Moyes So Far!

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Sunny Jim said:
Garry Neville once wrote that United would rather sack all players than a manger(cant remeberthe exact wording). In my opinion the 6 year contract was signed to show the big egos in the dressig room who the main man is.

Im sure that some/most players werent convinced Moyes was the right man. I think thats part of the reason of underperforming United. Players dont want to die for Moyes....

So the 6 year conctract is a message to players. Accept Moyes or die.

Having said.that...,im sure its.not as easy...there.must be some conditions or gentelmans agreement to terminate it.
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Which again hasn't worked. And I doubt that the club has finances to replace all the players, at best they can do is to buy Everton and then get all their players in loan.

It was simply very bad management from the club. From letting both SAF and Gill to leave the club at the same time, to giving Moyes absolute power. The transition would have been handled much better if Gill was still there for another transfer window, the club would have chosen the assistant of Moyes (similar to have other clubs do), Moyes wouldn't have been let to dismantle the entire coaching staff and finally he would have been given a list of targets to choose from.

SAF did the things himself but he was SAF. Moyes was/is still the guy with zero experience on a top club so I don't know why the club thought that he will simply do a SAF. Letting him a bit constrained (until he proves himself) might have been better IMO.
 
Brophs said:
As devil's advocate, Moyes also inherited a squad, a club, in fact, that was utterly based around Fergie. They had never known anything but stability. And now they're suddenly thrust into a lot of change with a new manager who doesn't know the players or what makes them tick. Trying to establish that knowledge and rapport with the players and staff was always going to take time. Quite honestly for all of Moyes' mistakes I feel he's been massively let down by the players. For all the statement "they're the league champions" is levelled at Moyes it rarely seems to be cast in the players' direction. They're getting a free pass at the moment but some of them look to have allowed their standards to drop, IMO.
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I agree with that. Which reminds me of SAF's final goodbye speech, in which he said something along the lines of 'always remember what shirt you're wearing and never let your standards drop'.

Unfortunately some of our players do seem to have forgotten what club they're playing for, aside from the odd exceptions.
 
Four years would have done the job. If you'd given him that, no-one would have said another word. It wasn't like offering him a one year rolling contract.

It's irrelevant anyway. You're not paying 5 years of wages if you get rid of him.
 
Brophs said:
As devil's advocate, Moyes also inherited a squad, a club, in fact, that was utterly based around Fergie. They had never known anything but stability. And now they're suddenly thrust into a lot of change with a new manager who doesn't know the players or what makes them tick. Trying to establish that knowledge and rapport with the players and staff was always going to take time. Quite honestly for all of Moyes' mistakes I feel he's been massively let down by the players. For all the statement "they're the league champions" is levelled at Moyes it rarely seems to be cast in the players' direction. They're getting a free pass at the moment but some of them look to have allowed their standards to drop, IMO.
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Don't think the players are performing that much worse to be honest. Valencia, Cleverley, Young, De Gea, Rooney, Rafael, Evans, Smalling, Jones have all been at a very similar level or better. Carrick, Evra, Ferdinand and RvP have been worse but both Carrick and RvP have had injuries. We're losing games and dropping points by such slim margins, 2-1, 1-1, 3-2 etc. Apart from the City match I don't think we've lost one match by more than a single goal. Had we invested wisely in the summer I think we'd still be in the title race. The main concern has to be the football we've produced which has been shocking. I'm also not sure whether it's now too late for the current players to believe in Moyes again.
 
alastair said:
Four years would have done the job. If you'd given him that, no-one would have said another word. It wasn't like offering him a one year rolling contract.

It's irrelevant anyway. You're not paying 5 years of wages if you get rid of him.
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We had no choice. He walked into the room and said "If Pardew got 10 years I'm worth at least 6".
 
shaggy said:
Don't think the players are performing that much worse to be honest. Valencia, Cleverley, Young, De Gea, Rooney, Rafael, Evans, Smalling, Jones have all been at a very similar level or better. Carrick, Evra, Ferdinand and RvP have been worse but both Carrick and RvP have had injuries. We're losing games and dropping points by such slim margins, 2-1, 1-1, 3-2 etc. Apart from the City match I don't think we've lost one match by more than a single goal. Had we invested wisely in the summer I think we'd still be in the title race. The main concern has to be the football we've produced which has been shocking. I'm also not sure whether it's now too late for the current players to believe in Moyes again.
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I wouldn't agree with that. For reasons of either injury or form I think that at leastRafa, Evra, Carrick, Cleverly, RvP snd Hernandez have all been markedly worse than last season.
 
Just as a reference point, the year after Everton were nearly relegated, they finished 4th so he has history of being able to turn things around. Whether he can do that here or get the the time is of course the great unknown.
 
datura said:
Just as a reference point, the year after Everton were nearly relegated, they finished 4th so he has history of being able to turn things around. Whether he can do that here or get the the time is of course the great unknown.
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How long was that into his career their, the almost relegation season I mean?
 
Siorac said:
It was 03/04, his second full season. They finished 7th in his first full season.
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We'll go in Champions (if we avoid Villareal) on 2015-2016 then? The first season seems to be a carbon copy of the season he had at Everton.
 
You can point to some poor tactics and decisions from Moyes but I' think that generally it's how good the 11 players on the field are is that dictates how good your results will be. Ferguson last year had Van Persie to thank for so many wins (and he's the greatest manager ever) but look at the teams that Moyes has had to put out -- Cleverley, a 40 year old Giggs, Young, Anderson, Valencia, Fletcher (who hasn't played properly for 2 years) Carrick/Van Persie injuries...basically is it any surprise we're 7th?

I thought it at the time but by not reinforcing the squad properly (not just this summer) , we've given Moyes absolutely no chance to succeed. Not that he's not contributed to the poor results but compared to the other challengers, we've spent fractions when we should have been compensating for the managerial transition with some instant great signings. As for Fellaini, I'm not sold but if he came in at the beginning of June, I think we'd have seen a much better player...had no chance to integrate or build confidence, which was criminal from Woodward/the negotiators of the transfer.
 
friendlytramp said:
Needs to grow some balls. If players aren't performing then get rid and bring someone else in.
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That's the big problem. I'm sure there's quite a few players he'd love to get rid of, but it seems like he can't bring any players in first.

And in terms of the players at the club, he's tried quite a few things and dropped some underperforming players altogether - like Rio and Anderson (though with Anderson it's a bit weird as he played quite a lot in pre-season then when the season started he was benched, then removed from the squad altogether), but there's too many still under-performing and due to injuries there aren't really any alternatives apart from playing Zaha or Fabio but that'll never happen and wouldn't transform us into a good side. The squad needs a bit more of an overhaul and with the squad not being reinforced with signings this past summer (and even before that), there's not a great deal of hope about his chances of succeeding at the moment.
 
Revan said:
We'll go in Champions (if we avoid Villareal) on 2015-2016 then? The first season seems to be a carbon copy of the season he had at Everton.
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I doubt he'll get the Manager of the Year award this time though.
 
Siorac said:
I doubt he'll get the Manager of the Year award this time though.
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It depends if SAF has still influence on other managers. It was funny how he got Manager of The Year in the same season when a guy from Portugal came on England and broke the record of points on English football. I guess nationality doesn't matter on those things.
 
marjen said:
Well, considering we're playing the exact same squad as last season but seven places further down the table, I'd look at the "What's new" column.

Hint: He's a manager.
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that argument says that we did not need any new players....we always strengthened. Rooney was asked to play out of position...something he objected to.

Hint: The new manager did not do what was obvious.
 
McGeady10 said:
Show OUR manager respect!

He's the most important man at the club and there should be no threads discussing the job he's doing.

We should be questioning these players and their performances.
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Grow up. It's his job to get them to perform, whether by motivation, man management or, you know, actual coaching on the training field. The 21st century kind. For me, it's getting more and more obvious that Moyes and the groundbreaking Steve Round have next to no clue in regards to getting a team to play attractive football. It's certainly not winning football.

Question the players? We're disjointed and they're suffering. I'd sooner question our no mark of a manager than proven players that have done nothing but spoil you for the last decade. But yeah, feck them...
 
Red Dreams said:
the one thing I find difficult to forgive is the lack of investments in the summer. It was obvious where we were weak. Sheer negligence.
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Woody is partially at faulty for this, just hope the pair of them get their act together for the summer window, plenty of time to prepare so no excuses.
 
hp88 said:
Woody is partially at faulty for this, just hope the pair of them get their act together for the summer window, plenty of time to prepare so no excuses.
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I think you can throw blame at the Glazers too for appointing two inexperienced personal into the two most important jobs in the club. They're all to blame, that's why I feel a bit of sympathy for Dave.
 
I'm desperately looking for some silver lining here. A while back there was a pros and cons. I'm just sticking to the football side of it for now - his ability to setup, coach and get a team playing how he wants:

Pros:
- Brought in Janujaz. Looks quality.
- Got Rooney firing again. Carrying us.
- Hasn't dropped De Gea for no reason.
- Welbeck looks okay

Cons:
- We apparently have the 2nd highest rate of long balls in the league behind West Ham
- We have attempted the most crosses, but have the lowest conversion rate
- We don't keep clean sheets anymore, and opponents look like scoring off every chance they get
- A centre back makes a mind-numblingly ridiculous mistake every single game
- We have no right back when Rafael is injured
- Our possession stats are down
- Our pass completion stats are down
- Our shots per game stats are down
- Our chances created per game stats are down


So basically as far as the stats and watching matches go, we're worse in pretty much every aspect of playing football since Moyes took over. And we were pretty crap last year too if we're honest.

I was excited by Moyes. I thought his Everton teams played better stuff then they were given credit for, and he was immense at building a team that is hard to break down and concedes very few. But Moyes' Manchester United are defensivel pourous, can't pass the ball, can't score and are literally losing the majority of their home matches. What is going on?
 
Pros:
- Phil Jones looks better in midfield than he ever did under Sir Alex.

Cons:
- Persists playing Smalling at right back
- Has ignored Fabio. See above.
 
Beachryan said:
Cons:
- We apparently have the 2nd highest rate of long balls in the league behind West Ham
- We have attempted the most crosses, but have the lowest conversion rate
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:lol: If you can't laugh then what can you do. The first statistic is utterly horrifying and I'd like to see it get a lot more attention if true.
 
Kid Cunto said:
Much appreciated.
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Just had a quick look on whoscored and I think that stat is bullshit.

Arsenal - 54 LBpG
Aston Villa - 69 LBpG
Cardiff - 67 LBpG
Chelsea - 63 LBpG
Manchester United - 64 LBpG

So just looking at those 5 teams, Villa/Cardiff are ahead and we're only 1 ahead of Chelsea.
 
Kag said:
:lol: If you can't laugh then what can you do. The first statistic is utterly horrifying and I'd like to see it get a lot more attention if true.
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That one's not true - we're 11th (or tied with 9th with Everton and Palace). A telling stat is that we're only 8th in the league for shots attempted per game and shots on target with 13.3 and 4.9, and then 7th with shots conceded per game with 12.
http://www.whoscored.com/Regions/25...amStatistics/England-Premier-League-2013-2014
 
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