That Burnley manager talks a good game.
Moyes So Far!
- Thread starter RedTillI'mDead
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Jesting
In the cases of Silva and Toure, we're talking about one of the richest clubs in the world here. If it hadn't been for the wages offered, Toure and Silva wouldn't have looked at City twice. I agree that it's not impossible to sign top players, but it undoubtedly becomes a lot more difficult, and if given the choice between us and a club of similar stature in the CL then it's likely they'll pick the club in the CL. We should bounce back eventually if we fall out, but it's a difficult thing to assume and it'd be easier if we just weren't in that position at all and maintained a top 4 place.
Thats so spot on man!
Why though? What has he done in his career, let alone the United job, that means he deserves time?
For any Pokemon fans
If we don't finish 4th he should be flogged in public.
I can't even envisage things getting better at the moment. Not that I believe it won't, I just can't imagine what it would look like. Will we suddenly click and start playing well? Will it be incremental, slowly but steadily improving?
Are we suddenly going to start fielding the kinds of teams suggested by the majority in the match day forum, playing a narrow passing game? When we bought Mata I had a surge of optimism but if he was going to do it why wait? Seems more likely we're going to continue playing with width, we just have to hope we start getting better at it.
Are we suddenly going to start fielding the kinds of teams suggested by the majority in the match day forum, playing a narrow passing game? When we bought Mata I had a surge of optimism but if he was going to do it why wait? Seems more likely we're going to continue playing with width, we just have to hope we start getting better at it.
You know things are bad when your Spurs supporting cousin gives you shit most weeks 
Yeah, it really is.
Hard to defend that type of defeat today. Despite us having our problems, we still should be able to find a system that allows us to be organised and harder to beat. If we can be more solid, we have more than enough quality in attacking positions to be a bigger threat on the break.
Players take confidence from the conviction and direction shown by the manager, especially when things are not going well. That conviction leads to a belief and trust in whatever the manager is trying to implement, and the players confidence grows as a result. We have seen exactly that occur most noticeably at Southampton, despite Pochettino not even speaking much english! From relegation fodder to europa challengers in a season, and shockingly by using mostly English players!
Our team seems to be reflecting the plight of our manager atm. All looks a bit anxious and desperate, and any belief appears to be more hopeful than expectant.The club is lacking direction and Moyes obviously isn't providing it. There doesn't seem to be that sense of something changing for the better that you would surely notice if the players were buying into Moyes instructions. It seems the players are no more convinced by Moyes, than the majority of fans have been. Moyes looks a bit lost, and to me he is merely attempting to reproduce what SAF did, without anywhere near enough charisma or arrogance to instill that same belief in the players.
If things don't improve i can't see him getting another year personally. I am not a knee jerker, but the real concern i have is this: if Moyes had an actual clear philosophy he wants to implement to take us forward, then it would surely have been evident long before now. I am not seeing anything new, and I believe we need a complete change of philosophy simply because nobody is going to improve upon what SAF did using his approach. So in my view we need to move purposefully away from that mentality before we can really begin to improve, but I have certainly not been persuaded that Moyes is the man to do it. How can Moyes reasonably expect to convince the players and fans we are moving forward, while all he seems to be offering is a far less convincing continuation of our past?
Players take confidence from the conviction and direction shown by the manager, especially when things are not going well. That conviction leads to a belief and trust in whatever the manager is trying to implement, and the players confidence grows as a result. We have seen exactly that occur most noticeably at Southampton, despite Pochettino not even speaking much english! From relegation fodder to europa challengers in a season, and shockingly by using mostly English players!
Our team seems to be reflecting the plight of our manager atm. All looks a bit anxious and desperate, and any belief appears to be more hopeful than expectant.The club is lacking direction and Moyes obviously isn't providing it. There doesn't seem to be that sense of something changing for the better that you would surely notice if the players were buying into Moyes instructions. It seems the players are no more convinced by Moyes, than the majority of fans have been. Moyes looks a bit lost, and to me he is merely attempting to reproduce what SAF did, without anywhere near enough charisma or arrogance to instill that same belief in the players.
If things don't improve i can't see him getting another year personally. I am not a knee jerker, but the real concern i have is this: if Moyes had an actual clear philosophy he wants to implement to take us forward, then it would surely have been evident long before now. I am not seeing anything new, and I believe we need a complete change of philosophy simply because nobody is going to improve upon what SAF did using his approach. So in my view we need to move purposefully away from that mentality before we can really begin to improve, but I have certainly not been persuaded that Moyes is the man to do it. How can Moyes reasonably expect to convince the players and fans we are moving forward, while all he seems to be offering is a far less convincing continuation of our past?
I don't believe one season out of the CL would make a big difference in our ability to attract players. But if one season turns to two and then three, that's a big game changer. And since I don't believe our big problem is the personnel, I fear even getting a couple of good players in the summer won't see us back up in the top 4 next season.
I take your point alright, but City started offering bigger wages / fee's than we were, to get these players in & their plans were to continue doing that - thats what sold it to Toure & Silva - "The Project".
Problem is now man, the wages have gone through the roof. How much more are we gonna have to pay in wages to beat the likes of City to get players now? And even if we match or improve a wage offered by the likes of City - these clubs are in a better position to win trophies, so thats to our detriment.
The amount of teams that can offer what City are willing to pay in fee's & wages has seriously upped since City started out doing it. Wish more players had the same attitude as RVP had when he only wanted to come here & for less money than City were offering. But we only lost the League on goal difference the season before. We've a very different team now in terms of performances & its seriously lacking of any motivation from the management!
feck me, now I understand why the folks in Jonestown drank the kool aid.
feck this is depressing reading.
We're in a tricky situation, with our influential elder statesmen, Fergie and Bobby, likely to support David Moyes through thick and thin, in order to prove Gods know what to God knows who about the club and the United way, and owners who bought United as a business investment, without knowing or caring much about the core activity of playing football.
The Glazers disinterest was fine, even an advantage, in the Fergie era, but it could now come back to bite us by making them reluctant to overrule United's wise men and take the necessary steps to safeguard the club's future. A more active, hands on ownership would be very welcome at this point. Where's Daniel Levy when you need him?
The Glazers disinterest was fine, even an advantage, in the Fergie era, but it could now come back to bite us by making them reluctant to overrule United's wise men and take the necessary steps to safeguard the club's future. A more active, hands on ownership would be very welcome at this point. Where's Daniel Levy when you need him?
He didn't watch the game if he thinks Mata played only as a winger in the opening half or all we did was lump it in from the flanks
In a way, we've been lucky that he's only managed to waste £27.5m of our funds this season. When we sack him in the summer, at least the new manager should still have some cash to improve the squad.
It could have been a lot worse if he'd managed to secure Baines etc
It could have been a lot worse if he'd managed to secure Baines etc
It concerns me that he is willingly creating more problems for himself due to mismanagement of certain players. Granted the squad did indeed require some attention, however Fergie also bestowed upon the manager some talented youth as well as reliable servants to the club.
Fabio - Sold
Zaha - Loaned out, poor relationship with the player.
Kagawa - Sporadic appearances and most of those out of position; likely to be sold in the summer.
Hernandez - Has featured less then last season and beginning, reasonable to assume that he is considering his options.
Smallign and Jones - More positions than at an orgy though minus the satisfying results.
Rio - A mutual loss of confidence between both parties, a circumstance that i can't help but believe has been damaging on and off of the pitch.
Rafael - Has regressed from what was a really very good 12/13.
Would he mind living up to his job title at some point?
Fabio - Sold
Zaha - Loaned out, poor relationship with the player.
Kagawa - Sporadic appearances and most of those out of position; likely to be sold in the summer.
Hernandez - Has featured less then last season and beginning, reasonable to assume that he is considering his options.
Smallign and Jones - More positions than at an orgy though minus the satisfying results.
Rio - A mutual loss of confidence between both parties, a circumstance that i can't help but believe has been damaging on and off of the pitch.
Rafael - Has regressed from what was a really very good 12/13.
Would he mind living up to his job title at some point?
"but we must have got to the byline eight or nine times.”
Oh noos, our only attacking plan is not a secret anymore.
Oh noos, our only attacking plan is not a secret anymore.
Speaking of which, at least we've been spared his presence in the team.
He deserves time? How has he earned more time? His resume doesn't justify his hire, his results don't justify his being kept on as manager nor does his football. We aren't losing because we're unlucky, despite his ritualistic repetition of this seemingly every match. We're losing because we're playing predictable, ineffective, and unimaginative football. Poor decision making on Moyes' part compounded things today. United's lack of identity this season falls at Moyes' feet. Giving him time for the sake of it will only lead us down the road of Liverpool under Souness. He has to earn his job before the end of the season. Thus far, he should be fired in May. His only "achievement" is getting out of a surprisingly weak group in the Champions League to the last 16. If he can't manage to beat Olympiakos, which currently I don't see us doing no matter how crap they are, he might need to go before May.
Also, how many fans' opinions of Moyes have changed? I, along with the vast majority of the Caf, did not want him to begin with on the basis of what he did at Everton. However, everyone supported him and gave him a chance once appointed. Everyone still has their doubts about him, justifiably. That doesn't change the fact that everyone wants him to succeed because it means United will succeed. Why shouldn't supporters be upset when he, in a single season, manages to take United out of the title race and now surely out of the race for even a top 4 spot? The signing of Mata gave United fans some much needed hope that the team's play and results would improve, not that Moyes was suddenly a championship manager.
When Keane wasn't good enough, Fergie moved him on. United need to do the same with Moyes unless he can prove himself between now and May. He doesn't deserve anything.
Exactly. People are talking that Moyes will get rid of the deadwood in the summer but it looks more likely than in the summer we would lose Hernandez, Kagawa and Nani (and add Fabio who already was sold) and still have Young, Buttner and Valencia. Basically we'll lose some of the really good squad players we have but continue to play some of the shit ones.
It hurts because it's true.
I knew we were in the shit when he was interviewed after the CS in August....
On the plus side, we're definitely not going to get relegated................Clutching at fecking straws here
On the plus side, we're definitely not going to get relegated................Clutching at fecking straws here
The Bubbles must fancy their chances against this United team. The win in Germany really looks like being a one-off, a rarely to be repeated fluke. Some of those players out there today demonstrated body language suggesting abject misery. Van Persie looks like he can't wait to feck off to Spain or somewhere and Rooney's shoulders slumped after Stoke scored their second. There was no shouting on the pitch, no mutual encouragement and nobody there to light a fire under their arses. Moyes moved around the technical area praying for divine intervention and Neville and Gail Platt could have been replaced with cardboard cut-outs and you wouldn't have known the difference. We "played well" and "got to the byline" a few times. That's it. That sums up 90+ minutes of a Manchester United game. Even Wilf McGuinness managed to get us to within spitting distance of a cup final in 1970. This berk took us to the third round.
Thats how Nazi Liverpool started
Tommy Doc said that in 1973. No, we won't get relegated but it might be some time before we're serious title contenders again.
I'll support him but he is simply awful and should never have been given the job in the first place.
I fear giving him transfer windows to fix the problem will backfire and create even more issues, I don't think he will ever turn it around
I fear giving him transfer windows to fix the problem will backfire and create even more issues, I don't think he will ever turn it around
We got to the 3 round due to being members of the FA.
We got to the 3 round due to being members of the FA.
Should have said "as far as".
Moyes has many things that can justifiably be threw at him, but targeting his transfer activity is a bit rich considering the perpetually questionable state of our transfer inactivity under SAF, leaving the situation far more desperate when Moyes took over than it ever should have been. I don't see how at least attempting to address that long overdue issue of strengthening is worthy of derision. He has bought 2 players, one is undoubted quality, and one has it all to prove. Nothing definitive about Moyes transfer acumen can be reasoned from that surely?
His inability to convince the players we already had is far more damaging to his suitability in my view.
It would be tragic if Rene goes and gets a result against him
Sure, I'm just thinking to the future now and am grateful that Moyes hasn't managed to bring in too many of 'his own players', which would then be a burden on the new manager in the summer.
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At least he's breaking records.
That's a good point I think.
I'm worried about it. Not being in the CL isn't going to mean you lose all your best players (tho Rooney? I wonder what he's thinking.) but it makes it difficult to attract people. Why come to us if they can go somewhere that'll probably pay them more and offer them CL football? We have history and players I'm sure respect it but I can't imagine it's a deciding factor for most of them. I think we'd have more joy with the forthcoming rebuild if we had CL football, it'll make a difference in who we get. I think people will want to play with RVP, Rooney if he stays, Mata and Januzaj. We have the makings of an exciting team, so I'm sure it can be done. But it's definitely made life harder and we may lose out on some targets we might otherwise have got.
Time for a "Moyes Sack Watch" thread WHEN that happens.
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