Maybe they do prefer them but it doesn't mean Moyes's are "below standard." Perhaps United players would prefer his methods to Martinez's? We just don't know.
Moyes So Far!
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Maybe they do prefer them but it doesn't mean Moyes's are "below standard." Perhaps United players would prefer his methods to Martinez's? We just don't know.
Is that totally down to Moyes though? Some of it maybe but the players are not free of all responsibility. We went further in the CL this year so not everrything nose dived.
I was screaming at the screen for him to get up and motivate the team. That second goal changed nothing, we still needed one goal to progress (same as at 0-0), but he just sat there looking helpless and sorry for himself, like we had no hope. That's not the United attitude. He's not the fighter I thought he was when he was at Everton.
This is the moment you knew we were dead and buried.
Surely playing Olympiakos does not equal facing Real Madrid?
Everton with Martinez's system are playing better than they ever did under Moyes. United with Moyes system are playing their worst football since fall of communism
I am just saying there is no concrete evidence for what you claimed. I'm not disputing that they are playing better under Martinez.
Yeah, I know. I was being facetious. You are right, most things have gone down.
We did go out to Basel only two years ago mind and they aren't much better than Olympiakos. Imagine if we actually had a similar campaign this season and were knocked out from CL by Benfica and Basel...
Saw it on reddit, had to use it
That's for the 7th place Moysie.
Up to that point, Moyes had been moving around the technical area like a tic, shouting and barking orders to the players. He had just seen his team score a fantastic away goal, only for the very same player to get caught out (for probably the 200th time this season) and concede so quickly. He must be thinking what he has to do to get the players to concentrate after a goal.
I felt deperately sorry for him on this shot. He is trying his hardest and his team almost did an almost impossible task last night - silly errors, again, caused us to ship 3 goals - 2 of which from the same poorly represented left full back position.
I get that 90% of the Caf want him out and I can understand the frustration, but the constant trolling of the man on social media and forums is just embarrassing. He is only human trying to do the best he can with a group of players that I think were at their ceiling last night. We started Carrick and Fletcher in CM against one of the best sides in the world - not their fault, not Moyes fault as that was the best we could muster. Yes, we could have addressed that in the past 2 windows but we didn't and we await what the next windows will bring. If Rooney had come off, as many seem to think he should, then who would have gone into CM to replace an even poorer Fletcher? Cleverley? I think Rooney was our 2nd best CM in that squad last night.
The image we see is him in his seat for about 10 minutes total in the whole match. I thought his pre match conference, his preparation for the game and the way he went about the game was spot on. We are trying to rip him apart for things he is doing ok on.
Then he would have been sacked by now, his only saving grace this year has been the Champions League.
We can talk all we like about tactics, motivation, systems etc but the problem is his ethos as a manager is the opposite of what Utd fans crave.....his priority is to hold onto what he has first and rarely will he gamble that to try and get a win. Its ingrained in everything he does and says "we made it hard for them....." for example.
Utd fans are used to throwing caution to the wind and accepting the highs and lows that go with the territory. Moyes is not wired that way and you're asking him to fundamentally change his priorities - this wont happen. Whether hes good enough or not is irrelevant, hes not "right" nor is he "Utd". That may be harsh but it was the one question we all asked after he was appointed - does he change Utd or does Utd change him? We have our answer.
Utd fans are used to throwing caution to the wind and accepting the highs and lows that go with the territory. Moyes is not wired that way and you're asking him to fundamentally change his priorities - this wont happen. Whether hes good enough or not is irrelevant, hes not "right" nor is he "Utd". That may be harsh but it was the one question we all asked after he was appointed - does he change Utd or does Utd change him? We have our answer.
He couldn't be sacked because there are still players in the team that were bought or promoted by Ferguson. He could only be sacked when there isn't a single players from the previous dynasty left.
I agree with this. Except Giggs could have played CM. He was listed as a sub....I think.
we went from being perenial title contenders to being the 6th/vth best team. We went from being a given CL team to potentially no European football. What further evidence do you need? The drop in performances is to alarming to not question the managers methods. We dropped 6 places in a year with the same squad + 2 additions
To 6 years of Moyes. Let's hope his players actually play the football we want.
He’s still got the mentality of an Everton manager, in some ways it’s not his fault. He was being told by everyone for 11 years that he was doing a fantastic job, he got manager of the year for three years and all looked rosey in his career.
Obviously the difference between Everton and United is massive, drawing isn’t good enough when you have a chance to win, it’s a win at all costs here instead of his damage limitation during his Everton days. I suppose if you’re doing the same thing for 11 years and being patted on the back for doing it, it’s going to be hard, if not near impossible to change.
They should be looked at? Everything should be. You stated it as a fact though that his training methods are "below standard." Tha's just conjecture and not based on any real proof. The players have probably dropped their levels purely because SAF isn't there anymore. I'm not saying Moyes is blameless and shouldn't review what he is doing. Things like training and motivation though are all hard to gauge because there is no CONCRETE evidence.
Yup, there isn't much wrong with our squad.
Bar the fact that we'll be short of 2 most experienced CBs and LB come summer, and God knows who more but hey, it seems that you entertain the idea of Büttner being our new first choice LB.
And yea, Klopp will magically come to us because we'll throw money at him, he surely wants to manage such great and huge club like Manchester United, he loves Kagawa naturally so he'll come here just for him.
Choo choo, everybody aboard the delusion train.
Good post. The majority of this forum has completely lost the plot now when it comes to Moyes. There is a small amount of good constructive criticism that is drowning in a sea of shite. I thought agenda posting was supposed to be a bannable offence, but then again there would hardly be anybody left on here. Actually that might be a good thing.
And that is the pertinent point. He's doing what:
A) Got him recognised
B) Got him the Utd job
Its not his fault. Jamie Carragher made this exact point before a ball was even kicked this season and its the most important point we should consider when debating Moyes - take the emotion of results out of the equation. Is the man capable of playing football that we want to see? I dont believe he is.
There is a huge amount wrong with this squad. We lack top level talent in too many key areas of the pitch to be able to compete at this level.
Yep, it's a step to far for him. He should have left Everton years ago and managed a bigger club with higher expectations. The question we should ask ourselves is; Would Everton take Moyes back now? I don't believe they would.
There's no doubt we need reinforcements in midfield and defence but our front four is among the five best in Europe. That should be enough foundation to get us playing exciting football, creating chances, scoring goals and finishing in the top-4.
Would Liverpool take Mourinho now over Rodgers?
Give Moyes time, this is the year he's had to see the players himself. We're going to be a lot better next year because Moyes knows where we need to improve IMO. Lets give him the next transfer window.
At which level? We won't even be in the Champions League next season.
Why has he not been sacked yet? 
Of course he knows where we need to improve everybody does. However the point remains, even with the players we have currently within our squad, he has failed virtually every time we have played a half decent team. He's had a year with the players, yet the same issues remain.
We should be improving massively given the start we had and the money we've spent, but the hard truth is, we haven't.
There is no evidence to suggest there will be any improvement.
PS. The areas we need to improve are the same areas as last July when he was appointed. Instead he has spent 64m on players who havent addressed the problem.
PS. The areas we need to improve are the same areas as last July when he was appointed. Instead he has spent 64m on players who havent addressed the problem.[/QUOTE]
Mata has certainly addressed a lot of our faults IMO. I'm still hopeful on Felliani.
Our problems stem from an aging backline that needed to be replaced but coudn't be sold. Evra/Ferdinand/Vidic will leave, I'm sure we'll imrpove on them which will make us a much much much better team.
Mata has certainly addressed a lot of our faults IMO. I'm still hopeful on Felliani.
Our problems stem from an aging backline that needed to be replaced but coudn't be sold. Evra/Ferdinand/Vidic will leave, I'm sure we'll imrpove on them which will make us a much much much better team.
XI wise, yes, squad wise, no. You can make a point that such front four of Mata, Rooney, RVP and Kagawa ( Januzaj / Welbeck ) is great front four although we all know how the partnership between Robin and Wayne has looked like recently. We need to get rid of our old wingers who are not performing ( Young, Nani, Valencia ) and then we're lacking in the squad unless we promote youth.
As you've said, there're lackings in midfield and defence, you could say that we need a new CB, LB and a RB for the next season and probably two midfielders. That's just 5 players and as I've said, we could use atleast one added player in the front formation.
While of course our squad is not 'shite' as some doom mongers try to suggest but there's hell lot of work to do with it, no matter whether 'this squad finished first last season' or not. We need to be prepared to play in the CL and we'll need both quality and numbers for that.
It's just so depressing how cowardly he is. Anyone in their right mind could tell that Rooney was not making a contribution last night and anyone that knows Rooney also knows that when he is playing like that he contributes absolutely nothing. However because he has Rooney sewn into the back of his shirt our management does not have the bottle to haul him off. They even had the perfect excuse of an injury last night, hide behind that if you're scared of the media questioning your decision.
His decision to take off Fletcher for Hernandez was equally bizarre. In my opinion Fletcher was our best central midfielder and was providing an effective shield to the back four. The obvious substitution was to bring on Hernandez for Rooney, send Welbeck out wide and put Kagawa behind Hernandez. Instead Moyes shuffles the pack and presumably puts Rooney in midfield. Two minutes later Robben is running across the edge of our box, in a position Fletcher covered all night and has a free opportunity and the game is lost.
It was exactly like the home leg in that players who are performing much better than Rooney have to be sacrificed to stroke his ego. Welbeck was essentially the sacrificial lamb on both occasions, because taking him off is easy, despite it being obviously wrong as he was our most effective forward.
The one thing a United manager needs to be is the most important man at the club. Unfortunately the likes of Rooney and RVP are bigger names than Moyes has the balls to deal with and so will play them every game they are fit irrespective of how beneficial they are to the team.
It's a shame because this kind of Football is Moyes' bread and butter and he executed it almost to perfection for 160 minutes. Defend deep, be organised and hoof it to a pacey strong attacker - ugly but effective when you're the underdog. Unfortunately his decision making and ability to change a game is non-existent, couple this with the aforementioned cowardice and you have a recipe for a manager that will be sacked in December/January for languishing in 5th or 6th.
As an aside on Talksport this AM they were in agreement that Moyes needed £250m in the Summer to buy a new first choice back 4, a new forward player and a couple of new midfielders. What other manager on the planet is given nearly £325m to take a title winning squad back to title challenging?
His decision to take off Fletcher for Hernandez was equally bizarre. In my opinion Fletcher was our best central midfielder and was providing an effective shield to the back four. The obvious substitution was to bring on Hernandez for Rooney, send Welbeck out wide and put Kagawa behind Hernandez. Instead Moyes shuffles the pack and presumably puts Rooney in midfield. Two minutes later Robben is running across the edge of our box, in a position Fletcher covered all night and has a free opportunity and the game is lost.
It was exactly like the home leg in that players who are performing much better than Rooney have to be sacrificed to stroke his ego. Welbeck was essentially the sacrificial lamb on both occasions, because taking him off is easy, despite it being obviously wrong as he was our most effective forward.
The one thing a United manager needs to be is the most important man at the club. Unfortunately the likes of Rooney and RVP are bigger names than Moyes has the balls to deal with and so will play them every game they are fit irrespective of how beneficial they are to the team.
It's a shame because this kind of Football is Moyes' bread and butter and he executed it almost to perfection for 160 minutes. Defend deep, be organised and hoof it to a pacey strong attacker - ugly but effective when you're the underdog. Unfortunately his decision making and ability to change a game is non-existent, couple this with the aforementioned cowardice and you have a recipe for a manager that will be sacked in December/January for languishing in 5th or 6th.
As an aside on Talksport this AM they were in agreement that Moyes needed £250m in the Summer to buy a new first choice back 4, a new forward player and a couple of new midfielders. What other manager on the planet is given nearly £325m to take a title winning squad back to title challenging?
If we have to wait there until Moyes gets the sack, then God help us because that's what Liverpool tried doing in the Sounness/Evans years. The new players were never capable of meeting the expectations when given the opportunity to take the reins.
I feel saddened that we wont be in the champions league next season. I don't actually remember the last time we weren't in it.
The problem we have is that people charged with the responsibility of appointing the next manager couldn't see how difficult it is for a man to change what he thinks got him here . In his mind, David Moyes, thinks his work at Everton gothim this gig but we all know that had he been born elsewhere and raised differently he wouldn't have got even a cursory glance . Besides that expecting a fifty year old to suddenly learn things alien to his nature whilst delivering at a club of this stature is the height of naivety and stupidity .
1996, wasn't it? Blackburn won the league and all countries only has one spot.
Let me put it this way - we wouldn't be contemplating on hiring a mid-table manager from Serie A or La Liga. West Brom appointed Mel from Betis - would we consider him?
Yeah, lets let a guy who led a title winning side to 7th oversee the rebuilding of our entire squad. What could possibly go wrong
Yes, we've been qualified for the group stages 18 seasons in a row, which is a record. Well, it was a record, it won't last long now. Another record broken by Moyes, he's truly gifted.
Well, now this season is over we can do the right thing and sack this total and utter failure of a manager.
I was 6 years old and remember my dad taking me to his work place to watch football on the old big sky dish. Such a sad moment
Then why in the world was HE picked for the job
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