Moyes So Far!

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Suedesi said:
http://strettynews.com/a-new-unacceptable-low/

Spot on

A new, unacceptable low
Posted by: Richard Cann February 1, 2014 in Match Reaction 54 Comments


If some United fans can’t see it now they never will. A 2-1 defeat at a quite frankly awful Stoke side, themselves in free fall, has to be the final straw. Five defeats in eight games in 2014, including deserved losses today, at home to Swansea and Spurs and at Sunderland. And none of us are surprised anymore. We’re no longer devastated by defeat. The players no longer look devastated, just resigned. The game at the Britannia was our season in microcosm: talented players in all bar the midfield, playing prehistoric, one dimensional football and, when things turn bad, a manager and coaching staff who appear totally baffled and unable to identify what to do to change things. A squad which won the title by eleven points last season, with Juan Mata, Marouane Fellaini and Adnan Januzaj, nearly £70m worth of talent and one of the finest young players in world football, have been assembled into a team which began by playing mid-table football and is now in relegation form. We can blame the players, and no doubt they should shoulder some responsibility for their performances, but the buck stops with the coaching staff. If three or four were under-performing we could point fingers at them alone, but this is squad wide. Every player bar De Gea, Rooney and Januzaj has played consistently below the level we know they can achieve and sustain.
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Ok, so he says it's squad wide but then excuses three players. So it's not squad wide?

Suedesi said:
Some claim that the manager and his staff should be given another six to twelve months. That this isn’t Moyes’ team. He hasn’t got the players he wants. He has a vision. This opinion is of course their prerogative and they are entitled to it, but to me that attitude appears to be built on nothing but blind faith, that Sir Alex took several years to succeed and that this manager will also come good. I do not believe that the current state of affairs would be tolerated at any other elite club worldwide. Persisting out of some sort of belief that our club is more special, more loyal than others is absurd. The main tenet of the optimists’ vision has been that injuries have greatly hindered us, which is partly true, but that when Carrick, Rooney and Van Persie returned from injury they would fire us to Arsenal’s fourth place trophy. Well there it is peeps. They’re back and we’re still tumescent dross. You can have great players, and those three are wonderfully talented, but if your principle tactic is to get the ball wide as quickly as possible for the winger or full back to cross, against a team of giants whose entire game plan is based around aerial dominance, then you could have Lionel Messi on the pitch and he’d struggle. It’s no coincidence that our goal came from a rare attempt to play through the middle. It’s a familiar pattern. You can go back to the Spurs game at home. 99% abject and aimless crossing. Our one goal came when Januzaj tore up the rule book and slid Danny Welbeck in from a central position.
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Wait, Manchester United isn't more special and more loyal than other clubs? Why does he support them, then?

Suedesi said:
Another statistic for you. This season Manchester United’s entire complement of natural central midfielders have contributed one goal and one assist. It’s February. Now this isn’t a new issue, but the numbers are more startling that ever before. There are two reasons for this. Firstly, they are simply poor players playing badly or, in the case of Michael Carrick, a very good but ageing player upon whom we have been totally reliant in recent years, struggling with injury and being terribly out of form. But then who isn’t? Secondly, the midfielders we have simply do not get forward. Their first thought, in any circumstance, is to get the ball wide. Statistically we have crossed the ball more than any other side in the Premier League this season and rank 20th at attacking moves through the central channel. There can be no excuse that Moyes doesn’t have the players to play any other way. Stoke, Cardiff, Villa, West Brom, Allardyce’s West Ham, all play through the middle more than us.

Read the rest at the URL posted above
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Brilliant, we need CMs. How did he figure that out? I mean, it's a problem that's been kicking us in the face repeatedly since 2005. A problem that has now been exacerbated by Fergie's sheer ability to gloss over such a galling deficiency of qualtiy in the middle of the park.
 
Kid Cunto said:
Yeah I'd agree with your points. Add to that the Januzaj point as well, Ferguson would've utilised him this season too. He made the bench in his last game. Think your man was trying to be fair to Moyes as possible.
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I am not sure about this. Ferguson in the last few years didn't trust the youngstes that much. I hate to bring it up, but Pogba was as talented as Januzaj.

I am not saying that Januzaj wouldn't have make an appearance or two, but no chance that he would have made 24 games so far under SAF. Not even half of them. Until now IMO, managing Adnan is Moyes' biggest highlight, followed by games against Leverkusen and the qualification for knock out round of UCL. And that is all pros for him IMO.
 
Why has it all gone horribly wrong?

At Everton Moyes' teams, while not beautiful, were solid, hard to beat and well set up to counter. They got the ball forward quickly, got bodies forward in support fast and played at a pace and tempo yet to be seen at Old Trafford this season.

Moyes also proved he had a great talent for spotting cheap, good players from abroad like Mirallas and nurturing talents like Cahill who had been overlooked by other bosses.

He has shown none of this ability since he took over at United, why? The team are playing worse than any of his Everton teams of recent memory. Defensively we're all over the place, our people aren't close together when we attack, we don't get bodies forward...Why has Moyes changed a habit of a lifetime for something much worse?

As for his moves in the transfer market. Fellaini for £28 million. Need I say more?
 
#07 said:
Why has it all gone horribly wrong?

At Everton Moyes' teams, while not beautiful, were solid, hard to beat and well set up to counter. They got the ball forward quickly, got bodies forward in support fast and played at a pace and tempo yet to be seen at Old Trafford this season.

Moyes also proved he had a great talent for spotting cheap, good players from abroad like Mirallas and nurturing talents like Cahill who had been overlooked by other bosses.

He has shown none of this ability since he took over at United, why? The team are playing worse than any of his Everton teams of recent memory. Defensively we're all over the place, our people aren't close together when we attack, we don't get bodies forward...Why has Moyes changed a habit of a lifetime for something much worse?

As for his moves in the transfer market. Fellaini for £28 million. Need I say more?
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People are complaining that we are turning into Everton, but from what you are saying that isn't even happening. If we had we wouldn't have lost the games we have. Maybe our players aren't up to a high tempo game? We have complained about the pace for ages. We have started games at a high pace at times and the tempo seems to drop after about 30 minutes. That makes you think the players aren't up to a high tempo game. He may have given up on that until he can get the right players for that style of play in the summer.
 
There was someone on Talksport just now saying we aren't closing down. We haven't done that for a while. We have been losing the ball and letting teams walk through our midfield for ages now. That isn't something that has just happened this season.
 
#07 said:
Why has it all gone horribly wrong?

At Everton Moyes' teams, while not beautiful, were solid, hard to beat and well set up to counter. They got the ball forward quickly, got bodies forward in support fast and played at a pace and tempo yet to be seen at Old Trafford this season.

Moyes also proved he had a great talent for spotting cheap, good players from abroad like Mirallas and nurturing talents like Cahill who had been overlooked by other bosses.

He has shown none of this ability since he took over at United, why? The team are playing worse than any of his Everton teams of recent memory. Defensively we're all over the place, our people aren't close together when we attack, we don't get bodies forward...Why has Moyes changed a habit of a lifetime for something much worse?

As for his moves in the transfer market. Fellaini for £28 million. Need I say more?
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Everton was a team which was build by him. If we give him time and money, e will build a team that will be playing better than this and very likely will be a beter team than his Everton. Unfortunately, I think that it wouldn't be near enough in quality to win the title.

Moyes was great at transfers when it came to cheap players. That is totally irrelevant to United. Even our squad players usually cost as much/more as their highest transfers. On the other side, he was very average when it came to big transfers, which is a big worry cause we make big transfers. Transfers like Smalling who for us were relatively cheap, for Everton would have been spending a fortune.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
People are complaining that we are turning into Everton, but from what you are saying that isn't even happening. If we had we wouldn't have lost the games we have. Maybe our players aren't up to a high tempo game? We have complained about the pace for ages. We have started games at a high pace at times and the tempo seems to drop after about 30 minutes. That makes you think the players aren't up to a high tempo game. He may have given up on that until he can get the right players for that style of play in the summer.
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We are definitely not turning into Everton, Moyes' or Martinez's. Everton barely used wingers. Pienaar and Mirallas are not wingers. They go narrow like Silva and Nasri. I had thought with Mata coming in we'd copy that with Mata and Januzaj. But instead Young and Valencia are still nailed on for starting places.

Its so weird. I feel sometimes like Moyes has been told Man Utd play with wingers so he feels compelled, because he's not a big enough personality to say no, to try and do something that is tactically and totally alien to him and persist with 'wingplay' (whatever the hell that means).

Moyes just doesn't seem to be managing the situation at all but being managed by it. There's no leadership, no signs of a plan. He's not brought his philosophy to United, he's been dragged about by a rubbish version of something close to West Ham under Big Sam. Hoof it wide, smash into into the box and hope it bounces to a United striker. Its pathetic.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
There was someone on Talksport just now saying we aren't closing down. We haven't done that for a while. We have been losing the ball and letting teams walk through our midfield for ages now. That isn't something that has just happened this season.
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On the first half of last season, we were the third team with the highest percentage of ball in Europe (after Barca and Bayern). Not sure about the second part.

We weren't excellent last year, but not near as bad as you are making it. During the entire season the only games we were dominated were: Soton (home and away, in both games we won), Chelsea and City home (Chelsea was after we won the title), first half against Spurs at home (no excuses for that) and ironically against Everton (away).

We have been dominated in more than half the games this season.
 
Revan said:
Everton was a team which was build by him. If we give him time and money, e will build a team that will be playing better than this and very likely will be a beter team than his Everton. Unfortunately, I think that it wouldn't be near enough in quality to win the title.

Moyes was great at transfers when it came to cheap players. That is totally irrelevant to United. Even our squad players usually cost as much/more as their highest transfers. On the other side, he was very average when it came to big transfers, which is a big worry cause we make big transfers. Transfers like Smalling who for us were relatively cheap, for Everton would have been spending a fortune.
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Maybe the owner would like someone who can uncover hidden gems that will be worth a fortune eventually. That will be another reason Jose wouldn't have got the job in their eyes. Any injuries or problems Jose just wants to throw money at it.
 
#07 said:
Why has it all gone horribly wrong?

At Everton Moyes' teams, while not beautiful, were solid, hard to beat and well set up to counter. They got the ball forward quickly, got bodies forward in support fast and played at a pace and tempo yet to be seen at Old Trafford this season.

Moyes also proved he had a great talent for spotting cheap, good players from abroad like Mirallas and nurturing talents like Cahill who had been overlooked by other bosses.

He has shown none of this ability since he took over at United, why? The team are playing worse than any of his Everton teams of recent memory. Defensively we're all over the place, our people aren't close together when we attack, we don't get bodies forward...Why has Moyes changed a habit of a lifetime for something much worse?

As for his moves in the transfer market. Fellaini for £28 million. Need I say more?
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Evra fecks up our back line and Rafaels omission does very bad things to us. Another daunting aspect is I can only really recall three good individual midfield performances this season and two were from Fletcher and one Jones. If Moyes had gone out and got us a midfielder we wouldn't be in this mess. All those people who didn't want Cabaye.......

I have confidence he'll build a decent title winning team if given time. I don't have confidence that he'll turn us around quick enough to avoid being sacked.

Only way we got top 4 is if our midfielders step up, Fellaini showing why we paid so much would be a great start
 
#07 said:
We are definitely not turning into Everton, Moyes' or Martinez's. Everton barely used wingers. Pienaar and Mirallas are not wingers. They go narrow like Silva and Nasri. I had thought with Mata coming in we'd copy that with Mata and Januzaj. But instead Young and Valencia are still nailed on for starting places.

Its so weird. I feel sometimes like Moyes has been told Man Utd play with wingers so he feels compelled, because he's not a big enough personality to say no, to try and do something that is tactically and totally alien to him and persist with 'wingplay' (whatever the hell that means).

Moyes just doesn't seem to be managing the situation at all but being managed by it. There's no leadership, no signs of a plan. He's not brought his philosophy to United, he's been dragged about by a rubbish version of something close to West Ham under Big Sam. Hoof it wide, smash into into the box and hope it bounces to a United striker. Its pathetic.
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He maybe has to stand up for himself and just say I don't want to use wingers. If United are insisting on it then we are in the shit no matter who the manager is. Is the another instance of The Manchester United Way? If it is then Manchester United need to get with the times before we are left behind.
 
Smores said:
Evra fcuks up our back line and Rafaels omission does very bad things to us. Another daunting aspect is I can only really recall three good individual midfield performances this season and two were from Fletcher and one Jones. If Moyes had gone out and got us a midfielder we wouldn't be in this mess. All those people who didn't want Cabaye.......

I have confidence he'll build a decent title winning team if given time. I don't have confidence that he'll turn us around quick enough to avoid being sacked.

Only way we got top 4 is if our midfielders step up, Fellaini showing why we paid so much would be a great start
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How many average midfielders should we stock up on?

We bought Fellaini for £27m after people NEEDING a transfer, the likes of you would have bought Cabaye for £20m or so, when neither are really what's required.
 
Revan said:
On the first half of last season, we were the third team with the highest percentage of ball in Europe (after Barca and Bayern). Not sure about the second part.

We weren't excellent last year, but not near as bad as you are making it. During the entire season the only games we were dominated were: Soton (home and away, in both games we won), Chelsea and City home (Chelsea was after we won the title), first half against Spurs at home (no excuses for that) and ironically against Everton (away).

We have been dominated in more than half the games this season.
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Do you know, that sounds like players going through the motions. I cannot imagine he is not telling them to not close people down.
 
The club are going to give him another season, rightly or wrongly its going to happen, I just cant see the club sacking him, even though he deserves it.
Ive also given up on our chances of getting top 4, to me that was the minimum goal for this season, the way we are playing and the teams we have to play and the fact we have three teams to overtake, its to be to big a gap to pull back. This season should just be written off, its been a disaster from the start.
I hope, come the summer he gets his players and turns it around, I don't think he will as he is finding it hard to get anything out of the team we have. I just cant see any light at the end of the tunnel, no matter how much I want to. I just dont see any signs that give me even the smallest glimmer of hope.
 
Revan said:
Very fair. The only thing I disagreed with him was Zaha. I don't know how can be a pro for Moyes to ship Zaha after he only got 60 minutes this year? If he becomes a better player, that is because of Moyes?

Well, also Rooney bit is becoming a myth. He isn't playing at his best. Better than last season for sure, but nowhere near as good as in 2009-2010 and the second half of 2010-2011.
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What's this based on? He's been out for a while, and has been our best player this season!
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Maybe the owner would like someone who can uncover hidden gems that will be worth a fortune eventually. That will be another reason Jose wouldn't have got the job in their eyes. Any injuries or problems Jose just wants to throw money at it.
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Hidden gems he got for Everton aren't good enough for us. The likes of Coleman or Mirallas (while good player) wouldn't be starters at United (maybe under Moyes yes but that is something else).

His big transfers were the likes of Fellaini, Johnson, Bilaledinov and Yakubu. Again not good enough.

Like in all other things, there is a big difference between Everton and United job. Getting a young Coleman for 50k, developing him for 5 years and making him one of the best RB in the league is impressive. But does he have that luxury at United. And even yes, still there are better players than him right there (like our very own Rafael). And getting saved a fortune by finding those gems is financially irrelevant to the losses from the lack of UCL.

Personally I think that for a club like United it is more important to be better in high transfers (Mata, Berbatov, Fellaini, Rio) and other 'medium' transfers (Young, Nani, Kagawa, De Gea) rather than low transfers (Hernandez, Smalling) or very low ones (Varela, Da Silva). The last two categories are more bonus, we usually every year buy a few cheap players and see how it goes. The biggest money though is spend on the expensive ones.

I think that they are two very different categories, and being good in one doesn't neccesarily means that you're good at other. Even SAF during the last years wasn't that good at expensive players.
 
#07 said:
We are definitely not turning into Everton, Moyes' or Martinez's. Everton barely used wingers. Pienaar and Mirallas are not wingers. They go narrow like Silva and Nasri. I had thought with Mata coming in we'd copy that with Mata and Januzaj. But instead Young and Valencia are still nailed on for starting places.

Its so weird. I feel sometimes like Moyes has been told Man Utd play with wingers so he feels compelled, because he's not a big enough personality to say no, to try and do something that is tactically and totally alien to him and persist with 'wingplay' (whatever the hell that means).

Moyes just doesn't seem to be managing the situation at all but being managed by it. There's no leadership, no signs of a plan. He's not brought his philosophy to United, he's been dragged about by a rubbish version of something close to West Ham under Big Sam. Hoof it wide, smash into into the box and hope it bounces to a United striker. Its pathetic.
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Spot on this, a lot of bullshit criticism flying around about Moyes but as you say it's the fact he's not stamped his image that is the issue. It's as if he wrote this season and some of our players off early on.

Only Fergie could make our shite system into winning football, Moyes needs to implement his own system rather than failing at Fergies.
 
Sandikan said:
What's this based on? He's been out for a while, and has been our best player this season!
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He was probably the third best player in the world in 2009-2010 and likely on top 5 - top 10 on the second half of 2010-2011. In both those cases he was easily the best in the league.

He isn't even near that level this season and he hasn't been in top 10 or even top 20 in Europe. Our best player, absolutely yes, but at the moment that isn't that hard. Don't get me wrong, I admitted that he is playing better than last season by people are going a bit far by Rooney is playing at his best.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Do you know, that sounds like players going through the motions. I cannot imagine he is not telling them to not close people down.
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The important part are the tactics, not what he says to them. Everyone knows what is good (make me manager, I would say to players to pass the ball, do pressure, play exciting) but likely on the game my team would look like a shit version of Stoke City.

What he says to players isn't as important as how he implements the tactics and the schemes/training.

Another thing that baffles me is the deep defense. Playing with a deep defense practically makes impossible to make pressure and makes the job impossible for the midfield. At times it's a good idea. Against the likes of City or Liverpool it is suicidal to play with a high defense (unless you can keep the ball forever). But against Stoke and Peter Crouch is pretty illogical.
 
Revan said:
The important part are the tactics, not what he says to them. Everyone knows what is good (make me manager, I would say to players to pass the ball, do pressure, play exciting) but likely on the game my team would look like a shit version of Stoke City.

What he says to players isn't as important as how he implements the tactics and the schemes/training.

Another thing that baffles me is the deep defense. Playing with a deep defense practically makes impossible to make pressure and makes the job impossible for the midfield. At times it's a good idea. Against the likes of City or Liverpool it is suicidal to play with a high defense (unless you can keep the ball forever). But against Stoke and Peter Crouch is pretty illogical.
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I am worried that some of the players are still disgruntled that SAF went how he did and are thinking of going at the end of the season. If they have that attitude and care more about themselves than the club, which is likely. It will not be helping the team one bit. You only need three or four players who aren't bothered and it can be disruptive to the rest. That type are also likely to be the big personalities on the team.
 
Revan said:
He was probably the third best player in the world in 2009-2010 and likely on top 5 - top 10 on the second half of 2010-2011. In both those cases he was easily the best in the league.

He isn't even near that level this season and he hasn't been in top 10 or even top 20 in Europe. Our best player, absolutely yes, but at the moment that isn't that hard. Don't get me wrong, I admitted that he is playing better than last season by people are going a bit far by Rooney is playing at his best.
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QFT
 
Andy Mitten's piece on ESPN this evening about the current state of United makes pretty grim reading, particularly this section:

The manager does not have the confidence of all his players, some of them senior. But then he doesn't have confidence in all his players, some of them senior. He feels that some haven't been putting in the required effort. Some players don't agree with his tactics, which they consider too conservative. They've thought that from the start. There's not a football club in the world without similar problems, but United was different under Ferguson. Usually.

The players are not going to speak out in public. What's the point? Would you speak out in public against your boss while under contract? It's likely that you would lose your job.

Most players were underwhelmed when they first heard Moyes' name, but that was partly because of the shock of Ferguson's surprise retirement. They had gotten used to life as it was. And it was fine under Ferguson. Everyone quickly came round to the idea of giving Moyes their best shot. Some haven't, though.
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http://espnfc.com/blog/_/name/manchesterunited/id/4210?cc=5739
 
I really don't get why we are going to let Moyes continue to build the side and just let him have a completely free pass this season. We all know he's not good enough, why delay the inevitable? Another year of Moyes may put us back 5 years from challenging for major honours again. No matter how much petrol you put in a diesel engine it won't work...
 
Infra-red said:
Andy Mitten's piece on ESPN this evening about the current state of United makes pretty grim reading, particularly this section:



http://espnfc.com/blog/_/name/manchesterunited/id/4210?cc=5739
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Interesting read from Andy, if they get rid of Moyes the players will have won. It won't happen as SAF has always said nobody is bigger than the club. If the players win then no matter who the manager is they will feel that anytime they are unhappy with something they can pull the same tricks again. I don't want my club run by the players. Other clubs have let that happen. He needs to weed out the slackers, we don't need players who are not fighting for the cause. You don't need to like your boss.
 
shaggy said:
I really don't get why we are going to let Moyes continue to build the side and just let him have a completely free pass this season. We all know he's not good enough, why delay the inevitable? Another year of Moyes may put us back 5 years from challenging for major honours again. No matter how much petrol you put in a diesel engine it won't work...
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Let's just have a poll amongst the players as who to have as manager, they obviously know best and are all fully qualified coaches.
 
Revan said:
The important part are the tactics, not what he says to them. Everyone knows what is good (make me manager, I would say to players to pass the ball, do pressure, play exciting) but likely on the game my team would look like a shit version of Stoke City.

What he says to players isn't as important as how he implements the tactics and the schemes/training.

Another thing that baffles me is the deep defense. Playing with a deep defense practically makes impossible to make pressure and makes the job impossible for the midfield. At times it's a good idea. Against the likes of City or Liverpool it is suicidal to play with a high defense (unless you can keep the ball forever). But against Stoke and Peter Crouch is pretty illogical.
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Reading the Andy Mitton article further down this thread, some players are not giving their all. That is disgraceful, they are letting the fans down, who always turn out to support the team and are indirectly letting SAF down as well, saying he doesn't know what he is doing. Well he bought them so maybe he doesn't.
 
LonelyFire said:
One point im frankly astounded by is how quickly some fans have turned on some great servants to our club - Río, Vidic, Evra etc have all delivered great years to this club while producing something at the end of it i.e. Trophies.

The fact that many are hanging these guys out to dry in some effort to support Moyes is just sad.
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I'm inclined to agree. It's not beyond the realm of possibilities that our training sessions are less effective and that the players are yet to understand how exactly Moyes plans to have us play. Many times in the last few years have we played relatively average football, but never so consistently terrible. I don't believe that our players are under-performing in some conspiracy attempt at undermining Moyes. If the whole team is under-performing for half a year something is clearly wrong at the highest level.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Reading the Andy Mitton article further down this thread, some players are not giving their all. That is disgraceful, they are letting the fans down, who always turn out to support the team and are indirectly letting SAF down as well, saying he doesn't know what he is doing. Well he bought them so maybe he doesn't.
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It's a two way street though, there's no doubting we've yet to see the best of many of our players this season. It could be argued Moyes has both failed to motivate them and to get the best out of them with his tactics.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Interesting read from Andy, if they get rid of Moyes the players will have won. It won't happen as SAF has always said nobody is bigger than the club. If the players win then no matter who the manager is they will feel that anytime they are unhappy with something they can pull the same tricks again. I don't want my club run by the players. Other clubs have let that happen. He needs to weed out the slackers, we don't need players who are not fighting for the cause. You don't need to like your boss.
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That applies to the manager as well.
 
Kid Cunto said:
It's a two way street though, there's no doubting we've yet to see the best of many of our players this season. It could be argued Moyes has both failed to motivate them and to get the best out of them with his footballing philosophy.
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If it is the senior players who are slacking and not trying, then where are the younger players going to get their guidance from? We always question about who are the leaders on the team, it appears there are none.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
If it is the senior players who are slacking and not trying, then where are the younger players going to get their guidance from? We always question about who are the leaders on the team, it appears there are none.
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We can hardly blame the player's for not being natural leaders. The leaders are Nemanja, Patrice and Rio but all three are fecking off in the summer. Like it or not, that's gonna affect their motivation.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Interesting read from Andy, if they get rid of Moyes the players will have won. It won't happen as SAF has always said nobody is bigger than the club. If the players win then no matter who the manager is they will feel that anytime they are unhappy with something they can pull the same tricks again. I don't want my club run by the players. Other clubs have let that happen. He needs to weed out the slackers, we don't need players who are not fighting for the cause. You don't need to like your boss.
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The position Moyes is in now isn't down to the players not liking him though. It isn't like AVB at Chelsea. They don't need to like our manager but they need to have faith and belief in his abilities. Moyes is eroding that as the season has gone on.
 
Kid Cunto said:
We can hardly blame the player's for not being natural leaders. The leaders are Nemanja, Patrice and Rio but all three are fcuking off in the summer. Like it or not, that's gonna affect their motivation.
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Then they should have gone last summer if they knew this was a possibility. They might as well got Smalling/Evans/Jones at the start with a couple of backups and a new LB and backup. Players strolling their way through a season are no good to us.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Then they should have gone last summer if they knew this was a possibility. They might as well got Smalling/Evans/Jones at the start with a couple of backups and a new LB and backup. Players strolling their way through a season are no good to us.
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Neither is an inept dinosaur of a manager.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
If it is the senior players who are slacking and not trying, then where are the younger players going to get their guidance from? We always question about who are the leaders on the team, it appears there are none.
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thing is that most "senior players"
have been either crocked - carrick,fletcher,vidic,young,nani,rvp or else past their best - Río,evra,giggs. Then there is Valencia who is out of form and Rooney whose form improved over last season.
so no wonder the team lacks leadership at the moment
 
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