Moyes So Far!

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The odd thing about DMs appointment is exactly the thing which worries me about the next season or more. At Everton, he never proved himself. He sustained himself. Unless the Glazers give him a bottom line ultimatum that he is expected to win x trophies in x seasons he might successfully find that excruciating medium of survival without winning anything he tightrope walked at Everton, all be it at a higher level and with a lot more money.
 
Needham said:
The odd thing about DMs appointment is exactly the thing which worries me about the next season or more. At Everton, he never proved himself. He sustained himself. Unless the Glazers give him a bottom line ultimatum that he is expected to win x trophies in x seasons he might successfully find that excruciating medium of survival without winning anything he tightrope walked at Everton, all be it at a higher level and with a lot more money.
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He proved himself enough to be given the United job. Then again he is scottish, and had only Alex McLeish and George Graham for competition.
 
Bilbo said:
He proved himself enough to be given the United job. Then again he is scottish, and had only Alex McLeish and George Graham for competition.
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There were two or three posters who wanted McLeish a while ago when he won the League Cup with Birmingham. BaldwinLegend I think was one of them, he completely ridiculed me when I said McLeish was a pretty poor manager.
 
All I want is to watch some good football, I mean is it really too much to ask? I accepted the good times were over the day Sir Alex left, I swallowed that horrible bitter pill, and what did I get? David Moyes, who served up some real tumescent tripe over his decade at Everton, also once saw his Preston side live and they were equally as disciplined and dull, If we're not going to be competing for the forseeable future at least let me watch some nice football for fecks sake, Yea I know this is an utter waste of a post, Moyes has shown himself consistently to be as technical as a turnip.
Even if we buy 100+ million pounds worth of talent this summer, and it magically integrates itself flawlessly into the side within a few weeks and claim a top3 place I still doubt I'd ever want to watch Moyes football and probably never will thats what really annoys me most in this annus horribilis.
 
Ekeke said:
He gave him 3 appearances and would have had more if he committed. We didnt do enough, but thats besides the point. We rated him and gave him games and tried to get him to stay, the exact opposite of Mustafi and Moyes. You dont have a point. And no Everton werent well stocked with international class German Cbs
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And he would have committed if there was any sign he was being integrated to the first team which he wasn't because we were playing players out of position in his. Anyway we didn't do enough.

Having done some research it appears Mustafi did play one game for the club, as a sub in Europe against Bate Borisov in 2009 in the Europa League. Everton had Jagielka, Distin and Heitinga in those positions. Moyes clearly felt they were doing well. With those CBs, Mustafi felt he wasn't going to get first team football and left. He has developed into a player this season and he has done great. But your argument is weak if you are using it to have a go at Moyes. Even this season, it has only been injuries to Distin and Jagielka which is the reason John Stones has played and he has taken his chance. Managers don't suddenly drop well performing CB pairings for no reason.
 
BennyBlanco said:
All I want is to watch some good football, I mean is it really too much to ask? I accepted the good times were over the day Sir Alex left, I swallowed that horrible bitter pill, and what did I get? David Moyes, who served up some real tumescent tripe over his decade at Everton, also once saw his Preston side live and they were equally as disciplined and dull, If we're not going to be competing for the forseeable future at least let me watch some nice football for fecks sake, Yea I know this is an utter waste of a post, Moyes has shown himself consistently to be as technical as a turnip.
Even if we buy 100+ million pounds worth of talent this summer, and it magically integrates itself flawlessly into the side within a few weeks and claim a top3 place I still doubt I'd ever want to watch Moyes football and probably never will thats what really annoys me most in this annus horribilis.
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This is exactly how i felt mate, with SAF gone i accepted theres no way we can dominate anymore with the Oil Baron clubs, was hoping we would get a young modern coach who could get us back to the way a Manchester United team should be playing.

When i heard the news we had appointed David Moyes it felt like a kick in the balls, worst of both worlds.
 
BennyBlanco said:
All I want is to watch some good football, I mean is it really too much to ask? I accepted the good times were over the day Sir Alex left, I swallowed that horrible bitter pill, and what did I get? David Moyes, who served up some real tumescent tripe over his decade at Everton, also once saw his Preston side live and they were equally as disciplined and dull, If we're not going to be competing for the forseeable future at least let me watch some nice football for fecks sake, Yea I know this is an utter waste of a post, Moyes has shown himself consistently to be as technical as a turnip.
Even if we buy 100+ million pounds worth of talent this summer, and it magically integrates itself flawlessly into the side within a few weeks and claim a top3 place I still doubt I'd ever want to watch Moyes football and probably never will thats what really annoys me most in this annus horribilis.
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stevoc said:
This is exactly how i felt mate, with SAF gone i accepted theres no way we can dominate anymore with the Oil Baron clubs, was hoping we would get a young modern coach who could get us back to the way a Manchester United team should be playing.

When i heard the news we had appointed David Moyes it felt like a kick in the balls, worst of both worlds.
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Oi!! No moping in the forums.


...that's my job :(
 
Duncan Castles' latest article.

http://www.oneworldsports.com/stories/david-moyes-targets-andre-gomes-rebuild/

David Moyes has taken an interest in Portugal under-21 international Andre Gomes following a midweek scouting trip to Lisbon. The Manchester United manager attended Benfica's 3-1 Taca de Portugal semifinal victory over FC Porto on Wednesday night in order to personally assess several individuals recommended as potential summer signings.

Moyes is said to have been unimpressed by the contributions of Jackson Martinez, the Portuguese League's leading goalscorer, and of his Porto teammate, Eliaquim Mangala, the much-coveted France center back Manchester City attempted to sign in January. Instead, the Scot took a fancy to 20-year-old holding midfielder Gomes, who produced an outstanding finish 10 minutes from time to decided the two-legged tie.

Gomes has been used primarily as a substitute by Benfica this season as the Lisbon club has established a seven-point lead in its domestic league and secured a Europa League semifinal against Juventus. The quality of Gomes' passing and his 6-foot-2 frame have, however, attracted the attention of Liverpool, who inquired about the player during the winter window.

Instead, Benfica sold Gomes' economic rights to Meriton Capital Limited, an investment fund controlled by the Singapore billionaire Peter Lim, ensuring the midfielder remained at Estadio da Luz until the end of this season. In addition to the €15million fee paid by Meriton, Benfica are entitled to 25 percent of any profit on Gomes' eventual transfer to another club.

Following a season in which United failed to mount a coherent challenge in either domestic or European competition, Moyes has effectively made his future at the club dependent on his ability to convince its American owners to accept an argument that the Premier League winning squad he inherited from Sir Alex Ferguson was no longer fit for purpose. The coach has proposed an unprecedented and hugely expensive overhaul of that group, asking for at least five top-class players in addition to January's club-record acquisition of Juan Mata from Chelsea.

To facilitate such a radical recruitment drive, Moyes has already made extensive changes to United's scouting department, bringing in trusted figures from the section he built at Everton. His new scouts have drawn up a long list of targets with the aim of buying in at least two first-team midfielders, defenders and a striker, yet there remains serious doubt as to whether Moyes will be permitted to continue as Old Trafford manager into a second campaign.
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Why would he want to sign a striker? I think even if RVP leaves we won't need to sign another striker. If both him an Hernandez leave then fair enough but I doubt we'll get rid of two anyway.
 
I honestly don't see how he can convince the Glazers that the squad isn't even good enough to get into top 4.
 
saivet said:
Why would he want to sign a striker? I think even if RVP leaves we won't need to sign another striker. If both him an Hernandez leave then fair enough but I doubt we'll get rid of two anyway.
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Hernandez is 100% certain to leave. A lot is dependant on whether van Persie leaves but even if he does we could move Rooney to a centre forward position, use Welbeck as a back-up and perhaps Henriquez as the next player in line.
 
'If I had been an Everton fan I would have clapped the manager too,' he said.

Did he really say that after his last game?
 
Moyes has effectively made his future at the club dependent on his ability to convince its American owners to accept an argument that the Premier League winning squad he inherited from Sir Alex Ferguson was no longer fit for purpose.
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If thats true its going to be a hard sell to try to convince anyone this squad is not good enough to come in the top 4, especially after adding a lot of expensive talent to it.

This squad is in my opinion better than one or two of the squads that will finish in the top 4. Thats before we even get to Everton & Spurs. Thats a speech he will have to practice in the mirror a right few times i would imagine before even he believes it.
 
stevoc said:
If thats true its going to be a hard sell to try to convince anyone this squad is not good enough to come in the top 4, especially after adding a lot of expensive talent to it.

This squad is in my opinion better than one or two of the squads that will finish in the top 4. Thats before we even get to Everton & Spurs. Thats a speech he will have to practice in the mirror a right few times i would imagine before even he believes it.
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It isn't better than City but it's at least as good as Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool.
 
BennyBlanco said:
also once saw his Preston side live and they were equally as disciplined and dull,
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Maybe you caught them on a bad day, because if you go back and read the reports from the time, they were renowned for playing quick, attractive, passing football. Some examples:

Last season North End reached the Division One play-off final - largely with the same squad that won the Division Two title. Moyes transformed an under-achieving team into one that plays slick, attractive and - crucially - winning football. He was in charge of Preston 243 times, of which his team won 113 games, lost 63 and drew 67.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/e/everton/1870407.stm

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DAVID MOYES, the young Preston manager, can take great credit for the fact that his team are gaining many new admirers for the style and quality of their football
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...ion-One-Stylish-Preston-pass-latest-test.html

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The first goal came totally against the run of play after Preston had dominated the opening 10 minutes with their slick possession football.
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http://www.harriers-online.co.uk/season01-02/reports01-02/pres_h_21-8-01.html

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"Davie Moyes is doing a good job," he said. "They play the game the correct way, pass it and try to get at you. If they were to get into the Premiership it would be nothing short of a miracle, considering they were a struggling club only a few years ago.
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http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-5164148.html

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And so on. There's a reason why Fergie wanted him as assistant during that period, and that he was being talked about as a potential United boss as early as 2001, and it isn't just because he was Scottish.

Now don't get me wrong. Moyes will be the first to admit that ultimately, winning points is the most important thing to him, and that if he believes winning points requires a more defensive approach, then that's the way he'll set his team up. But he isn't at all averse to attractive, attacking football, and it was in fact his default style earlier in his career.

And if I may be so bold, we've perhaps seen seeds of it at United in recent weeks, with good wins over Newcastle, West Ham and Villa.
 
But we've seen it in nothingness games. When we need to dig in against teams who won't yield we move back to the conventional, safe way of playing. Or when it's a big team who can match us blow for blow, he sets us up as the underdog.
 
DWelbz19 said:
But we've seen it in nothingness games. When we need to dig in against teams who won't yield we move back to the conventional, safe way of playing. Or when it's a big team who can match us blow for blow, he sets us up as the underdog.
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With good reason. If you look at the Bayern games, I think he found a good way of playing that nearly paid off. If we'd have gone toe-to-toe then I've no doubt we'd have been turned over big time. Perhaps he's just realistic about the quality of our team compared to the likes of Bayern.

In hindsight, a lot of people said they wished we'd played the same against the likes of Liverpool, City etc.
 
pocco said:
With good reason. If you look at the Bayern games, I think he found a good way of playing that nearly paid off. If we'd have gone toe-to-toe then I've no doubt we'd have been turned over big time. Perhaps he's just realistic about the quality of our team compared to the likes of Bayern.

In hindsight, a lot of people said they wished we'd played the same against the likes of Liverpool, City etc.
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It's more pessimistic than realistic.
And how did we play against City and Liverpool? Because we sure as hell didn't go at them. We started with a three man midfield against City, and our aims were obviously to try strangle and stifle the possession and influence of Silva and Yaya. Within five minutes of the game we switched to two solid banks of fours and Cleverley was playing wide right...
 
Moyes is such a riddle. We have been so dire for the majority of games but now we have recently began playing much much better. Maybe he just took a longer time to get adjusted than most managers. When you read about the reports as above, combined with the fact that we literally have no midfield and a left back who cant defend, you so think that maybe with a bit of strengthening fergie could be proven right with his choice. But then you think of those negative press conferences, excuses he has been dishing out and you just wonder negatively again.
 
DWelbz19 said:
It's more pessimistic than realistic.
And how did we play against City and Liverpool? Because we sure as hell didn't go at them. We started with a three man midfield against City, and our aims were obviously to try strangle and stifle the possession and influence of Silva and Yaya. Within five minutes of the game we switched to two solid banks of fours and Cleverley was playing wide right...
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We had some good spells against Liverpool to be fair. But against Bayern there was a clear difference in the way we set up. We accepted that we wouldn't have much possession and formed a game plan around that. Against City we did set up to be hard to break down and attempted to block off areas of the pitch, but we didn't completely sit back and attempt to hit them on the break with pace. We seemed to be caught in two minds somewhat.
 
pocco said:
We had some good spells against Liverpool to be fair. But against Bayern there was a clear difference in the way we set up. We accepted that we wouldn't have much possession and formed a game plan around that. Against City we did set up to be hard to break down and attempted to block off areas of the pitch, but we didn't completely sit back and attempt to hit them on the break with pace. We seemed to be caught in two minds somewhat.
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We did? I remember one good period against City, nothing for Liverpool though. Maybe I've just been scarred by that match. It was the one that made it clear Moyes had to go, anyway.
 
I hope he gets a good reception at Everton. Despite Martinez's excellent job there, Moyes did some great things for them too.
 
pocco said:
We had some good spells against Liverpool to be fair. But against Bayern there was a clear difference in the way we set up. We accepted that we wouldn't have much possession and formed a game plan around that. Against City we did set up to be hard to break down and attempted to block off areas of the pitch, but we didn't completely sit back and attempt to hit them on the break with pace. We seemed to be caught in two minds somewhat.
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I guess so, but the issue that gripes me is that after we've made our signings and should have the personnel to match the likes of Liverpool and City (personally believed we already did but that's another matter) will we still continue in the manner we have? I.E - wanting to play the underdog, catching the opponent on a set piece of some sort and absorbing their attacks. I fear we will.
 
Revan said:
I hope he gets a good reception at Everton. Despite Martinez's excellent job there, Moyes did some great things for them too.
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Why? Who cares? If they like him so much they can have him back with Fellaini. Thing is they don't. And that's even more worrying.
 
NessunDorma said:
Now don't get me wrong. Moyes will be the first to admit that ultimately, winning points is the most important thing to him, and that if he believes winning points requires a more defensive approach, then that's the way he'll set his team up. But he isn't at all averse to attractive, attacking football, and it was in fact his default style earlier in his career.

And if I may be so bold, we've perhaps seen seeds of it at United in recent weeks, with good wins over Newcastle, West Ham and Villa.
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Nice detective work good finds, i never seen his preston sides play so i couldn't comment on how they played.

I have seen two of his sides play regularly over the last 12 years though, and had the misfortune of having to pay to watch one a few times this season.

I don't think he's a completely defensive manager, everton played some good stuff last season, but that was the best i've seen them play under moyes. I think moyes problem is like against disinterested teams recently in dead rubbers he has no problem taking the shackles off when we are clearly the better side. But as we have seen all season when we face a decent team he reverts to type and sets us up to be hard to beat or as against Bayern full on camped out in the box. If we had adopted the approach we took vs bayern against City/Liverpool we probably would have got a point or two, but i think a lot of the home support would have turned on him and i think he knew that which is why he didn't set up like that.

Can he overcome this and have us playing entertaining football regularly even against top teams at this stage of his career? Who know its certainly not impossible i wouldn't be putting money on it though.

Sarni said:
It isn't better than City but it's at least as good as Arsenal, Chelsea and Liverpool.
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Chelsea debatable perhaps this season has clouded my judgement though.

Yeah i would have our squad better than Liverpool, Arsenal, Everton & Spurs (who have had a shit season themselves) and yet we find our selves behind them all in the table, behind 1 or 2 could be put down to bad luck but not all of them, as i said hes some job ahead of him trying to convince anyone with sense that our squad is the 7th best in the league.
 
If you didn't know who the Utd/everton managers were and read that interview with Baines, who would strike you as the Utd manager?

Painful we are the ones sitting with the man who doesn't prioritise the type of football we want to see.
 
LonelyFire said:
If you didn't know who the Utd/everton managers were and read that interview with Baines, who would strike you as the Utd manager?

Painful we are the ones sitting with the man who doesn't prioritise the type of football we want to see.
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the word painful can also be used to describe this thread too..
 
dev1l said:
the word painful can also be used to describe this thread too..
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Indeed, the fact that United still haven't pulled the trigger and put and end to his reign of mediocrity gets more painful by the day. :(
 
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