Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

I found this recently and thought it was pretty interesting. They had pretty similar stats the first 4/5 years of their career:

That graph doesn’t really say that.

This is the worst thread on this forum, but boiling down Messi and Ronaldo to a competition based on graphs is just daft. Removes all context, delivers no value.

 

[pregra]

Messi has almost always played in an around the box where as Ronaldo has not.

Ridiculous statement. Ever since Xavi was phased out (and Iniesta was still there) Messi has more times than not played as a midfielder without any defensive responsibility. He literally picks the ball up inside his own half 15-20 times per game. CRon has played in the box for the last 5+ seasons...

 

[SportingCP96]

Ridiculous statement. Ever since Xavi was phased out (and Iniesta was still there) Messi has more times than not played as a midfielder without any defensive responsibility. He literally picks the ball up inside his own half 15-20 times per game. CRon has played in the box for the last 5+ seasons...

In the totality of their careers Messi has played closer to the box then Cristiano Ronaldo. I am not talking about current Ronaldo which is almost a striker. Ronaldos career at United and many years in Madrid was of a winger/wide forward. Messi has almost always played in either the left forward/rigth forward position and and or at the CF position.

Ronaldo up until 07/08 was primarily a winger whose first instinct was not to score goals. We are talking about a player who has adapted and champed his play style and ability on 3 separate occasions in his career which is remarkable.

Phase 1- Flashy winger who played street football on a pro level.
Phase 2- Goal scoring winger who would both score goals AND provide goals for his teammates. He would get a minimum of 15 assist a season around this time
Phase 3- Classic Goal scorer using his experience and unmatched awareness on the pitch knowing where the ball will fall too.

You can even date to where each phase began.

Messi had one of the greatest if not the greatest midfield in football playing behind him in his absolute prime. Then as they faded away yes he began to drop more to fill that burden but he also had so much space because you have to focus on a prime Luis Suarez and a young quick skillful and exciting Neymar who can beat any man 1 0n 1.

Ronaldos best teammates he has had in the forward position were...Benzema and Bale.....and I mean no disrespect to those players when I say that but when you compare them to what Messi has had..I mean come on. His best midfielder was Luka Modric while Messi had both Xavi AND Iniesta.

It is not a coincidence that Barca prime there they achieved their most success coincided with Spain creates ever glory where they won 3 major trophies in as many tries.

 

[Pow]

Nonsense here. Ronaldo has gotten closer to the goal and messi futher away in the last decade and messi still has matched/outscored him

 

[Ishdalar]

In the totality of their careers Messi has played closer to the box then Cristiano Ronaldo. I am not talking about current Ronaldo which is almost a striker. Ronaldos career at United and many years in Madrid was of a winger/wide forward. Messi has almost always played in either the left forward/rigth forward position and and or at the CF position.

Ronaldo up until 07/08 was primarily a winger whose first instinct was not to score goals. We are talking about a player who has adapted and champed his play style and ability on 3 separate occasions in his career which is remarkable.

Phase 1- Flashy winger who played street football on a pro level.
Phase 2- Goal scoring winger who would both score goals AND provide goals for his teammates. He would get a minimum of 15 assist a season around this time
Phase 3- Classic Goal scorer using his experience and unmatched awareness on the pitch knowing where the ball will fall too.

You can even date to where each phase began.

Messi had one of the greatest if not the greatest midfield in football playing behind him in his absolute prime. Then as they faded away yes he began to drop more to fill that burden but he also had so much space because you have to focus on a prime Luis Suarez and a young quick skillful and exciting Neymar who can beat any man 1 0n 1.

Ronaldos best teammates he has had in the forward position were...Benzema and Bale.....and I mean no disrespect to those players when I say that but when you compare them to what Messi has had..I mean come on. His best midfielder was Luka Modric while Messi had both Xavi AND Iniesta.

It is not a coincidence that Barca prime there they achieved their most success coincided with Spain creates ever glory where they won 3 major trophies in as many tries.

Bollocks, you'd think that a player capable of scoring 73 goals in a season with the best midfield in the world would win the league, instead of a team with lesser quality versions like Ozil, Di Maria, Benzema, Kaka and Higuain not only beating them, but also setting the goal record in La Liga.

If our midfieiders were so superior, and our striker set the record for most goals in a season, why did we lose the title, defense? I don't think Ramos was the main force creating part of those 121 goals.

 

[SportingCP96]

Bollocks, you'd think that a player capable of scoring 73 goals in a season with the best midfield in the world would win the league, instead of a team with lesser quality versions like Ozil, Di Maria, Benzema, Kaka and Higuain not only beating them, but also setting the goal record in La Liga.

If our midfieiders were so superior, and our striker set the record for most goals in a season, why did we lose the title, defense? I don't think Ramos was the main force creating part of those 121 goals.

You have your season confused I believe. 11/12 Madrid won the title with a masterclass by Jose Mourinho. The following year was the 73 goal year by Messi and Barca won the league by 15 points.....

 

[Pow]

You have your season confused I believe. 11/12 Madrid won the title with a masterclass by Jose Mourinho. The following year was the 73 goal year by Messi and Barca won the league by 15 points.....

Nope. 2011/12 knocked out the cl by chelsea lost the league to Madrid.
Messi scored 50 league goals 73 in the season.

 

[SportingCP96]

Nope. 2011/12 knocked out the cl by chelsea lost the league to Madrid.
Messi scored 50 league goals 73 in the season.

Ah ok thank you for correcting me but yes as I said above that 11/12 Madrid team is probably the best team (performance wise) they have had in a LONG time. Better then any other Madrid team after that IMO. Was unlucky to get eliminated by Bayern.

 

[Daysleeper]

Never mind

 

[Gehrman]

In the totality of their careers Messi has played closer to the box then Cristiano Ronaldo. I am not talking about current Ronaldo which is almost a striker. Ronaldos career at United and many years in Madrid was of a winger/wide forward. Messi has almost always played in either the left forward/rigth forward position and and or at the CF position.

Ronaldo up until 07/08 was primarily a winger whose first instinct was not to score goals. We are talking about a player who has adapted and champed his play style and ability on 3 separate occasions in his career which is remarkable.

Phase 1- Flashy winger who played street football on a pro level.
Phase 2- Goal scoring winger who would both score goals AND provide goals for his teammates. He would get a minimum of 15 assist a season around this time
Phase 3- Classic Goal scorer using his experience and unmatched awareness on the pitch knowing where the ball will fall too.

You can even date to where each phase began.

Messi had one of the greatest if not the greatest midfield in football playing behind him in his absolute prime. Then as they faded away yes he began to drop more to fill that burden but he also had so much space because you have to focus on a prime Luis Suarez and a young quick skillful and exciting Neymar who can beat any man 1 0n 1.

Ronaldos best teammates he has had in the forward position were...Benzema and Bale.....and I mean no disrespect to those players when I say that but when you compare them to what Messi has had..I mean come on. His best midfielder was Luka Modric while Messi had both Xavi AND Iniesta.

It is not a coincidence that Barca prime there they achieved their most success coincided with Spain creates ever glory where they won 3 major trophies in as many tries.

In the totality of their careers Messi has played closer to the box then Cristiano Ronaldo. I am not talking about current Ronaldo which is almost a striker. Ronaldos career at United and many years in Madrid was of a winger/wide forward. Messi has almost always played in either the left forward/rigth forward position and and or at the CF position.

Ronaldo up until 07/08 was primarily a winger whose first instinct was not to score goals. We are talking about a player who has adapted and champed his play style and ability on 3 separate occasions in his career which is remarkable.

Phase 1- Flashy winger who played street football on a pro level.
Phase 2- Goal scoring winger who would both score goals AND provide goals for his teammates. He would get a minimum of 15 assist a season around this time
Phase 3- Classic Goal scorer using his experience and unmatched awareness on the pitch knowing where the ball will fall too.

You can even date to where each phase began.

Messi had one of the greatest if not the greatest midfield in football playing behind him in his absolute prime. Then as they faded away yes he began to drop more to fill that burden but he also had so much space because you have to focus on a prime Luis Suarez and a young quick skillful and exciting Neymar who can beat any man 1 0n 1.

Ronaldos best teammates he has had in the forward position were...Benzema and Bale.....and I mean no disrespect to those players when I say that but when you compare them to what Messi has had..I mean come on. His best midfielder was Luka Modric while Messi had both Xavi AND Iniesta.

It is not a coincidence that Barca prime there they achieved their most success coincided with Spain creates ever glory where they won 3 major trophies in as many tries.

Modrich, Alonso and Kroos were excellent cm's. Didnt di maria also excell as a cm under ancelotti. And ozil is a class playmaker.

 

[Member 117152]

No. Read again the post I made these are his stats from 09 when both “began the rivalry” per say Ronaldo was a winger before that a flashy creative winger.

Since 09 and his whole time in Madrid he had a better goal scoring ratio then Messi in every single competition.

Messi leads him overall because Ronaldo was a winger for first 5 years and never a goal scorer.

Messi has almost always played in an around the box where as Ronaldo has not.

Since 09 there is no debate if we are going off of ratios as Ronaldo leads every single category as shown above.

Messi is younger than Ronaldo too, plays further back for the majority of his career on the field. 2012 he played striker and scored over 80 goals in a calendar year and has been the best footballer in the world for over 10 years pretty much ever season.

It’s ridiculous people even comparing goals because Messi does so much more. Messi is the best playmaker, free kick taker and scorer in the world atm despite bringing the ball forward from deep. He will be remembered as the finest footballer of his generation despite what all the propaganda says.

I love Ronaldo btw but to say he’s better than Messi is wrong and always has been since 2009. 2012 Messi was the greatest player we’ve ever seen on a football pitch if you want to talk about goal scoring exploits.

 

[Bebestation]

Messi is younger than Ronaldo too, plays further back for the majority of his career on the field. 2012 he played striker and scored over 80 goals in a calendar year and has been the best footballer in the world for over 10 years pretty much ever season.

It’s ridiculous people even comparing goals because Messi does so much more. Messi is the best playmaker, free kick taker and scorer in the world atm despite bringing the ball forward from deep. He will be remembered as the finest footballer of his generation despite what all the propaganda says.

I love Ronaldo btw but to say he’s better than Messi is wrong and always has been since 2009. 2012 Messi was the greatest player we’ve ever seen on a football pitch if you want to talk about goal scoring exploits.

The thing is - this conversation will never end because its not about the player but it's about the fans mind.

What's more important if you built a team?

For you to have the most technically gifted footballer ever who has achieved nearly everything possible for his one club -

or

for you to have a player that possibly gave up part of his technical ability to become the deadliest, most consistent player for every club, country, league and team he played in?

If I was the manager of Stockport County - I personally want Ronaldo because I simply know the man will get the job done for me & I can say that more than Messi. Messi on the other hand is the most beautiful player anyone has ever seen & will score wonder goal after wonder goal but may not interlink as consistently well with a club at a poorer level, poorer standard of player in a league he isn't used to. Ronaldo on the other hand likes a test and wants to come out on top and will come out on top - putting the club on top. Pure mentality in my opinion.

So for me C Ronaldo is the player I want in any team because he wins not because he is beautiful in the way he plays. Messi for others is their main player because he has the technique and an ability to win games for Barcelona.

Ronaldo is an assassin & I can close my eyes & says he gets the job done wherever and whoever he plays for in the world due to his mentality. Messi is an assassin I keep with my eyes open in Spain for Barcelona and occasionally Argentina.

 

[Gehrman]

The thing is - this conversation will never end because its not about the player but it's about the fans mind.

What's more important if you built a team?

For you to have the most technically gifted footballer ever who has achieved nearly everything possible for his one club -

or

for you to have a player that possibly gave up part of his technical ability to become the deadliest, most consistent player for every club, country, league and team he played in?

If I was the manager of Stockport County - I personally want Ronaldo because I simply know the man will get the job done for me & I can say that more than Messi. Messi on the other hand is the most beautiful player anyone has ever seen & will score wonder goal after wonder goal but may not interlink as consistently well with a club at a poorer level, poorer standard of player in a league he isn't used to. Ronaldo on the other hand likes a test and wants to come out on top and will come out on top - putting the club on top. Pure mentality in my opinion.

So for me C Ronaldo is the player I want in any team because he wins not because he is beautiful in the way he plays. Messi for others is their main player because he has the technique and an ability to win games for Barcelona.

Ronaldo is an assassin & I can close my eyes & says he gets the job done wherever and whoever he plays for in the world due to his mentality. Messi is an assassin I keep with my eyes open in Spain for Barcelona and occasionally Argentina.

Ronaldo has played for united, real madrid, juventus and portugal. Even though portugal are not a football superpower they are not Wales or lithhuania.

 

[KirkDuyt]

508 pages in, people still don't realize one is clearly better? Despite all these topic ending posts?!

 

[Pow]

The thing is - this conversation will never end because its not about the player but it's about the fans mind.

What's more important if you built a team?

For you to have the most technically gifted footballer ever who has achieved nearly everything possible for his one club -

or

for you to have a player that possibly gave up part of his technical ability to become the deadliest, most consistent player for every club, country, league and team he played in?

If I was the manager of Stockport County - I personally want Ronaldo because I simply know the man will get the job done for me & I can say that more than Messi. Messi on the other hand is the most beautiful player anyone has ever seen & will score wonder goal after wonder goal but may not interlink as consistently well with a club at a poorer level, poorer standard of player in a league he isn't used to. Ronaldo on the other hand likes a test and wants to come out on top and will come out on top - putting the club on top. Pure mentality in my opinion.

So for me C Ronaldo is the player I want in any team because he wins not because he is beautiful in the way he plays. Messi for others is their main player because he has the technique and an ability to win games for Barcelona.

Ronaldo is an assassin & I can close my eyes & says he gets the job done wherever and whoever he plays for in the world due to his mentality. Messi is an assassin I keep with my eyes open in Spain for Barcelona and occasionally Argentina.

Its pretty simple. All ronaldos tools are to score goals. Messi scores just as much but is also the best playmaker in the world.

 

[Trezeguet17]

Ronaldo:
Best goalscorer of all time

Messi:
Best passer of all time
Best playmaker of all time
Best dribbler of all time
oh and besides that he scores as much goals as the best goalscorer of all time.

I really don't know how this topic is even a discussion

 

[Gehrman]

508 pages in, people still don't realize one is clearly better? Despite all these topic ending posts?!

Ronaldo extra CL titles and euro will always be amunition enough for some to claim hes better.

 

[Bebestation]

Its pretty simple. All ronaldos tools are to score goals. Messi scores just as much but is also the best playmaker in the world.

That's obvious - but it's the fact that Ronaldo tests or challenges himself and comes out on top that makes his fans.

Messi was handed a god given talent and has shown it for Barcelona consistently & so far Barcelona only.

It's the mentality of the athlete rather than the technique of the footballer that makes C. Ronaldo's fans - for those who prefer the technique, then Messi trumps him and no one can complain.

 

[Gehrman]

That's obvious - but it's the fact that Ronaldo tests or challenges himself and comes out on top that makes his fans.

Messi was handed a god given talent and has shown it for Barcelona consistently & so far Barcelona only.

It's the mentality of the athlete rather than the technique of the footballer that makes C. Ronaldo's fans - for those who prefer the technique, then Messi trumps him and no one can complain.

What club could Messi possibly join thats a step up since 2009?

 

[Zehner]

That's obvious - but it's the fact that Ronaldo tests or challenges himself and comes out on top that makes his fans.

Messi was handed a god given talent and has shown it for Barcelona consistently & so far Barcelona only.

It's the mentality of the athlete rather than the technique of the footballer that makes C. Ronaldo's fans - for those who prefer the technique, then Messi trumps him and no one can complain.

 

[Pocho]

62,5% in a United forum, close thread.

 

[Cal?]

62,5% in a United forum, close thread.

This thread is back alive?

You do realize that this poll lost all credibility when an idiot decided to open it after Barca beat Liverpool and close it after their capitulation in the 2nd leg?

 

[Pow]

That's obvious - but it's the fact that Ronaldo tests or challenges himself and comes out on top that makes his fans.

Messi was handed a god given talent and has shown it for Barcelona consistently & so far Barcelona only.

It's the mentality of the athlete rather than the technique of the footballer that makes C. Ronaldo's fans - for those who prefer the technique, then Messi trumps him and no one can complain.

But whats the debate ? They both score goals on a similar level. But the rest of their game one is streets ahead.
For messi to be this good for this long doesnt point to a poor mentality.

 

[Gehrman]

But whats the debate ? They both score goals on a similar level. But the rest of their game one is streets ahead.
For messi to be this good for this long doesnt point to a poor mentality.

Frankly regardless of talent its impossible be as good as he has been for over a decade without being incredibly mentally strong.

 

[Member 117152]

That's obvious - but it's the fact that Ronaldo tests or challenges himself and comes out on top that makes his fans.

Messi was handed a god given talent and has shown it for Barcelona consistently & so far Barcelona only.

It's the mentality of the athlete rather than the technique of the footballer that makes C. Ronaldo's fans - for those who prefer the technique, then Messi trumps him and no one can complain.

A lot of people follow Ronaldo for his Instagram as much as his football these days. He does social media better than any athlete today.

He’s not Pele or Muhammad Ali personality wise that’s for sure but he’s changed football with his superman type approach. Pele and Ronaldo have been foobtalls biggest stars I’d argue but Messi has been its enigma and probably its only true genius.

 

[Hala Madrid]

What club could Messi possibly join thats a step up since 2009?

You could say the same for United in 2008/2009, but Ronaldo made a stepdown at the time to go to a struggling Madrid.
There's no excuse for Messi not leaving at anytime, the fact is he simply wouldn't or couldn't leave Barca

 

[roonster09]

You could say the same for United in 2008/2009, but Ronaldo made a stepdown at the time to go to a struggling Madrid.
There's no excuse for Messi not leaving at anytime, the fact is he simply wouldn't or couldn't leave Barca

There is, he is Barca academy graduate, he loves the club and wants to play for the club he really loves.

 

[Hala Madrid]

There is, he is Barca academy graduate, he loves the club and wants to play for the club he really loves.

That's not an excuse at all. You could say he's loyal to the money since he's renewed 10 times. If he cared much for the club, he'd refuse a raise in order to relieve the club of such burden so they could get quality players faster, that's one of the things a LOYAL player and someone who LOVES the club would do.
Being an academy graduate is a dumb excuse

 

[roonster09]

That's not an excuse at all. You could say he's loyal to the money since he's renewed 10 times. If he cared much for the club, he'd refuse a raise in order to relieve the club of such burden so they could get quality players faster, that's one of the things a LOYAL player and someone who LOVES the club would do.
Being an academy graduate is a dumb excuse

Maybe in Disney movies, not in reality.

Saying Messi should leave Barca is just a dumb logic, it's not like he is playing with same set of players, this is already 3rd or 4th team already.

Also just because some dumb guys wants to prove something doesn't mean player should leave the club, maybe he doesn't give a feck about what "ronaldo vs Messi' brigade thinks.

 

[Hala Madrid]

Maybe in Disney movies, not in reality.

Saying Messi should leave Barca is just a dumb logic, it's not like he is playing with same set of players, this is already 3rd or 4th team already.

Also just because some dumb guys wants to prove something doesn't mean player should leave the club, maybe he doesn't give a feck about what "ronaldo vs Messi' brigade thinks.

Well, you could as well have highlighted my reason for saying he should've refused a raise, stop nitpicking my comment, it's inappropriate.
Yeah, guess what...we are just having a discussion, so yes, both of them couldn't care less about this discussion

 

[roonster09]

Well, you could as well have highlighted my reason for saying he should've refused a raise, stop nitpicking my comment, it's inappropriate.
Yeah, guess what...we are just having a discussion, so yes, both of them couldn't care less about this discussion

Why will he refuse a raise? GOAT playing for a club with ridiculous revenue, should be paid highest wage. He is not doing a charity work.

What kind of discussion is "player should refuse the raise if he loves the club"? That's just dumb thing to say. His level deserves every penny he makes.

 

[RedRonaldo]

Ronaldo:
Best goalscorer of all time

Messi:
Best passer of all time
Best playmaker of all time
Best dribbler of all time
oh and besides that he scores as much goals as the best goalscorer of all time.

I really don't know how this topic is even a discussion

Messi is great in passing, playmaking, dribbling and goalscoring. But to call him best of all time in everything is quite abit too farfetched.

Passing 9.5/10 - he is maybe one of the best passer in the final third, but there are plenty of great passer in the past who I think are better, or at least more all rounded (short pass, long pass, weighted pass, crossing, through balls, one touch pass, skilled pass, movement pass, pin-point pass, controlling the pace passing etc)

Playmaking 9.5/10 - again he is a great playmaker, but best of all time? I don’t think so, not even in his country. Personally I rate Maradona and Riquelme (at his peak) better playmaker than Messi from Argentina. Yes Messi has a lot of assist, but so does Ronaldo.

Dribbling 10/10 - yes he is probably the best of all time, or at least on par with Maradona and George Best in dribbling.

Goalscoring 10/10 - yes alongside with Ronaldo, he is up there among the best of all time tier.

Now let’s also look at Ronaldo:

Goalscoring 10/10 - 700+ career goals, 99+ international goals, 127+ CL goals, I am sure he is going to break all types of major goalscoring records by the time he retired.

Heading/Ariel threat 10/10 - Can’t think of any players better than him in scoring header goals. Maybe Bierhoff?

Determination/mentality 10/10 - By far the most determined/committed footballer I’ve seen. It’s nothing to do with technical/physical, it’s purely the mental aspect of his game, which is 2nd to none.

Dribbling 9/10 - not the same league as Messi obviously, but he is still ranked among top 5 dribbler since OPTA data begin in 2006. So, he is officially top 5 dribbler in the world over past decade. Although it’s true his dribbling has regressed a lot over his later years, which makes him look worse.

Passing 8.5/10 - he is actually a very good crosser, back in his early Man Utd years his main role is to dribble, cross and to create goals from wing. He also has 219 assists over his career (only behind Messi) and has all time most assists in CL too. But overall Messi is clearly better passer.

 

[Gehrman]

That's not an excuse at all. You could say he's loyal to the money since he's renewed 10 times. If he cared much for the club, he'd refuse a raise in order to relieve the club of such burden so they could get quality players faster, that's one of the things a LOYAL player and someone who LOVES the club would do.
Being an academy graduate is a dumb excuse

It's ridicoulous notion. It would be like Giggs and Scholes joining Liverpool after 1999 because they were historically greater. In 2009 they were treble winners and played us off the park and did the same in 2011. In the Pep period they were destryoing Real Madrid as well. Figo was crucified for joing Real by the Barca fans and so was Michael Laudrup who joined them because he fell out with Cryuff and felt the barca squad at the time were at the end of their cycle.

Messi is a La Mazia product and by the time he started peaking so did Barcalona and he's been their key player in their most succesfull ever period. La Mazia products like Iniestea, Xavi and Iniesta would never join Real Madrid unless Barcalona was shit and they would be paid a hell of a lot more money and that's not the case.

And the thing about Messi playing for free or lowering his wage. Messi is regarded as the best player of all time, he has propelled the club into another stratosphere because football fans watch Barca just to watch the greatest player ever. they are mega rich and of course he wants to be paid what he feels he is worth.

I don't feel moving to Bayern, United or juventus makes any sense for Messi. Perhaps when his legs go and he's not good enough anymore he might to collect his last pay cheque in China, the MLS or PSG.

 

[Gehrman]

You could say the same for United in 2008/2009, but Ronaldo made a stepdown at the time to go to a struggling Madrid.
There's no excuse for Messi not leaving at anytime, the fact is he simply wouldn't or couldn't leave Barca

Real Madrid were going full galactico when they bought Ronaldo and he knew this. That's why bought Kaka and Benzema the same summer. At the time it was crazy money. He went to the club, that was traditionally been the only step from from United in the Fergie Era.

 

[MrEleson]

Real Madrid were going full galactico when they bought Ronaldo and he knew this. That's why bought Kaka and Benzema the same summer. At the time it was crazy money. He went to the club, that was traditionally been the only step from from United in the Fergie Era.

Not really. Ronaldo had flirted with Madrid for years before his eventual departure. He always had his eyes set on the Bernebeau no matter what even though him and his team were top dog in England. He was supposed to move in 2008 but Alex Ferguson asked him to play for another year before allowing him to leave.

I don’t think their transfer activity had any play in his transfer at all. It was just a coincidence that they spent Mega big in the summer he did move as florentino had just been appointed and was making a statement with the signings of Kaka and Benzema.

 

[Gehrman]

Not really. Ronaldo had flirted with Madrid for years before his eventual departure. He always had his eyes set on the Bernebeau no matter what even though him and his team were top dog in England. He was supposed to move in 2008 but Alex Ferguson asked him to play for another year before allowing him to leave.

I don’t think their transfer activity had any play in his transfer at all. It was just a coincidence that they spent Mega big in the summer he did move as florentino had just been appointed and was making a statement with the signings of Kaka and Benzema.

Still he knew he was going to have a great team built around him. It's not like Maradonna winning the Seria with Napoli.

 

[Swoobs]

Messi is great in passing, playmaking, dribbling and goalscoring. But to call him best of all time in everything is quite abit too farfetched.

Passing 9.5/10 - he is maybe one of the best passer in the final third, but there are plenty of great passer in the past who I think are better, or at least more all rounded (short pass, long pass, weighted pass, crossing, through balls, one touch pass, skilled pass, movement pass, pin-point pass, controlling the pace passing etc)

Playmaking 9.5/10 - again he is a great playmaker, but best of all time? I don’t think so, not even in his country. Personally I rate Maradona and Riquelme (at his peak) better playmaker than Messi from Argentina. Yes Messi has a lot of assist, but so does Ronaldo.

Dribbling 10/10 - yes he is probably the best of all time, or at least on par with Maradona and George Best in dribbling.

Goalscoring 10/10 - yes alongside with Ronaldo, he is up there among the best of all time tier.

Now let’s also look at Ronaldo:

Goalscoring 10/10 - 700+ career goals, 99+ international goals, 127+ CL goals, I am sure he is going to break all types of major goalscoring records by the time he retired.

Heading/Ariel threat 10/10 - Can’t think of any players better than him in scoring header goals. Maybe Bierhoff?

Determination/mentality 10/10 - By far the most determined/committed footballer I’ve seen. It’s nothing to do with technical/physical, it’s purely the mental aspect of his game, which is 2nd to none.

Dribbling 9/10 - not the same league as Messi obviously, but he is still ranked among top 5 dribbler since OPTA data begin in 2006. So, he is officially top 5 dribbler in the world over past decade. Although it’s true his dribbling has regressed a lot over his later years, which makes him look worse.

Passing 8.5/10 - he is actually a very good crosser, back in his early Man Utd years his main role is to dribble, cross and to create goals from wing. He also has 219 assists over his career (only behind Messi) and has all time most assists in CL too. But overall Messi is clearly better passer.

This trick again...heading being a subset of goal scoring should be just under 1 category, or should we start talking about messi’s center of balance and ball control as well since you love to “multiply” a general skillset.

Also dribbling? Come on now...if Ronaldo has been dribbling for a decade at his “last season at United/first season at Real Madrid” level, then yes he is a 9. But if we look holistically for more than a decade, no he he is never a 9.

 

[Swoobs]

On another note, up to today I still do not understand why people thinks ronaldo going to juventus is somehow a challenge. It is like going to the only horses in other 1 horse leagues (PSG/Bayern).

If anything, I felt that he was running away from challenging the la liga, taking the easy way out if you may.

 

[MrEleson]

Still he knew he was going to have a great team built around him. It's not like Maradonna winning the Seria with Napoli.

The team was equally built around him at United and he was on top. Madrid had just had their worst season in recent history when he signed for them, having been thumped by Barca at the bernebeau and demolished by Liverpool in the CL. There certainly weren’t any guarantees when he moved.

Also, when he initially joined Madrid, he was treated like just another superstar among the others - he didn’t start or finish every game nor did he take all the set-pieces (even though he arrived as the reigning Ballon D’or holder). Nothing like how he walked into Juve being #1. The team eventually building itself around him was by merit.

 

[Utd7]

Ronaldo is the GOAT, however Messi is the most naturally gifted. He's still top 5 but not as well decorated as Ronnie who has played for the 3 biggest clubs in the 3 biggest leagues and has attained success in each place plus the National team