no one can argue that this has been an absolutely disasterous start for him. He looks lost, totally out of his depth and I would question giving him money to spend if he rates Fellaini @ £27.5m
Moyes So Far!
- Thread starter RedTillI'mDead
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probably should've stopped SAF spending money too after spending 18m on Young eh?
He signed some good players too.
But yeah, I agree with your point. If the club continues to trust Moyes as our manager then they should back him with transfers. The worse thing it can happen is that if they allow him to continue the job but aren't sure entirely so they don't give him money to sign players. Either sack him and find a suitable replacement or back him with a bunch of money and hope that we'll do better. Without some qualitative midfielders we won't improve anyway.
And hopefully Moyes will do the same if he's given proper backing and time to do so!
let's face it though, our squad are a big bunch of fecking fannies, I hope he overhauls the shit out of it in the summer.
Fergie has bought some utter bilge for United (probably as much shit as good) but he could get the absolute best out of what he had.
Moyes is looking a desperate man
Not sure what yur point is. Surely you arent comparing the greatest manager ever to David Moyes?
No, I'm saying even the greats make mistakes in the transfer market.
it was his first purchase, I'm sure he'll do better in the future, if his next 2-3 turn out to be shit, then I'll worry.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that even if you lose only one more game all season and win all the others, you'll still end up with fewer points than last year.
I wouldn't get sad if all of Rio, Giggs, Buttner, Evra, Ando, Fellaini, Cleverley and Young leave. Some legends, some icons, some academy players and some shit ones, but I don't think that any of them is good enough. Hard to replace all of them in a short time though
No, he isn't. Can we debate without going into extremes?
We shall see. I think everyone could see that Fellaini wasn't United quality (and thus far he seems to struggle being a footballer)
I'm pretty nervous about what he has lined up - I can see Baines coming in for close to £20m in January - and that is close to £50m spent on everton players.
It's glaringly obvious that our midfield needs sorting. I think Moyes can see that. I just hope he knows what type of player we need.
Yes, however if we win all 23 games we finish on 91 points. The dream is not over (YES IT feckING IS)
Fellaini for all intents and purposes was not a shit acquisition, he has proven Premier League experience, was wanted by the big 4 teams, he in an all-rounder with potential to be a great box-to-box player. On paper he had the chance to be what we wanted. The problem is, as with many players over the years he hasn't quite had the chance to settle in and prove himself.
The travesty was the price. No one else offered to buy him when available at £24m, thus his worth is no more than say £20m. We paid well over this due to our other transfer market failings and simply looking desperate. This has not only made the transfer look worse value, but has given Fellaini no pre-season to settle in. Come next season he could become one of our best players. He just needs time. Or at least I hope this is the case!
Agree on those, I'd add Valencia and potentially Nani (if the club aren't willing to trust in him) to the list too, I'd keep Fellaini though, I haven't lost hope on him this early on.
of course he does, he didn't address it properly this summer but he did try to, he'll do better next time, hell, we could even get a good midfield in January (Cabaye?)
I'm not writing Fellaini off yet - but it's hard to argue that he's been dogshit. Looks a right clumsy cnut.
The worrying thing is that he loses most 50-50 balls, ariel challenges etc - I thought we bought him to add a bit of steel to the midfield?
The worrying thing is that he loses most 50-50 balls, ariel challenges etc - I thought we bought him to add a bit of steel to the midfield?
To clarify, I don't think he was a shit purchase, I still think he has a future here.
Doubt it. Chasing Thiago and Fabregas first, then Herrera, Khedira and Fellaini in the end doesn't suggest a red thread.
Fingers crossed eh?
Btw, I dont want Moyes sacked or forced out. It was always going to be difficult for him and I do think Fergie left him a really weak squad with a lot of deadwood. He needs to spend big and I hope he identifies the type of players we need and not panic buy. Will he get the funds though? Hmmmm
Is this true? Definitely no-one bid for him though, and I don't think that we could have beat Chelsea/City if they were interested on him. Don't agree with any of your other points about him, and I don't care about 'Premie League proven'. Give me Mata and Ozil unproven on Premier Leagu eevryday before the Premier League proven players like Young or Fellaini.
This is the strange thing! Somehow he seems to have lost a bit of the coolness in control he had at Everton. He isn't adding that dynamic attack you might expect from him either. Maybe it's just a confidence thing.
Yep, Valencia needs to restart performing, and the club should either sell Nani or give him some games in a row and see how good/bad he does.
Fellaini situation is baffling, he never looked as someone who is good for a top team. He'll play better than he has done for us until now, but still hard to imagine that he'll do good for us. But yeah, there is no chance that we'll sell him for a few years.
Pretty good response -
By media bollocks I mean the stories that did the rounds about us fecking up the deal because we weren't aware of the intricacies of local taxation laws - or whatever it was. And those impostors - or whatever they were. When Woody says plainly enough that he called them up and asked whether we could have the player for less than his release clause if we added on some friendlies and such - I see no reason not to believe him. Maybe it was pointless to ask - but surely there was no harm in it either. Not a monumental feck-up at any rate.
You can question our own valuation of the player - sure. But that's a different question.
Its well known that SAF had been monitoring Thiago for the last two years and was hoping to buy him, and Sneijder could have done the part in CM when we were interested in him.
Right. Not gonna bother anymore with this. Maybe before you speak you should look at our results a few weeks ago when we had a Carrick who was fit, an RVP who was fit, and a Rooney who was fit. All season last year every single one of us said if any of these players, even one let alone two, got injured, we would really really struggle. It's funny now how people seem to think it shouldn't matter. I guess that's because it's Moyes at the helm.
I also love how you give Ferguson the benefit of the doubt but not Moyes. Oh no, with Moyes he is an idiot because he panic bought Fellaini. SAF made bad transfers too don't forget. And no one will mention how it's not like Fellaini was is main target, but clearly a last resort. He thought Fellaini would improve us, but instead of being negative, how do you know Fellaini won't improve with time? I bet you forget how long it took certain players to understand and play well on a United shirt.
No one said Moyes has been great. Again underestimating the impact of change. Really you think Moyes would be good at United just cos he was good at Everton? Such naively.
When we signed Pallister it took him about 6 months before he looked anywhere near up to playing for United. Fellaini isnt the first player to struggle badly initially. Thats my hope anyway....
Meh, I've just noticed our goal difference as well. Depressing.
There were stories about us being interested in Thiago, sure. Never seen anything substantial, though.
It's a bit pointless to bring it up, though. Surely nobody is seriously disputing that Fergie neglected strengthening our CM options? He clearly didn't prioritize it. His main targets during the last seasons were offensive players, wingers and attacking midfielders - and strikers, for that matter.
Injuries are part of the game. We had Rooney injured last season too. Whats the point?
I have criticized SAF more than most for not signing a midfielder all these years. And for signing Young since day 1.
I said that while the summer was awful, we don't know if Moyes/Woody can do good in transfers yet, didn't I?
My opinion on Fellaini has nothing to do with his performances for us so far. I said that I think he'll play better than he has done so far for us. However I don't think that he'll ever be a good player for us. This is based on having seen him play for the last 5 years, not on 5 matches for us. We'll see I guess, but he'll be another Young signing IMO.
Of course, it makes sense. One is a multiple league winners, the other doesn't.
Yes, im very sure. We had plenty to spend. Woodward wad obsessed with a marquee player and would pay silly money to get them. The low bid for Fabregas was his naivety but he bid big on Bale.
Woodwards stance is we will spend big on the right player.
SAF obviously loves his wingers but Veron Djemba Djemba Kleberson Hargreaves Miller and Anderson were his attempts for midfield along with Carrick obviously.
Aye - but that's going back a decade with some of those names. Hargreaves was a potentially astute signing at the time. The others he tried in recent years were punts, kids and players he attempted to transform into CMs rather than being natural CMs to begin with.
It's obvious that he didn't regard it as imperative to field absolute top class players in the middle - and for his purposes he was largely right too. Except for when we met truly exceptional opposition, he managed to outweigh the CM deficiency by being better/sufficiently good in other areas. It was, however, a strategy that wouldn't have suited any other manager on the top level.
My feeling was that his main goal towards the end was to somehow replace Ronaldo - unearth a similar type of player, a true ace in the offensive deck. That was clearly more important to him than signing what most of us would call a top class CM.
I think you can write this off as Ferguson's illconceived attempt at emulating Wenger in the transfer market. Once he decided to just pay up for the likes of Carrick, Hargreaves, et al, you were much better off.
Quite a self-defeating statement isn't it. Then what's the point of appointing Moyes then, if we think he wouldn't be good at United.
No point at all. But then the question must rather be whether he can become good at United or not. The board obviously think he can. They probably didn't give the job to him because they expected him to hit the ground running.
why would a club that relies so much on revenue from europe and staying in competitions take such a huge gamble? part of getting somebody that has managed long in the premiership was to hit to the ground running.
Interesting observation in today's DT by Mark Ogden.
"When asked, after United's fifth league defeat of the season, whether the team's failings were a result of too many changes since taking the job, Moyes bristled and insisted that he had changed nothing with the exception of promoting teenaged winger Januzaj and signing midfielder Fellaini. Moments earlier however, Moyes spoke of United being in transition and that the turbulence he and the team have endured was only to be expected. "
"So which is it to be? How can United be a team in transition if the manager has made no changes and if transition is a negative reality, how are Everton managing the process under Martinez?"
I have noticed before how Moyes sometimes contradicts himself and how he can unintentionally put his foot in it ( eg. saying Rooney would be needed if RVP ever got injured in the close season and adding more fuel to that particular fire.)
My sad conclusion is that a man who cannot think quickly on his feet, shows little imagination and is over cautious and naive in such things as transfer dealings just does not have what it takes to tackle such a massive job as Manchester United's Manager. A proper recruitment exercise would have demonstrated that of course and proves the folly of a plc allowing one man to choose his own successor. The Board has a lot to answer for and will go the way of all dynasties if it does not change its ways. I feel sorry for Moyes tbh, he should have realised his limitations and stayed where he was.
"When asked, after United's fifth league defeat of the season, whether the team's failings were a result of too many changes since taking the job, Moyes bristled and insisted that he had changed nothing with the exception of promoting teenaged winger Januzaj and signing midfielder Fellaini. Moments earlier however, Moyes spoke of United being in transition and that the turbulence he and the team have endured was only to be expected. "
"So which is it to be? How can United be a team in transition if the manager has made no changes and if transition is a negative reality, how are Everton managing the process under Martinez?"
I have noticed before how Moyes sometimes contradicts himself and how he can unintentionally put his foot in it ( eg. saying Rooney would be needed if RVP ever got injured in the close season and adding more fuel to that particular fire.)
My sad conclusion is that a man who cannot think quickly on his feet, shows little imagination and is over cautious and naive in such things as transfer dealings just does not have what it takes to tackle such a massive job as Manchester United's Manager. A proper recruitment exercise would have demonstrated that of course and proves the folly of a plc allowing one man to choose his own successor. The Board has a lot to answer for and will go the way of all dynasties if it does not change its ways. I feel sorry for Moyes tbh, he should have realised his limitations and stayed where he was.
Why gamble on anything? Because you expect it to pay off eventually? When they - Gill, Fergie, Charlton - went on about "long-term" thinking, I presume they meant that Moyes was the right man in...the long term. Not an instant fix but a permanent (in so far as anything is in football, of course) solution.
He's definitely overwhelmed and probably quite taken aback at the criticism he's seeing in the press.
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