Manchester United view sidelining Marcus Rashford as key to cultural reboot

noodlehair said:
If he fetches a big fee it will be because of his potential as a player, which you have dismissed. I think if the club were to sell him on the basis they will definitely not struggle to replace him AND will save money signing someone better AND which they can only do by selling Garnacho (I mean wtf?), it'd have to be based on a bit more than the baseless opinion of a random internet person.

And no they don't. Already very good teams might sell players because they have a surplus of good players. We are definitely not in that position. We should not be selling any talented young players unless they are causing more trouble than they are worth. It is not a viable tactic to build a winning team unless you are planning to build it in The Championship.

This also has absolutely nothing to do with Marcus Rashford and all stems from some absolutely mental idea that we should sell Garnacho and Mainoo to make us better which has come from feck knows where. Maybe don't go aiming the word insane at other people when you're peddling or piggy backing on ridiculous irrelevant nonsense that wouldn't even make sense if you were playing FIFA.
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Yes because players have NEVER been sold that had more name value than actual ability right? We’ve never seen big fees for players that ended up average? That would make no sense!

Get over yourself. You keep taking some grand offense when all I stated was that Garnacho isn’t some “unsellable asset” if the club deems that his current price tag is worth more now than it’ll end up being if he ultimately becomes just a rotational squad player.
 
TrivelaDeBruno said:
Funny how there’s never a response to posts that strictly point out his unacceptable lack of work ethic and professionalism. Maybe because there’s no logical excuse.
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Tis true. His most shameful trait.

I see he’s got skauslover Henry Winter onboard to promote his Mother Teresa II campaign. Desperate.wonder if he was dripping with $100s of $1000s worth of jewellery around the schools?
 
TrivelaDeBruno said:
Funny how there’s never a response to posts that strictly point out his unacceptable lack of work ethic and professionalism. Maybe because there’s no logical excuse.
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Yeah, plus anybody seriously scouting him must see this aswell. It’s what makes me think Saudi is the only real option, he can sit and laugh at us all while earning a mil per week
 
Ole'sattheWheel said:
Yeah, plus anybody seriously scouting him must see this aswell. It’s what makes me think Saudi is the only real option, he can sit and laugh at us all while earning a mil per week
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Or he could sit tight and earn his 350K a week here doing nothing
 
tf1989 said:
Very MUFC to try to offload him in a way which says "warning: do not sign this player". Honestly, who is going to want him?
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The Sancho situation was worse to be honest and we got rid of him
 
Denis' cuff said:
Tis true. His most shameful trait.

I see he’s got skauslover Henry Winter onboard to promote his Mother Teresa II campaign. Desperate.wonder if he was dripping with $100s of $1000s worth of jewellery around the schools?
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check simon's eyeroll here (timestamped)

 
Moriarty said:
World Cup coming up and he's going to want to be back in the England squad so he'll have to be playing somewhere in the PL or Europe. Can't see Tuchel picking players from the Saudi league.
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Good point, but it's hard to see Tuchel selecting Rashford under any circumstances other than a massive improvement in his performances. Which is possible, but it seems very unlikely. But even so, the potential for disruption within the squad by bringing in Rashford may be enough for a hard no regardless of what Rashford does over the next year.
 
Not exactly "Rooney wants out" type of situation, so am not much bothered... It is side story at best regarding what our priorities as a team should be atm. And it is probably for the best that it blew up so soon after Amorim came in.

As for Rashford himself, yes, it would be a lot smarter to keep his head down and try to get back in the team. But ultimately, I think this actually helps with everything, from explaining why he is benched/not in the plans and so on.
 
clarkydaz said:
check simon's eyeroll here (timestamped)

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PR team working overtime here.

And people need to ask who is leaking the lineups. Who’s been a mainstay at this club over a period of more than 4-5 managers?

Mask is finally off and people see it for what it is.
 
EnviedRed said:
Saying that it 100% it has nothing to do with race is also wrong especially considering that he has been the victim of racism. The commentary and "disgust" around him being "dressed like a rapper" is 100% shrouded in racism. Cole Palmer was hanging out with a rapper, gave the middle finger in a Pic and everyone said how cool it was.

It's been proven that Rashford has been racially abused multiple times..Those same people who were sending out racist tweets are some of the same people who according to you are "only criticizing his performance". Except that racism can't be turned on and off like a light switch..it's always there, either on a conscious or subconscious level. It's been proven through research that most people have implicit biases. Yes, it has been proven that racists watch football. Are you under the impression that those racists disappear from convos about his performance?

It's generally people who have never experienced racism a day in their lives who think they have the right to tell everyone else what does or does not qualify as racism. Odd that.
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I share your disgust about racism. But we cannot say that no black player can be criticised for his performance because it would entail racism. That in itself would be racist, in that we are treating the marvellous black players here at the club over several decades as somehow needing a different standard to be judged by than those from other ethnicities. They don't. Many - not all, I (now) fear to say - have been absolute bloody dynamite. So let's not patronise them.

If Marcus moves on, that is NOT because we are a racist club.It's do with with his form.

I
 
To think that Amorin shielded him for his trip to the US, and now he throws him under the bus. Sigh
 
lex talionis said:
The hate is over the top, although it's not hard to see why the hate is there. Marcus grew up in extremely humble circumstances and now carries himself like a prima donna off the pitch and like someone who doesn't care on the pitch.

But if he produced the end product, Marcus Rashford can carry on like a pre-Madonna for all I care. But the end product has evaporated and it's not just a run of poor form. When Forlan was missing chances on goal at least he ran his socks off. When Rooney would go cold, you knew he would get hot again. Both gave it everything they had, even on days when they had nothing. Rashford just gives up too easily and it's weird to watch. But above all he never bothered to learn a new skill, a new trick or anything to advance his game beyond what it was when he was 20 years old.
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See I have a different opinion on this as I think hate is unnecessary in football as there’s so much of it elsewhere in life but I understand the strong emotions that football can evoke. I’m not really going to debate whether he is being a prima Donna of the pitch or just enjoying life. In relation to on it, something is clearly wrong and I don’t think it’s lazy and not caring but maybe it is.

I’d agree that total effort should be a requirement for all players but in reality it’s not as people are human and that’s why players like the ones you’ve mentioned stand out to a degree for me. I’ll admit to being frustrated when he has lost a duel or foot race but it leaves me confused more than angry.
 
Denis' cuff said:
Tis true. His most shameful trait.

I see he’s got skauslover Henry Winter onboard to promote his Mother Teresa II campaign. Desperate.wonder if he was dripping with $100s of $1000s worth of jewellery around the schools?
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Would he prefer he don sackcloth and ashes?
 
FlawlessVictory88 said:
It's you who doesn't get it.

It's obvious to everyone that if a team is struggling then you'd expect individual performances to also look worse but the point that's being made over and over again is the extent of how much his performances have fallen off and for how long.

You're example of Haaland being off form is a span when he's sill scored 3 premier league goals and 4 champions league goals, also no one is looking at the current city slump and thinking it's because of Haaland.
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And no one can seriously say that Manchester United's 10 year slup is because of Rashford.

There have many a player that have come into United have have cost the club way more and that have failed miserably.

Like it or not, even though he has been patchy, Rashford is one of the brighter points of the past decade.
 
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lex talionis said:
I can’t see any other club agreeing to his 350/week wages and I can’t see Marcus agreeing to a lesser salary. The way this works out is that Marcus will eventually break and behave like a professional footballer again at OT. Squad man perhaps, but a squad man under Amorim.
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I think it's more likely we loan him out an pay half his wages than try to make it work as a squad option
 
I’ve said it before but he is one of a clutch of players who have been here a while who have lacked any sort of consistency in either form, injuries, attitude, effort and ability, under many managers now. Others still here along those lines are Lindelof, Shaw and Dalot imo.

Its best for him to move on - he may go somewhere else and relight that peak Rashford for several years but I just dont see him ever doing it here again.

Call it what it is at the moment - he has 1 good game in 10 and is paid a huge amount of money and should be the shining light of our attack. If you look at past worldies in the PL: Hazard, Salah, Ronaldo, Giggs, etc etc. He’s just not in that bracket of player, the players who are world class game in game out, season after season for years. And those are the sort of profile of player you need to get to where we need to get.

He’s an overpaid mediocrity and we need to move on
 
Big Ben Foster said:
To be exact, income on the income statement, not cash on the balance sheet. It's a one-time windfall that helps you offset expenses in the current accounting period.

The flip side of the argument is that you still need to find a way to fund the wages + amortization of incoming players in future years.
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No one wants to sell young talent, but Unied are in a mess. We have 3 first team players that will potentially walk away on a free this season - Eriksen, Lindloff and maybe Maguire if he feels that he is better off making more money at a smaller club who would save the transfer fee on him.

We have very few players we can sell and make money on to rebuild the squad at a rate the speed that may be required. Is Amorim going to want to wait for 3 or 4 years to rebuild the side like Klopp was able to? Will he be given that time?

Im not saying i want this, but if you did sell a young academy player for 80m, we could bring in 3 or 4 players and amortize over multiple years. Yes, they still need to be funded, but the club do still make enough revenue year on year, so the idea is that the players would be funded by the club over future years.

Chelsea have done their spending, they have the core of their team that looks set for some time. The next few years, i dont expect them to be going hard in the windows as they will be maxed out having to pay for the players they amortized.
 
I was watching Amorim’s embargoed pre-Spurs match press conference and I was getting sick of the Marcus circus/ questions. “Was Marcus upset? Can you get him to his best level if he wants to leave? Can you get him focused given his present state of mind? Does the club want Marcus to stay?”

You could sense the exasperation on Amorim’s entire body as journalists kept piling on and on their darling subject Marcus. Ruben time and time again tried to shift the focus on the team away from any individual players, but the press hyenas kept coming back for more Marcus.

Why the feck isn’t there a press officer to help usher away some of this nonsense? Ruben is trying to coach the team on a new system and yet here we are completely wasting his time with English gutter press.
 
Dazzmondo said:
Maguire knew he wouldn't get an equivalent wage elsewhere. That's why he stayed. He was thinking of his future in terms of financial compensation. Rashford's thinking of his future in terms of getting back to his previous level and winning his spot back in the England squad. If he was only interested in keeping his wage, he could insist on staying and the club could do nothing about it.

Frankly I don't have any admiration for Maguire staying since he's still taking a massive wage off the club for very little effort (due to not being good enough to be 1st choice). I don't have any ill-will to him either since he's just doing what's in his best interests, but there's nothing admirable in it either in the way you seem to be suggesting. Rashford will have options that Maguire simply wouldn't have.
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Christ, Rashford FC in full force here. Maguire did/has done exactly what your hero should do, get his head down, keep quiet, and work hard to get back in the team.

Rashford could learn a lot from Maguire, but I bet he won't, we'll just get more PR pieces from him.
 
devilish said:
Most of those who wanted him out in the summer are probably gone. Therefore if Rashy wanted to change the club's mind then he had all the time in the world to do so. Its evident from his commitment on the pitch and in training that it's not the case.

And to have a seasoned football editor like Winter drive over to write about his charity work is quite amazing. The guy is more powerful PR wise then we even imagine
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My question is, why would he want his charity work publicised? Why can't he do his things quietly like most others do?
 
EnviedRed said:
People like you also conveniently pretend like Rashford hasn't been the victim of racist abuse. People like you like to pretend that there isn't currently a campaign to kick racism out of football because there have been so many racist incidents.

The same people who think it's cool that Palmer is literally hanging out with rappers giving the middle finger are the same people clutching their pearls that Rashford is "dressed like a rapper".

Some of the same people racially abusing him are the same people criticizing his performances and pretending that racism doesn't exist..hiding their biases behind his performances..that's great if that doesn't describe you specifically..but let's stop pretending that there aren't people shrouding their racism in criticism about performances. No racists don't dissappear they simply hide their true intentions.
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Using the racism card is just trying to deflect from the issue. It's just cheap.
 
David Bartley said:
I share your disgust about racism. But we cannot say that no black player can be criticised for his performance because it would entail racism. That in itself would be racist, in that we are treating the marvellous black players here at the club over several decades as somehow needing a different standard to be judged by than those from other ethnicities. They don't. Many - not all, I (now) fear to say - have been absolute bloody dynamite. So let's not patronise them.

If Marcus moves on, that is NOT because we are a racist club.It's do with with his form.

I
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You aren't arguing in good faith. So now you have switched to implying that I said something which I never did. When did I say that no black player can be criticized? I NEVER said that a black player can't be criticized but don't insult my intelligence by saying that it's 100% not about race. You clearly don't share my disgust for racism because you can't actually admit the problem and you are actually trying to excuse it.

Your argument is basically "well maybe kind of sort racism exists but that's OK because we don't want the black players to feel left out from criticism." Also, NEVER said that Sir Jim will sell Rashford because he is black and that's completely irrelevant to this convo. I never even implied that but that's just another bad faith argument from someone who can't defend their opinons.

I said some of the same people who were spewing racist insults are some of the same people who are criticizing his performances. That means the vitriol and hatred surrounding someone like Rashford will be significantly more because of racism. Unless of course, you believe that racists have magically disappeared from football. It's almost 2025 and FIFA is still trying to "get rid of racism" so we all know that it's absurd to suggest that racism doesn't exist.

Palmer is friends with rappers, taking pictures with rappers, giving the middle finger with rappers and there is zero outrage. Most people said it was cool. Most of the discourse around Palmer was that he is a "great guy just having fun". Imagine the outrage if Rashford took a picture like Palmer did. Rashford "dresses like a rapper" while behaving perfectly and everyone criticizes him. That's racism.
 
alexthelion said:
Using the racism card is just trying to deflect from the issue. It's just cheap.
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The only people who think racism is a card to be played are people who have never experienced racism. Only people who speak from a place of privilege are the only ones who describe racism as a card in a game. The only thing that's cheap is describing racism as a game.

Racism exists in football. Rashford has been the victim of racist abuse. Those are just facts. So where do all of the racist fans go when it's time to discuss Rashford performances? Do they just magically disappear? They stop being racist for those few moments to discuss his performances huh hahaha? Those racists are completely logical and rational when discussing his performances? That's just absurd.

Well If you are even a little bit of a logical thinker you would realize that there are racists who are part of the discourse around his performances. Many of those people have simply learned to be less overt in their racism. That doesn't mean it isn't there. Unless of course you actually think racism has just magically vanished from earth.
 
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EnviedRed said:
Palmer is friends with rappers, taking pictures with rappers, giving the middle finger with rappers and there is zero outrage. Most people said it was cool. Most of the discourse around Palmer was that he is a "great guy just having fun". Imagine the outrage if Rashford took a picture like Palmer did. Rashford "dresses like a rapper" while behaving perfectly and everyone criticizes him. That's racism.
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If Palmer had done feck all for over 2 years for Chelsea earning superstar wages you can be sure he’d get criticism for flying off to the states too just as they got a new manager, or just generally not giving a toss on the field.

When you’re performing like… an actual star, you tend to get away with a fair bit more. Surprisingly.
 
horsechoker said:
Some parallels between Arsenal getting rid of Aubameyang but it provokes a sadness in me.

Rashford was a local lad who came through the academy and now to see him as something we need to get rid of in what should be his prime is not how the story should end.

I really hope we're not talking the same way about Mainoo in 8-10 years.
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Then someone will tell us how they always thought he was a little ordinary, Amad as well. They won,t sat it now though.
 
gaffs said:
No one wants to sell young talent, but Unied are in a mess. We have 3 first team players that will potentially walk away on a free this season - Eriksen, Lindloff and maybe Maguire if he feels that he is better off making more money at a smaller club who would save the transfer fee on him.

We have very few players we can sell and make money on to rebuild the squad at a rate the speed that may be required. Is Amorim going to want to wait for 3 or 4 years to rebuild the side like Klopp was able to? Will he be given that time?

Im not saying i want this, but if you did sell a young academy player for 80m, we could bring in 3 or 4 players and amortize over multiple years. Yes, they still need to be funded, but the club do still make enough revenue year on year, so the idea is that the players would be funded by the club over future years.

Chelsea have done their spending, they have the core of their team that looks set for some time. The next few years, i dont expect them to be going hard in the windows as they will be maxed out having to pay for the players they amortized.
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Fair enough, I agree with that - as much as I'd hate to lose some of our young academy talent, I don't think any player sales should be off limits, especially if a crazy offer comes in.
 
gaffs said:
You don't get it, do you?

No one is saying Rashford is a patch on Haaland.

The point is, without a functioning team Haaland is not the super striker he was in previous years at City or Dortmund. City are playing like shit and Haarlands goals have dried up. So why not accept that United have been playing like shit for well over a year and accept that Rashford is also off form?

Is it not complicated, is it?

And why bring up Cunha. The guy was crap for Athletico, which is exactly why he ended up at Wolves. He is looking great now and from what Gary O'Neill said, he is extremely motivated at the moment - perhaps to get back to a decent club.
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Jesus, chill it marcus.
 
Funny thing is I’ve donated to Fareshare. But I’ve always maintained. My serious dislike of him has had nothing to do with his person.
My dislike is all about Rashford the player. I don’t understand how someone will say he loves the club he’s always been at since age 8, is the highest paid player and then goes around on the pitch and refuses to work as hard as he can. He needs to explain that.
 
Today’s game gonna be another Rashford show isn’t it? even though he didn’t travel. Love him as a person but he threw the manager under the bus there. We all seen it in his performances he’s been under par for a longtime but would have had more respect and sympathy from everyone if he had waited to get his transfer first before saying anything. Now just seems like throwing his toys out the pram because he was dropped for the weekend
 
The fact that hebuas a good game against Everton and then trains sonpoorly that hebisbnot even in the squad tells it all
 
David Bartley said:
I share your disgust about racism. But we cannot say that no black player can be criticised for his performance because it would entail racism. That in itself would be racist, in that we are treating the marvellous black players here at the club over several decades as somehow needing a different standard to be judged by than those from other ethnicities. They don't. Many - not all, I (now) fear to say - have been absolute bloody dynamite. So let's not patronise them.

If Marcus moves on, that is NOT because we are a racist club.It's do with with his form.

I
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Absolutely. No one is denying racism exists and that many black players are subjected to this on a daily basis. We all agree that that is awful.

But, as you say, the majority are criticising Rashford because of a whole variety of factors - both on and off the pitch, and none of these are race related.
 
I think the real lesson from this 'story' is that whoever leaked it should be fired, thoroughly.

I'm not sure which is worse, undermining the manager in his efforts to rehabilitate a star, or the fact it was to Jamie f*cking Jackson, whose only reason to get out of bed each day is to stick it to United. He's a disgrace.
If INEOS really want to improve things at United, the investigation shouldn't be into the lineup leaks, it should be which dipsh*t is choosing to take all this into the public.
 
Good riddance.

Been a toxic part of the squad for far too long and his output and effort is nowhere near the salary he has and thinks he commands.

Never really kicked on over the years and still the same weaknesses in his game since the start.

We need these egos and type of players gone. The PR stuff which started with integrity and looked like a kid that cared has slowly evolved into happening everytime he takes valid criticism and has now become a cynical cycle.

A split suits both parties.
 
lex talionis said:
The hate is over the top, although it's not hard to see why the hate is there. Marcus grew up in extremely humble circumstances and now carries himself like a prima donna off the pitch and like someone who doesn't care on the pitch.

But if he produced the end product, Marcus Rashford can carry on like a pre-Madonna for all I care. But the end product has evaporated and it's not just a run of poor form. When Forlan was missing chances on goal at least he ran his socks off. When Rooney would go cold, you knew he would get hot again. Both gave it everything they had, even on days when they had nothing. Rashford just gives up too easily and it's weird to watch. But above all he never bothered to learn a new skill, a new trick or anything to advance his game beyond what it was when he was 20 years old.
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This is a good point, and to my mind the biggest concern with him, perhaps even more than his questionable level of application and work rate. His repertoire is too narrow, and hence it doesn't take much of a drop in levels before the end product starts suffering badly, and it also limits his ability to function in different systems. And the really annoying thing is it looks like it really wouldn't take huge improvements in many areas. If he was just a little bit better with his take-ons, in his passing, with his timing, with his finishing - it's all there. But he has never taken that step into becoming a truly effective and more well-rounded attacker that he has looked capable of for years, and which I think everyone more or less have expected him to.

I've always been a big fan, and think he's gotten a good deal more stick than is reasonable. But at this point it's hard to disagree that the time seems to have come to move on.
 
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