To be fair they created feck all.. We have often, under Ferguson, conceded possesion to Arsenal after taking the lead - letting them just do their thing without being able to break us down.
Moyes So Far!
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To be fair they created feck all.. We have often, under Ferguson, conceded possesion to Arsenal after taking the lead - letting them just do their thing without being able to break us down.
We created much more chances than they did....shows that Moyses did the homework well on this one.
Very harsh to criticise Moyes for shutting up shop in this game. Arsenal are miles better than Saints and deserved the respect we gave them. Had we chucked on Januzaj and Nani then conceded a sloppy equaliser we'd have all criticised the substitutions.
Did we? I thought there were very few clear chances throughout the game. Probably evens although United always looked the more threatening with Van Persie and Rooney overshadowing Giroud.
Moyes always does his homework, he's one of the most prepped managers in the league. It is his instincts that slightly concern me more than his preparation. Don't get me wrong I'm delighted with the win and the manner in which it was fought for, just feel it could have easily gone awry in the final 10-15 minutes.
Yea I know exactly your point and I am not arguing it, I was just adding my take on it, we're going through a very alien period for us all and I feel we will see more of the same in the coming months. I actually felt we went into the game as underdogs to a degree, Arsenal in fine form, United a bit uncertain and we have no idea what we're capable of under Moyes yet, he's feeling his way in my opinion and we are looking like a side that can challenge. We are certainly better than holding on at home, but we were hanging onto 3 points which is what can be expected as the clock ticks and you remain able to close the opposition out, had we been hanging on for a draw then that's a different proposition. Our days of being Man United and doing what we want requires that we get our heads down and work our arses off, grind out results, take a scrappy 1-0 at home to the league leaders but above all avoid costly defeats. That's now 9 unbeaten and a damn good run that was argued we were not capable of early season, I am over all quite happy with how things are moving along even if the football is airing on the side of cautious.
By the hour mark, United had been the more threatening and had the better chances. But Arsenal dominated the last half hour, and probably evened it up in terms of chances. Says a lot, though, that their most dangerous creative player was Sagna. Ramsey, Ozil and Cazorla were all surprisingly toothless.
Today, Moyes made the right subs obviously. It was right to bring on Giggs instead of a 18 year old and Fellaini to help out in our midfield
The boys are right, we should all criticise Moyes because it COULD have gone wrong.
I don't think Ferguson ever asked United to willingly concede possession? That isn't what happened today anyway, Arsenal will always have more of the ball due to their superior possession game. They created a few openings in the last 15 minutes mate, one of those could easily have gone in.
It was always going to be a tight affair with very few chances. Result was the key today and it has been achieved.
Re: conceding possesion, perhaps not. However, we were very much in control towards the end. I rewatched it and they did not creat much, standard arsenal.
The thing i'm pleased about the most is that he clearly has the players on his side now, they're playing for him and believing in his methods, that was a worry for me after the bad start, but now i've no doubt that they're 100% committed to the cause, that's half the job done as far as i'm concerned.
Yeh agree I thought Cazorla in particular was dreadful, as he was in the same fixture last year. Wenger did us a favour playing Ramsey on the right, they lacked penetration through the central area, as in runners from midfield. I thought Wilshere was their best midfielder and he only played the last half hour, mainly because he actually tried to take them forward.
We deserved it overall, more dynamic in our play.
Again I don't think we were in control the last 15 minutes? That period was Arsenal's best in the game. The last 3 minutes we saw the game out well.
Maybe not control, but as you say, we saw out the game. I wasn't really worried they were going to score, we've played so many matches against them and seen them having the majority of possesion (with us sitting back) without being able to do us in - with a few exeptions obviously. The away match in 07/08 comes to mind.
Does it look like things are improving?. Thats probably the main question and it really is still very early days for Moyes. I was expecting a loss. The way we played especially in the first half for me was really encouraging. Its going to be a season of 2 steps forward 1 step back. Nice to see the team looking positive and happier.
Where have I been harshly critical?
Who is really criticising? I've seen nobody overly critical, and a few simply pointing out their worries of a trend of trying to hang on late on in games setting in. It's hardly a huge criticism, and is a fair worry. It's bit us on the arse already this season.
I've seen nobody really tear at Moyes in here tonight, and rightly so. It seems some of you are a bit sensitive.
Does it sound harsh to you?
I specifically mentioned his settling in and hoped that explained his reluctance to be more positive. I also praised the result and the first half performance. Where have I been harsh?
Is it wrong of me to hope for more than trying to hang on in games? Is that what we, as United fans should aspire to?
I thought he made the right choice today to bring Fellaini on. At that time we were up against it so it would have been madness to make a substitution in an attacking sense.
I'm also not so keen on defensive subs when we're 1-0 up. In years past when teams pressed us at Old Trafford we generally scored on the break. We nearly paid the price in the last few minutes.
Fellaini was playing furthest forward with Rooney.
I think it's harsh in this instance yes. The times we beat the big teams last year in close games it was very much the same - hang on and put 11 men behind the ball. It's usually always the case in big-game clashes with just the one goal in it. The match scenario against Saints and Arsenal were completely different - against Saints we were playing well and looked on the verge of scoring a second and then Moyes made those bizarre substitutions.
I don't think the subs had that effect tbh. We were dropping deeper and inviting pressure before the subs. I think it would have been madness to make subs in an attacking sense in this situation.
Aye, he was put there because we couldn't keep hold of the ball. Fellaini is great at having the ball fired at him and holding up to bring people into play. I can understand this sub and tactical change from Moyes.
It's certainly not wrong but the opposition has earned the respect we gave them today, I think we need to keep perspective, the Southampton subs where a disaster but given their league position perhaps we are judging the side on it's name and not the quality of football it was putting out on the pitch. Perhaps Moyes saw the bigger picture and that Southampton result actually looks a little better given how they have done so far. We also shouldn't judge todays defensive substitutions to much, the Vidic injury took Jones out of the midfield who was doing a magnificent job hindering Arsenal's build up play and it fecked our game plan over. Moyes came up with a plan B and for a moment after Cleverleys introduction I thought he had fecked it up but Jones and Smalling grew into monsters alongside the accomplished Evans performance and Arsenal where alweays going to struggle to get in among those lads having blinders. I guess closing out the game was the most sensible option given the situation.
Arsenal were leaving massive gaps at the back trying get an equaliser. I think a more positive approach to substitutions would have led us scoring a second.
Right, so because it happened before we should be happy to watch it all the time? I haven't particularly had a go at Moyes, I replied to a post that I agreed with. Moyes, Fergie, Jesus, whoever, I don't care who it is that is managing us, I don't want to watch us deliberately hang on late in games and sit back like a smaller team playing a bigger side, against Arsenal, Southampton or whoever else because eventually it will cost us. It didn't today and it's a great result, but it has already this season and I hope it isnt a trend.
How in the name of holy fecking Christ is that a harsh criticism?
It almost did anyway to be fair and also offered us an element of protection, that's exactly how you beat Arsenal, we've been doing it for years.
Absolutely. We are 8 or 9 games unbeaten now, having won most of them and we ate playing decent attacking football.
Moyes has clearly learnt from his mistakes. Team selection now are much better and a big reason for it is that Young, Rio and Giggs aren't starting (and Valencia has finally found some form). Also we are playing more attacking, as opposed to the beginning when we were more concerned to not concede than to score, which of course backfired. As a result of us being a more attacking unit (IMO), it looks that player are enjoying it and playing for him. It was a terrible start with a lot of stupid mistakes from him, but since Soton game, I think that he has done a good job. If we continue like thiis then likely we'll be fighting for title which was the expectation in the beginning. I don't expect us to win it, but as long as we'll finish in top 4 (preferably in top 3), play attacking football most of the time and are signs of progress, I'll be happy.
Aye, that's a fair point tbf and we have caught Arsenal out like this many times over the years. Making subs in an attacking sense could have paid dividends no doubt. But I feel this was one of those matches where the players (no matter who was on the pitch) were always going to hold on for dear life at 1-0. We had a lot riding on this result and you heard Rooney at the end. "We knew we couldn't lose today and go 11 points behind Arsenal. We had to win!"
It's not at all harsh. It's a valid observation and a suggestion that I hope his slight negaitivity is simply a symptom of him settling in and not a hint at the ethos he'll bring here with him.
I'm happy with the result and happy with the improvements we've made of late, I just hope we're more positive in big games going forward. Don't you?
Nev is right it has happened a few times this season already and cost us. It could easily have done so again today, when really Arsenal were there for the taking.
I thought exactly the same, Sultan. Having said that, Fellaini did well enough when he came on, as did Giggs.
I agree. That had a big part to play in my opinion.
The Nev doing irony like no other
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