Moyes So Far!

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Castia said:
He could show a little passion for a start. Im not expecting him to publicly slate the players but he just 'laughs' it off, 'we move on to the next game and try to get a win' type of replies just reek of a man who has no winning mentality in his blood what so ever.
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Every little thing he has said has been overanalysed and used against him in press conferences so at the moment he's barely giving anything away, you have no idea what he says behind closed doors, which is what really matters.
 
moses said:
Rafael has been injured, as was Welbeck, and Kagawa has not progressed in all his time here. 2 of them arguably are not even in our best XI. The transfers are not 100% under his control. He hasn't been great, but there was always going to be a fallout post Fergie.
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But then he needs to grow a set and take control of the transfers - his comments post-transfer window suggested that it had been conducted in the manner that he wanted (ex. that ridiculous joint bid for Fellaini and Baines; his implying that United were never interested in Thiago.) As for Rafael and Welbeck, yes they've been injured, but when healthy there have still been some puzzling decisions (ex. taking Rafael off against Everton to move the under performing Valencia to right back.) And Welbeck simply hasn't been good enough when he has played (barring the first game.)

Fallout post-Fergie should be in the form of a couple close losses, perhaps 3rd or 4th by December. To be mid-table with the team we have is truly stunning.
 
datura said:
Seen this or similar lots of times and I just don't see how you can come to that conclusion? There seems to be no lack of effort, or application.
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You honestly think there is effort??? There was absolutely no reaction today after Wednesday. We had 30 mins after Newcastle scored and Krul had nothing to do. The senior players weren't rallying the troops - no one stood up. If you think this is effort then with all due respect mate, you see football totally different to me.

The players do not trust him. All it takes is for one senior player to doubt the manager and the rest quickly fall into line. You may not like it but its true. Alpha male mentality from players these days....and they will prevail if they want too.
 
Red Shorts said:
Thanks for putting this up.

He just seems so accepting of the result; no anger, little disappointment, it's almost like he's expecting these sort of results. Grow a fecking pair and show anger at your players, it's unbelievable. We need a leader, not a spineless character.
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My thoughts too, but it might not be the best course of action in actuality.
 
Red Shorts said:
Thanks for putting this up.

He just seems so accepting of the result; no anger, little disappointment, it's almost like he's expecting these sort of results. Grow a fecking pair and show anger at your players, it's unbelievable. We need a leader, not a spineless character.
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Spot on. Cringeworthy stuff.
 
Chelsea are currently losing and City are drawing. Damn it.

Edit - Chelsea lost and City drew. Damn it.
 
Red Shorts said:
Thanks for putting this up.

He just seems so accepting of the result; no anger, little disappointment, it's almost like he's expecting these sort of results. Grow a fecking pair and show anger at your players, it's unbelievable. We need a leader, not a spineless character.
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Unfortunately it's not what he's about. He has always been a popular character that had decent players play for him. Now he can't get the best out of internationals and world class players...He looks scared like a teacher who's afraid to be hard on the kids, wanting to be liked rather than respected

He doesn't appear to have the tactical nous either that can get away with being nice but has a an exciting game plan.
 
jem said:
Fallout post-Fergie should be in the form of a couple close losses, perhaps 3rd or 4th by December. To be mid-table with the team we have is truly stunning.
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Spot on. I doubt we'll be mid-table by the end of the season though. I still expect at the very least a top 6 finish, which would still be disgraceful with the players we have.
 
FlawlessThaw said:
Moyes hasn't got the best out of any of our players except for probably Rooney and he's the type of player who can take a game by the scruff of it's neck and is least in need of a manager to stand out.
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And the truth is, for all the hype about Rooney, the only thing that looks better about him is his fitness.

Can anyone genuinely say the Rooney of today is playing better than the Rooney who scored a hat-trick at the San Siro or who popped up with the header that knocked City out of the League Cup at the death in 2009/10? Can anyone genuinely say the Rooney of today is playing better than the Rooney who dug us out of the mire at West Ham or led us through the Champions League quarter final tie at Stamford Bridge in 2010/11? Can anyone genuinely say the Rooney of today is playing better than the Rooney who was peerless against Arsenal in the 8-2 win in 2011/12 and gave us the impetus to knock City out of the F.A. cup the same year?
 
OneUnited24 said:
True but it almost seemed like other manager try and absorb all the blame and protect their players this made me think he feels he will do his best and hopefully the players wont let him down. Again that's just me
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Understandable. It's a tricky balance. You don't want to look like you're saying "Well, I'm getting it right but they're getting it wrong" but then he's not in a very strong position, given the media scrutiny at the moment, so I'm not sure it's a great time to be saying "I got it wrong, I'll get it right next week" either.
 
datura said:
You were saying that he brainwashed the board!!! Charlton had a big say as well I'm sure.
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Convinced, persuaded, however you want to word it. The board would never have considered Moyes if not for Fergie's influence, and I'm pretty sure Charlton's recommendation was entirely off his own back, either.
 
Raoul said:
Spot on. Cringeworthy stuff.
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I suppose it's important to him to seem like he can keep his emotions in check, at least publically. A Moyes meltdown in a post match interview would probably put more pressure on him. This guy is in it for the long haul.

His defeatist attitude bothers me though. The fact that he almost accepts all these defeats as part of the parcel when a top team gets a new manager is what annoys me the most.
 
datura said:
Seen this or similar lots of times and I just don't see how you can come to that conclusion? There seems to be no lack of effort, or application.
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I think the signs are there in almost every game. Lack of effort, lack of desire to win, lack of interest is obvious to me and a lot of other fans. I think that is the most worrying about the way we are playing these days.
 
thegregster said:
Moyes in the games against teams who will likely finish in the top half. ​
​
Chelsea 0-0​
Liverpool lost 1-0​
City lost 4-1​
Arsenal 1-0​
Everton lost 1-0​
Southampton drew 1-1​
Spurs 2-2​
Newcastle Lost 1-0​
​
6 points out of 24.​
​
How many of these games did we play well in? ​
​
A very damming stat.​
​
​
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Only 4 goals for. Only 2 goals in 4 games at home against these teams.
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Deary me.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
I am not being hysterical. Just saying the team we have should be playing better. They have forgotten how to be ruthless in the PL. The CL result should have spurred them on and it hasn't.
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I guess Moyes tactics have something to do with they being a bit clueless on the pitch.

Also the situation of sacking Moyes isn't comparable with Chelsea/Madrid sackings. Chelsea sacked the manager for finishing in the second place. Mourinho come and won them two titles after half a century and then was sacked after a season without a trophy. Ancelotti came and won them the title (and the cup) after we completely dominated on three years and then he was sacked on the following season for finishing second. Madrid sacked Del Bosque on 2003 and Capello on 2007 for not being able to win UCL despite they won the title (Capello after 4 years, since the title of Del Bosque). That was absurd and lunacity.

Here, pretty much every United supporter was ok with us not winning the title for three years as long as we were competitive and we qualify for Champions. But being on the midtable team, nearer the relegation zone than the leader isn't great, isn't even good, isn't even mediocre. It's absurd and horrible. There must come a time when we realize what retarded decision we have made. From now on, it is all about damage limitation. Sacking Moyes IMO is the most logical decision to make and wanting to prove that we're better than others by sticking with him, will just make us look arrogant and it will be more difficult for his successor to recuperate. In the end of the day, the trophies are all that is counted, not how years we sticked with a manager.

In the last 10 years:

Barcelona has had 5 managers. During that time they have won 6 La Liga, 3 UCL and a shitload of other trophies. They will likely win the 7th La Liga in those years this year.

Bayern Munich has had 9 managers. During that time they have won 5 Bundesliga, 1 UCL and a shitload of other trophies. They will likely win another Bundesliga this year.

Point is, changing the manager isn't the worst thing you can make. Teams remain pretty succecful by doing it all the time. It is obviously great having the same manager for a lot of years but having that priority is absurd. Better is to choose a great manager. There aren't many of them who would left us just for the sake of it. I think it's more ilogical staying with the same manager for a long time, with medicore results just for the sake of it.

Would people here prefer that in the last 10 years to change 5 manages but to win let's say three Premier League titles and a UCL, or they would prefer to stay with the same manager for the next 10 years but our only trophy to be the fourth place trophy? I for myself would choose the first option every time. Even if that would make us look normal and won't make us feel better than the others who sack their managers all the time.
 
LonelyFire said:
You honestly think there is effort??? There was absolutely no reaction today after Wednesday. We had 30 mins after Newcastle scored and Krul had nothing to do. The senior players weren't rallying the troops - no one stood up. If you think this is effort then with all due respect mate, you see football totally different to me.

The players do not trust him. All it takes is for one senior player to doubt the manager and the rest quickly fall into line. You may not like it but its true. Alpha male mentality from players these days....and they will prevail if they want too.
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The effort was there, the confidence isn't and that only comes from results.

You are just making up that the players don't trust him, you haven't got a clue. It's a fiction.
 
Inigo Montoya said:
Well, the board have got to take a huge amount of responsibility too. They appointed him on the recommendation of Fergie who shouldn't have been allowed so much influence. The game has moved on, Everton made a bold appointment in a manager who has an attacking philosophy. Our board are clueless.They haven't done their homework either in researching a proper manager for Utd who would have continued the Utd ethos and also in Woodward;someone who was equally clueless in trying to do too little too late. I'm not sure not giving him funds is the answer.

I'm actually feeling sorry for Moyes right now as it seems whomever he picks they do not respond.He needs to get nasty and ship players out or it won't be long before he's out.
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Problem for Moyes he has the rest of December to deal with them. If December is an absolute disaster he might not get chance to ship any of them out. Maybe some of them need to know they are under threat. You would hope they would be then playing for their places.
 
datura said:
Haha you are an utter embarrassment to this forum.
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One of the most logical posters in this forum is an embarrassment? I am sure he got his adminship by being an embarrasment to this forum. Thanks Lord we have great posters like you, cause the life here would have been impossible from the embarrassment of posters like Raoul.

Haha
 
Revan said:
I guess Moyes tactics have something to do with they being a bit clueless on the pitch.

Also the situation of sacking Moyes isn't comparable with Chelsea/Madrid sackings. Chelsea sacked the manager for finishing in the second place. Mourinho come and won them two titles after half a century and then was sacked after a season without a trophy. Ancelotti came and won them the title (and the cup) after we completely dominated on three years and then he was sacked on the following season for finishing second. Madrid sacked Del Bosque on 2003 and Capello on 2007 for not being able to win UCL despite they won the title (Capello after 4 years, since the title of Del Bosque). That was absurd and lunacity.

Here, pretty much every United supporter was ok with us not winning the title for three years as long as we were competitive and we qualify for Champions. But being on the midtable team, nearer the relegation zone than the leader isn't great, isn't even good, isn't even mediocre. It's absurd and horrible. There must come a time when we realize what retarded decision we have made. From now on, it is all about damage limitation. Sacking Moyes IMO is the most logical decision to make and wanting to prove that we're better than others by sticking with him, will just make us look arrogant and it will be more difficult for his successor to recuperate. In the end of the day, the trophies are all that is counted, not how years we sticked with a manager.

In the last 10 years:

Barcelona has had 5 managers. During that time they have won 6 La Liga, 3 UCL and a shitload of other trophies. They will likely win the 7th La Liga in those years this year.

Bayern Munich has had 9 managers. During that time they have won 5 Bundesliga, 1 UCL and a shitload of other trophies. They will likely win another Bundesliga this year.

Point is, changing the manager isn't the worst thing you can make. Teams remain pretty succecful by doing it all the time. It is obviously great having the same manager for a lot of years but having that priority is absurd. Better is to choose a great manager. There aren't many of them who would left us just for the sake of it. I think it's more logical staying with the same manager for a long time, with medicore results just for the sake of it.

Would people here prefer that in the last 10 years to change 5 manages but to win let's say three Premier League titles and a UCL, or they would prefer to stay with the same manager for the next 10 years but our only trophy to be the fourth place trophy? I for myself would choose the first option every time. Even if that would make us look normal and won't make us feel better than the others who sack their managers all the time.
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Very good post.
 
Revan said:
I guess Moyes tactics have something to do with they being a bit clueless on the pitch.

Also the situation of sacking Moyes isn't comparable with Chelsea/Madrid sackings. Chelsea sacked the manager for finishing in the second place. Mourinho come and won them two titles after half a century and then was sacked after a season without a trophy.
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Didn't Mourinho resign?
 
Not scoring in two consecutive home games is also rather worrying.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Problem for Moyes he has the rest of December to deal with them. If December is an absolute disaster he might not get chance to ship any of them out. Maybe some of them need to know they are under threat. You would hope they would be then playing for their places.
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Seeing Fellaini sat on his mobile texting spoke volumes for me. Looked like he couldn't give a feck. I may be wrong but his attitude is 'I've got my dream move, I've got nothing to prove'.
 
Ixion said:
Wouldn't be our manager if he wasn't Scottish.
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Overly simplistic (intentional so I'm sure) but yeah, I'd say a massive reason why he was employed is because he's British. To be honest, to me it seems like the two main reasons he was hired are because a) he's British, and b) He kept one job for a long time... neither of which really should have been high priorities when trying to find a new manager, but that's the way it went.

I'm probably just spouting bollocks, but I'm annoyed.
 
That interview is annoying to watch. Little giggle at the transition bit and constantly saying transition. Stand up and be pissed off like the rest you ginger cnut.
 
We all expected transition. We all expected a difficult period. But how bad does it have to be before people say enough is enough though?

I didn't have unrealistic expectations going into the season. My hope was for the top 3 but never really challenging for the title. Minimum is top 4. We're currently 9th and could even be 10th tomorrow. We're no longer a few games into the season. It's December now and it isn't good enough.

This squad has many issues. We all know that. However, it doesn't change the fact he inherited a team that won the league and reached the last 8 of the Champions League. This team is miles better than it's showing and the buck stops with the manager.

I'm not saying Moyes Out yet, but if this goes on much longer I will be.
 
Inigo Montoya said:
Seeing Fellaini sat on his mobile texting spoke volumes for me. Looked like he couldn't give a feck. I may be wrong but his attitude is 'I've got my dream move, I've got nothing to prove'.
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What? In the one instance where the camera panned to him, he happened to be on his phone, and from this you've managed to conclude that he doesn't give a feck?
 
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