Eh not really IMO. He was very good in that game even if he didn't score.
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
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I may always argue that Messi is better than C.Ronaldo but he isn’t better by a great distance. In the top 5 greatest of all time list I would put them pretty close
1. Pele
2. Maradona
3. Messi
4. C.Ronaldo
5. Cruyff/Beckenbauer
1. Pele
2. Maradona
3. Messi
4. C.Ronaldo
5. Cruyff/Beckenbauer
Thread needs a poll @Damien 
Discussing how good Ronaldo would be if he had only scored half his goals, is like discussing how good Bolt would be if he ran 100 m in 20 seconds.
This is my list too.
Objectively speaking Ronaldo can't be lower than top 4. But for those who dislike his style I've heard they would rate him outside top 10 or 20, which is shockingly biased IMO. I mean, if just look at everything objectively - his whole career, goals, impact, records, individual awards, trophies and success, there's hardly more than 2 or 3 players ever in the game who could claim to be above him.
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Nice try, but A Ronaldo goal record of 1 in 2 would still be enough to consider him elite and a 20 second 100m time is attainable by 8 year olds
No, it would be akin to discussing who is the better runner out of two runners with equal 100m times, then saying ok, if they both ran it in double the time, then who would be the better runner and subsequently coming to the conclusion that Messi wins as he can not only run fast, but also dodge obstacles, handle variations of running surface etc.
I know, he was very good against Chelsea in the 08-09 and 11-12 games too and in the second leg against inter in 09-10 but people need to find something to criticize right ?
If both Messi and Ronaldo score half less of their goals over their career, then they would probably be rated as highly as Neymar and Suarez (at most), and probably won't be mentioned as GOAT.
People have their own opinions which is fair enough but to have Ronaldo outside top 10 is ludicrous.
Pele Maradona Messi Cruyff Beckenbauer Best Eusebio Di Stefano Puskas Charlton. They are probably the only players that could be argued to be above him, but his goals record, individual record, Euro and CL record put him above half of them.
To me, Ronaldo is the better goal scorer and to many others Messi is so of course it is worth discussing. Goal scoring is the most important thing here and my opinion on who becomes the better player is who is better at goal scoring, who turns up more often at the big stage and who was that special mentality of a winner more so than the other.
Ronaldo is simply not a playmaker. It has never been his role. His body structure itself is not that of a playmaker. Yes Messi does blow Ronaldo out of the park with that but so does Pirlo, so does Scholes.
I agree that in this debate, the ability to create chances for your teams/playmaking Messi wins (for me anyway) but then is that even Ronaldo's role?
How about mental strengths I mentioned. I think Ronaldo is the superior mental player by far and to me personally that counts a lot towards greatest of all time ranking. Messi is weak at that. People call Ronaldo penaldo but penaldo would have scored that penalty in Copa America and that sort of stuff makes a huge difference for me.
My point is I am not discounting that skill to that point but I do believe Ronaldo has similar skills that blows Messi out of the water. It all comes down to skills you rate more.
This is my list (and I am excluding players I have not seen. Notably, Maradona and those before him.
Post 2000's:
1. C. Ronaldo
2. Messi
3. Zidane
4. Ronaldinho
5. Ronaldo bald
Post 2000's:
1. C. Ronaldo
2. Messi
3. Zidane
4. Ronaldinho
5. Ronaldo bald
The same Penaldo that missed penalty 2012 v Bayern. in 2008 CL semi's and also the final in the shoot-out itself. Euro 2016 v Austria.
He isn't as clutch as people are making out.
Congratulations on immediately contradicting yourself. Worse than people who say “I’m speechless”
That's years ago. He was still a kid back in 2008. Besides, in 2012 he still hadn't completed his transformation to the player. In 2012 Messi was still crushing him as the best player and everyone thought he was done/finished. I'm proving my point here again. He wasn't as clutch and it cost him wit not being the best which is why mental strength is so important.
He is definitely as clutch as people are making him out to be. You don't win the amount of trophies he has without being one. He is a total big game player. Just look at last year Champions League run.
Look at this season. Even as a fan of Ronaldo I talked about he really does seem like he's on the decline/not a force anymore but he comes out and bangs goals on the biggest stage again.
I think the resurgence of Ronaldo after everyone thought he was done and Messi was running away with Ballon d'ors has gotten into Messi's head. His retirement from international football was a mini meltdown as well. It's just those things that make me think Ronaldo is definitely better than him mentally .
How is he contradicting himself? He said it is ludicrous. If someone thinks Watford is the most talented club in England it is a ludicrous opinion.
(P.S: I'm speechless is also not a contradiction. They aren't giving a speech)
I was on about pens only in comparison to Messi. I don't think difference is that great between them in terms of big stage pens, both are vulnerable IMO. I always think keeper has a chance against either unlike say a Shearer.
He's definitely clutch in general though, legendary player and one of the all time greats - gets written off far too often.
Messi has a left foot that can place the ball to the exact centimeter of where he wants. Does Ronaldo have as much accuracy? If not and they still have the same penalty taking skills (although I think Ronaldo is better at it) that itself is proof Ronaldo is mentally stronger than Messi.
Messi
Ronaldo
The rest
Ronaldo
The rest
Seriously? The number of vital penalties that Messi has missed is shocking given how clinical he can be with a moving ball.
My point is, you can’t remove the goals as it was not important for a forward or for the team. Yes, Messi can change a game with his smartness, but remember how important Ronaldos goals were in the CL final games last year. Two hattricks in 14 days and two goals in the final. That is impact through goal scoring. Messi has also had similar impact in important games.
RIDDLE - PLEASE FIND THE SOLUTION AND PROVIDE A PROOF
In terms of statistics, I can see only one winner and his name is comprised of 4 characters. Legend.
In terms of statistics, I can see only one winner and his name is comprised of 4 characters. Legend.
When?
Yet when they play against each other or against big teams in general Messi's level of performance is generally higher than Ronaldo's even say in 2008, when young Messi was in a very dysfunctional side and United were in the midst of arguably the best or second best side Fergie has ever produced. To say Ronaldo is mentally stronger for me just based on his superior penalty prowess, which is marginally better IMO when taking into account big match situations (he doesn't have a faultless record on the big stage by any means - see my post above) - comes across as biased to me.
Ronaldo is more driven, I agree but overall a more clutch player? not IMO.
It's not just his penalties that I am basing it on though. That's just one of the side effects of being mentally stronger. I think he has better mentality because of how he an struggle in games yet still pop up with goals or be in bad form but show up at the big stage when it matters most. Just in the way he plays and the way he has always come back from being written off.
Now that's not to say Messi is some baby with a fragile mind. Being arguably one of the GOAT, no doubt Messi is a big game player and incredibly talented mentally as well (one of the best). Ronaldo however is better at it. As better as Messi is than Ronaldo when it comes to dribbling.
Ronaldo has better hair and a sillier statue. Messi is better at football. That's 2-1 to Ronaldo.
You're clutching at straws if you use an intangible variable as "mentality" to definitively rank 2 players.
That's the only real thing he has going for him in this race though.
I think most people will agree Messi is far more naturally gifted. Ronaldo's mentality is what keeps him in the discussion at all. In that regard Ronaldo's accomplishments might be deserving of even more respect, because he has less to work with talent wise.
Honestly saying Ronaldo is a better football player though, meh, I just can't fathom anyone honestly, really, hand on the bible, believing that. It's simply not true. You don't need any stats for it.
How is it an intangible? It's the exact reason he has a huge international trophy and is crushing it in the champions league. This argument goes in loops since some are unwilling to accept skills Ronaldo is better at.
Because our definitions of better footballer vary. To me the "better footballer" and "greatest footballer" are all different as well. Adel Taraabt is a better dribbler and goal scorer than Micheal Carrick so who is the greater footballer? Just trying to give an extreme example before anyone goes "So Messi is Taraabt now".
Messi is better at crying when he bottles it and having mini meltdowns quiting footy. 3-2 Messi
Evidence just doesn't stack up in such a way to suggest that Ronaldo is any more of a "big game player" than Messi. Messi has played to his full potential on the biggest of stages with just as much consistency as Ronaldo has.
Thing is. Messi is a better dribbler, play maker, passer, is technically better and has more vision. Whereas Ronaldo has a slightly better goal scoring record.
The only way you can say Ronaldo is better at football is if your definition of a greatness is scoring goals and even then, he's only slightly better.
Also for the non serious 2-1 thing, Messi is better at crying? Really? You can fill the entire internet with pictures of Ronaldo crying
It just means Ronaldo is a better penalty taker. Finishing from open play is a different skill to being able to score a penalty. That's why you sometimes get seemingly odd players on penalty duty (right backs, holding mids) and top class strikers who aren't very good at them.
See the reason why some see Messi as the greater player than Cristiano is because he is equally good in goal scoring department, while being better in other departments like
Thing is. Messi is a better dribbler, play maker, passer, is technically better and has more vision. Whereas Ronaldo has a slightly better goal scoring record.
The only way you can say Ronaldo is better at football is if your definition of a greatness is scoring goals and even then, he's only slightly better.
Also for the non serious 2-1 thing, Messi is better at crying? Really? You can fill the entire internet with pictures of Ronaldo crying
When you compare a playmaker to a forward and use all of the playmaking skills required to compare them then you're going to make it seem he is better in every department of course. Ronaldo has better heading, more strength, better long shots, better finishing, better goal scoring (the biggest deal for me), better leadership (can raise a whole team) and better mentality (the so called 'intangible' which has resulted in him winning Ballon'dor after Balln'dor and trophy after trophy in recent times)
And back to the non serious: crying after losing vs crying after bottling trophies and having mini melt downs is another thing
I accept this opinion. Who knows maybe I am biased and Messi is the better goalscorer which would make him the greatest. To me, I don't accept the idea that it is no contest just because Messi is a better playmaker.
I have no problem on people rating few more others above Ronaldo in terms of who is the better player (For example I do think Messi is better player than Ronaldo). But in terms of greatness (which is more down to individual impact on the game, overall achievements and success) there's only very very few above him. I'd even argue Messi is at best only equal to Ronaldo in terms of greatness.
1. He’s contradicting himself by saying it’s fair people have an opinion, then calling it ludicrous that someone wouldn’t include him in a top 10 of all time list. I think there’s a fair argument for a lot of players being ahead of Ronaldo in that list, at least debatable conversation, whereas there is zero debate with regards your example. Let it be known that you are categorically wrong in what you said here.
2. The word speechless means unable to speak. You are categorically wrong in what you said here.
I think neither Messi nor Ronaldo are leaders to be honest. For the other points, well we will never agree, and I respect that. It’s not like this thread is meant for agreeing on stuff anywayWhen you compare a playmaker to a forward and use all of the playmaking skills required to compare them then you're going to make it seem he is better in every department of course. Ronaldo has better heading, more strength, better long shots, better finishing, better goal scoring (the biggest deal for me), better leadership (can raise a whole team) and better mentality (the so called 'intangible' which has resulted in him winning Ballon'dor after Balln'dor and trophy after trophy in recent times)
And back to the non serious: crying after losing vs crying after bottling trophies and having mini melt downs is another thing
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