Your child?
Martial agent looking for a new club for him
- Thread starter dinostar77
- Start date
Your child?
I hope not. It would mean Haaland to City next season, and we'd be stuck with a potentially injury prone Harry Kane. I'd rather we keep Cavani and Martial this season to rotate as our CF options, and go balls to the walls for Haaland next summer. Let City and Chelsea be stuck with Kane and Lukaku respectively.
Only the favourite..
It's hyperbolic. Martial's first league goal last season was december 17th. His other 2 goals were the 5-0 Leipzig win and the 2-1 Istanbul loss. He'll score less now that he's a squad player and he needed 1000 minutes to make those 3 goals. Would you consider me to be "in la la land" too for thinking Elanga can do better than those numbers as a squad player than Martial, who just recovered from a ruptured knee ligament?
This is what I wrote in response to someone saying we need to keep Martial for depth because Rashford is out for 3 months:
Rashford will be back around November. Oh, the absolute horror of having to play Elanga and putting Hugill on the bench if we run into the unlikely scenario of having 2 injuries in the same position within 3 months. My ass will be so clenched if Elanga gets injured and we have to play Hugill or Bruno up top for 10 minutes!
The point is that it's unlikely we'll have have 3 injuries (Cavani, Greenwood, Elanga) in the same position within 3 months ('till Rashford returns). I don't know how you interpreted this as "bringing Hugill in".
| Matchday | Date | Venue | For | Opponent | Result | Pos. | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Group A | 6/19/21 | A | (6.) | Argentina (4.) | 1:0 | CF | 90' | |
| Group A | 6/21/21 | H | (7.) | Chile (3.) | 1:1 | CF | 90' | |
| Group A | 6/24/21 | A | (9.) | Bolivia (10.) | 0:2 | CF | 1 | 90' |
| Group A | 6/29/21 | H | (9.) | Paraguay (10.) | 1:0 | CF | 1 | 68' |
| Quarter-Finals | 7/4/21 | H | (9.) | Colombia (10.) | 2:4 on pens | CF | 90' |
"can only play once a week", my brown arse.
Right, so you admit you were not telling the truth. At least we're getting somewhere now. Why did you feel the need to be hyperbolic exactly, rather than just tell the truth?
You also seem to be using last season as your only point of reference, which is interesting because the 3 previous seasons, he started like a house on fire. There is an extremely slim chance that Elanga would out perform Martial, but there's absolutely no fecking way anyone at the club is willing to take that chance.
Cavani is injury prone, Greenwood is yet to show anything that convinces me he's ready to be a striker at this level and mentioning Elanga, in my view, is beyond ridiculous.
International tournaments are not gruelling 9 month long seasons though are they? You'll notice that last season, Ole only ever played him once a week. Why do you think that is?
If we are to get rid of Martial, the only way it'll work is if we bring in a good striker to replace him. In this event, I'm completely open to the idea, otherwise, let's keep him until we have a replacement.
You've decided to throw together another long post filled with nothing but absolute nonsense. I'm not sure if it's just a blind hatred towards Martial causing you to do this or if you're just completely underestimating the challenge we're facing this season, but I think you need to have a longer think about the situation.
I couldn't be arsed to look up the stats at the time of writing, because I didn't think someone would be so pedantic to take it literally. If the stats surprise you and you couldn't tell he was shite before winter, you should drink less. If you still think it's a lie read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbole
You drivel on about the length of my posts, but your word count was higher than mine, Dorsey. Take your own advice:
Save yourself time and effort and shorten your shit-filled essays. It's annoying and your wasting everyone's time!
I'd love to stay and chat but I'm afraid I'm out of characters.
I'm glad you've decided to shorten your posts, thanks. If you'd like to engage on a few of the points I've made, I'd be happy to converse but I suspect you don't have anything to add. You have a good one.
It's weird. I was just thinking if It's could shift Martial maybe they could get a player like Wood relatively cheap as a backup striker.
Why do some still think it's realistic that we're even interested in selling him this season?
It makes no sense, whatsoever
It makes no sense, whatsoever
@Revan & @VanDeBank get a room you two.
I think part of people's thinking here (wanting him sold ASAP) has to do with a suspicion that he isn't suitable for a backup role.
If we can trust him to give 100% trying to prove himself at either CF or LW as someone who is - per now - behind several others in those positions (at least according to fan opinion), there's no urgency to move him on: if he actually steps up, everybody's happy. But many have simply started to doubt that he'll ever amount to much - AND that he won't react well to being, essentially, a backup option.
If he'd been an unproven kid, none of the above would worry anyone. But he isn't - he's on a huge contract and should, by normal standards, be the default starter in whatever position is considered his best (he's 25 now and on more money than anyone in our squad except Pogba and DDG according to most sources).
Ironic, considering you couldn't even manage to engage on my tiny little paragraph
You took the words right out of my mouth. What more could I possibly add?
All of what you've said makes sense but it doesn't change the fact that if we sell a striker, we need a new striker.
If we'd sold Martial for 50m and signed someone like Ings for 30m, great. We would have made 20m in transfer fees swapping one player for another who has played more games and scored a better rate in each of the last two PL seasons.
Just selling Martial and not replacing him though? Less keen. If anything the concern is we're a bit short at CF as is given Cavani can't play every week, Greenwood is a kid and Martial is Martial. We don't make it better by reducing ourselves to two thirds of those options.
Just selling Martial and not replacing him though? Less keen. If anything the concern is we're a bit short at CF as is given Cavani can't play every week, Greenwood is a kid and Martial is Martial. We don't make it better by reducing ourselves to two thirds of those options.
It's Raven, he keeps getting tagged when I'm having a discussion, he's probably sick of it at this stage.
I addressed your points, hence my essay. I also asked you a number of questions, which, so far, you've failed to answer.Ironic, considering you couldn't even manage to engage on my tiny little paragraph
You took the words right out of my mouth. What more could I possibly add?
Are you asking me? I certainly didn't use it in a derogatory way and that name has been used on the CAF for decades so unless something changed overnight it is above board.
Yes - and I wouldn't simply sell him here and now either (unless someone offers genuinely great money for him, which seems very unlikely).
As it stands, with Rashford's situation and whatnot, I'd rather keep him and gamble on him being semi-useful at least.
Might add that the above holds true if we're actually serious about challenging this season - and not just happy with entering yet another stage of a rebuild process.
It’s tricky. Ideal scenario is we replace Martial with Haaland next summer, but what if we could get more for Martial this month? Other clubs might low-ball us next year if they know we’re selling Martial to fund Erlin.
We have Rashford, Sancho and James for the left wing and Cavani, Greenwood and Rashford (not his best position) for CF - I think that’s enough cover to get us through the season.
Of course, Martial has been hot and cold but he may have a great season and increase his value; either way I don’t think he’s long for this club, not with a potential superstar CF signing a year away. I’d let him go now for the right price.
We have Rashford, Sancho and James for the left wing and Cavani, Greenwood and Rashford (not his best position) for CF - I think that’s enough cover to get us through the season.
Of course, Martial has been hot and cold but he may have a great season and increase his value; either way I don’t think he’s long for this club, not with a potential superstar CF signing a year away. I’d let him go now for the right price.
Huh?
Talk to me abou outright lies please
Exactly.
I still think he can comeback and have a big season this season but I have no issue with those who don't. I just feel we need to be sensible and not weaken our squad for the sake of it.
Not you, sorry, I meant @Raven
Rashford is a shit striker and a very good left winger.
Greenwood has largely been poor up top.
Cavani was pretty much only played once a week last season, do you see that changing?
Some don't like him and want to sell him just for the sake of selling him, being proven right. It's hardly more complicated than that, heck, some are still unhappy about Mourinho being sacked, whatever floats their boat i suppose. Martial kept fighting to get back into the starting lineup when he kept being benched by Mourinho, he was one of the few feckers that actually performed well at the start of the 18/19 season. The notion that he's sulking and being detrimental to the rest of the squad is make belief. He didn't shy away from it then and there's little to suggest he'll do it now. Ole tolerates quite a lot, but not that.
If we get rid of Martial this summer then we have to bring a striker in as backup\alternative to Cavani.
Rashford
Greenwood
Cavani
Martial
Sancho
We're unlikely to play more than 3 of them together, 5 players to rotate between 3 positions is hardly overkill, especially when we'll have to be careful not to play Cavani too much...With Rashfords surgery and resting period, Sancho just returning to training, Cavani returning late, we're not exactly well stocked for the start of the season.
Everything points in the direction that we'll go all in for Haaland next summer, so trying to go for a first choice up front this summer when available strikers (quality ones) are difficult to sign makes no sense at all.
So no, it makes no sense to sell him this summer.
This forum genuinely amazes me. why sell him? Guy scored 20+ goals in his first season upfront, then had a poor season when - let's be honest - none of our strikers were that amazing (Rashfod was top with 11 goals). He's hardly an old player or a crock and you can't replace him with a netter player for £50m. Greenwood, Cavani, Martial as three ST options is excellent depth
Is that why Martial has scored 4 in 9 in the league against Chelsea and 3 in 11 against City? Versus Lukaku's 1 in 10 vs Chelsea and 4 in 14 vs City.
https://www.transfermarkt.com/anthony-martial/bilanzdetails/spieler/182877/plus/1/gegner/631
There is literally no point in selling him and we can just be thankful that the people making the decisions aren't as short sighted as some posters on here.
180k p/w is pretty steep as well right? Reports say Salah / Mane are on something like 170k / 220k p/w and that's all-in. Very few players in the world make >180k p/w and almost every one of them is a nailed on starter for their club (I think literally everyone except Bale?).
City for instance have just KdB, Grealish and Sterling on that money.
I really think Martial has got his chances. Should not say much about his efforts against Everton, since he has been out for 4 months.
But I think his development has been bad in the years he has been here. In addition, his attitudes are very bad. Seems like it's going to be hard to sell him too.
But I think his development has been bad in the years he has been here. In addition, his attitudes are very bad. Seems like it's going to be hard to sell him too.
How do City and Liverpool have bigger wage bill than us?
My counterpoint to this is that our forward line is currently full of kids. Martial is older than our whole forward line except Cavani. I'd be anxious about going into this season where we need to challenge with Rashford - 23 and out for the 1st 2 months of the season as our 2nd most senior attacker. I don't think that Martial should be sold purely because his salary is so high - he earned that salary by being our only useful attacker for a good while. And right now he is important to our squad as (weirdly) one of our longest serving and most experienced players.
You are sort of suggesting selling him based on where you think his head is at now. That's not a great reason to sell him, especially as it's not based on anything certain. I think he'll play a lot this season, as one of our most experienced and trusted forwards - the other option is heaping loads of pressure on Sancho (21 and new in the league), Greenwood (20), Amad, Elanga and James, and that is too much pressure for a bunch of really young and unproven players. Cavani won't play every week and Rashford is injured until October, so we will be relying on 20 year olds to keep us in the title race.
Martial might not fundamentally change how you think about our chances here, but he makes me feel more relaxed that we're not just piling pressure onto kids.
Cavani being prone to injury has been exaggerated. He was unavailable a bunch due to the FA ban and quarantine. Covid for all the players excluded:
Greenwood has played the entirety of pre season up top and had 15 appearances (4 GA) there last season. Clearly Ole isn't just experimenting and sees a future for him in that position. Even if you think he's better on the right, we have Sancho and Rashford as first choice wingers.
Rashford can do just fine as 3rd choice CF:
Compare to Martial:
Why would anyone ignore 20/21 and think he'll go back to his 19/20 form? How does Martial play himself into form when he's shown he's unable to play second fiddle? Cavani is back this week.
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@Raven I'm just not interested in responding to a poorly written essay that ends with some crying about post length 4 times in a row. The one time you did it in a reply that was longer than the post you responded to was hilarious though
| Player | # games missed due to injury |
| Bailly | 15 |
| Pogba | 14 |
| Shaw | 13 |
| Van de Beek | 12 |
| Cavani | 12 |
| Rashford | 10 |
| Maguire | 7 |
| James | 6 |
| McTominay | 5 |
Greenwood has played the entirety of pre season up top and had 15 appearances (4 GA) there last season. Clearly Ole isn't just experimenting and sees a future for him in that position. Even if you think he's better on the right, we have Sancho and Rashford as first choice wingers.
Rashford can do just fine as 3rd choice CF:
| Season | Apps | G | A |
| 20/21 | 15 | 4 | 6 |
| 19/20 | 8 | 4 | 1 |
| 18/19 | 29 | 10 | 7 |
| 17/18 | 16 | 5 | 2 |
| 16/17 | 19 | 6 | 2 |
| 15/16 | 16 | 8 | 1 |
Compare to Martial:
| Season | Apps | G | A |
| 20/21 | 27 | 7 | 10 |
| 19/20 | 44 | 23 | 10 |
| 18/19 | 11 | 2 | 1 |
| 17/18 | 10 | 4 | 3 |
| 16/17 | 7 | 1 | 1 |
| 15/16 | 21 | 6 | 2 |
Why would anyone ignore 20/21 and think he'll go back to his 19/20 form? How does Martial play himself into form when he's shown he's unable to play second fiddle? Cavani is back this week.
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@Raven I'm just not interested in responding to a poorly written essay that ends with some crying about post length 4 times in a row. The one time you did it in a reply that was longer than the post you responded to was hilarious though
Do they? depends who you ask, but I think that's a separate conversation. It's still relevant to look just at an individual contract and ask if you're getting your money's worth there esp. if there's an offer on the table to sell a player.
Where are you getting these figures from?Cavani being prone to injury has been exaggerated. He was unavailable a bunch due to the FA ban and quarantine. Covid for all the players excluded:
Player # games missed due to injury Bailly 15 Pogba 14 Shaw 13 Van de Beek 12 Cavani 12 Rashford 10 Maguire 7 James 6 McTominay 5
Greenwood has played the entirety of pre season up top and had 15 appearances (4 GA) there last season. Clearly Ole isn't just experimenting and sees a future for him in that position. Even if you think he's better on the right, we have Sancho and Rashford as first choice wingers.
Rashford can do just fine as 3rd choice CF:
Season Apps G A 20/21 15 4 6 19/20 8 4 1 18/19 29 10 7 17/18 16 5 2 16/17 19 6 2 15/16 16 8 1
Compare to Martial:
Season Apps G A 20/21 27 7 10 19/20 44 23 10 18/19 11 2 1 17/18 10 4 3 16/17 7 1 1 15/16 21 6 2
Why would anyone ignore 20/21 and think he'll go back to his 19/20 form? How does Martial play himself into form when he's shown he's unable to play second fiddle? Cavani is back this week.
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@Raven I'm just not interested in responding to a poorly written essay that ends with some crying about post length 4 times in a row. The one time you did it in a reply that was longer than the post you responded to was hilarious though
When did he prove he is unable to play 2nd fiddle?
Yeah they do. So if all their players are earning less, then surely you have to question why their wage bill is so high?
As with everything, it's how these wages are reported.
Salah was earning more than 120k per week at Roma, when he signed for Liverpool, their journalists started with "Salah is on 80k per week" reports.
It's like how every player takes paycut to join Barca but their wage bill is huge.
Transfermarkt. You can see # matches missed and the reason on the injury page and you can sort apps/goals/assist per position and season.
Cavani being prone to injury has been exaggerated. He was unavailable a bunch due to the FA ban and quarantine. Covid for all the players excluded:
Player # games missed due to injury Bailly 15 Pogba 14 Shaw 13 Van de Beek 12 Cavani 12 Rashford 10 Maguire 7 James 6 McTominay 5
Greenwood has played the entirety of pre season up top and had 15 appearances (4 GA) there last season. Clearly Ole isn't just experimenting and sees a future for him in that position. Even if you think he's better on the right, we have Sancho and Rashford as first choice wingers.
Rashford can do just fine as 3rd choice CF:
Season Apps G A 20/21 15 4 6 19/20 8 4 1 18/19 29 10 7 17/18 16 5 2 16/17 19 6 2 15/16 16 8 1
Compare to Martial:
Season Apps G A 20/21 27 7 10 19/20 44 23 10 18/19 11 2 1 17/18 10 4 3 16/17 7 1 1 15/16 21 6 2
Why would anyone ignore 20/21 and think he'll go back to his 19/20 form? How does Martial play himself into form when he's shown he's unable to play second fiddle? Cavani is back this week.
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@Raven I'm just not interested in responding to a poorly written essay that ends with some crying about post length 4 times in a row. The one time you did it in a reply that was longer than the post you responded to was hilarious though
I look at those figures and wonder where this superstar striker is who we cant afford to lose? 1 in 3, 1 in 5, 1 in 4, 1 in 3, 1 in 2, 1 in 5
Cavani being prone to injury has been exaggerated. He was unavailable a bunch due to the FA ban and quarantine. Covid for all the players excluded:
Player # games missed due to injury Bailly 15 Pogba 14 Shaw 13 Van de Beek 12 Cavani 12 Rashford 10 Maguire 7 James 6 McTominay 5
Greenwood has played the entirety of pre season up top and had 15 appearances (4 GA) there last season. Clearly Ole isn't just experimenting and sees a future for him in that position. Even if you think he's better on the right, we have Sancho and Rashford as first choice wingers.
Rashford can do just fine as 3rd choice CF:
Season Apps G A 20/21 15 4 6 19/20 8 4 1 18/19 29 10 7 17/18 16 5 2 16/17 19 6 2 15/16 16 8 1
Compare to Martial:
Season Apps G A 20/21 27 7 10 19/20 44 23 10 18/19 11 2 1 17/18 10 4 3 16/17 7 1 1 15/16 21 6 2
Why would anyone ignore 20/21 and think he'll go back to his 19/20 form? How does Martial play himself into form when he's shown he's unable to play second fiddle? Cavani is back this week.
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@Raven I'm just not interested in responding to a poorly written essay that ends with some crying about post length 4 times in a row. The one time you did it in a reply that was longer than the post you responded to was hilarious though
Your statistics there do show that Martial performs considerably more reliably than Greenwood or Rashford as a striker in terms of pure G+A, not to mention the other things he does as a striker that Greenwood/Rashford don't do. Also, if you play Greenwood or Rashford as striker you take them out of their most effective position cos you don't have another striker. You make the team less effective by selling Martial.
Honestly, 17 goal contributions in 27 games is not bad. For someone who's spent so long saying that Martial is absolutely useless those stats really don't support you, especially when you take into account the previous year's record too - 33 in 44 is amazing! Clearly Rashford would start from the left - him on the right is horrible most of the time - and Sancho would start right. When everyone's fit Greenwood and Martial provide quality cover across that line. I don't get why you hate this idea so much?
Our forward line, barring Cavani, is ridiculously young. Martial is 25, Rashford and James 23, and everyone else is 21 or younger except Lingard. You were saying earlier that Elanga should take his place. That would be swapping out one of our only forwards with experience for another kid with potential and heaping pressure on 20 year olds in a season where we need to challenge.