Moyes So Far!

[amolbhatia50k]

All said and done, the team was hit by injuries right now. RvP, Carrick, Vidic, Rafael, Jones. That's like 5 first teamers out at the same time!

And then the epic levels that Valencia and Rio have fallen to. Yes, Moyes should have done better in the transfer window, but you need to have some perspective as well regarding todays match. He had to desperately rotate keeping the midweek match in mind, as that is more important to win. I agree the 2nd half was very lax, and the players should have put in more effort, but to blame it on the manager. Naah!

The buck stops with the manager. This eagerness to always blame context, fergie, players and never Moyes for anything is wrong IMO. I don't even like the word blame. I just think we would see some sort of imprint of football by now. We just keep going out there and look void of any planning.

 

[Ronaldo's Mum Eh?]

Yeah, 1-0 wins are a fecking disgrace. Under Fergie we won every game 5-0. Moyes Out!

We were much more composed under Sir Alex and actually had a better game plan. Moyes doesn't really have a game plan besides scoring one and hoping for time to run out.

I think he needs time but he needs to work harder.

 

[bosnian_red]

I'm not really that worried yet, I'm always pretty optimistic about things. As long as we buy somebody to start in midfield, we'll make the top 4 no problems. Then next summer we buy 2 more midfielders (schneiderlein, pjanic for example) and sell Anderson and we'll be sorted for a good title run and European run maybe.

If we don't buy anybody in January though, there's no chance we're making top 4. We'll be close but not good enough. Midfield is what gives you consistency and let's you dominate teams. We haven't dominated teams in years and we've only been so good because we are so clinical and had a great defence before.

 

[Barney]

Let's be honest, he's inherited a pretty misbalanced squad.

You have a goalkeeper that is one of the top 3 in the league.
You have a defence that isn't the best in the league and is certainly the deepest along with ours.
You have wingers that are solid, but unspectacular. Not all of them are being given a chance though.
You have three of the top five strikers in the league, IMO.

The only place you lacked was CM and Moyes bringing in his pal for £30m should've rectified that a fair bit. Your squad is ridiculously well balanced, after City it's the most balanced in the league. The trouble is you have several players underperforming.

 

[bosnian_red]

You have a goalkeeper that is one of the top 3 in the league.
You have a defence that isn't the best in the league and is certainly the deepest along with ours.
You have wingers that are solid, but unspectacular. Not all of them are being given a chance though.
You have three of the top five strikers in the league, IMO.

The only place you lacked was CM and Moyes bringing in his pal for £30m should've rectified that a fair bit. Your squad is ridiculously well balanced, after City it's the most balanced in the league. The trouble is you have several players underperforming.

Yeah, our problem is the players under performing, and Rafael being injured. He is among the top 5 right backs in world football in my opinion and we look so shaky defensively and awful going forward without him.
Our midfield then of course is useless. We should be doing a lot better then what we are though.

 

[coolredwine]

The buck stops with the manager. This eagerness to always blame context, fergie, players and never Moyes for anything is wrong IMO. I don't even like the word blame. I just think we would see some sort of imprint of football by now. We just keep going out there and look void of any planning.

It will take time. Until unless we have World Class players in every position ala Bayern/Barcelona.

He was rightly criticised for the subs, he has improved in that respect. With our only midfielder out due to injury, who else do you think would have played in the midfield? And with the Leverkusen game looming, we couldn't have expected Kagawa/Nani to play today and then come out blazing 3 days later as well (not to forget, I am reading that Kagawa is injured. Probably Twatter bollocks). So we are left with Januzaj, Valencia, Young. Hernandez had absolutely no service today.

his job is to set up teams with a plan in mind. He did that. If the players aren't implementing that, I am not going to put that on the manager.

 

[Barney]

Yeah, our problem is the players under performing, and Rafael being injured. He is among the top 5 right backs in world football in my opinion and we look so shaky defensively and awful going forward without him.
Our midfield then of course is useless. We should be doing a lot better then what we are though.

I'd also say it's putting unrealistic expectations on players that can't live up to them.

 

[Rowem]

You have a goalkeeper that is one of the top 3 in the league.
You have a defence that isn't the best in the league and is certainly the deepest along with ours.
You have wingers that are solid, but unspectacular. Not all of them are being given a chance though.
You have three of the top five strikers in the league, IMO.

The only place you lacked was CM and Moyes bringing in his pal for £30m should've rectified that a fair bit. Your squad is ridiculously well balanced, after City it's the most balanced in the league. The trouble is you have several players underperforming.

Having depth does not making it well balanced.


- We have an over stocked defence, with only one natural right back in contention for a squad place. 5 CBs fighting for 2 positions.
- We have a pretty dreadful CM (the biggest deficiency by far)
- Our best midfielder is quite immobile, and we brought in another immobile CM
- We are over-stocked in the wide positions, meaning most of them are lacking game time and consistency. We have no stand out performers here. I'll grant that they are quite balanced as a group with differing abilities, but they are all individually average to poor, so it's a pretty shit balance.
- We have 5 quality attacking players who are better than any of our wingers but all prefer to play in the front 2 positions. Two of these players have to make do with game time on the wing, where we are already overstocked.
- Our two best attacking players (and 3 of the best 5) both prefer to play as the lead the line striker, and don't complement each other well when they play.

It's a misbalanced squad. There's no two ways about it. Thanks for your attempt at neutral observation, but I think you're way off here.

Moyes didn't help the situation by bringing in Fellaini, who's immobility is highlighted next to Carrick, but I think SAF could have left the squad in better shape. That said, the squad has some fantastic young players and some top experienced players, so there's hope that Moyes will turn it around with a couple of quality additions and getting rid of some of the deadwood.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

It will take time. Until unless we have World Class players in every position ala Bayern/Barcelona.

He was rightly criticised for the subs, he has improved in that respect. With our only midfielder out due to injury, who else do you think would have played in the midfield? And with the Leverkusen game looming, we couldn't have expected Kagawa/Nani to play today and then come out blazing 3 days later as well (not to forget, I am reading that Kagawa is injured. Probably Twatter bollocks). So we are left with Januzaj, Valencia, Young. Hernandez had absolutely no service today.

his job is to set up teams with a plan in mind. He did that. If the players aren't implementing that, I am not going to put that on the manager.

Personally I think the manager has work on how a team plays as much as who plays. Brendon Rodgers has worked and altered Liverpools style of play. Whether Everton are better or worse off today, Martinez has stamped his authority on that team. I want to see Moyes do something similar. I want to see him get us to play "some" particular way. And of course we should all give him time. But at the same time, it's okay to say that it's been disappointing to see little progress in terms of that so far.

 

[coolredwine]

Personally I think the manager has work on how a team plays as much as who plays. Brendon Rodgers has worked and altered Liverpools style of play. Whether Everton are better or worse off today, Martinez has stamped his authority on that team. I want to see Moyes do something similar. I want to see him get us to play "some" particular way. And of course we should all give him time. But at the same time, it's okay to say that it's been disappointing to see little progress in terms of that so far.

Rodgers took 1 year. Martinez, yes, I agree. But he got the chance to bring in 3-4 players that he wanted. And most of the Everton team was already settled apart from a couple of changes.

Moyes started off okay-ish-ly. We could see the pressing and stuff, but couldn't keep up (mainly due to our lack of those players). And then, our team - with 4 wingers and 2 Top strikers - can only play in one formation with that set. And there's nothing he could have done about that. So he is just going in that "Auto-Fergie" mode, with some minor tweaks until he gets to ship out deadwood and get some players which can suit him.

 

[darko]

The truest words he has spoken since he came here was about our lack of World Class talent, and that we need a few to go straight into the first-team.

They we playing Cardiff City, not Barcelona. No one on Cardiff City would walk into United's starting XI or perhaps even be on their bench. What does he think of the quality of Southampton's squad? It's a poor excuse for some poor results in the EPL. He needs to stop making excuses for these results. That doesn't mean he should want better players. Anything less than a top three finish is a big failure on his part.

 

[Barney]

They we playing Cardiff City, not Barcelona. No one on Cardiff City would walk into United's starting XI or perhaps even be on their bench. What does he think of the quality of Southampton's squad? It's a poor excuse for some poor results in the EPL. He needs to stop making excuses for these results. That doesn't mean he should want better players. Anything less than a top three finish is a big failure on his part.

Medel would definitely start for youse. He's quality.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Rodgers took 1 year. Martinez, yes, I agree. But he got the chance to bring in 3-4 players that he wanted. And most of the Everton team was already settled apart from a couple of changes.

Moyes started off okay-ish-ly. We could see the pressing and stuff, but couldn't keep up (mainly due to our lack of those players). And then, our team - with 4 wingers and 2 Top strikers - can only play in one formation with that set. And there's nothing he could have done about that. So he is just going in that "Auto-Fergie" mode, with some minor tweaks until he gets to ship out deadwood and get some players which can suit him.

Rodgers took a year to refine his teams style but the foundations were laid last season. I'm not saying that he's a barometer but if managers want to change teams it is possible and if not the final product, at least the signs should be visible fairly early on.

What I've least like about Moyes time so far is not his results. It's that I'm not seeing any particular style of gameplan. And I hope it starts emerging soon and we some exciting football.

 

[Mad Winger]

I'll just repost what I wrote in that other thread, because I feel that Moyes is at least partly responsible:


Because I grew up not having a sports channel that showed Premier League, I didn't start watching United consistently(i.e. every week) before 2008. That was when I discovered the wonderful world of streaming.

In these 5 and a half years, I really can't remember us being even nearly as bad as we are now. And we're not just talking about a bad period here either. We're almost finished with 1/3 of the season! We're 7 points behind the leader, and only 1 point seperates us from 9th place. This could have been acceptable had we at least played entertaining football that seemed promising for the future. But we're not. In fact, we look incredibly shit. I cannot count how many times this season I've nearly fallen asleep while we're playing.

Say what you want about our team(though I'll admit that our midfield is shit); this is pretty much the same team that walked the league last season, while also doing well in the CL. It's the same team, with the addition of Januzaj, Zaha and Fellaini. No player of major importance has left, except for Scholes(who barely played in the first place).

The season is still fairly young, but at the moment I see no promising signs whatsoever. This could quite possibly go down as the worst United season in 20 years or something. That's not acceptable with the squad we have. We're not that bad.

 

[charleysurf]

I'll just repost what I wrote in that other thread, because I feel that Moyes is at least partly responsible:


Because I grew up not having a sports channel that showed Premier League, I didn't start watching United consistently(i.e. every week) before 2008. That was when I discovered the wonderful world of streaming.

In these 5 and a half years, I really can't remember us being even nearly as bad as we are now. And we're not just talking about a bad period here either. We're almost finished with 1/3 of the season! We're 7 points behind the leader, and only 1 point seperates us from 9th place. This could have been acceptable had we at least played entertaining football that seemed promising for the future. But we're not. In fact, we look incredibly shit. I cannot count how many times this season I've nearly fallen asleep while we're playing.

Say what you want about our team(though I'll admit that our midfield is shit); this is pretty much the same team that walked the league last season, while also doing well in the CL. It's the same team, with the addition of Januzaj, Zaha and Fellaini. No player of major importance has left, except for Scholes(who barely played in the first place).

The season is still fairly young, but at the moment I see no promising signs whatsoever. This could quite possibly go down as the worst United season in 20 years or something. That's not acceptable with the squad we have. We're not that bad.

* post Attention Whore gif here *

If RVP is not playing (and certainly not playing in the amazing arse-saving form of last season) and Carrick is not playing, and Rio is basically retired, then it's not the same team.

 

[coolredwine]

Rodgers took a year to refine his teams style but the foundations were laid last season. I'm not saying that he's a barometer but if managers want to change teams it is possible and if not the final product, at least the signs should be visible fairly early on.

What I've least like about Moyes time so far is not his results. It's that I'm not seeing any particular style of gameplan. And I hope it starts emerging soon and we some exciting football.

He had to ship off Carroll and Downing. Not to forget, his defense is still not settled. He keeps on shifting between a 3-man and 4-man midfield.

Anyway, as I said, there were instances, but everything went bust with that City game. He has been trying a lot of things though, with no real concrete results. First getting the wingers to play as inside forwards. Then starting Kagawa on the left side and allowing him to drift inside. But then, the players have been in and out which haven't helped the case either. The Back 4 keeps on changing every other game. Players keep on having brainfarts which dampen the performance.

 

[alastair]

Might get a bit of stick for this post, but I'll go for it anyway.

From my experience of watching United, it has now for a while been a team based around the quality of individuals or partnerships. Ferguson always liked to have at least one superstar in the squad, because he was aware more than anyone that the high end games are won by moments of superb individual quality.

It was for this reason that Van Persie was signed even though you didn't 'need him' as so many on here said at the time. You very much did need him. To an extent, you still do.

In recent years, it strikes me that you've moved away from a particular brand of football which I always saw as 'counter-attacking containment.' You let teams get to a certain point of the pitch, then pressed, won it back and scored.

This game-plan relied on top quality forward players, but it also gave you an identity and, in my view, was what created the fear factor.

What has been deteriorating, and seems to be something Moyes is trying to correct, is the pressing game. It's all a little bit lethargic in that area between half way and your penalty box. You're letting teams get a little closer to you, and you're giving yourselves further to go with it once you get the ball.

Where Moyes went wrong is that he thought Fellaini could be the destroyer to win the ball back. He's shown that he can't really do that well. Moyes thought he'd bought one half of the solution. The other half is a central creator; someone who is able to explosively start attacks from the half way line or deeper. Someone with the ability to spread the play or thread little through balls between a defence. That should be Kagawa but it really isn't.

So thus the issue with the football you're playing. Fellaini isn't playing the role for which he was bought, and you still haven't got the connector between the midfield and the striking quality. This means that the strikers are still scoring a lot of good goals, but there's a reliance on them pulling a rabbit out of the hat, as opposed to having a consistent threat throughout the team.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He had to ship off Carroll and Downing. Not to forget, his defense is still not settled. He keeps on shifting between a 3-man and 4-man midfield.

Anyway, as I said, there were instances, but everything went bust with that City game. He has been trying a lot of things though, with no real concrete results. First getting the wingers to play as inside forwards. Then starting Kagawa on the left side and allowing him to drift inside. But then, the players have been in and out which haven't helped the case either. The Back 4 keeps on changing every other game. Players keep on having brainfarts which dampen the performance.

Exactly, but he's trying things. You could see him trying to change them last season too.

I think a lot of the second paragraph sound likes excuses. Players having brainfarts and injuries are part of the game.

 

[Mad Winger]

If RVP is not playing (and certainly not playing in the amazing arse-saving form of last season) and Carrick is not playing, and Rio is basically retired, then it's not the same team.

- RVP has featured in 10 our of 12 PL games this season, and started 9 of them. He's also our topscorer.
- Carrick has started 10 out of 12 games, and finished them all.
- Rio is not better than Evans or Vidic, so it's weird to lean in him. Last season we didn't have Vidic for half the games(or more?). I'd argue that's much worse.

 

[coolredwine]

Exactly, but he's trying things. You could see him trying to change them last season too.

I think a lot of the second paragraph sound likes excuses. Players having brainfarts and injuries are part of the game.

Probably yes, but then, it would be unfair to put everything on Moyes, no?

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Might get a bit of stick for this post, but I'll go for it anyway.

From my experience of watching United, it has now for a while been a team based around the quality of individuals or partnerships. Ferguson always liked to have at least one superstar in the squad, because he was aware more than anyone that the high end games are won by moments of superb individual quality.

It was for this reason that Van Persie was signed even though you didn't 'need him' as so many on here said at the time. You very much did need him. To an extent, you still do.

In recent years, it strikes me that you've moved away from a particular brand of football which I always saw as 'counter-attacking containment.' You let teams get to a certain point of the pitch, then pressed, won it back and scored.

This game-plan relied on top quality forward players, but it also gave you an identity and, in my view, was what created the fear factor.

What has been deteriorating, and seems to be something Moyes is trying to correct, is the pressing game. It's all a little bit lethargic in that area between half way and your penalty box. You're letting teams get a little closer to you, and you're giving yourselves further to go with it once you get the ball.

Where Moyes went wrong is that he thought Fellaini could be the destroyer to win the ball back. He's shown that he can't really do that well. Moyes thought he'd bought one half of the solution. The other half is a central creator; someone who is able to explosively start attacks from the half way line or deeper. Someone with the ability to spread the play or thread little through balls between a defence. That should be Kagawa but it really isn't.

So thus the issue with the football you're playing. Fellaini isn't playing the role for which he was bought, and you still haven't got the connector between the midfield and the striking quality. This means that the strikers are still scoring a lot of good goals, but there's a reliance on them pulling a rabbit out of the hat, as opposed to having a consistent threat throughout the team.

Don't think you should get stick for that. Lots of that is definitely true. We tend to rely on our attackers doing "something" these days rather than play cohesive football.

 

[coolredwine]

Where Moyes went wrong is that he thought Fellaini could be the destroyer to win the ball back. He's shown that he can't really do that well. Moyes thought he'd bought one half of the solution. The other half is a central creator; someone who is able to explosively start attacks from the half way line or deeper. Someone with the ability to spread the play or thread little through balls between a defence. That should be Kagawa but it really isn't.

No. Fellaini was our last roll of the dice, when he lost out on all the "options".

Kagawa isn't a CM, has never played as one. There is another alternate theory, but it isn't in anyway related to today's match or performance.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Probably yes, but then, it would be unfair to put everything on Moyes, no?

Not everything. Of course not. Too many factors to pin it down to an individual. But he does have "responsibility". And I don't like the word "blame" either. But I think he's been disappointing so far and I'm not seeing the signs I think we should be.

 

[Mad Winger]

So thus the issue with the football you're playing. Fellaini isn't playing the role for which he was bought, and you still haven't got the connector between the midfield and the striking quality. This means that the strikers are still scoring a lot of good goals, but there's a reliance on them pulling a rabbit out of the hat, as opposed to having a consistent threat throughout the team.

Good post overall, but I especially agree with this part.

I'll be embarrassed if anyone gives you stick for that post.

 

[alastair]

No. Fellaini was our last roll of the dice, when he lost out on all the "options".

Kagawa isn't a CM, has never played as one. There is another alternate theory, but it isn't in anyway related to today's match or performance.

Fellaini isn't remotely similar to any of the other players you were linked with though, which leads me to believe it was always his intention to bring someone of the ilk of Fellaini in regardless.

And Kagawa isn't a CM, but I was more referring to someone who can play centrally in a more advanced role, but who could also float left and right.

 

[soapythecat]

Moyes has got the perfect run of league fixtures to sort this out now. Spurs away will be tricky but the next 7/8 games after that should be games we can win (judging on previous years). We are a good days results from a top 4 league placing. Once we are sat in there the squad will feel at home again. Still a lot of pressure on them. But by feck do we need to sell some shite and buy a midfielder.

 

[Aboutreika18]

Might get a bit of stick for this post, but I'll go for it anyway.

From my experience of watching United, it has now for a while been a team based around the quality of individuals or partnerships. Ferguson always liked to have at least one superstar in the squad, because he was aware more than anyone that the high end games are won by moments of superb individual quality.

It was for this reason that Van Persie was signed even though you didn't 'need him' as so many on here said at the time. You very much did need him. To an extent, you still do.

In recent years, it strikes me that you've moved away from a particular brand of football which I always saw as 'counter-attacking containment.' You let teams get to a certain point of the pitch, then pressed, won it back and scored.

Not really a response to today's defeat but more of a general observation over the past couple of seasons or so.

When I watch the likes of Dortmund, Barca, Juve etc it's quite clear in the pattern of play how they play and try to beat their opponents and they do it in a systematic and cohesive way as a team unit. e.g. Dortmund will pressure the ball carrier as a unit and break at pace, something they've clearly spent ages working on in training.

On the other hand, why are we so disjointed as a side and end up relying on individual brilliance too often? Normally when you think of Man Utd, you think of a side that dominates its opponents with excellent wingplay and devestating counter attacks but it's been a good few seasons since we've done that consistently.

Yeah, I made a thread around this theme. We've not always been like this but the last time I can remember us ditching this reliance on individual brilliance was the start of the 2011/12 season where we played some open, attacking and generally entertaining football.

With Fergie gone, our reliance on individuals is more evident than ever.

 

[Comsmit]

We looked like an expensive version of Moyes' Everton out there today. Very direct and physical, static central midfielders, focus on set-plays and counter-attacking (not very well.) Sitting back and defending a one-goal lead for as good as 30 minutes, waiting for the inevitable to happen. We should have come out in the second-half and pressed the shit out of Cardiff, encourage mistakes and get the two goal lead.

It was the same against Arsenal really but luckily we didn't concede although it was nearly the case.

 

[coolredwine]

Not everything. Of course not. Too many factors to pin it down to an individual. But he does have "responsibility". And I don't like the word "blame" either. But I think he's been disappointing so far and I'm not seeing the signs I think we should be.

I would only use the word disappointed for today. Rest of the matches have been as expected. There was absolutely nothing in the 2nd half. So much so that I dozed for a good 10 minutes around the 65th minute mark. Infact, the defense doesn't striker fear in the opposition as much as it used to. Things have changed drastically and it would take some time to get back to normal.

 

[Will Absolute]

The truest words he has spoken since he came here was about our lack of World Class talent, and that we need a few to go straight into the first-team.

But he had his chance to rectify that in the summer and failed dismally to do so.

The last transfer window was a golden opportunity. Moyes may not get a better one. League champions; and the top teams and the oil giants weren't in the market for midfielders - so, no competition. Next summer we may not even have CL football to offer, and, who knows? we might have to compete with Real, PSG or City for the likes of Fabregas.

 

[coolredwine]

Fellaini isn't remotely similar to any of the other players you were linked with though, which leads me to believe it was always his intention to bring someone of the ilk of Fellaini in regardless.

And Kagawa isn't a CM, but I was more referring to someone who can play centrally in a more advanced role, but who could also float left and right.

We have never had that formation to play Kagawa in that position. With 2 forwards, it was always going to be them in the middle, with Kagawa occupying one of the wing position. Moyes did play him in that central-ish role though, in 2-3 matched before the break. Against Stoke and in CL, I think. Stoke never gave him the space, and he looked good in CL.

But yeah, with Rooney and RvP vying for those two spots up top, I doubt if Kagawa will get a chance to play exclusively in the central role. Today was a good chance - I was expecting - but then, there is Hernandez as well, and guess Moyes had one eye on the CL fixture.

With Fellaini being at United, the only thing that I can imagine is a 4-3-3. But then again, no place to fit Rooney and RvP which leads us to square one!

 

[Ringo 07]

The worrying thing for Moyes will be the fact that he will not get the players he needs in January and will have to wait till next summer to possibly get the likes of Barkley and Shaw.......By that stage many fans could be calling for his head with a top 4 finish possibly not being achieved

 

[kundalini]

We looked like an expensive version of Moyes' Everton out there today. Very direct and physical, static central midfielders, focus on set-plays and counter-attacking (not very well.) Sitting back and defending a one-goal lead for as good as 30 minutes, waiting for the inevitable to happen. We should have come out in the second-half and pressed the shit out of Cardiff, encourage mistakes and get the two goal lead.

It was the same against Arsenal really but luckily we didn't concede although it was nearly the case.

I tend to agree with this. Soton, Arsenal, Donetsk and now Cardiff, we've tried to hold on. Three times we've failed. At no point during the season have we looked sufficiently competent defensively to have much faith in such an approach. I just don't think Moyes appreciates what actually worked for Sir Alex. Does he really believe his Everton formula is going to win titles for United ?

 

[Sixpence]

I think we are a hard working side with some quality in attack. That's about the sum of it, we are unlikely to outplay anyone when it comes to passing the ball. We've scored a hell of a lot of set piece goals and we look easy to play against. Fortunately the league is very poor this season and we still have a shot at the title, albeit a small one.

 

[Beachryan]

In Moyes' defense, take a look here: http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/...telligence-global-salary-survey-espn-magazine

We spend 60% less on wages than Barcelona, 40% less than Madrid, 30% less than City/Chelsea and probably similar to Bayern after they've bought a ton of quality in the last 12 months. We only spend marginally more on wages than Liverpool.

I'm not saying we shouldn't expect players that can pass 5 feet to a teammate, but the truth of the matter is that we're only a top 5 European team in terms of revenue in. And that doesn't help the team, at all, because that money clearly isn't going to improving our squad.

Moyes has a similar 'budget' to Arsenal and LFC, and we're closer to spending what heavyweights like Aston Villa than we are to Barcelona and Madrid.

 

[Amir]

Moyes has got the perfect run of league fixtures to sort this out now. Spurs away will be tricky but the next 7/8 games after that should be games we can win (judging on previous years). We are a good days results from a top 4 league placing. Once we are sat in there the squad will feel at home again. Still a lot of pressure on them. But by feck do we need to sell some shite and buy a midfielder.

They way we've been playing, we're bound to drop points because we're just not good enough. Everton are tricky, Newcastle are tricky, Villa away. We won't get away with it if we play like we did today. I really can't even look 7-8 games forward. We need to sort ourselves out for the next one. Whatever comes after that doesn't matter now.

 

[Moriarty]

In Moyes' defense, take a look here: http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/...telligence-global-salary-survey-espn-magazine

We spend 60% less on wages than Barcelona, 40% less than Madrid, 30% less than City/Chelsea and probably similar to Bayern after they've bought a ton of quality in the last 12 months. We only spend marginally more on wages than Liverpool.

I'm not saying we shouldn't expect players that can pass 5 feet to a teammate, but the truth of the matter is that we're only a top 5 European team in terms of revenue in. And that doesn't help the team, at all, because that money clearly isn't going to improving our squad.

Moyes has a similar 'budget' to Arsenal and LFC, and we're closer to spending what heavyweights like Aston Villa than we are to Barcelona and Madrid.

So where's it all going then? On second thoughts, don't bother to answer that.

 

[Carl]

I've heard Moyes said he'd have taken a point beforehand. Is that true?

 

[Sam]

His comments after the game are unbelievable (if true). Just smacks of small time mentality.

Really want him to succeed, but he's not helping himself at times.

 

[Brophs]

One of the things that's a bit of a pain in the arse for him at the moment is how poor Fellaini's been. If he'd come in and looked good then it would have taken a lot of pressure off. The next signing he brings in will have a lot of pressure attached to him. That's why I think he'll go for a sure thing - as he sees it - and bring in Baines who is a good player, quite obviously, but he probably won't set pulses racing and he's not the top midfielder people want. Then once the summer comes he'll try bring in a top midfielder.