Mats Hummels

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Invictus said:
They don't want Kagawa.

Hans-Joachim Watzke : We have worked with Marco Reus as a number 10 which…everyone is talking about. And we have Henrikh Mkhitaryan who can also play there. Would then a third number 10 still make sense?”

Hummels could move, there's always a minor chance. But only if he desperately wants to (Klopp is a nice guy and probably won't block the transfer) and for David Luiz type money.
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If BVB doesnt want Kagawa I cannot understand how some posters here think we can get him for under £35-40m
Having said that, we have the money and he is worth it.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
You can read into it whatever you want.

You're obviously keen to interpret it as having no relevance regarding whether or not Manchester United is a football club he might eventually want to play for.

My interpretation would be somewhat different.
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I'm not interpreting it at all, since no one knows the circumstances of that event and how relevant it is today.
That is kinda my point
 
ravi2 said:
This is our most improbable transfer, the only deal I can think of that may pique' their interest is something along the lines of £40m + Kagawa.
Its either a smokescreen for the real CB target or LVG knows something we do not.... there has been nothing remotely substantial from either side.
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I said that from the beginning. Hummels is the most unrealistic of them all he'd be fantastic but Dortmund won't let another important player leave.
 
ravi2 said:
If BVB doesnt want Kagawa I cannot understand how some posters here think we can get him for under £35-40m
Having said that, we have the money and he is worth it.
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Yeah man he'll probably cost atleast 40m +. Hummels just too valuable for Dortmund as a player of the highest quality, an exemplary leader and seemingly good character to have around.

Also there haven't been any public statements or quotes to suggest that Hummels wants to move. He seems content with being the big fish in a relatively smaller Dortmund pond than a medium sized one at an elite club.

That said maybe there's something going on covertly behind the scenes so the possibility cannot be dismissed. But as you pointed out it certainly won't happens for the 30 million odd being mentioned. Especially when the market has been distorted by Luiz to PSG.
 
Invictus said:
Yeah man he'll probably cost atleast 40m +. Hummels just too valuable for Dortmund as a player of the highest quality, an exemplary leader and seemingly good character to have around.

Also there haven't been any public statements or quotes to suggest that Hummels wants to move. He seems content at being the big fish in a relatively smaller Dortmund pond than a medium sized one at an elite club.

That said maybe there's something going on covertly behind the scenes so the possibility cannot be dismissed. But as you pointed out it certainly won't happens for the 30 million odd being mentioned. Especially when the market has been distorted by Luiz to PSG.
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Whilst I don't believe we'll get Hummels this summer.

I find all the talk about prices a bit silly. Usually when a price is mentioned is likely to be around about the mark. Do you remember how we all laughed at the Fab bids we made last summer, now look how much Chelsea paid.

The Luiz transfer changes nothing, certain clubs know what the real market value of a player is, and they tend to stick to it.

Having said that I don't believe Hummels is for sale this summer.
 
Cassidy said:
Whilst I don't believe we'll get Hummels this summer.

I find all the talk about prices a bit silly. Usually when a price is mentioned is likely to be around about the mark. Do you remember how we all laughed at the Fab bids we made last summer, now look how much Chelsea paid.

The Luiz transfer changes nothing, certain clubs know what the real market value of a player is, and they tend to stick to it.

Having said that I don't believe Hummels is for sale this summer.
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Fair enough mate. But we have to consider that Fabregas was almost run outta town by the Catalan media, the Barcelona supporters and their management. This was a player surplus to his club's needs and despite being from Catalunya never matched their style of play. They needed to sell Cesc and even Sanchez to fund a summer spending spree in the wake of a potential transfer embargo.

Hummels in comparison is integral to Klopp's project at Dortmund. They don't have a need to sell to balance the books and if they do the player will be overvalued. I agree with the sense that the Luiz transfer might not affect the market but consider a base 30 million for a world class defender like Hummels. Then add 5 million World Cup bonus. Then add atleast 5 million because of Dortmund's reluctance to sell that might inflate the deal. Maybe add another 5 million on top because other clubs will be interested too and we may have to outbid them. Possibly a hike in wages due to lack of European football. And around 45 million + massive wages seems very realistic.

Purely hypothetical of course but still a plausible turn of events if Woodward/ Van Gaal are hell bent on signing him.
 
There's a lack of quality centre backs out there at the minute. Dortmund could justifiably ask for 40m minimum and he doesn't seem keen to push a move through. Shame really as he ticks every box i can think of.
 
NMF said:
I said that from the beginning. Hummels is the most unrealistic of them all he'd be fantastic but Dortmund won't let another important player leave.
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Having said that... if we drop a £50m bid on BVB they will have to seriously consider it... the same goes for Juventus and Vidal... £50m.
 
Invictus said:
Fair enough mate. But we have to consider that Fabregas was almost run outta town by the Catalan media, the Barcelona supporters and their management. This was a player surplus to his club's needs and despite being from Catalunya never matched their style of play. They needed to sell Cesc and even Sanchez to fund a summer spending spree in the wake of a potential transfer embargo.

Hummels in comparison is integral to Klopp's project at Dortmund. They don't have a need to sell to balance the books and if they do the player will be overvalued. I agree with the sense that the Luiz transfer might not affect the market but consider a base 30 million for a world class defender like Hummels. Then add 5 million World Cup bonus. Then add atleast 5 million because of Dortmund's reluctance to sell that might inflate the deal. Maybe add another 5 million on top because other clubs will be interested too and we may have to outbid them. Possibly a hike in wages due to lack of European football. And around 45 million + massive wages seems very realistic.

Purely hypothetical of course but still a plausible turn of events if Woodward/ Van Gaal are hell bent on signing him.
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2 Man Midfield said:
There's a lack of quality centre backs out there at the minute. Dortmund could justifiably ask for 40m minimum and he doesn't seem keen to push a move through. Shame really as he ticks every box i can think of.
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Agreed, I cannot see the bidding for him starting for under £40M... there are heaps of clubs out there with too much money to spend and not that many World Class CB's to go around.... its supply and demand.
 
If I was to take a stab in the dark I'd say that Kagawa+27m would do it.
 
Cassidy said:
Whilst I don't believe we'll get Hummels this summer.

I find all the talk about prices a bit silly. Usually when a price is mentioned is likely to be around about the mark. Do you remember how we all laughed at the Fab bids we made last summer, now look how much Chelsea paid.

The Luiz transfer changes nothing, certain clubs know what the real market value of a player is, and they tend to stick to it.

Having said that I don't believe Hummels is for sale this summer.
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I think it very naive to think that the Luiz transfer changes nothing. It is the market! Look what the Ronaldo fee and subsequently the Bale fee did. Luis Suarez is worth 75m because of those.
 
SolidShite said:
If I was to take a stab in the dark I'd say that Kagawa+27m would do it.
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Don't take a stab in the dark. Pls..

What is Dortmund's motivation for slashing the transfer fee and taking Kagawa - a player they currently have no use for ? They already have Mkhitaryan, Reus, Jojic, Hofmann, Ji that can play in similar positions.
 
50 million for a CB? no CB in the world is worth anything close to that! Thank god some people here don't have any control over our transfer budget!!
 
Yorkeontop said:
I think it very naive to think that the Luiz transfer changes nothing. It is the market! Look what the Ronaldo fee and subsequently the Bale fee did. Luis Suarez is worth 75m because of those.
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Luis Suarez will be sold for between 70-75m EUROs not £££s wait and see.
I'm not saying it doesn't affect the market, you talk about Bale but he went to the same club who bought Ronaldo.

Ill say it again, certain clubs know what the real market value of a player is, and they tend to stick to it.

You can hold RM to ransom when they announce to their fans that they will sign a player even when a deal isn't on the table.
 
Jammydodger7 said:
50 million for a CB? no CB in the world is worth anything close to that! Thank god some people here don't have any control over our transfer budget!!
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Thiago Silva 2 years ago and I think most clubs wouldn't even blink a second, if they'd knew how mad the market would become. It's just that the overall lack of quality CBs makes it hard to justify such a fee.
 
Jammydodger7 said:
50 million for a CB? no CB in the world is worth anything close to that! Thank god some people here don't have any control over our transfer budget!!
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Why not ?

Lilian Thuram cost 30 million in 2001.
Rio Ferdinand cost 32 million in 2002.

Hummels is only 25 and could possibly perform at the highest level for 7-8 seasons. 50 million is a perfectly reasonable price for a player of his quality and age profile.
 
Many consider Thiago Silva the best defender in the world, and he went for 19m to Milan at his peak. The difference is they were hard up, Dortmund don't need to sell.
 
Il Prete Rosso said:
100 million on two players? That would mean you would spend over 160 million on 4 players. That's a lot of money.
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Especially given we've already spent 120 million on 4 players over the last 12 months. I think we will spend around 50-60 million more and even that might need to be offset by selling a few players.
 
Melvyn said:
Dortmund don't need Kagawa.
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Ah right having lost Lewandowski and Reus being injured, Abameyang being the only real current threat on the wings. Then you consider the injury to Gundogan I think they'd be quite interested in an attacking midfielder who can double up as a striker, knows the squad, knows the team, knows what to expect. I know they have strengthened already this summer a winger am I right? I think they'd be very interested especially for nothing plus receiving cash themselves.
 
SolidShite said:
Ah right having lost Lewandowski and Reus being injured, Abameyang being the only real current threat on the wings. Then you consider the injury to Gundogan I think they'd be quite interested in an attacking midfielder who can double up as a striker, knows the squad, knows the team, knows what to expect. I know they have strengthened already this summer a winger am I right? I think they'd be very interested especially for nothing plus receiving cash themselves.
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Yeah because Reus will be injured for the entire season right? Gundogan's injury is irrelevant to Kagawa. Their CEO himself said that they don't need another no.10 because they already have Mkhitaryan. And why the feck would Dortmund buy Kagawa to fill in the striker position? They also won't be getting him 'for nothing' because they need Hummels a lot more than they need Kagawa.
 
Sorry, to add to this didn't Andy Mitten say that the squad will be trimmed and without naming names some players have not performed as they might have been expected to? I'd say Kagawa is maybe on that list.
 
Melvyn said:
Yeah because Reus will be injured for the entire season right? Gundogan's injury is irrelevant to Kagawa. Their CEO himself said that they don't need another no.10 because they already have Mkhitaryan. They also won't be getting him 'for nothing' because they need Hummels a lot more than they need Kagawa.
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considering they will be going toe to toe with Bayern they need all the cheap/free enforcements they need. What happens if Mkhitaryan goes injured? I wouldn't dismiss the idea so freely it would suit both parties.
 
I think Kagawa could thrive here if we had a working midfield and wide players. Our lack of movement and rigid line formations really don't help him.
 
SolidShite said:
considering they will be going toe to toe with Bayern they need all the cheap/free enforcements they need. What happens if Mkhitaryan goes injured? I wouldn't dismiss the idea so freely it would suit both parties.
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And who would they bring in to replace Hummels? It wouldn't suit both parties because they'd be losing one of their most important players for a backup.
 
Cassidy said:
Luis Suarez will be sold for between 70-75m EUROs not £££s wait and see.
I'm not saying it doesn't affect the market, you talk about Bale but he went to the same club who bought Ronaldo.

Ill say it again, certain clubs know what the real market value of a player is, and they tend to stick to it.

You can hold RM to ransom when they announce to their fans that they will sign a player even when a deal isn't on the table.
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Those "certain clubs" eventually get influenced by the likes of RM. With them paying 80m for players it doesnt seem so obscene to ask for 30m or even 50m for players regardless of talent level. Enough of these deals happen and soon it is the norm. Its not like Dortmund are going to say "we are a certain club and we will ignore the goings on of the market to offer you a good deal because you Manchester United are just like us". We aint going back like Fergie thought,the market is set.
 
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Invictus said:
They don't want Kagawa.

Hans-Joachim Watzke : We have worked with Marco Reus as a number 10 which…everyone is talking about. And we have Henrikh Mkhitaryan who can also play there. Would then a third number 10 still make sense?”

Hummels could move, there's always a minor chance. But only if he desperately wants to (Klopp is a nice guy and probably won't block the transfer) and for David Luiz type money.
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They admitted trying to sign him last summer though? I think if he's available they will take him.
 
Hal9000 said:
They admitted trying to sign him last summer though? I think if he's available they will take him.
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Erm just to elaborate on that point :

I believe this is the quote from Zorc you're referring to :

“After the departure of Mario Götze was certain, of course, our first idea was to assess how things stand in the case Shinji Kagawa,” Zorc said.

“Shinji has always said that he would someday return to Dortmund, but after a call, it was clear that neither the player nor Manchester United were interested in an exchange at this time."
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http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...s/kagawa-staying-at-manchester-united-5803103

Gotze moved to Bayern on 23 April 2013. So talks for Kagawa must've taken place between that and date and 9 July - when they signed Mkhitaryan from Shakhtar for 25 million, a record for their club. So essentially they've already secured a first teamer to take up Kagawa/ Gotze's spot and is arguably better than the former.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/23207884

They then also signed Jojic in January - who can play both CM and CAM. Another player that can play in Kagawa's position.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/25985343

Dortmund also signed Ji Dong-Won who can play striker, CAM and wide. Another player that taken up Kagawa's position.

Plus when they tried to sign Kagawa Jonas Hofmann wasn't a regular member of the first team having made just 3 appearances. But now he's made 35 total appearances in the 2013/ 2014 and secured his value in the squad. He also plays CAM and wide.

That's about 4 players that can play where Kagawa usually plays. They also have Aubamyang, Reus and even Sahin who can play CAM if need be. Infact Reus has said he wants to play CAM but Mkhitaryan is first choice. So total 7 players who can all play in Kagawa's CAM role. I don't really see how they'd benefit from re-signing Shinji now.
 
Il Prete Rosso said:
100 million on two players? That would mean you would spend over 160 million on 4 players. That's a lot of money.
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Look at this way... its years of penny pinching coming back to bite us in the ass.
We have to spend and spend big, if we want to keep pace with the likes of City and Chelsea....times have changed.
 
In the end, whether Klopp wants Kagawa or not is what really matters. Of course Dortmund don't want to sell Hummels, but if a move is possible then I would be very surprised if Klopp didn't want to include him in the deal. As mentioned before, Kagawa knows their system and played his best football there. Even if he isn't going to start every game he'd still be an invaluable rotation option.
 
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