who he was. Moyes doesn't have that luxury. He'll have to earn it over time.

I don't remember when we played an incredibly attacking line-up in any of our big games either. In pretty much all of them, we were incredibly tentative and could've done with being more attacking, bar the Chelsea one where they were even more defensive than us.

Expectations haven't changed though. No one is expecting incredible free-flowing football, they're simply expecting us to score some goals and win the odd big game, which we haven't done so far. No one is saying we've got to be incredibly defensive to cover our ageing defence; they're simply dismayed when we ship four with 11 men on the pitch against our main title rivals. The expectations haven't changed at all; Moyes just simply hasn't been anywhere near to living up to them so far and until he shows some signs of doing so, he'll be criticised. If he can, people will praise him for it. If he can't and fails, he'll go eventually. I think some people simply want there to be an agenda from his detractors, when the reality is that some people are simply not impressed by him as a manager.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Why, then? Why was he given the job?
Click to expand...
Fergie must have obviously been impressed to a certain degree with what he did with Everton, but then no more so than dozens of other managers must have given what they've achieved compared to Moyes.

One positive he seemed to have over the alternatives (in the eyes of the club at least) was he managed not to resign or get sacked from his last club, which means he'll probably stay here a while, though that doesn't appear to consider the fact he needs to be very successful during that time to actually remain here - which a lot of other managers were more likely to achieve.

Another being that he's British, which I'd be disappointed to find out the club actually considers important, if anything it feels slightly xenophobic to consider this a deciding factor.

Every other criteria (for me, the most important criteria) he falls short of any number of managers - style of football, top level/European experience, trophies/success, taking a team to far above their station (i.e. CL), innovative methods, knowledge of European market...

It feels like the club have the idea that we're above every other club in the world when it comes to how to run a club, and ultimately the romanticism of a "Fergie-like" Glaswegian character taking over from Sir Alex and staying here for the next 20 years swayed it in his favour.
 
I don't think he was ever after Fellaini as his main target. All he needed to do was secure Thiago but he dithered as he was unsure sp he then twiddled his thumbs whilst Woody was putting in low ball bids. Then he felt pressured to sign someone when it would have been braver no to, so we overpaid for a player we don't need.
 
Hectic said:
I said I'd have preferred Martinez. Not so sure now. I've warmed to Moyes because he will definitely be given the time he needs, and I like knowing he will be our manager for the long term. It's hard to find that assurance in football.
Click to expand...

To be fair you wanted anyone but Moyes. Anyway what I would be interesting to hear from you, is why the warming for Moyes? Because he's now the manager and we must support the manager regardless, because of SAF recommendation, because you think that we're stucked with him regardless for some time so doing a 'Chelsea fan' like they did for Benitez will result with even worse results or you have changed your opinion about him (you rate him more now which I have seen this phenomenom happening here by a lot of posters)? Personally like you, I never wanted Moyes here and I haven't change my opinion that he shouldn't have become our manager. Anyway, I don't think that I've warmed for him at all, if anything until now he has done exactly what it was predicted by people who didn't want him here.
 
Sarni said:
Fine, we employed Moyes because he's used to working on a tight budget. We should have picked some manager from League Two, they work on even tighter ones. Or even better - I'd recommend Smuda from Wisła Kraków, he doesn't have any money to spend at all. Foolish us, we didn't research our options properly.
Click to expand...

I also think part of our decision to go for Moyes was that he had proved he could work without spending big and also wouldn't need a ridiculous wage for himself. We don't brake the bank for players and we wouldn't want a brake the bank manager. I don't know why you're bringing up league two managers as an argument, Moyes proved he could do well without spending in the same league as us.

Anyway I've already done this in another thread and dont really want to go through it again

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/uniteds-on-pitch-identity.377946/
 
UnofficialDevil said:
I also think part of our decision to go for Moyes was that he had proved he could work without spending big and also wouldn't need a ridiculous wage for himself. We don't brake the bank for players and we wouldn't want a brake the bank manager. I don't know why you're bringing up league two managers as an argument, Moyes proved he could do well without spending in the same league as us.

Anyway I've already done this in another thread and dont really want to go through it again

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/uniteds-on-pitch-identity.377946/
Click to expand...

Absolute nonsense. Whether a manager asks for £3m a year or £7m a year it makes very little difference for club's wage structure. As for being frugal with money they wouldn't have allowed him to spend £27.5m on Fellaini if that was the plan.
 
Sarni said:
Fine, we employed Moyes because he's used to working on a tight budget. We should have picked some manager from League Two, they work on even tighter ones. Or even better - I'd recommend Smuda from Wisła Kraków, he doesn't have any money to spend at all. Foolish us, we didn't research our options properly.
Click to expand...


A league two manager doesn't face the expectations and pressures found at a historically big EPL club who pride of a relatively big and demanding fan base. Moyes was scouted very well. The man overachieved with a very tight budget in the EPL. He never complained, he was always respectful towards his superiors and he never pushed the owners to give him more financial e-way. You do agree that he wasn't chosen because he's a proven winner don't you?
 
Sarni said:
Absolute nonsense. Whether a manager asks for £3m a year or £7m a year it makes very little difference for club's wage structure. As for being frugal with money they wouldn't have allowed him to spend £27.5m on Fellaini if that was the plan.
Click to expand...


As I said 27m aren't crazy money expecially for a club which pride to be the biggest club in the world. In fact we're not even amongst the top 4 EPL spenders. Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs and City had spent much more then we did. Not to forget the salary. I doubt that Fellaini's salary is over the top.
 
Sarni said:
Absolute nonsense. Whether a manager asks for £3m a year or £7m a year it makes very little difference for club's wage structure. As for being frugal with money they wouldn't have allowed him to spend £27.5m on Fellaini if that was the plan.
Click to expand...


Actually only spending £27.5 the summer after the greatest manager ever has just left, with a team that drastically needs top quality reinforcements in the midfield proves just that in my opinion.
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Actually only spending £27.5 the summer after the greatest manager ever has just left, with a team that drastically needs top quality reinforcements in the midfield proves just that in my opinion.
Click to expand...


this
 
devilish said:
A league two manager doesn't face the expectations and pressures found at a historically big EPL club who pride of a relatively big and demanding fan base. Moyes was scouted very well. The man overachieved with a very tight budget in the EPL. He never complained, he was always respectful towards his superiors and he never pushed the owners to give him more financial e-way. You do agree that he wasn't chosen because he's a proven winner don't you?
Click to expand...
So you think our board doesn't give a single feck about success and just want us to do fine on a tight budget? Is that the message you're trying to get across here?
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Actually only spending £27.5 the summer after the greatest manager ever has just left, with a team that drastically needs top quality reinforcements in the midfield proves just that in my opinion.
Click to expand...
I wonder if he might have taken Fellaini knowing the midfield needed some muscle and will take time to assess the premier league champions in depth this season in order to know more about where and how he feels the strengthening should be done.
Perhaps he should have rushed in and signed a few players that may or may not have slotted into the squad he only knew from an outsiders view. I reckon that would have pleased the masses to be honest.
 
Sarni said:
So you think our board doesn't give a single feck about success and just want us to do fine on a tight budget? Is that the message you're trying to get across here?
Click to expand...


If success is that important then we would have got a manager with a proven record on that. Moyes pride of having worked well with tight budgets and had produced some good talent in the process but with all due respect, he has won as many major honors as we (Sarni and Dev) did. Surely United could have attracted a more successful manager.

Profit is key here. Its more worth spending 20m and earn 50m then spending 50m and earn 70m. Honours are all but a bonus.
 
gasmanc said:
I wonder if he might have taken Fellaini knowing the midfield needed some muscle and will take time to assess the premier league champions in depth this season in order to know more about where and how he feels the strengthening should be done.
Perhaps he should have rushed in and signed a few players that may or may not have slotted into the squad he only knew from an outsiders view. I reckon that would have pleased the masses to be honest.
Click to expand...


We fecked up big time in this summer's transfer window we've been over this so many times.

And I wouldn't get excited about the January window either.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...David-Moyes-rules-January-spending-spree.html
 
devilish said:
If success is so important then why bringing in a manager who had never won anything in all his life? Surely if success is key here then we would have brought someone with a proven record in providing that right?

So yes, I don't think that success is thought as a crucial asset to our club. Profit is the key here and there's bigger profit in spending 27m and get '40m' then spending 50m to win 60m
Click to expand...
You're so annoying. Most managers haven't won a thing in their career, Klopp didn't win a single trophy before moving to Dortmund and Guardiola wasn't even a proper manager before he got the job at Barcelona. If you genuinely think that Manchester United board don't think success is important then you're even more clueless than I thought. It's a fecking football club, how is it supposed to stay on top and remain profitable if it's not competitive?
 
Tooni said:
A lot of people here seem to have completely forgotten about how dire our actual performances were in league last season just because we won the league. You simply can not undermine the fact that RVP bailed us out on numerous matches last season and our playing style was as bad or even worse then. Even SAF has been struggling to fix our team's issue with tempo and creativity so to expect someone new to come and turn it around in a couple of months does not make sense.

Having said that, just blindly giving a manager time will not ensure success. It's also laughable that some people are ready to accept our team finishing outside of top 4, while we may not have the best of the squads we surely are not that bad. A competent manager will be able to get us to finish easily in Top 4 even during a transition phase. While it's good to back your manager, there also needs to be some constructive criticism. Let's not forget that SAF recommended Sven last time around so we also need to be open to the possibility of having gotten the wrong guy.

If half a season has passed and we are still playing Young on a poor form over players like Kagawa or Adnan or Zaha and there is no clear progress in our style of play irrespective of results then Moyes will need to be under some pressure but not right now.

A lot of us have good feeling about Moyes but all of that at the moment is just emotions, hopefully soon there will be some facts to support these emotions.
Click to expand...

I haven't forgotten at all, but have we taken on a manager who can change things for the better, or is a just going to be same old stuff. It is almost like he is giving the players a rope to hang themselves with. The summer could be interesting if he is prepared to be ruthless.
 
devilish said:
If success is that important then we would have got a manager with a proven record on that. Moyes pride of having worked well with tight budgets and had produced some good talent in the process but with all due respect, he has won as many major honors as we (Sarni and Dev) did. Surely United could have attracted a more successful manager.

Profit is key here. Its more worth spending 20m and earn 50m then spending 50m and earn 70m. Honours are all but a bonus.
Click to expand...

I am kind of the same opinion here regarding Moyes record for spending and that being part of the reasoning for his appointment, however. Moyes has proven his worth taking Everton to consistent finishes whilst operating far and above the clubs actual spending power. He is a proven motivator and at times a tactical genius, his work ethic and sheer appetite for learning and constant self improvement are testament to him. Given time his ability to operate within a budget whilst remaining consistent will pay dividend, he has a larger budget to operate within and thus the natural progression should give his teams a higher finish.
Patience here is key.
 
Sarni said:
You're so annoying. Most managers haven't won a thing in their career, Klopp didn't win a single trophy before moving to Dortmund and Guardiola wasn't even a proper manager before he got the job at Barcelona. If you genuinely think that Manchester United board don't think success is important then you're even more clueless than I thought. It's a fecking football club, how is it supposed to stay on top and remain profitable if it's not competitive?
Click to expand...
The general thought pattern seems to be that you have to be successful in order to be successful, young managers stepping into big positions have no chance of cutting their teeth on the big stage these days and thus will remain inexperienced. AVB'S days at Chelsea and now Spurs seems to back up the fact that train of thought is somewhat flawed.
 
The man has taken on the most difficult managers role in the entire game after Sir Alex left. I refuse to say cnutish things about him so early on.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.