This came towards the end of Peps reign, when people started to find it predictable. In its prime it was never called boring
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This came towards the end of Peps reign, when people started to find it predictable. In its prime it was never called boring
He's bound to get the sack by Christmas.
Eric wasn't talking about possession was my point, he was talking more from the whole ethos
I don't think it is that baffling. Cantona is a romantic and unpragmatic guy - he walked away from a life as a pro player at the age of 31 because he wanted to do something different. I don't agree with the King on this occasion, but I certainly don't begrudge him his opinion or find it that strange.
Very good.
He's not saying he will "cave in" or fail. Just that he prefers Pep's brand of football.
And a lot of people consider Pep's brand of football to be much better than Mourinho's.
What a weird thing to say. It's not impossible for him to admire two very successful managers and have a clear preference for one's style.
Did you know Pep's Barcelona were also the one Martial considers the best he's ever seen? There's a lot of people who consider the system Pep introduced there, and the football they played, the absolute pinnacle. It's not "baffling" at all, rather a pretty common view.
The difference between Mourinho and Pep is not just possession football.
Erm no, that's not how "preference" works. You can prefer one of two things while not "ignoring" the other. In fact, preferring one thing in itself means both have been considered.
Bravo.
Have they been present at the unveiling of Moyes or LVG? If so, then yeah, I'd expect them to be there.
If not, then I'd rather they're not. Making forced public appearances which differ from the previous 'standard protocol' just creates a talking point where there isn't one.
I think its Joses way of feck off for a lot of our fans now. Get used to it
Okay. Got the point. Still Pep was given more credit than he actually deserves. Barcelona is a well run system. Pep has great influence on first team when he was there. He is no way the English manager type who runs the whole club. Let's not get into Pep's 2 times being announced mid season when other managers' still have a work at their clubs to do. Thing is at the moment, Pep still consider his captive at clubs as his personal projects, while Mourinho seem by rumor is settling down.
That's going to be so difficult given how wonderful our football has been over the last few years.
I'm not arguing for either, I was defending Erics right to have an opinion.
But I'm not saying they were shit or ineffective, that'd be daft. I'm saying that since our fans are not used to the system that Pep prefers (pre LVG) it's weird to claim that his playstyle is closer to our hearts.
During Fergie era we were closer to Mou's counterattacking style implemented at Madrid than Pep's football at both Barca and Bayern, no?
And I'm not having a go at Cantona for having an opinion as Randall tries to imply. I simply find it quite weird if he's talking from Uniter fans' perspective. His personal opnion doesn't concern me in the slightest.
United traditionally play with fast, pacy wingers, usually at their most devastating on the counter. That is a whole lot closer to Mourinho's football than it ever is to Pep's football. Van Gaal's football is much closer to Pep's, and that didn't work out so well. I think Pep is much better than LvG though, so may be more successful.
Talking about defensive football? We are not adverse to parking the bus when we need to. The 0-0 against Barca in 2008 CL semi final almost mirrors what Mourinho did with Inter a couple of years later.
Talking about defensive football? We are not adverse to parking the bus when we need to. The 0-0 against Barca in 2008 CL semi final almost mirrors what Mourinho did with Inter a couple of years later.
Same here.
Let's not pretend that this isn't a valid opinion just because Mourinho is set to become our manager and Pep will be City's. I personally was in the camp that didn't enjoy Pep's Barcelona, but that was also possibly because I disliked them for beating us and all that jazz. I do, however, acknowledge that their football being seen as the pinnacle, is not a rare or illegitimate view at all.
He isn't talking about his preference, he said that Mourinho's style would clash with United. If he had said that he prefers Guardiola's style then I would have understood but here he is pretending that United are closer to a manager who uses possession football than a manager who uses a fast and poweful style, that's nonsense.
Over time Fergie played many styles tbh, we were not always counterattacking, we had some boring phases, and we also has some brilliant possession based phases.
The point Eric was making wasn't about possession football. It was about having an attacking mentality over a pragmatic one.
If that's the case then fair enough but I can't really agree with it either
I understood it in relation to the neverending possession vs counterattacking oriented football.Fair enough. My same stance. I am just wondering where Eric came for. With this Pep's way. Try reasoning, Pep has problems too. As my previous post explained, Pep was not SAF type who oversee the whole club's work. Pep so far had been given good resources in players at both Barcelona and Bayern to work with.
One more thing. SAF's last few years team was more Mourinho than Pep. Even SAF's most attacking side is closer to Klopp's gung-ho than slow build up Pep's.
If that's the case then fair enough but I can't really agree with it either
It's utter nonsense when 95% of the time Pep has had the better team. Of course he can play on the front foot. But he needs to adapt when he doesn't have the best players. Even Wenger has had to change his style in big games.
Let's look at Peps man marking tactic when he came up against Barca last year who were a better team. Or when Real Madrid destroyed Bayern the year before.
Eric can't dress up Guardiola as Keegan or Rodgers, try as he might - surely possession football is the ultimate in pragmatism?; essentially a form of cowardice which negates the chances of one's team getting 'hurt' by the opposition. We can all admire the skills of a Mayweather...but he's not as brave or as exciting as a Joe Frazier.
You can't even have an opinion these days without being in a "camp" or having some kind of agenda. It's quite ridiculous how much abuse ex players and journalists for disagreeing with the people on the caf.
Strange from Cantona. I always thought Mourinho's Real Madrid was closer to the way Ferguson played than Guardiola's possession football
Did you purposely ignore this line:
"In both cases though there are examples of them going in the other direction, but their defaults are those."
Mourinho came to OT and played for a 0-0 vs Moyes United. The guy is more pragmatic than Pep.
Every manager should be given a chance before being criticised. We'll see if those who supported LvG til the end keep up that standard with Mourinho.
I can see why some would have doubts but no one should be disappointed that we've appointed a proven winner.
That's not where I imagine Cantona is coming from. I think, this is:
He sees United as the place where joyous football is to be played. Where teams march forward, take control of games, and win in style. We undoubtedly did that under SAF. In Pep he presumably sees the manager out of the current lot that plays the football that brought most joy to his heart and soul. I can see that being the case even if I wasn't enamored by it. And that's the parallel he sees IMO. He wants the guy whose team played the dominant style to bring that to the club he loves. It's a fair opinion IMO. Like I said, I don't think the connection necessarily is "counter attack" or "possession". Rather more to do with football that brings about joy (for me personally - see Dortmund under Klopp, maybe Pep for King Eric?), and playing on the front foot.
Just waiting for the inevitable Sir Alex connection now.
I guess the thing about SAF is he was with us a long time and the football evolved a lot, yet people still think of SAF as having the ideals of his early days when it was all gung-ho attack. That was what it was like when Cantona was there. It started to change significantly after the turn of the century, with a more pragmatic approach, and went steadily further in that direction. In the last few years the ethos that SAF is associated with was nowhere in evidence, really. I think Mourinho had quite an influence on SAF in that way. He wanted to win and to entertain but if he could only do one the winning was more important.
They both have an attacking mentality, the problem is that Mourinho is pragmatic on top of it, while Guardiola is "romantic". And you only see Guardiola's romantic side when he tries something crazy in a big game.
Aye, Cassidy explained this point of view to me, I understood it from a slightly different degree I admit.
I'd much rather watch counter attack football. Quick and with a purpose.
when done right Pep's tactic can be great to watch, but it can also be very boring
As for the managers, picking Mourinho is the safer option in my opinion. He's done it in much tougher leagues, and whenever he has been, he's been a winner.
Pep on the other hand, has been at the two best clubs over the last decade. It's not been the hardest job in the world. City and the Premier league is going to be a lot different for him.
That being said, he could come in here and blow everybody away. Time will tell. It will be a very exciting league next season in my opinion and I am very much looking forward to it
when done right Pep's tactic can be great to watch, but it can also be very boring
As for the managers, picking Mourinho is the safer option in my opinion. He's done it in much tougher leagues, and whenever he has been, he's been a winner.
Pep on the other hand, has been at the two best clubs over the last decade. It's not been the hardest job in the world. City and the Premier league is going to be a lot different for him.
That being said, he could come in here and blow everybody away. Time will tell. It will be a very exciting league next season in my opinion and I am very much looking forward to it
When does this happen in that article? You're making it up. A manager is more than just counter attack or possession.
Indeed.
Yes and that is the point Eric was making, do you get it now. He is entitled to his opinion, and it is not a crazy one.
Perhaps Eric is too Romantic about Barca, Cruyff etc to see the gaps in his thinking. Pep is not Johan, not by a long stretch. And besides, Cruyff - for all his genius - was often the definition of pragmatism: like Eric, he could do something extraordinary yet often he'd do things the simple, right way according to situations.
What? I imagine only fans of English can be so hateful towards possession football.- Status