Moyes So Far!

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Fergie said that by Xmas last year, he knew he'd wanted to retire. At that time, pep was available and there were strong indiciations that Mourinho's season at Real would be his last. We should've approached either one of them. Mourinho was chomping at the bit, it was quite evident after the CL tie with Real.

We've made our bed now, we're stuck with Moyes for the forseeable future. I can't see us giving Moyes the sack in his frist season, especially with Fergie on the board of directors.
 
Brosstan said:
My stream said we had 13 goal scoring opportunities compared to their 12 and that the possession was 50-50.
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http://espnfc.com/us/en/report/367413/report.html?soccernet=true&cc=5901
That's where I got the stats from, and it's not really a surprise considering how the game went. Anyways, I think it's fair to say we weren't the better team today and it was a fairly even game. We hit the bar twice, and Januzaj had a good long range shot and Fellaini had the rebound, but apart from that, I can't remember us really troubling them too much. For once not the wingers' fault either because I felt they both played pretty good games. I think it was just down to poor tactics today.
 
bosnian_red said:
I don't think we even needed somebody big. We just needed another charismatic character to be our manager. It could have been a relatively inexperienced manager, or an ex player of ours. Just somebody who would encourage good attacking football and who the players would respect. Moyes is uninspiring and boring in pretty much everything he does. Some people just aren't cut out for the job of being United's manager. You can include Moyes' name in that list.
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I think if you are charismatic you can get away with a lot or early mistakes, Moyes just looks lost at the moment, almost frightened of the job. Maybe it is even bigger than he realised. The scrutiny you are under can be crippling.
 
I must admit I do feel sorry for Moyes. He seems like a decent guy. Howver, in life sometimes you just have to face the fact that you're not quite up there to hold a big position for a big club.
 
poisson said:
The absolute worst thing is, the players look like they have ZERO confidence in him! They just don't seem like they're enjoying their play. As others have already mentioned, when Fergie left we needed someone big to take over the reins, like pep or Jose. Moyes may or may not be successful in the long run but the way things are the moment, it's looking doubtful.
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I agree with this and for me the main concern.
No confidence in the manager is a major problem and this more than the lack of results could be his undoing.
 
poisson said:
I must admit I do feel sorry for Moyes. He seems like a decent guy. Howver, in life sometimes you just have to face the fact that you're not quite up there to hold a big position for a big club.
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I like Moyes, but he seems to tentative as a manager and if the manager is tentative, then so is his team. I would give him this season to settle in, then next season we have to be right up there competing. The Glazers cannot afford to go for years without success.
 
It's annoying that the U-18 game was not on live today, because supposedly they were concentrating on the first team. They have never done that before. To be honest I would rather watch the U-18 and U-21 than the first team at the minute. They are still entertaining.
 
poisson said:
The absolute worst thing is, the players look like they have ZERO confidence in him! They just don't seem like they're enjoying their play. As others have already mentioned, when Fergie left we needed someone big to take over the reins, like pep or Jose. Moyes may or may not be successful in the long run but the way things are the moment, it's looking doubtful.
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I don't think its a case of Moyes' personality being the problem, I think many of the players are unconvinced by his negativity and his approach. I don't think the players look at Moyes and think he's only ever managed Everton we need a bigger man than this. United's players dont strike me as that kind of arrogant. I think what most of them think is that Man Utd should be going out to attack not to contain, and that Moyes' instructions simply don't suit either them as players or the capabilities of our squad. You could tell at Sunderland, for example, the instruction had been to hit high balls into the box from deep and that in the end Evra especially just thought 'screw that'.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
It's annoying that the U-18 game was not on live today, because supposedly they were concentrating on the first team. They have never done that before. To be honest I would rather watch the U-18 and U-21 than the first team at the minute. They are still entertaining.
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They were during the first few years under SAF. That team went on to form the basis of the treble winning side.

It will again, let's not worry too much
 
rednev said:
I think some people are overplaying his apparent errors in his substitution choices this season. His big failure so far has been in allowing us to enter the season with a midfield that is well below top-4 standards. Fellaini was never going to be enough.
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Moyes inherited that below par CM we have from the great man himself. Fellaini may well not be the solution, but I doubt Moyes isn't aware of the poor midfield we have. It's quite obvious that Anderson and Cleverley are average, Carrick is excellent but approaching the final stages of his brilliant career. That unless we insist on playing him when he's into his 40's.
 
Ole'sbodyguard said:
I'm not one of the people who thinks Moyes should be sacked as he's needs a season at least before being judged but I'm getting tired of the quality of the players being questioned.

Moyes was left with the champions of last season and one full of top and proven players. Even if central midfield, where we have been weak, he was left with Carrick(top performer last season) and some decent options which he had the entire summer to strengthen.

At the moment, this team is underachieving hugely and the buck stops with him on that score. What's most concerning is other than the Swansea game, we have not put in a convincing performance all season and are dropping points at home to mid table sides.
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Pretty much this.

No revisionism should be allowed about "weak" squad, crap centre mid, aging players, blah blah. This squad won the league last year!!

WON the league last year.
To not get this squad into the top 4 would be epic mis-management.

However, it is still early days.

roll on wed and sat.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Those teams aren't coached by anyone Moyes brought in. Not sure if that is a good observation or not.
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But he didn't change it either. He's not stupid though. He was entitled to bring in his team of coaches and they are knowledgeable but he does know a good youth system as well and in Nicky butt and the others; he knows they are good and know the kids.

it's like a school, you wouldn't want to change a teacher when the kids trust and like that teacher plus he/she is producing results.The leadership may change but you make too many changes in the staff you lose continuity and stability
 
#07 said:
I don't think its a case of Moyes' personality being the problem, I think many of the players are unconvinced by his negativity and his approach. I don't think the players look at Moyes and think he's only ever managed Everton we need a bigger man than this. United's players dont strike me as that kind of arrogant. I think what most of them think is that Man Utd should be going out to attack not to contain, and that Moyes' instructions simply don't suit either them as players or the capabilities of our squad. You could tell at Sunderland, for example, the instruction had been to hit high balls into the box from deep and that in the end Evra especially just thought 'screw that'.
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It's very difficult to say this as I pride our club on not being knee jerk, or indeed myself as I consider myself a patient supporter. However, regardless of the results my biggest concern is the quality of football we've played. It's been terrible. I also find the Kagawa situation baffling. A world class coach will find a system to fit his best players, so far Moyes has shown complete rigidity and lack of tactical problem solving.

I would not be against him being sacked as I am starting to think we have made a grave error in his appointment.

Can anyone honestly say if they heard we had sacked him that they would be disappointed other than the fact that it hadn't worked out. We all want it to, but currently the teams performances are unacceptable.
 
holyland red said:
Moyes inherited that below par CM we have from the great man himself. Fellaini may well not be the solution, but I doubt Moyes isn't aware of the poor midfield we have. It's quite obvious that Anderson and Cleverley are average, Carrick is excellent but approaching the final stages of his brilliant career. That unless we insist on playing him when he's into his 40's.
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He might be aware of the problem but he completely fecked up his chance of fixing it. Threw away 30 mil (a huge sum of money) for someone who isn't suited to us at all. Wasted how long going after impossible targets like Fabregas instead of trying harder to go after more realistic, cheaper options like Thiago. And if the reports are to be believed, he chose not to sign Ozil because he didn't think he needed him. Who the feck says no to somebody as good as Ozil :lol:
 
Redfighter said:
It's very difficult to say this as I pride our club on not being knee jerk, or indeed myself as I consider myself a patient supporter. However, regardless of the results my biggest concern is the quality of football we've played. It's been terrible. I also find the Kagawa situation baffling. A world class coach will find a system to fit his best players, so far Moyes has shown complete rigidity and lack of tactical problem solving.

I would not be against him being sacked as I am starting to think we have made a grave error in his appointment.

Can anyone honestly say if they heard we had sacked him that they would be disappointed other than the fact that it hadn't worked out. We all want it to, but currently the teams performances are unacceptable.
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While I agree with a lot of your post; a world class or any coach has a system/ideal whatever first then finds or coaches the players for that system.

Look at Wenger, he's always had a philosophy first then sought the players for that system otherwise he would have bought all sorts just to please supporters
 
We have a better squad than Everton who have a better manager - they are 4 points ahead of us.
 
Inigo Montoya said:
But he didn't change it either. He's not stupid though. He was entitled to bring in his team of coaches and they are knowledgeable but he does know a good youth system as well and in Nicky butt and the others; he knows they are good and know the kids.

it's like a school, you wouldn't want to change a teacher when the kids trust and like that teacher plus he/she is producing results.The leadership may change but you make too many changes in the staff you lose continuity and stability
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He made a lot of changes to the first team coaching staff, maybe we are seeing that in the differences in performances at different age groups. Are his current staff experienced enough to advise him about making changes?
 
The team look so devoid of confidence, it's untrue. This HAS to fall down to Moyes as it his job to motivate and inspire these players. I don't buy the argument that the players are letting him down, because it's been pretty much every player, at some stage or other, over a period a few months. We look so far away from a team of winners it hurts. We are painful to watch and the fact that we are praising some of the passages of play today is testament to how low our expectation have become under him.
I think the pressure is going to be so bad for him now, things are going to have to change. The players are not used to this and there are some massive personalities in that dressing room. He needs to find his formation, 1st 11 and the like fecking fast.
I notice we are still top of the long ball league......that's something the clueless c**t has achieved so far!
 
bosnian_red said:
He might be aware of the problem but he completely fecked up his chance of fixing it. Threw away 30 mil (a huge sum of money) for someone who isn't suited to us at all. Wasted how long going after impossible targets like Fabregas instead of trying harder to go after more realistic, cheaper options like Thiago. And if the reports are to be believed, he chose not to sign Ozil because he didn't think he needed him. Who the feck says no to somebody as good as Ozil :lol:
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so "reports" that Thiago had signed a deal with Bayern months before are not to be believed, but "reports" that United turned down Ozil are to be believed.
I guess whatever bullshit makes you hard.
 
bosnian_red said:
He might be aware of the problem but he completely fecked up his chance of fixing it. Threw away 30 mil (a huge sum of money) for someone who isn't suited to us at all. Wasted how long going after impossible targets like Fabregas instead of trying harder to go after more realistic, cheaper options like Thiago. And if the reports are to be believed, he chose not to sign Ozil because he didn't think he needed him. Who the feck says no to somebody as good as Ozil :lol:
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Moyes went after top targets, which is what you expect a United manager to do, but Ozil is not what we need when Kagawa doesn't even get a look in.. Our extremely average CM needs fixing, and it will take time to do it. I trust Moyes to see it coming good. It can't be much worse than what he inherited.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
He made a lot of changes to the first team coaching staff, maybe we are seeing that in the differences in performances at different age groups. Are his current staff experienced enough to advise him about making changes?
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The first team are different in performances yes, but he does have phil Neville on board. Is there a more knowledgeable ex player out there who can advise him? Neville played in several of the finest attacking sides ever to grace English football he knows the DNA of Utd and Utd's style
 
I have no faith in him whatsoever, but I don't know who is out there that we could get during the season. Surely he'll have to go if we don't get top4.
 
holyland red said:
Moyes went after top targets, which is what you expect a United manager to do, but Ozil is not what we need when Kagawa doesn't even get a look in.. Our extremely average CM needs fixing, and it will take time to do it. I trust Moyes to see it coming good. It can't be much worse than what he inherited.
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Ozil is far better than Kagawa though. The fact that Kagawa doesn't get a look in doesn't mean Ozil wouldn't. You'd need to be mad not to play Ozil, he's the type of player you build teams around.
 
sullydnl said:
Ozil is far better than Kagawa though. The fact that Kagawa doesn't get a look in doesn't mean Ozil wouldn't. You'd need to be mad not to play Ozil, he's the type of player you build teams around.
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Do you think Fergie would have gone for him if he was still around, he wanted him before he went to Madrid?
 
bosnian_red said:
He might be aware of the problem but he completely fecked up his chance of fixing it. Threw away 30 mil (a huge sum of money) for someone who isn't suited to us at all. Wasted how long going after impossible targets like Fabregas instead of trying harder to go after more realistic, cheaper options like Thiago. And if the reports are to be believed, he chose not to sign Ozil because he didn't think he needed him. Who the feck says no to somebody as good as Ozil :lol:
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The most annoying thing about the Fellaini signing is that he could have joined earlier (which could have been benefited him and the club) and for a lot less money. A major cock up this transfer, it's helped nobody at all.
 
charleysurf said:
so "reports" that Thiago had signed a deal with Bayern months before are not to be believed, but "reports" that United turned down Ozil are to be believed.
I guess whatever bullshit makes you hard.
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There weren't any reports that said he signed a deal with Bayern months before. There were loads of rumours all june and it looked like he would come to United. Then once Moyes officially took over we stopped going after him and Bayern came in at the start of July and got the deal wrapped up, while Moyes said we aren't interested in him, and then we started going after Fabregas despite the fact that Barca just sold his main competition. Our transfer dealings this summer were amateurish at best, no two ways about it. Didn't Moyes also say we weren't in for Ozil, despite him being offered out to clubs when Madrid were going for Bale? In the end, we signed the sack of shite that is Fellaini for 30 mil on deadline day, without really being close to sign anybody else until the last day of the transfer window.
Go ahead though and keep your head up Moyes' arse thinking all is rosy at United and just because he'll stay here for a while that we'll end up playing good football and results will come.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Do you think Fergie would have gone for him if he was still around, he wanted him before he went to Madrid?
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Hypothetically, yes. But it's not as if Moyes is repulsed by flair players ; he wasn't at Everton. He's played all our most creative players apart from Kagawa but doesn't know his most effective team yet
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Do you think Fergie would have gone for him if he was still around, he wanted him before he went to Madrid?
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I think there's no doubt that Sir Alex would have gone in for him. Sir Alex always went after world class players when they became available at reasonable prices. We might not have got him but you can be sure that we'd have at least tried to bring him in.
Also I have no doubt that Kagawa would have gotten much more chances this season had Fergie still been here, based on how highly Sir Alex talked about him and how he was saying how good he was going to be this season. Instead we have Moyes wasting him.
 
sullydnl said:
Ozil is far better than Kagawa though. The fact that Kagawa doesn't get a look in doesn't mean Ozil wouldn't. You'd need to be mad not to play Ozil, he's the type of player you build teams around.
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It's not a computer game. You have to look at areas you need strengthening most, and as long as Kagawa and Rooney are on our books then splashing 40 odd million on Ozil is not required. We can't sign all the great players in the world.
 
kouroux said:
The most annoying thing about the Fellaini signing is that he could have joined earlier (which could have been benefited him and the club) and for a lot less money. A major cock up this transfer, it's helped nobody at all.
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We would have lost 23.5m instead of 27.5m. 4m less. He won't be here for long IMO.
 
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