It's actually interesting that the only example you can come up with was over a decade ago.
Of all those supposed quotes you go with the unbiased Ronaldinho?
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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It's actually interesting that the only example you can come up with was over a decade ago.
Of all those supposed quotes you go with the unbiased Ronaldinho?
What are you talking about, that wasn’t Ronaldinho. Did you just make that up?
So who was it? The only quote I found that’s similar came from Ronaldinho.What are you talking about, that wasn’t Ronaldinho. Did you just make that up?
Now you’re comparing group stage and whatever to an international final?
I never said Ronaldo never missed penalties, just that Messi sabotaged Argentina in the FINAL
I never said Ronaldo never missed penalties, just that Messi sabotaged Argentina in the FINAL
Now you’re comparing group stage and whatever to an international final?
I never said Ronaldo never missed penalties, just that Messi sabotaged Argentina in the FINAL
Are you seriously positing that a single penalty affects who you think is better?
You realize any given penalty has about 25% chance of missing, right? So if the RNG happened to be against him that one time, that somehow diminishes how good he’s been for over a decade now?
Beckham missed quite a few important penalties. That doesn’t affect his qualities as a player.
Ta. So Cruyff one and which "obvious" three?
Now you’re comparing group stage and whatever to an international final?
I never said Ronaldo never missed penalties, just that Messi sabotaged Argentina in the FINAL
Is this what you're reduced to nowadays? Who missed what penalty and when? You're getting more and more desperate.
What illuminating argument will you have next, the world awaits.
It was you lot who implied an INJURY to Ronaldo in the Euro final affects how you rate him as a player
I was merely pointing out that, even getting injured is a better performance than the sabotaging that Messi did against Chile.
I have made my case and stand by it. It’s you lot who felt the need to distract from the fact that Ronaldo won the inaugural Euro Nations League and Messi is looking less than clever in another Copa.Is this what you're reduced to nowadays? Who missed what penalty and when? You're getting more and more desperate.
What illuminating argument will you have next, the world awaits.
I have made my case and stand by it. It’s you lot who felt the need to distract from the fact that Ronaldo won the inaugural Euro Nations League and Messi is looking less than clever in another Copa.
”Won”
Portugal got to the semis without him and he didn’t score or assist in the final. But bagging a few against Switzerland’s joke of a back 3 with the mighty Akanji, Schär and Rodriguez is all it takes to make you lot swoon.
That defense is a comedy. Much, much worse than Arsenal’s.
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Maradona missed four pens in a row, that makes Ronaldo better than him? Sure not
They are both fantastic players.
In terms of who the better footballer is, it is clearly Messi for me. In terms of greateness, Cristinao Ronaldo is arguably greater at this moment and his narrative will most likely be superior by the end of both their careers, especially if Lionel Messi dissapoints once again with Argentina.
Greateness is very subjective and is mostly decided by the narrative usually driven by the 'media'. Players legacies are often exaggeratted to mythical proportions in order to drive a narrative.
Pele's 3 world cups are actually two and he was only given 3 world cups very recently as he was injured for the bulk of the 1962 World Cup and did not get a medal. His 1962 World Cup medal is retrospective.
Diego Maradona's myth about 'carrying' a poor Argenitna side is exactly that, a myth. His Argentina side was a very good team that was functional and had the right parts that complemented his strengths. His Napoli side had great playyers and I recall one Silvio Berlusconi complaining about Napoli's spending at the time.
What baffles me is that people seem to forget the player Cristiano Ronaldo was at Manchester United and his early years at Real Madrid. He was already one of the all time greats back then.
At this moment in time, rightly or wrongly, Cristiano Ronaldo's narrative is that he led Portugal to 2 International trophies, won the champions league single handedly for Real Madrid 4 times (5 in total), has won the league in 3 different countries and is the greatest goal scorer of all time. He is also seen as a leader.
Messi's at this moment in time is that he is only good when playing in Barcelona, he folds under pressure and is weak mentally, despite having alien like abilities.
Their narratives have been carefully crafted by the media, one 'born' with natural talent while the other had to 'work hard'. Both nonsense obviously.
As for me personally, Messi is the superior player but he needs a specific environment and certain players surrounding him to maximise his effectiveness.
Cristiano Ronaldo's highest level does not approach Lionel Messi's but in almost any situation, he can still be effective. He can touch the ball 3 times and win the game for his team.
If I was building a team that had the best players I would pick Messi as he would create a synergy with them.
If I had a team that was more 'ordinary', I would pick Cristiano Ronaldo. If you put him in any side, he will deliver because of his attributes. Be it crossing into the box for 90 minutes, or playing through balls, he can win you games with simple actions. That versatility is priceless.
In terms of who the better footballer is, it is clearly Messi for me. In terms of greateness, Cristinao Ronaldo is arguably greater at this moment and his narrative will most likely be superior by the end of both their careers, especially if Lionel Messi dissapoints once again with Argentina.
Greateness is very subjective and is mostly decided by the narrative usually driven by the 'media'. Players legacies are often exaggeratted to mythical proportions in order to drive a narrative.
Pele's 3 world cups are actually two and he was only given 3 world cups very recently as he was injured for the bulk of the 1962 World Cup and did not get a medal. His 1962 World Cup medal is retrospective.
Diego Maradona's myth about 'carrying' a poor Argenitna side is exactly that, a myth. His Argentina side was a very good team that was functional and had the right parts that complemented his strengths. His Napoli side had great playyers and I recall one Silvio Berlusconi complaining about Napoli's spending at the time.
What baffles me is that people seem to forget the player Cristiano Ronaldo was at Manchester United and his early years at Real Madrid. He was already one of the all time greats back then.
At this moment in time, rightly or wrongly, Cristiano Ronaldo's narrative is that he led Portugal to 2 International trophies, won the champions league single handedly for Real Madrid 4 times (5 in total), has won the league in 3 different countries and is the greatest goal scorer of all time. He is also seen as a leader.
Messi's at this moment in time is that he is only good when playing in Barcelona, he folds under pressure and is weak mentally, despite having alien like abilities.
Their narratives have been carefully crafted by the media, one 'born' with natural talent while the other had to 'work hard'. Both nonsense obviously.
As for me personally, Messi is the superior player but he needs a specific environment and certain players surrounding him to maximise his effectiveness.
Cristiano Ronaldo's highest level does not approach Lionel Messi's but in almost any situation, he can still be effective. He can touch the ball 3 times and win the game for his team.
If I was building a team that had the best players I would pick Messi as he would create a synergy with them.
If I had a team that was more 'ordinary', I would pick Cristiano Ronaldo. If you put him in any side, he will deliver because of his attributes. Be it crossing into the box for 90 minutes, or playing through balls, he can win you games with simple actions. That versatility is priceless.
Reported for making sense. It’s not what they’re about in here!
A thought through and balanced post.
Pfffft. Be off with you!
(You also realise you'll be praised and attacked by both camps now?)
Well well well, what do we have here? The best and more rational approach here by an Ajax fan who entirely dismisses the simplistic views by some more extreme Ronaldo fans who seem to think he is prejudiced by a certain view of type of football. On another point it introduces some rationality to some extreme views by some Barcelona/ Guardiola type of football analysis who refuse to accept other type of football views.
I would close this thread with this post, but how would the psychotic bunch of Messi/Ronaldo lovers survive in a world where rational views and tolerance to other types of football views are acceptable.
No way, just prepare to the Justin Bieber extremists type of fans come flying here to throw insults at your arguments @totaalvoetbal .
are you his spokesman?
The joke of Switzerland who topped Belgium? That same one?”Won”
Portugal got to the semis without him and he didn’t score or assist in the final. But bagging a few against Switzerland’s joke of a back 3 with the mighty Akanji, Schär and Rodriguez is all it takes to make you lot swoon.
That defense is a comedy. Much, much worse than Arsenal’s.
How about losing to mighty Colombia?
Ronaldo is better than him regardless of penalties
So greatness is based on narratives, some of which may be bullshit or media-driven? Awesome, makes the title irrelevant.
Well done! Most honest and best post i've seen in here
Yes in your particular little world Cristiano is better than Maradona.
Not sure ive seen anyone say that Cristiano single handedly won Real 4 CLs. He may have played a major part, but honestly how many would Real have won if it wasnt for Ramos for example? He had extremely good team mates who also played a part.
Not sure i agree on the narrative in general. If that was true, Cristiano would currently be considered the greater player. He's not. Leo is currently seen as the greater of the two by most people. And the 2 international trophies? You really think people will bring up the Nations Cup, he only played a measly 2 games. Euro2016 was the big one.
Agree with most of the rest.
I would put him at 4th, being completely honest. But again, thats a way more interesting debate than Messi vs CR7 thats for sure. Anyone from Cruyff/Di Stefano/Beckenbauer IMO will give CR7 a huge fight, and as good as R9 was at his prime he just didnt perform at that level long enough for him to be in that position.
Great post until this part. Only people that think that are the kind of people that the only football they watch is the clips they come across on their facebook newsfeed. Actual football fans have watched them play over a decade and have watched both of them succeed and fail multiple times.
Also, if it was all about "narrative", Muller would be the undisputed GOAT by now. Won everything and was basically twice as a "clutch" player than anybody else in the history of the game, yet i doubt you will struggle to find anyone calling him a top 20 or even a top 30 player ever.
Nope, I just think that it’s obvious.are you his spokesman?
Messi, Maradona, Pele are the big 3.
Isn’t so obvious though, I’d put both Messi and CR7 in top 3, they’ve had far better conditions than Maradona, let alone Pele, but they’ve also had the more impressive careers, that is basically a fact, inhuman consistency, what else can we really judge them on?Nope, I just think that it’s obvious.
Messi, Maradona, Pele are the big 3.
Pele dribbling past a bunch of league 2 level defenders from the 60s on some youtube compilation?
I really can’t see how you can compare players from the 60s and the 70s with modern day players playing modern day football...(?)
those bunch of league 2 defenders were also some of the greatest CB ever like Moore, Beckenbauer, and Figueroa.
Well there are many people who consider Ronaldo having a "greater career" anyway. The term and narratives of "greatest player" has too many interpretations, it really depends how you prefer to define this term. I always think history will says Ronaldo is greater (because his achievement is more impressive, their club career are more or less equal at GOAT level, with Ronaldo having an edge for the international and more proven everywhere), but if you add all these "genius at football" factors, then its all up for debate.
You Messi fans really live in some kind of fantasy world where Messi is some sort of deity, where you seem to have happily invited Messi to the GOAT debate between Pele and Maradona that has been going on for decades while plenty of great players have come and gone, based on sweet feckall as usual. Please tell me why this 'Big 3' doesn't include the likes of Cruyff, Di Stefano, Beckenbauer and a few others - you know - players who symbolise generations of football and have unquestionable stature in the game?Nope, I just think that it’s obvious.
Messi, Maradona, Pele are the big 3.
Cruyff reached the ceiling of individual brilliance as an attacker - all time great scorer, dribbler, creator and an absolute genius on the pitch with searing pace, acceleration and did all that at a time when players would tear his shirts and kick him to bits whenever they wanted, while also being the absolute central figure in possibly the most groundbreaking team the game has ever seen under the finest tactician in Rinus Michels, and Cruyff embodied the spirit of total football through that entire time. Not only that, he carried forward that philosophy to two of the greatest academies that exist to this day, and which Messi himself is a product of, among being an influence for countless other players. But Messi makes the 'Big 3'.
Not sure the entire cult you guys are a part of realises just how deluded and self indulged you guys are, practically covering your eyes to everything that doesn't suit your agenda. As I've always said, one of the most pathetic group of fans.
I applaud this very much. First time I’ve seen it used like this.
You Messi fans really live in some kind of fantasy world where Messi is some sort of deity, where you seem to have happily invited Messi to the GOAT debate between Pele and Maradona that has been going on for decades while plenty of great players have come and gone, based on sweet feckall as usual. Please tell me why this 'Big 3' doesn't include the likes of Cruyff, Di Stefano, Beckenbauer and a few others - you know - players who symbolise generations of football and have unquestionable stature in the game?
Cruyff reached the ceiling of individual brilliance as an attacker - all time great scorer, dribbler, creator and an absolute genius on the pitch with searing pace, acceleration and did all that at a time when players would tear his shirts and kick him to bits whenever they wanted, while also being the absolute central figure in possibly the most groundbreaking team the game has ever seen under the finest tactician in Rinus Michels, and Cruyff embodied the spirit of total football through that entire time. Not only that, he carried forward that philosophy to two of the greatest academies that exist to this day, and which Messi himself is a product of, among being an influence for countless other players. But Messi makes the 'Big 3'.
Not sure the entire cult you guys are a part of realises just how deluded and self indulged you guys are, practically covering your eyes to everything that doesn't suit your agenda. As I've always said, one of the most pathetic group of fans.
The irony in this post is strong. You ask why the Messi cultists dont include Beckenbauer and Di Stefano on the same plateau? Well guess what, neither do the Cristiano fans. Are they cultists also because they too don't rate those 2 players as highly? Didnt Cal say he had both Cristiano and Leo in his top 3? Is he a cultist?
Your general post smacks of delusion. You think its Messi fans that have elevated Leo to GOAT status? Have you been living under a rock the last 5 to 10 years? Leo has been elevated by the likes of Capello. Wenger has called him the GOAT, so have the likes of Steven Gerrard , Rooney, and John Terry. Simeone hinself said he is better than Diego. There are many others. So your conclusion is that all these guys are self indulgent Messi cultists. What motivation do Capello and Arsene have to say what they say?
It pains you, and the Cristiano fans on this board but the reality is that Leo is considered as the Greatest by many neutrals, not Cristiano. You live in cloud cookoo land if you cant see this.
Jose Mourinho: "For me the top three players in history are Messi, Pele and Maradona."
Adriano Galliani (ex AC Milan CEO): “Messi is the best player ever. And this is said by someone who has seen Maradona and Pele play."
Ronald Koeman: “Messi? He’s the best player of all time. The talk is of Pele, Cruyff, Messi, Maradona…no one has been as decisive as Messi. For the goals he’s scored, how he scored them. He’s the greatest player of all time.”
"Who is the Best Player in the World?” Arsene Wenger: “Lionel Messi” “Who is the Best Player Ever?” Arsene Wenger: “Lionel Messi."
Jürgen Klopp: "Messi is the best. There must be life out there somewhere, on some other planet. Because he is too good and we are just too bad for him."
Marco van Basten: ”There is no doubt about it, Messi's clearly the best player in the world.”
Julen Lopetegui: “For me Leo Messi is the best in history.”
Unai Emery at ‘The Best’ ceremony: “We all know that Messi is the best and is every year but also it is good that there are other players to be able to divide the cake.”
Vicente del Bosque: “Messi is the best in history”.
Fabio Capello: “In my entire life I’ve never seen a player of such quality.”
Raul: “I was lucky enough to play with Zidane, Ronaldo, Figo, Cristiano... but Messi is different; he makes everything look so easy, so effortless – even the impossible.”
Sergio Ramos: “I respect Maradona, I think he’s great and a superstar but all of Argentina know that he’s light years behind the best Argentine, which for me, is Lionel Messi”
Paul Scholes: “I think about the great players with whom I have shared a pitch: Eric Cantona, Zinedine Zidane, Pirlo, Xavi, Cristiano Ronaldo – and the greatest of them all is Messi."
“Ronaldo vs Messi: who’s better?” Rooney: “Messi” “Oooh that was quick. And you played with Ronaldo too” Rooney: “Yeah I think, I’ve said this before but they’re both probably the best two players ever to play the game and I just think Messi is in my eyes the greatest ever”
David Beckham: "While Cristiano Ronaldo and Lionel Messi are both better than the rest, Ronaldo does not reach the level of Messi."
Roy Keane: "I was a big fan of Maradona growing up and of the current crop Ronaldo is good but Messi is the best I’ve ever seen. I don’t dish out praise lightly but Messi deserves it. I look for weaknesses in his game and I can’t find them."
Ruud van Nistelrooy: “Messi, he’s one of a kind. I think he’s arguably the best player in history we’ve ever had”.
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Mourinho? The one who called Ronaldo the best ever before they fell out and said Messi just to piss Cristiano off?
The one who still praises Ronaldo but saw Messi destroy his teams time and time again
Can we have some dates on those quotes or something. I would like to see when they were said/written
Would be shocked if even more than two of those changed their mind
The Roy Keane one is definitely out of date, his latest opinion is Ronaldo is better. Furthermore, I would also like to see the sources of those quotes, I wouldn't put it past Messi extremists to make things up either .
I understand that you could be shocked but i would still like some dates. Everyone knows how these two players careers path went so i think is meaningfull to have dates
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