I'm guessing that's James Ducker's article? He's been sucking Moyes' arse all season, at least we may be finally getting some perspective on the media.
Moyes has to go
- Thread starter Orton
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This is probably it. A lot of them have bigged up Moyes for years and now they don't want to admit they were wrong. I really don't think it's possible to do any worse then he has done.
Just look at that backroom staff.. Just look at it. He should never have sacked Ferguson's team. Add to it by all means but there is no way Phil Neville should be a significant part of United's staff in his first coaching role, particularly with a new manager getting to grips with the job.
We will beat them.
I'm going over for the second leg so I'll be getting a taste of it soon enough. I think even among those who sing his name there is massive doubt over his capability.
Honestly, I reckon I'd have done better. The very worst I would do is just let Fergie's staff to run the team and they can't have done any worse than Moyes' gang.
Being the 'best fans' should be about wanting what's best for your club. And in this case, that's getting rid of the fella who is so painfully out of his depth.
ON the evidence so far this season, and taking all of my correct predictions thus far this season, I'm afraid we won't
I say no, but that's mainly because I can't see an obvious replacement. Simeone would appear to be very good, but also hasn't managed the highest profile of club, he would be preferable to Moyes, but not necessarily the stella manager we need. The pressures at our club are unique to some extent.
There is a word for that... Pöhler!
It must be a culture shock for the players to see our management look so defeated. It's their job to guide and motivate. There's no way any positivity comes from looking at that.
I think you're correct.
He's managed to turn a team with an ageing defence, crap midfield and reliant on Rooney and Van Persie into a team with an ageing defence, crap midfield and reliant on Rooney, Van Persie and Januzaj.
What will it take? A hammering by the Scouse at OT, because that's what is going to happen.
I really do hate the attitude they take on bench, when things are not going well they look like the world is going to end. There should be belief and stoic expressions yet they all slump in their seats, Steve Round has a terrible poker face and I'm still haunted by his English losers face from his time with the Wally with the Brolly.
Funny, but complete bullshit of course. He's turned a good team into a shite one. Spending 65m in the process.
Agree on media, think you are being unfair to the fans. Just cos people arent screaming 'Moyes out' doesn't mean they're happy with the cak being served up. They are proud that the fans are sticking behind the team and not making things worse, which they would be if the ground turned poisonous. People need something to feel good about mate, don't hate them for clinging to something regardless of how small.
I'll tell you what it is, it is the exact same reason why so many fans are still defending him, out of a misplaced sense of respect for Ferguson.
He chose him as his successor, he demanded the supporters would stick by him and alot of people including at the media are feeling like they would disrespect Ferguson in some kind of way if they turned on him after just a couple of months. Wanting Moyes out equals to disrespecting Ferguson for some and although I get it, its completley fecked up !
The fact Ferguson made the appointment and made a big thing about giving him time and supporting him no matter what, is the major stinker in all this. If he hadn't done that, the media would have been far worse for him and I guarantee you that he would have been firred already months ago.
I love Ferguson, but he messed up big time on this one, BIG TIME !
Can't argue with that.
I've said this before but if we're getting rid of him it has to be now, not at the end of the season. That way we can actually overtly go about the business of finding a replacement for next season - don't really care who takes over as the interim manager until then, the point is for Moyes to go so we can properly prepare the succession.
Edit: just to add, that's not to say I think he will be sacked; after all this bollocks about 'the United way' he'll be given 18 months at the minimum.
Edit: just to add, that's not to say I think he will be sacked; after all this bollocks about 'the United way' he'll be given 18 months at the minimum.
That's a massive understatement right there...
He should have been sacked at the start of January.
Good team? We were dragged kicking and screaming to the title by Van Persie's goals and DDG with Rooney and Rafael the only other regular stand-out performers.
Funny, but complete bullshit of course. He's turned a good team into a shite one. Spending 65m in the process.
I have always felt that Moyes needs at least till the end of next season to be given a fair chance of getting things running his way and to have had enough time to have been able to let any transfer window signings start to show what can be done.
The big problem for me now is that I was hoping to see some consistent improvement, even little hints of improvement. I had seen a few indications of that in the last couple of games but this loss seemed to me to be a big step backwards. I am now finding it very difficult to keep with my earlier view. Im not a Moyes supporter and was underwhelmed by his appointment but did feel that whoever came in needed a decent and fair chance to get settled. The performances are starting to worry me more and more, we dont play the way Utd should. We lack that historic swashbuckling style and I dont mind losing if we look like we are having a go. Scottish fans endured Craig Levene and even though we know the Scottish players are seriously lacking in quality the majority of Scots fans would prefer to lose while having a go than to lose by 1 goal but be dull and boring doing it. Strachan came in and gave us belief again simply by getting the players to have a go. Scotland will still have a huge battle to qualify for major tournaments but at least we now feel like we will fight for it.
Under Moyes I am now starting to feel like I am having to endure things in the way Levene had Scots fans feeling rather than feeling like we are fighting to win.
I am now very close to the point where I dont think he should get that 2 seasons to show what he can do because the signs of improvement are too small and too infrequent.
The big problem for me now is that I was hoping to see some consistent improvement, even little hints of improvement. I had seen a few indications of that in the last couple of games but this loss seemed to me to be a big step backwards. I am now finding it very difficult to keep with my earlier view. Im not a Moyes supporter and was underwhelmed by his appointment but did feel that whoever came in needed a decent and fair chance to get settled. The performances are starting to worry me more and more, we dont play the way Utd should. We lack that historic swashbuckling style and I dont mind losing if we look like we are having a go. Scottish fans endured Craig Levene and even though we know the Scottish players are seriously lacking in quality the majority of Scots fans would prefer to lose while having a go than to lose by 1 goal but be dull and boring doing it. Strachan came in and gave us belief again simply by getting the players to have a go. Scotland will still have a huge battle to qualify for major tournaments but at least we now feel like we will fight for it.
Under Moyes I am now starting to feel like I am having to endure things in the way Levene had Scots fans feeling rather than feeling like we are fighting to win.
I am now very close to the point where I dont think he should get that 2 seasons to show what he can do because the signs of improvement are too small and too infrequent.
This
I completely forgot this team won the title. Good point, well made. We were shite.
When a manager has a title-winning squad in relegation form it boggles the mind that some people want him to stay for years.
I agree though, he should have got the boot months ago.
Kicking and screaming to 89 points and an 11 point lead over 2nd place. Sure thing.
What we should've done is appoint a coach who could take the individual quality we had that won us the title, and also make them play as a cohesive group whilst strengthening our weak areas. We didn't do that.
You aren't looking hard enough. It's like saying you can't see a player who could improve our midfield; there are dozens.
I don't understand the identification of loyalty to manager and loyalty to club. DM has done nothing for United except waste it's money, and yet some fans are prepared to accept years in the wilderness rather than call for his removal.
I wrote a thing on Moyes a few weeks ago, and tonight pretty much summed up certain parts of it:
http://newdless.wordpress.com/2014/02/11/moyes/
I even missed out his baffling and deliberate reliance on his worst performing players, but basically yeah, I'm now quite scared of the idea of more responsibility being entrusted to him.
He sees his team play badly and doesn't understand or notice the obvious things they're doing wrong. He sees them play well and then seems to almost alter everything about the team that worked. This isn't about the players or needing time. It's just generally being clueless.
Tonight was a perfect example. Team played well at the weekend...so he takes out his best performing midfielder, plays Young and Valencia so he changes not only the personel but the system, leaves Januzaj at home. The only part of the midfield he left alone was Michael Carrick, who was the only part of the midfield on Sunday that looked shite. All he needed to do was replace Mata with Kagawa. IF there was any other part of the midfield that needed changing, it was Michael Carrick, who's been a pathetic liability every time he's played since the Norwich game.
He played the same two centrebacks despite them being awful against Palace, and generally all season. He could have had Smalling there and moved someone else to feck around at badly pretending to be a fullback. He didn't though, and he wont, because he doesn't even understand that Vidic is doing anything wrong. He's like one of the deluded fanboys on here.
Generally the only bits of the team he leaves alone are the ones that didn't perform nearly well enough in the previous game. It is almost as if he's deliberately trying to be shit.
http://newdless.wordpress.com/2014/02/11/moyes/
I even missed out his baffling and deliberate reliance on his worst performing players, but basically yeah, I'm now quite scared of the idea of more responsibility being entrusted to him.
He sees his team play badly and doesn't understand or notice the obvious things they're doing wrong. He sees them play well and then seems to almost alter everything about the team that worked. This isn't about the players or needing time. It's just generally being clueless.
Tonight was a perfect example. Team played well at the weekend...so he takes out his best performing midfielder, plays Young and Valencia so he changes not only the personel but the system, leaves Januzaj at home. The only part of the midfield he left alone was Michael Carrick, who was the only part of the midfield on Sunday that looked shite. All he needed to do was replace Mata with Kagawa. IF there was any other part of the midfield that needed changing, it was Michael Carrick, who's been a pathetic liability every time he's played since the Norwich game.
He played the same two centrebacks despite them being awful against Palace, and generally all season. He could have had Smalling there and moved someone else to feck around at badly pretending to be a fullback. He didn't though, and he wont, because he doesn't even understand that Vidic is doing anything wrong. He's like one of the deluded fanboys on here.
Generally the only bits of the team he leaves alone are the ones that didn't perform nearly well enough in the previous game. It is almost as if he's deliberately trying to be shit.
I suspect Fergie is not happy seeing his reputation be dragged down by backing Moyes and picking him.
He'll probably will have made us thinking back on this period, how nice it was to be part of a european night, however small and shitty that part was (still better than no part). He'll have made us thinking back on the PL aswell, how nice it was to be in a secure 6th place instead of battling for relegation.
If he were to be sacked now, almost nailed on giggs would do job till the summer. Wouldn't be unhappy with this - spend the next few months getting the right man....Klopp.
The infuriating thing is there are players who could improve our midfield, who play for Manchester United. Like Fletcher and Fellaini for example, who have both played next to Carrick and looked obviously better than him, this season, multiple times...without a single occasion where the opposite has been true.
I would say Moyes is scared of Carrick's ego, but if Carrick has an ego, it's busy hiding behind his inner coward
I'm starting to think he should stay. In Greece
Tonight is the first time I thought that he is out of his depth. I have been supporting him but that is seriously waining after tonights shocker.
He won't be sacked at this point. It is not an irretrievable deficit. Even when we inevitably crash out after the second leg I don't believe he will get the boot. A rinsing by the scousers might be the catalyst, but I wouldn't bank on it.
We can only hope he does the decent thing.
We can only hope he does the decent thing.
Nah we were right to give him this much time at least.
As it turned out we were just giving him enough rope to hang himself with. Still, at least it's now clear to everyone that he's failing.