Marcus Rashford (Out) | Ornstein: United want to keep, will only consider substantial bids

[Donut]

Get him and Bruno out, bring in Kvartiaschkela and 2 midfielders and we’d be golden.

 

[led_scholes]

Do you have 2 in mind?

Oliseh can be one of the options. Kvara too, but maybe he is too expensive. Thinking that we also have Diallo and Forson, I would go for a more experienced forward. Unfortunately, I don't keep up with the rest of the leagues, but certainly there is someone with this profile in Spain, France, Germany, Portugal, Netherlands or Italy that can cost up to 40 millions.

 

[RedRocket08]

With his wages and current form are people seriously suggesting he is worth more than £75m?

Now I don't see this happening, always makes me laugh when folk say "sell him to PSG". They are not Saudi or China trying to boost a new league.

If there is any truth in this we would be mad to say no and PSG have learnt nothing wanting to spend more than £35/40 mill for current Rashford

I’d bite their hand off for 75m, I felt he was worth not more than 50. If it happens, I hope we don’t replace one overpaid player with another - and I hope we spend wisely.

 

[Lash]

It won’t when every left sided attacker we go for will be quoted at 100 million and we’ll be desperate for quality.

True, but there's the likes of Williams and such who have clauses. I'm excited to see some of the targets from south America we look at this summer - we seemed to overlook loads in the last few years.

 

[Oranges038]

If Mbappe is actually leaving this summer then Rashford or Milan's Leao would be the obvious two replacements.

Can see it being Leao over Rashford.

Although if Rashford does leave to PSG, I'd be taking a look at Leao if I were Utd.

 

[Doracle]

Can see it being Leao over Rashford.

Although if Rashford does leave to PSG, I'd be taking a look at Leao if I were Utd.

Yeah, I don’t think Milan have the financial firepower to fight off PSG if they come calling. I’d hope we still do. It’s going to be a bad look if, after not even being in the running for Kane and Bellingham last summer, we can’t even hold on to Rashford when one of the big clubs comes calling. Still, if we are forced to sell, I’d expect it to be upwards of £100m. £75m is laughable.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Yeah, I don’t think Milan have the financial firepower to fight off PSG if they come calling. I’d hope we still do. It’s going to be a bad look if, after not even being in the running for Kane and Bellingham last summer, we can’t even hold on to Rashford when one of the big clubs comes calling. Still, if we are forced to sell, I’d expect it to be upwards of £100m. £75m is laughable.

Nobody is stupid enough to pay 100m for Rashford. 75m is probably way too much as well. I hope we don’t have it in us “fight off” PSG for Rashford given his general play is absolutely woeful.

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

Fecking yes to £75m.

Unless we’re playing teams who flood everyone forward and leave lots of space open to counterattack, he’s become really ineffective. Low blocks and teams sitting deep is something he‘s never got used too and a lot of our games will be like those types of games.

No one sits deep against us this season. We have been dominated in field tilt. If we get a new coach then hopefully we will play like the above.

 

[Revaulx]

Said it before but I doubt he's going anywhere: local lad, star player, excellent on his day and when on form.

Agreed, except:

The next manager will want to work with him,

Will he though? Rashford is inconsistent and high maintenance. A new manager who’s coming in with his eyes open might wonder whether he’s worth the effort. A DoF might well think the same, given the number of other things that need fixing.

he'll probably have a great season and then it will all crash again the season after that.

Possibly. I’m not convinced Rashford is capable of any more great seasons; he just doesn’t seem capable of the required physical intensity.

 

[Dan_F]

True, but there's the likes of Williams and such who have clauses. I'm excited to see some of the targets from south America we look at this summer - we seemed to overlook loads in the last few years.

Nico Williams has less than half the amount of league goals as Rashford this season. Imagine we sign him for whatever that clause is and he scores 3 league goals. He’ll get eaten up.

The level of expectation that we can get rid of players and replace them easily is far fetched. Whoever is making these decisions has got a hell of a job on their hands. It’s going to be hard enough to shift the players that have to go, let alone replacing our better key players.

 

[jderbyshire]

Marcus shouldn’t be sold, and I believe he won’t be sold. We have bigger priorities.

I also think it’s fair to value him higher than Jarrad Branthwaite for example.

I think there will be some people in charge who will push for his sale because it would ease finances significantly - any fee would be pure profit and the sale would also shift one of our majorly under-performing high earners. (A similar situation to Chelsea when they sold Mount)

But that's obviously looking at it from a cold, statistical, financial perspective.

From a marketing point of view, and from a romantic one... Rashford is a valuable asset to the club because he's a local lad and academy success story.

 

[Moston Red]

Such a frustrating player. When on form he’s world class but his low periods means we can’t rely on him. I’d jump at an offer of 80m

 

[flameinthesun]

Needs to be a minimum of 100mil to sell.

 

[SomeRandomPerson]

Nobody is stupid enough to pay 100m for Rashford. 75m is probably way too much as well. I hope we don’t have it in us “fight off” PSG for Rashford given his general play is absolutely woeful.

Honestly, if anyone offers 100m for Rashford, we should take it and run. Given that Mbappe is going to Madrid, and they also have Endrick coming in the summer, who Ancelotti has said is going to go straight into the first team squad, and there's absolutely no chance they let Vinicius go, so we might have a chance to get Rodrygo at a good price. Selling Rashford for ~75m and getting Rodrygo for a reasonable price would honestly be a great deal for us. He has great close control and his pace/acceleration are absolutely insane. Plus, he can play on both the left and right so him and Garnacho (who looks a much better player on the right IMO) could interchange positions during the game - and both are fairly creative players (Garnacho is on the right at least, on the left he comes in and tries to shoot too often, I think). If we have surplus left from the Rashford sale/Rodrygo purchase, we can put that money into a new left back and completely rejuvenate the left side.

Unfortunately, I think there is basically zero chance PSG go for Rashford. They've lost Messi, Neymar and Mbappe recently and, under Luis Enrique, they seem to be wanting to move away from the Galactico era. Even if they do go for a big signing, I think they will go for Osimhen even if they did invest big in Goncalo Ramos and Randall Kolo Muani last year.

 

[Doracle]

Such a frustrating player. When on form he’s world class but his low periods means we can’t rely on him. I’d jump at an offer of 80m

Just curious but can you name a period when the team has played consistently well and Rashford hasn’t?

 

[Plant0x84]

I think there will be some people in charge who will push for his sale because it would ease finances significantly - any fee would be pure profit and the sale would also shift one of our majorly under-performing high earners. (A similar situation to Chelsea when they sold Mount)

But that's obviously looking at it from a cold, statistical, financial perspective.

From a marketing point of view, and from a romantic one... Rashford is a valuable asset to the club because he's a local lad and academy success story.

There’s nothing I disagree with here, I just feel with the club ‘losing’ Martial, moving out Sancho and Greenwood, and open to offers for Antony I think Rashford on top would leave us too light in attack and with too much to do in the market, and to integrate on the pitch. He can wait until next summer,

I also think he is our poster boy and his commercial value in this sense outweighs any perceived benefit of selling him.

 

[davegk]

I think he’s waiting for ETH to leave/get the boot and then will start running around again.

 

[Mike Smalling]

There’s nothing I disagree with here, I just feel with the club ‘losing’ Martial, moving out Sancho and Greenwood, and open to offers for Antony I think Rashford on top would leave us too light in attack and with too much to do in the market, and to integrate on the pitch. He can wait until next summer,

Hard to disagree with this, but there is definitely also a risk of Rashford losing market value if he has another season like this one. There is potentially an opportunity now to capitalize on his perceived value and getting something more than what he is worth to us. But finding quality forwards is also not easy.

I'd much rather Rashford turned around his form, and turned into a consistent player. It's not that he has to score 30 goals a season, but just putting in the effort and making better decisions in the final third would go a long way. But if we get an offer we have to weigh all the pros and cons of selling. Definitely not an easy choice.

 

[gajender]

There’s nothing I disagree with here, I just feel with the club ‘losing’ Martial, moving out Sancho and Greenwood, and open to offers for Antony I think Rashford on top would leave us too light in attack and with too much to do in the market, and to integrate on the pitch. He can wait until next summer,

I also think he is our poster boy and his commercial value in this sense outweighs any perceived benefit of selling him.

He is United's poster boy because United made him so and somebody else would easily take his place without United skipping a beat if we do decide to sell him .

 

[Born2Lose]

Should have sold Pogba for £90m, in the end he went on a free.

It's time someone at the club started making grown up decisions.

Wouldn't be surprised if Rashford goes the Lingard route and sits out the contract until he's done at 30+, while putting in half arsed "performances".

 

[Buster15]

Hard to disagree with this, but there is definitely also a risk of Rashford losing market value if he has another season like this one. There is potentially an opportunity now to capitalize on his perceived value and getting something more than what he is worth to us. But finding quality forwards is also not easy.

I'd much rather Rashford turned around his form, and turned into a consistent player. It's not that he has to score 30 goals a season, but just putting in the effort and making better decisions in the final third would go a long way. But if we get an offer we have to weigh all the pros and cons of selling. Definitely not an easy choice.

Exactly.
I also would prefer Marcus to turn up and play for United the way we know he is capable of.
But with every weak display, the chances of that are less likely.
So if he is going to be sold, this is the right time.

 

[Red Regista]

I'd sell him for £60m tbh. Even 16 year old Yamal is fighting and tackling and our 'star' player can't be arsed to do anything other than shoot the ball.
Players like him that are lazy and finicky are the exact reason why we are where we are as a club and team on the pitch.

If INEOS are serious about the rebuild, they need to get rid of players like Rashford, Sancho, Martial, and maybe Amad (who is showing the same tendencies lately).

I'd rather play a hard working winger with less talent than those gifted brats who sabotage the team effort.

I can tolerate a player who does feck all against the ball and only plays with the ball in his reach, but that has to be a super special player, like Ronaldo/ Messi/ Haaland/ Mbappe and Rashford is miles and miles away from that category, Sancho even further. Play both of them on each wing and you're defending/ pressing with 9 men against 11...

 

[Telsim]

£75M is in line with my estimation. Would be delighted to see him go, especially for such a fee, but it won't happen. And that's before the quality of the source.

 

[devilish]

I think he’s waiting for ETH to leave/get the boot and then will start running around again.

That's why he should be sold. We can't have a senior player who switch on or off according to his agenda. It's bad for the club and to have around kids

 

[Moston Red]

Just curious but can you name a period when the team has played consistently well and Rashford hasn’t?

Not since SAF left no. We had a purple patch after Ronaldo left last year but it was short lived.

 

[spe88]

I’d take £50m. Get his wages off the books and we’ll be saving £7.5m a year even if he’s replaced with someone on £150k a week

 

[Jericholyte2]

I think he’s waiting for ETH to leave/get the boot and then will start running around again.

...for about six months, then back to square one.

 

[Insanity]

From Wiki,
- He has 85 goals so far in about 223 games in this last 5 seasons (including this one).
- Both his off seasons, this one and the one in 21-22 came after seasons where he appeared in 55+ games in the season and was run into the ground; first by Ole and then by ETH last season.

Can one of you Stats Gurus find out for me how many assists Rashford has in the last 5 seasons (5 including this one). Once you have that, can you please give me a comparison of the other top left wingers in world in terms of goals and assists.

Before someone gets on the soapbox about their "Stats are not everything" pitch, I acknowledge that stats are not everything. I am also a little disappointed that Rashford's game hasn't developed to the level I expected it to in time since his debut. His goal scoring, even in his best seasons, comes in patches and his dribbling & decision making can leave a lot to be desired at times. However, I do not believe in the assertion that he is lazy or doesn't want to put a shift in or whatever consistently. I am sure there is a reason his drop-offs have been after seasons in which he has been overworked and overused. 'Tiredness', can be an excuse for someone who is expected to make sprints at full pelt chasing the ball in a counter-attacking set-up for an entire season playing 50+ games.

I am not ready to let Rashford go, especially without knowing that we are getting another top notch replacement who is equally or more productive than he has been over a significant period of time. So, someone please provide the comparison. Thanks.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I’d take £50m. Get his wages off the books and we’ll be saving £7.5m a year even if he’s replaced with someone on £150k a week

I’d be absolutely fine with that

 

[VP89]

From Wiki,
- He has 85 goals so far in about 223 games in this last 5 seasons (including this one).
- Both his off seasons, this one and the one in 21-22 came after seasons where he appeared in 55+ games in the season and was run into the ground; first by Ole and then by ETH last season.

Can one of you Stats Gurus find out for me how many assists Rashford has in the last 5 seasons (5 including this one). Once you have that, can you please give me a comparison of the other top left wingers in world in terms of goals and assists.

Before someone gets on the soapbox about their "Stats are not everything" pitch, I acknowledge that stats are not everything. I am also a little disappointed that Rashford's game hasn't developed to the level I expected it to in time since his debut. His goal scoring, even in his best seasons, comes in patches and his dribbling & decision making can leave a lot to be desired at times. However, I do not believe in the assertion that he is lazy or doesn't want to put a shift in or whatever consistently. I am sure there is a reason his drop-offs have been after seasons in which he has been overworked and overused. 'Tiredness', can be an excuse for someone who is expected to make sprints at full pelt chasing the ball in a counter-attacking set-up for an entire season playing 50+ games.

I am not ready to let Rashford go, especially without knowing that we are getting another top notch replacement who is equally or more productive than he has been over a significant period of time. So, please someone, please provide the comparison. Thanks.

Re.the bit in bold, I'm not sure you do.

Rashford has chronic issues in:
- workrate
- build up play
- professionalism (two occasions here in the last year)
- form

He is also a severely limited player system wise. He suits a counter attacking approach which is the bulk of his contributions. However he is ill suited to a progressive style of play since he can only come alive when he's running into space and not double marked. For such a limited player at 26, we should be counting our lucky stars for a potential big offer.

 

[Lash]

Nico Williams has less than half the amount of league goals as Rashford this season. Imagine we sign him for whatever that clause is and he scores 3 league goals. He’ll get eaten up.

The level of expectation that we can get rid of players and replace them easily is far fetched. Whoever is making these decisions has got a hell of a job on their hands. It’s going to be hard enough to shift the players that have to go, let alone replacing our better key players.

But he has triple the assists. We'd be better off getting someone who provides and invest in another forward. Only Arsenal rely on their wide players for goals and we still say they need a striker to win the league.

I don't think we need to directly replace them, in the same way I said Spurs will be a better side when Kane left. We need to be a better team and Rashford is not a team player, so even if he scores a loads, his slack has to be picked up by the rest of the team and now he's not even scoring.

 

[Mainoonited]

80m and Xavi Simons and you've got yourself a deal!

 

[Chairman Steve]

We shouldn’t be hesistating over selling him based on his poster boy status. Ferguson didn’t give a feck when he ousted Beckham twenty years ago and we didn’t look back quite frankly.

I thought our boast as a club was we make the stars… so let’s ‘make’ the likes of Mainoo, Garnacho and Hojlund the new stars.

Even if we kept him and we hypothetically bought direct replacements for Martial, Sancho and whoever else should go, they outperform him and then we’re stuck with a £300k a week sub with years on his contract. No-ones touching him then. I feel it’s a good time to cash in on him this summer if possible.

He gives off that feeling he’s going to be completely retired from football by 30. He seems driven by the perks of being a football player rather than being a football player, and once he’s accumulated enough money he’s just going to live off that and do his own thing of socialising and partying in glamorous places.

 

[Insanity]

Re.the bit in bold, I'm not sure you do.

Yikes!

Rashford has chronic issues in:
- workrate
- build up play
- professionalism (two occasions here in the last year)
- form

Rashford has played under 5 managers in the last 9 seasons, I haven't heard or read one complain about his commitment and professionalism. Where did you hear that? Does that regularly come up in your nightly conversations before bed with Ten Hag? You read/heard about it somewhere? Or did you make it up?

Also, why would ETH play him if it was true when he is such a stickler for professionalism and had no issues sending Sancho to the gallows?

In professional sports, player form goes up and down. No one, besides may be a few superhuman exceptions, can maintain the same consistency game after game for season after season. Form for most player fluctuates from time to time is never a constant. Sometimes form can also fluctuate when a player is asked to move around positions and is played in a position which his game is not the most suited to. Which happens a lot with Rashford as we keep spending huge money on RW duds and due to our inability to get a proper striker since RVP.

No one was questioning his work-rate when he was banging them in last season. He was played relentlessly throughout last season and his form & consistency has suffered due to that this season. That is the reason I pointed out in my post about his drop in performances after the two 55+ game seasons.

He is also a severely limited player system wise. He suits a counter attacking approach which is the bulk of his contributions. However he is ill suited to a progressive style of play since he can only come alive when he's running into space and not double marked. For such a limited player at 26, we should be counting our lucky stars for a potential big offer.

Good news then, as we play counter-attacking football! Or do you want ETH sacked and would prefer if we go for another manager?

I actually don't think his game is not suited for progressive style of play. He came unto the scene under Van Gaal, who played a more possession based approach. Also, I cannot see a reason why he won't excel under a Klopp or a Arteta, when players like Diaz and Martinelli can succeed under those managers.

 

[Plant0x84]

Just curious but can you name a period when the team has played consistently well and Rashford hasn’t?

For me, our best periods post-SAF have been when Marcus had been on form.

 

[TrailMonkey]

From a footballing perspective, we have to consider any offer for this guy. He's not interested in playing for the club so ship him out. Hopefully PSG will come up with the funds.

 

[VP89]

Rashford has played under 5 managers in the last 9 seasons, I haven't heard or read one complain about his commitment and professionalism. Where did you hear that? Does that regularly come up in your nightly conversations before bed with Ten Hag? You read/heard about it somewhere? Or did you make it up?

In the last year publically we know he has been dropped in a match for poor punctuality, and fined two weeks wages for being on a bender in Belfast the night before training. The Athletic said there are other issues not made public.
So yes, I think he does have commitment and professionalism issues.

Also, why would ETH play him if it was true when he is such a stickler for professionalism and had no issues sending Sancho to the gallows?

Because sancho spoke out publically and undermined the manager. It's worth noting Ten Hag did drop Rashford for some games this season because he was poor. He's getting better of late but therein lies the problem - he is terribly inconsistent.

No one was questioning his work-rate when he was banging them in last season. He was played relentlessly throughout last season and his form & consistency has suffered due to that this season. That is the reason I pointed out in my post about his drop in performances after the two 55+ game seasons.

Again false. There were many mentions of his lack of work rate but it was more than accepted as he could score. As long as he scores goals the limitations are palatable. If he's not scoring though, he's also not working and it's obvious. This is the 2ns season in the last 3 he's having a poor time.
No chance that's remotely standards of a United attacker at 26 year old.

Good news then, as we play counter-attacking football! Or do you want ETH sacked and would prefer if we go for another manager?

Ten Hag does not want to implement counter attack football long term. He doesn't even want that now but a lot of our attacks happen to be counters, which I accept. Worth noting Rashford is still broadly quite shite at them. There's also no chance our owners will accept sit back and counter football as a plan A for much longer, so irrespective of the manager Rashfords limitations will just be more exposed.

The players you named are far more polished, in first touch, press resistance, decision making and dribbling. Rashford actually lacks in these areas.

 

[Pughnichi]

I will drive him to Paris.

If this story is true, the way INEOS handles this will determine if this is a real or false dawn

Agree entirely. Have said from the start that I’ll judge them on what they do with Rashford.

he’ll either continue being the home grown poster boy or we’ll get serious about having effective players and see him out the door.

we’ve lost Stam, Beckham, Ronaldo, Ruud etc…there’s no reason we can’t survive and thrive after selling Rashford

 

[TrustInJanuzaj]

For me, our best periods post-SAF have been when Marcus had been on form.

While thats obviously true, he’s never actually been the best player during those good spells. In lockdown Martial and Greenwood were better. For Ole, Martial and Pogba were better. For Mourinho Ibra and Pogba were also better. Last season was the only time he’s been our “best” player but we didn’t play great stuff back then and even that aside I’d argue Bruno, Casa and Martinez were more influential to our good football spells.

 

[Plant0x84]

seems driven by the perks of being a football player rather than being a football player

I don’t get this impression at all.
He’s a streaky player who struggles to perform when his confidence is low, and he has cut a frustrated figure in the last few seasons but it seems unfair to say he doesn’t love football. I’m confident he’d love to win a league with United, he’s been a red all his live.