Moyes So Far!

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We haven't been a technical side for a good few years now. Rolando in his prime meant we were a lot better to watch.. we have been boring for a while now.. the difference is we were effective and it was justified. We are no longer winning. and we don't have Scholes.. and we don't have Ferguson.

The style of play is largely the same
 
Shark22 said:
That Liverpool team at the time was truly piss poor, were as this United team are the current champions. Even with the key players out, we should be knocking this Sunderland team out at home. We hardly even bothered to go at Sunderland with a sense of threat until we were sure we were going out. The tactics were shocking.
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We were champions because RVP saved us time after time. Our season was one of shit performances being saved by one man.

Why do you think the Caf was panicking when we were up by 12 points in April? Because we were playing fantastic? Is that why we were embarrassed by City last season and people started freaking out? Are we the same champions that collapsed two years ago and handed the title to City?

You have to ignore all that to come to your conclusion. Their is a problem with the squad. There is a problem with the manager.
 
It's time for people to stop this pretence of being behind Moyes 100%. We are a laughing stock, no other major team has sunk so low so fast.
 
Jimy_Hills_Chin said:
@Eyepopper

Who exactly are the players who played so badly? Welbeck, Carrick, Hernandez, Buttner, Fletcher and De Gea for my money.
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But it would be unfair to single De Gea out. He's been very good all season and Popper is going on about players who don't care and can't be arsed - De Gea looked like he was going to cry after his mistake. It was a horrible error, no doubt, but a very uncharacteristic one. He also went on to save two penalties.
 
AlwaysRedwood said:
No. Once we went up Sunderland began playing for a goal and we couldn't stop them. I don't think we sat back, I think we were pushed back.
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You have to be kidding me...

Valencia on for Kagawa perhaps is not a defensive sub as well? Jones for Carrick with Cleverly on the bench?
 
Godfather said:
Even if Mata joins... with those tactics we just won't win shit. He's a fecking dinosaur and tactically outplayed by almost very manager in the Pl so far. I have been patient but that kind of performance today against fecking Sunderland really takes the piss
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The thing is, even if we won on penalties or DDG hadn't spilled the ball in his own net, we would still be complaining, for me it's not even about the result, that performance was utterly inept.
 
Enigma_87 said:
You don't believe we were sitting out that 1-0 lead in the ET? And the players deliberately chose to play like that?
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I don't see a huge problem with sitting on a 1 nil lead in a cup semi in extra time to be perfectly honest.

In terms of how we chose or were instructed to play, I highly doubt Moyes instruction to our defenders is 'right lads, just give them loads of time, then panic and see if you can get yourself sent off... do not, under any circumstances mark anyone.'
 
BennyBlanco said:
The thing is, even if we won on penalties or DDG hadn't spilled the ball in his own net, we would still be complaining, for me it's not even about the result, that performanc was utterly inept.
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extactly its the way the team as played the entire season, the football is shocking
 
Sums up the luck Moyes is having. Sunderland have one shot on target all night and score via a rare mistake from de Gea. And Carrick gets another injury as well.

Unbelievable.
 
When we actually try to go forward and score we get a goal within 30 seconds. I joked to the people I was watching the match with when we scored that we only had 82 minutes to hold on. But that was exactly how we played the game. Small time manager who blagged the big job. Excuses being made for him about the players it there is no way on Earth that the quality of players prohibits us from having a go at teams like Sunderland. The results might improve slightly but we'll need to get used to this way of playing under this horribly out of his depth manager. No amount of Mata's will change the way he sets teams up to approach games.
 
Livvie said:
The players, the backroom boys, and the manager - it's a collective problem. It's like a rolling stone gathering moss.

It does concern me that David Moyes doesn't seem to be able to motivate the players. And maybe the players aren't motivating him either, but he's the one who has to get the team functioning. We can't win trophies for nearly 30 years and attribute it to the greatest manager ever, but then blame the players when it goes wrong. Obviously the players share the responsibility, but have they turned bad overnight? Or were they never as good as they've been hyped up to be. There's been enough discussion in other threads, with the diehard faithful insisting that we have a great squad. So if they are great, what's happened to them?
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I think we saw Fergie get the last out of some ageing players to win the title and that in reality we were a team in transition or about to go in to transition. Add in a new manager, new coaching setup, new executives and it was always going to be a tough year. I didnt think it would be as tough as this but add in injuries to our 2 best players who provided a massive backbone for last years title and right now its just really ugly.
Moyes should be able to get more out of this but its going to get worse before it gets better.
 
Eyepopper said:
I don't see a huge problem with sitting on a 1 nil lead in a cup semi in extra time to be perfectly honest.

In terms of how we chose or were instructed to play, I highly doubt Moyes instruction to our defenders is 'right lads, just give them loads of time, then panic and see if you can get yourself sent off... do not, under any circumstances mark anyone.'
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But we didn't just do it in extra time, we we're doing from half time onwards, against the worst team in the league. No I'm not gaving that. It was pathetic.
 
Thisistheone said:
Sums up the luck Moyes is having. Sunderland have one shot on target all night and score via a rare mistake from de Gea. And Carrick gets another injury as well.

Unbelievable.
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It's not luck when it happens all the time. Sit back on a lead and you can't be surprised when it blows up in your face.
 
Enigma_87 said:
You have to be kidding me...

Valencia on for Kagawa perhaps is not a defensive sub as well? Jones for Carrick with Cleverly on the bench?
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Cleverly is useless. Kagawa was tired and fading. If he was really making substitutions like you say, he would have taken off Hernandez or Welbeck.
 
He has to go. Now might not be the right time, but by the time summer rolls around he better be out. I don't care when personally, I'm just looking forward to the day.
 
This is just getting to funny.. Clueless even our standout players look piss poor aka Rafael ect... We need a manager with guts and a good set of balls. Moyes needs to go the sooner the better. Get someone in who likes football and playing it the way it should be at OT! There arent enough Mata's in the world to save us from the Moyes effect.
 
It's a right mess, alright. That was a criminal performance in a semi-final at Old Trafford - even if you factor in that is was only the Mickey Mouse cup. We had an interest in winning this semi-final - and we looked like a bloody corpse out there for much of the match. Smalling defended well, as he usually does. Adnan wasn't bad - and looked more arsed than most, as per usual. I thought Kagawa did reasonably well too - and I don't understand why he was subbed off. Granted, he seemed to lose a little steam - but when the alternative is what it is...I don't know. Valencia offers so little when he isn't on song that it's not even remotely funny - it's just painful to watch.

Let's hope we can get a boost from a transfer or two. And for God's sake, get Rooney and RVP back as soon as possible. We need an injection of something. We're in a terrible rut at the moment.
 
Eyepopper said:
I don't see a huge problem with sitting on a 1 nil lead in a cup semi in extra time to be perfectly honest.

In terms of how we chose or were instructed to play, I highly doubt Moyes instruction to our defenders is 'right lads, just give them loads of time, then panic and see if you can get yourself sent off... do not, under any circumstances mark anyone.'
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I do when we're playing against the 19th in the table, at home. Especially since we lost points or games against Cardiff, Swansea, Soton this season with the exact same sitting on a 1 goal lead.

Moyes never learns it seems.
 
BennyBlanco said:
The thing is, even if we won on penalties or DDG hadn't spilled the ball in his own net, we would still be complaining, for me it's not even about the result, that performance was utterly inept.
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Obviously. Going out makes it even worse but the performance alone was a horrorshow once again
 
Neville was right about bringing on Giggs.

Moyes said we haven't played well. Finally .
 
Eyepopper said:
Any player, pulling a Utd shirt for a semi at OT, needs to have a level of pride and determination that just doesn't look to be there with some of them. Moyes has to carry the can for some of it but regardless of who the manager was or what the system or tactics were tonight I felt the majority of the players let the club and the supporters down.

Funny that as soon as Sunderlands goal went in the players were able to inject a bit of urgency and find a goal straight away... and that had absolutely feck all to do with Moyes.
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The fact that the players can't be arsed means they're not playing for him anymore, we all know that most footballers are wankers, but at the end of the day top managers are capable of getting the best out of those wankers.
 
arthurka said:
This is just getting to funny.. Clueless even our standout players look piss poor aka Rafael ect... We need a manager with guts and a good set of balls. Moyes needs to go the sooner the better. Get someone in who likes football and playing it the way it should be at OT! There arent enough Mata's in the world to save us from the Moyes effect.
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As we are signing Mata, it won't be Jose.
 
Without Fergie and Sir Bob's patronage he'd have been gone by the end of November. "But we are a proper club with values. Unlike Citeh and Chelsea we don't hire and fire managers willy nilly. We have class and we'll stick by our rubbish manager. "
 
Someone said:
The fact that the players can't be arsed means they're not playing for him anymore, we all know that most footballers are wankers, but at the end of the day top managers are capable of getting the best out of those wankers.
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I was just hoping that our players weren't wankers, seems they are all the same.
 
Eyepopper said:
He's not, but as far as tonight goes he's quite a bit down the list in terms of those due for criticism IMO. Some of the players looked like they were out for a kick about with the reserves, and they wouldnt have even been acceptable at that level.

Its easy to get caught up in systems, and styles and formations, what I'm talking about is a bit more basic than that, show some fecking pride and a pair of nuts first and foremost, then lets have a look at the system.

I also don't buy this shit about players being disillusioned under a new manager, you're a player, you're paid to train and play, train and play to the best of your ability... simple as that.
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In an ideal world, Popper. But we have to take into account the defensive tactics we employ at Old Trafford, being happy at times to sit on a 1-0 lead. Players aren't always being used in their best positions. Substitutions have frequently been more than a bit bizarre.

Have the players got confidence in each other - or more importantly, have they got confidence in the managerial team?
 
Now that some of the initial anger is gone.. It's just the league cup. Who cares..
Get Mata and press on for the top 4.. All we have left to play for.. that and the CL.. we are still in that somehow.

Seriously though. Get our strikers back fit. Get whoever we need to get in Jan and just work on the league.
 
We don't play as a unit, tactics are wrong, there is no confidence, we lack creativity. All things the manager is responsible for. I know it gets old but I never felt comfortable with Moyes. It can't be that players "need to get used" to something new for so long and play so poorly
 
The negativity must come from the management though. Under Ferguson that would never have happened.

It was quite frankly astonishing to watch United hang on for a 1-0 knowing that it would mean extra time. Sunderland were fortunate in how the goal came about but they more than deserved it.

I hope they're given credit though. I know Poyet isn't liked on this forum, but he has been an inspiration to one of the worst sides in the league. Even Altidore was useful when he came on.
 
AlwaysRedwood said:
Cleverly is useless. Kagawa was tired and fading. If he was really making substitutions like you say, he would have taken off Hernandez or Welbeck.
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Ok so what gameplan we since the second half? Soaking up the pressure because S'land with their whole team, worth as much as Kagawa and DDG, playing us off park at home turf? Or what counterattacking?
 
It's not bad luck that the players are playing shit.

There's no confidence at the club.

The fact Moyes stands there looking like a beaten man all the time doesn't help him.
 
Siorac said:
But it would be unfair to single De Gea out. He's been very good all season and Popper is going on about players who don't care and can't be arsed - De Gea looked like he was going to cry after his mistake. It was a horrible error, no doubt, but a very uncharacteristic one. He also went on to save two penalties.
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Yeah. De Gea has been great when everyone else around him has crumbled. Carrick is my biggest disappointment. He is supposed to be an experienced winner. He should be taking responsibility but instead he is playing well within himself. Fletcher shows balls but I thought at times tonight he looked off the pace which is understandable. Hernandez was awful, just awful. Welbeck, I don't like him dropping deeping, doesn't seem able to turn with the ball.
 
When a couple of players are playing badly, it's normal, it's time to rotate.

When it's 4 or 5 you start to worry about the quality of the team that's been chosen.

When it's 8 or 9 you've got to look at the training, the preparation, the manager. It's too often now to be pure coincidence that we've gone from champions to mediocre.

If the management want to keep Moyes, and we're still being assured they do, then the priority is to get him fixed. I've no idea what it'll take. The hairdrier? A holiday? A rocket? Hypnosis? Let's hope someone's got a cure for it.
 
if moyes does not get us into the top 4 he should be as good as gone you don't go from winning the title to 7th im sorry. there is no reason these teams should be turning us over at OT like this theres no excuse for it.
 
prateik said:
Now that some of the initial anger is gone.. It's just the league cup. Who cares..
Get Mata and press on for the top 4.. All we have left to play for.. that and the CL.. we are still in that somehow.

Seriously though. Get our strikers back fit. Get whoever we need to get in Jan and just work on the league.
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I agree, Rooney and RVP back, but not sure Mata is enough to turn this round. Starting to worry about Moyes, he is actually starting to look ill, that he isn't enjoying what should be the best job in the world.
 
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