Moyes So Far!

[Sarni]

I was 6 years old and remember my dad taking me to his work place to watch football on the old big sky dish. Such a sad moment

I remember how tough it was to know that we wouldn't be in the CL in the Spring in 2005 and 2011.

Now imagine having this feeling through all Summer as well.

 

[KM]

Call me mad, but I was impressed by his approach last night. We played pretty well IMO and If Rooney hadn't missed those two chances, then we could've progressed through. He got the first XI spot on and although the Rooney gamble didn't work, you can't really fault Moyes for taking the gamble.

It looks like Kagawa will be a first XI under him now plus he seems to be very keen on Smalling and Jones as a central defender pairing which is very good news for us. The only shame that it has taken 7-8 months to show that he's capable of being a Man Utd manager. I still think that he'll be sacked this season but even if he isn't, the previous four matches has given us a new lease of hope for next season.

 

[Cheesy]

Disappointed to be out but there's not much I can blame him for. Very few would've done better in that one against Bayern.

 

[united_99]

We were playing our 200th game in the CL yesterday, it's a record, not even Barca, Real or Bayern have played that many games. Shows you how well SAF and our players have done over the years. Bad news: Those three mentioned clubs will probably overtake us next season anyway! Moyes is stopping all positive records and breaking all negative in one season, I can't think of a single reason to keep him!

 

[Rado_N]

Call me mad, but I was impressed by his approach last night. We played pretty well IMO and If Rooney hadn't missed those two chances, then we could've progressed through. He got the first XI spot on and although the Rooney gamble didn't work, you can't really fault Moyes for taking the gamble.

You can't blame him for taking the gamble of picking him, but you can definitely blame him for not realising it wasn't working and leaving Rooney on the pitch for 90 minutes.

 

[itso 7]

Let me put it this way - we wouldn't be contemplating on hiring a mid-table manager from Serie A or La Liga. West Brom appointed Mel from Betis - would we consider him?

As we shouldn't because we are in the business of fighting for titles and midtable managers generally look to survive, consolidate their positions . We shouldn't have hired a midtable manager from England or anywhere else .

 

[KM]

You can't blame him for taking the gamble of picking him, but you can definitely blame him for not realising it wasn't working and leaving Rooney on the pitch for 90 minutes.

You can but then not many managers will sub off your very best players in the biggest matches. Not even Fergie would do that.

 

[Rado_N]

You can but then not many managers will sub off your very best players in the biggest matches. Not even Fergie would do that.

SAF left him out in the biggest match (Madrid) and he subbed him off when it was required, so that's just not true.

It's the managers job to be in charge, not to pander to the ego of Wayne Rooney. At the end of the day he was playing like a pub footballer, and if Moyes isn't strong enough to hook him off when that happens then it's a problem. A big one.

 

[KM]

SAF left him out in the biggest match (Madrid) and he subbed him off when it was required, so that's just not true.

It's the managers job to be in charge, not to pander to the ego of Wayne Rooney. At the end of the day he was playing like a pub footballer, and if Moyes isn't strong enough to hook him off when that happens then it's a problem. A big one.

SAF left him out when he had an alternative i.e RVP.

Let's not forget that SAF started an half fit Rooney in front of Berbatov against Bayern in the QF, and would've proceeded to play him if Rooney hadn't got injured midway.

 

[RoadTrip]

SAF left him out in the biggest match (Madrid) and he subbed him off when it was required, so that's just not true.

It's the managers job to be in charge, not to pander to the ego of Wayne Rooney. At the end of the day he was playing like a pub footballer, and if Moyes isn't strong enough to hook him off when that happens then it's a problem. A big one.

It's not about massaging his ego though, is it? Maybe Moyes felt that even if he was struggling, he has the quality in him to produce one bit of magic. He took a gamble, it didn't pay off. Why does everyone constantly assume it's because he is mentally weak? It's a lazy and poor analysis.

 

[Julian Denny]

Then why in the world was HE picked for the job

Because as far as we know, it was left entirely to Fergie. Charlton had already put his oar in by stating that Mourinho was unsuitable (thanks Sir Bob!).
How Fergie was expected to make a sound and, more importantly, objective assessment about the man most suited to replace him was beyond comprehension.
If they'd followed a proper process, taking into account the magnitude of the job and the traditions of the club etc, Moyes might have been considered but that's as far as it would have gone most probably. He just wasn't sufficiently qualified in terms of success at the highest level. Above all he had never demonstrated that he was a "winner" throughout his 11 years with Everton. He had never demonstrated anything more than being a capable manager who could steady a club heading downhill and get them into a decent position. Certainly not one expected to challenge consistently for top honours, playing attractive football as per their traditions and being able to think on his feet in an inspirational way.

 

[Mainoldo]

Yup, there isn't much wrong with our squad.

Bar the fact that we'll be short of 2 most experienced CBs and LB come summer, and God knows who more but hey, it seems that you entertain the idea of Büttner being our new first choice LB.

And yea, Klopp will magically come to us because we'll throw money at him, he surely wants to manage such great and huge club like Manchester United, he loves Kagawa naturally so he'll come here just for him.

Choo choo, everybody aboard the delusion train.

Thats true god forbid we get a manger that fails to make summer transfers.......

Then again after last year!!!

 

[Blasphemy]

Still think there's a good chance he'll be sacked at the end of the season. I can't believe that a winner like Fergie will find 7th place acceptable.

 

[A1X]

Moyes needed goals, why would he take off our top scorer this season?

Honestly some of the Rooney hate is getting unbearable. Yes he had a poor game, but Rooney has had poor games before and then produced the goods late on. He was shocking in that game against City where he did this.

 

[Rado_N]

SAF left him out when he had an alternative i.e RVP.

Let's not forget that SAF started an half fit Rooney in front of Berbatov against Bayern in the QF, and would've proceeded to play him if Rooney hadn't got injured midway.

Welbeck was already on the pitch and proving far more effective than Rooney, so when bringing Hernandez on it should have been Rooney who was brought off. There were alternatives, and Rooney was a complete waste of resources last night.

It's not about massaging his ego though, is it? Maybe Moyes felt that even if he was struggling, he has the quality in him to produce one bit of magic. He took a gamble, it didn't pay off. Why does everyone constantly assume it's because he is mentally weak? It's a lazy and poor analysis.

It was perfectly apparent that Rooney wasn't going to produce jack shit last night.

From the moment he started getting jeered me and the missus commented that we wondered how he'd react to that; would he rise up and prove them wrong or would he just try too hard and feck everything up? Then he had the opportunity to give the ball to a wide open Kagawa in a goalscoring position but decided to turn around a few times and then tackle himself instead.

He was garbage from start to finish, and should have been taken off - whatever reason you want to give for that it was a mistake by the manager.

 

[Mainoldo]

Moyes needed goals, why would he take off our top scorer this season?

Honestly some of the Rooney hate is getting unbearable. Yes he had a poor game, but Rooney has had poor games before and then produced the goods late on. He was shocking in that game against City where he did this.

Its not hate. The man himself said he was struggling to strike a ball... Where the hell was he going to find the belief to pull of a wonder strike? An over foot header??

 

[Kakeru]

The only shame that it has taken 7-8 months to show that he's capable of being a Man Utd manager.

This is the key line to mark with indelible ink in our minds. No manager undertaking a job in any big club would ever take this long to show what he is capable of; it's usually whether he has it or he doesn't. No matter what his defenders will say, Moyes fits the second category and this is not what we look out of a Man Utd manager.

I can't remember who wrote about a sending off with dignity in May, but I'd not wait for that. No, I think it would be better to call the divorce when the race for 4th spot will be officially over for us (probably in 2 weeks ATM), then let Giggsy act as caretaker while the new short-term objective for a number of players would be simple: save their own jobs.

 

[KM]

Welbeck was already on the pitch and proving far more effective than Rooney, so when bringing Hernandez on it should have been Rooney who was brought off. There were alternatives, and Rooney was a complete waste of resources last night.

Hernandez offers us nothing except of the goal threat and that wouldn't have been enough. Look I'm not saying keeping Rooney on was the right decision, but I can see the reasoning behind it.

 

[Sarni]

Hernandez offers us nothing except of the goal threat and that wouldn't have been enough. Look I'm not saying keeping Rooney on was the right decision, but I can see the reasoning behind it.

Goals are pretty essential part of football though.

 

[Rado_N]

Hernandez offers us nothing except of the goal threat and that wouldn't have been enough. Look I'm not saying keeping Rooney on was the right decision, but I can see the reasoning behind it.

A goal was exactly what we needed, and putting Hernandez up top whilst dropping Welbeck behind him would have been more effective than having Rooney stood in the middle doing pretty much nothing.

 

[KM]

Goals are pretty essential part of football though.

Well done, Captain Birdseye.

Playing Hernandez against Barcelona(which is very similar to this Guardiola team) really paid off, didn't it?
How did he play again?

 

[Mainoldo]

Hernandez offers us nothing except of the goal threat and that wouldn't have been enough. Look I'm not saying keeping Rooney on was the right decision, but I can see the reasoning behind it.

Neither did Pipo Inzaghi but great managers managed to win big games with him.

 

[Sarni]

Well done, Captain Birdseye.

Playing Hernandez against Barcelona(which is very similar to this Guardiola team) really paid off, didn't it?
How did he play again?

He was pretty crap but I thought we could have used him yesterday - the two chances Rooney had might have been better off left to Hernandez as he's quicker and takes less time to make a decision.

 

[Cheesy]

Moyes needed goals, why would he take off our top scorer this season?

Honestly some of the Rooney hate is getting unbearable. Yes he had a poor game, but Rooney has had poor games before and then produced the goods late on. He was shocking in that game against City where he did this.

The problem is that's just one example; there will be plenty of games like last night where Rooney has been poor and produced nothing, but we'd be more inclined to naturally remember one like that.

I don't really blame Moyes for that one because I see the logic in keeping Rooney on, but it's not really solid logic to say he should've because he's produced when playing poorly in the past since there'll have been plenty of times where he was playing poorly and did nothing.

 

[Sky1981]

As cliche as it sounds, you can only win a football match with a goal (or more, depending on the scoreline)

All the beauty of the game have one aim : to win a match a.k.a scores a goal.

 

[KM]

This is the key line to mark with indelible ink in our minds. No manager undertaking a job in any big club would ever take this long to show what he is capable of; it's usually whether he has it or he doesn't. No matter what his defenders will say, Moyes fits the second category and this is not what we look out of a Man Utd manager.

I can't remember who wrote about a sending off with dignity in May, but I'd not wait for that. No, I think it would be better to call the divorce when the race for 4th spot will be officially over for us (probably in 2 weeks ATM), then let Giggsy act as caretaker while the new short-term objective for a number of players would be simple: save their own jobs.

Can't disagree with any of that. I'd have no complaints if he's sacked today.

 

[Mockney]

You can but then not many managers will sub off your very best players in the biggest matches. Not even Fergie would do that.

That's exactly what the top managers do. Pep took off his biggest signing (and the most expensive German player of all time) as soon as they scored.

 

[Cheesy]

This is the key line to mark with indelible ink in our minds. No manager undertaking a job in any big club would ever take this long to show what he is capable of; it's usually whether he has it or he doesn't. No matter what his defenders will say, Moyes fits the second category and this is not what we look out of a Man Utd manager.

I can't remember who wrote about a sending off with dignity in May, but I'd not wait for that. No, I think it would be better to call the divorce when the race for 4th spot will be officially over for us (probably in 2 weeks ATM), then let Giggsy act as caretaker while the new short-term objective for a number of players would be simple: save their own jobs.

While I'm someone who'd be happy to see him go in May, I can see your point here. One of the things people have used to defend Moyes is that because he was unprepared coming in, he didn't get the proper time needed for purchases. If we did have a replacement lined up earlier, then they wouldn't struggle with that. Unfortunately, I doubt it would happen this summer at all, so he'll still be here.

 

[Cheesy]

Well done, captain obvious.

Playing Hernandez against Barcelona(which is very similar to this Guardiola team) really paid off, didn't it?
How did he play again?

He played that full game. If he'd come on as a sub late in the game, then it'd arguably have been easier for him to make more of an impact since he'd have been fresh.

 

[KM]

That's exactly what the top managers do. Pep took off his biggest signing (and the most expensive German player of all time) as soon as they scored.

Can't really compare Rooney with Goetze.

Goetze has been a bit disappointing for the past few months whilst Rooney has been our best outfield player this season.

 

[Mockney]

Well if you decide you can't compare them, then no, you can't compare them, but the fact is that Pep has the balls to take off any player he wants - even his stars - to change things tactically. He brought on a cocking right back FFS.

Rooney was injured and playing badly. He wasn't even kept up front to get a goal, he was moved back into midfield just to accommodate keeping him on. It was the opposite of balls.

Remember when Mourinho would take people off after half an hour if it wasn't working? That's what top managers do.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

That's exactly what the top managers do. Pep took off his biggest signing (and the most expensive German player of all time) as soon as they scored.

Took off an attacking player to replace him with a defender as soon as they scored.

Aye, you wouldn't get anyone on here complaining about a manager who did that.

 

[Sky1981]

SAF left him out when he had an alternative i.e RVP.

Let's not forget that SAF started an half fit Rooney in front of Berbatov against Bayern in the QF, and would've proceeded to play him if Rooney hadn't got injured midway.

This is where I have issues, SAF rotated heavily to kept players like Hernandez fit and sharp to be called upon when needed. We rotate with no real purpose other than messing up. Almost all our players got a game here and there, and that what makes our squad depth sharp and dependable when called upon.

That's what makes rotation a skill so hard to master, rotating when there is no rotation necessary. SAF could have persists with the strongest XI but that'll left us with unfit players when injury/suspension arise.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Took off an attacking player to replace him with a defender as soon as they scored.

Aye, you wouldn't get anyone on here complaining about a manager who did that.

Nobody would've complained if we did that with Rooney last night.

Nobody.

 

[Blasphemy]

That's exactly what the top managers do. Pep took off his biggest signing (and the most expensive German player of all time) as soon as they scored.

Can't really compare Rooney with Goetze.

Goetze has been a bit disappointing for the past few months whilst Rooney has been our best outfield player this season.

Indeed. Balls of absolute steal bringing off the most expensive German player of all time for a second string Brazilian right back, but Pep is a bit of a genius and it paid off immediately.

 

[Kakeru]

Rooney was injured and playing badly. He wasn't even kept up front to get a goal, he was moved back into midfield just to accommodate keeping him on.

Remember when Mourinho would take people off after half an hour if it wasn't working? That's what top managers do.

Or even just plain deny him a presence in the squad no matter how important a player is in normal time. That's what Simeone did even though Diego Costa appealed to play; Simeone couldn't afford to have a dead weight in his starting XI against Barcelona at all.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Nobody would've complained if we did that with Rooney last night.

Nobody.

Of course they fecking would. Don't be stupid.

If we subbed off a striker for a defender, then were immediately pinned back deep into our half, before conceding two late goals (all of which happened anyway) every cnut on here would be wailing and gnashing their teeth about Moyes and how his negative substitutions cost us.

 

[entropy]

SAF left him out in the biggest match (Madrid) and he subbed him off when it was required, so that's just not true.

It's the managers job to be in charge, not to pander to the ego of Wayne Rooney. At the end of the day he was playing like a pub footballer, and if Moyes isn't strong enough to hook him off when that happens then it's a problem. A big one.

Rooney was having a shit season and deserved to be benched against Madrid. Up until the bayern game there were no signs of Rooney dropping off. Fans need to accept that Rooney just did not show up yesterday night, instead of diverting his poor performance as a shit excuse to blame Moyes. Did RVP get benched when he he went through a lean patch last season?

 

[Massive Spanner]

Of course they fecking would. Don't be stupid.

If we subbed off a striker for a defender, then were immediately pinned back deep into our half, before conceding two late goals (all of which happened anyway) every cnut on here would be wailing and gnashing their teeth about Moyes and how his negative substitutions cost us.

I think you're looking at it in the wrong way.

If we subbed off Rooney nobody would've complained, he was dreadful, i'd have welcomed it.

Also, it's not like Pep just threw another defender in, he just did it so he could move Lahm into midfield, something Moyes could do from time to time instead of sticking to 4-4-2.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Of course they fecking would. Don't be stupid.

If we subbed off a striker for a defender, then were immediately pinned back deep into our half, before conceding two late goals (all of which happened anyway) every cnut on here would be wailing and gnashing their teeth about Moyes and how his negative substitutions cost us.

I think you're looking at it in the wrong way.

If we subbed off Rooney nobody would've complained, he was dreadful, i'd have welcomed it.

Also, it's not like Pep just threw another defender in, he just did it so he could move Lahm into midfield, something Moyes could do from time to time instead of sticking to 4-4-2.

 

[Rado_N]

Rooney was having a shit season and deserved to be benched against Madrid. Up until the bayern game there were no signs of Rooney dropping off. Fans need to accept that Rooney just did not show up yesterday night, instead of diverting his poor performance as a shit excuse to blame Moyes. Did RVP get benched when he he went through a lean patch last season?

Have you actually read my posts? I've already said quite clearly that you can't blame Moyes for taking the gamble of playing a semi fit Rooney. The point is that he was shit and should have been subbed off.

I'm not using him being picked as a 'shit excuse to blame Moyes', I'm pointing to the fact that he failed to correct the issue as a problem.