We now have a manager with no experience, we need to get someone in the role who has lots of experience and a vast knowledge of European leagues.
Man Utd set to appoint Director of Football (when hell freezes over)
- Thread starter RedMachine03
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New CL and PL tv-rights to be negotiated in the next two years (Amazon, Apple ++++ wants in on the action and the deals will be much larger than before). Football as a sport, continuing to grow worldwide. As long as we are top 4 every other season they will not have any problems making money. We can continue to sign commercial deals and the current deals will be larger as football becomes more and more popular in the world. The loans are very manageable at this time. Club turns a profit without winning anything major for some time...
As Woodward said "Playing performance doesn't really have a meaningful impact on what we can do on the commercial side of the business."
I'd be very happy with that and could suggest work has already gone into the summer. Link please?
isn't he already head of football development, and plays a major role in recruitment and has done over the past 6 years of... poor recruitment?
I really don't think he meant this literally. At the point he made those comments, we were doing poorly. I think he meant it as a short term thing. Our big contracts are performance related and long term our commercial value will decrease if we get a reputation as a struggling club. It is a reality we cannot avoid and the Glazers know it.
Tony Whelan was one of the earlier names thrown around
Am I the only one that thinks that a director of football is really necessary?
We went through the generation of the manager is the sole person in charge of the club, and then moved swiftly to a more efficient approach with a DoF. However, later we have seen the role of the manager and the DoF being two separate entities. This would mean that there would be a lot of discrepancies in what the DoF wants (hired before the manager) and the manager wants. Like we have seen with Chelsea. The DoF has to be in exact mindset as the Manager for the relationship to work. Now managers want more control because of this.
What I think is maybe the third generation is a mix of two prior generations hybridised a bit. Hear me out, so in a conventional coaching team, you will have one extra person whose role is an 'assistant'. The role is to mix with everyday training, tactical planning, scouting reports etc. Basically, someone who is a 'jack of all trades, master of none'. This means he can focus his time more about scouting reports while communicating to the manager and seeing weaknesses first hand etc.
I think for man utd, this person is Mike Phelan. Ole is the manager, McKenna and Carrick as a coaching team, and Mike who is the 'wanderer'. Allows him to be close enough to Ole's ear, and far enough to look at things off the pitch.
What do you think?
We went through the generation of the manager is the sole person in charge of the club, and then moved swiftly to a more efficient approach with a DoF. However, later we have seen the role of the manager and the DoF being two separate entities. This would mean that there would be a lot of discrepancies in what the DoF wants (hired before the manager) and the manager wants. Like we have seen with Chelsea. The DoF has to be in exact mindset as the Manager for the relationship to work. Now managers want more control because of this.
What I think is maybe the third generation is a mix of two prior generations hybridised a bit. Hear me out, so in a conventional coaching team, you will have one extra person whose role is an 'assistant'. The role is to mix with everyday training, tactical planning, scouting reports etc. Basically, someone who is a 'jack of all trades, master of none'. This means he can focus his time more about scouting reports while communicating to the manager and seeing weaknesses first hand etc.
I think for man utd, this person is Mike Phelan. Ole is the manager, McKenna and Carrick as a coaching team, and Mike who is the 'wanderer'. Allows him to be close enough to Ole's ear, and far enough to look at things off the pitch.
What do you think?
Yes, I agree. The way the coaching team is set up, there’s more than enough leeway for one of them to act as a director of football of sorts. Also fergie is lending his advice as we know. I would be happy enough knowing mike phelan or McKenna or someone else internal was taking on that type of role and would stay in place even if another manager came in.
Depends on what timeframe you mean with short/long term and how bad performance might be used as the referense for this statement. In the past, performing poorly was when we did not win/challenge for the title and reaching far into the CL. Now it is top 4.
When the next generation of kids grows up, becomes consumers with their own money etc the other clubs will make more money than us from the commercial side, but we still got 10/15 years until this becomes a reality.
Might be nice to have someone with football knowledge (playing/coaching/scouting etc) at board level, taking decisions on the basis of sporting rather than commercial considerations.
Thanks.
Some of the dramatics in here 
How about we wait and see what the club and Ole have planned?
They will have had many meetings about the future. Ole will want control.
A dof doesn’t guarantee success. I would love a technical director to come in but it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t.
Didn’t spurs get rid of their one? Liverpool hired internally. There’s simply no reason for the panicking and negativity.
Try and enjoy yourselves for once.
How about we wait and see what the club and Ole have planned?
They will have had many meetings about the future. Ole will want control.
A dof doesn’t guarantee success. I would love a technical director to come in but it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t.
Didn’t spurs get rid of their one? Liverpool hired internally. There’s simply no reason for the panicking and negativity.
Try and enjoy yourselves for once.
Yeah there is. We have been buying like clueless football club. Having spent so much money without even a proper balance or structure letting go some of the best talents we needed to other clubs who are playing way better than us and our bought players.
Gary Neville is trying to force the club to appoint a DoF, based on his social media activity and interviews.
Some of the dramatics in here
How about we wait and see what the club and Ole have planned?
They will have had many meetings about the future. Ole will want control.
A dof doesn’t guarantee success. I would love a technical director to come in but it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t.
Didn’t spurs get rid of their one? Liverpool hired internally. There’s simply no reason for the panicking and negativity.
Try and enjoy yourselves for once.
Sure. That's what I am doing.
But I completely understand the other fans. IMO they are entitled to think that by doing things a bit differently to what we have done with the last 3 managers and going from one style to another, having a DOF with a coach in charge would be a better solution going forward.
DoF or a technical director the club has to decide but someone who doesn't make mistakes and get right players in and have a vision even without a manager in charge.
What you're writing is the same stuff we've been reading for years and years on here now, though. How much control did van Gaal or Mourinho have? You think Ole will have more than them? Are you happy with how Woodward has operated the transfer market? We need football people in charge of the football side.Some of the dramatics in here
How about we wait and see what the club and Ole have planned?
They will have had many meetings about the future. Ole will want control.
A dof doesn’t guarantee success. I would love a technical director to come in but it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t.
Didn’t spurs get rid of their one? Liverpool hired internally. There’s simply no reason for the panicking and negativity.
Try and enjoy yourselves for once.
The whole point of having a DoF is so that the club has someone in charge of making transfers that fit the ethos of the club (both players and managers). Someone that understands United and the way we play. That doesn't have to be someone that has ties to Utd or currently works there at all. In fact, i'm afraid we'll see another Woodward yes man with an internal appointment.
Not seeing how anything will change unless Woodward relinquishes control of the football side but that probably won't happen so here we are.
Bring back rene...
And someone that can negotiate contracts without sitting left with the Old Maid...
Problem is that if we appoint a DoF/TD, will he/she be given enough freedom? Or will Glazers/Woodward medle in transferdealings, contractnegotiations etc.
The best solution for the club (for everyone except Woodward and players wanting a stupid increase in wages) would be a separation between the commercial side and footballingside of this club, where the football department runs more or less autonomous within a budget set by the Glazers/Woodward. Not that this is going to happen, but one can dream.
Woodward isn't the one negotiating contracts.
Yep. Unless we buy exceptionally well before then and its a simple case of Ole not being up to it tactically. But the chances of us not spunking money away on dross is unlikely.
I know. It is Matt Judge, head of Corporate developement. I tend to lump Woodward and Judge together, as they are both seemingly incompetent in their tasks related to footballspesific elements.
Getting a DoF would hopefully change this.
If reports are true and we're now going for young emerging talents, then this suggests, that unlike previous seasons we are looking slightly to the long term, therefore it makes sense that the need for a DOF is diminished, we just need to make sure our scouting is good.
You can still end up signing young players who don't fit the next managers system. So hiring managers with continuity in style of play is essential which would be part of the DOFs or sporting directors job. Its not just about scouting.
And based on our record of success in the transfer market in the last 10 years, we have nothing to worry about there...
Some of the dramatics in here
How about we wait and see what the club and Ole have planned?
They will have had many meetings about the future. Ole will want control.
A dof doesn’t guarantee success. I would love a technical director to come in but it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t.
Didn’t spurs get rid of their one? Liverpool hired internally. There’s simply no reason for the panicking and negativity.
Try and enjoy yourselves for once.
I think you are stuck in 2012. Or perhaps you are posting from an insane asylum since you think the 4th manager in 6 years will finally be the new SAF. It took us 5 years to improve our scouting network after the shambles of Moyes and LVG's transfers, it will take us 6+ years to get a director in. All the evidence points to the upper hierarchy fighting tooth and nail against delegating decision making to other people, they want as much control as possible.
We have spent more net than Real Madrid and Barcelona and won a fraction of the trophies in the past 6 years. That is clear indication of poor upper management. No one knows whether a DoF will bring success, we do however know that Woodward and his lackies playing director of football brings failure.
We are the only major club in world football (Real Madrid excepted) that doesn't have a sporting director / DOF in place. If you want Woodward to ask the manager "who do you want" in the summer and then repeat the process once a new manager is installed seems short-sighted. We've gone through 4 managers since Fergie, each changing and chopping at will, and the club is left with an unbalanced squad, despite spending a fortune. An inspired sporting director figure would go some ways to mitigate that.
(quoting from another thread):
Rory Smith and Gab Marcotti make some interesting points about United, Solkjaear, and the search for a DOF. Starts at 6:40
Highlights for those concerned:
In their view, the sporting director should oversee the recruitment side (identifying the players) and delivering the players (negotiating and bringing in the players, at the right price, paying the right agent commission and also selling well). Absent a DOF, United faces for the 4th time since Fergie left a situation where Woodward asks the manager "who do you want"? Implication being, once that manager is gone, the process of "who do you want" starts again with the new manager. There's no cohesion and United are the only major club in the world (except Real Madrid who've been an anomaly) with no one doing that job (aka overseeing the recruitment, the academy, the delivering of transfer targets and selling well).
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast...sodeGuid=9fbf04aa-c3bb-4906-94df-2d7c499fe356
Rory Smith and Gab Marcotti make some interesting points about United, Solkjaear, and the search for a DOF. Starts at 6:40
Highlights for those concerned:
- "The Board" is a misnomer. There is no board in the corporate sense. "The board" is Ed Woodward, Richard Arnold and a couple of Glazers occasionally weighing in.
- Solskjaer's success should get him the job, but maybe has convinced United's hierarchy that there was nothing wrong with the club structure all along.
- United met with a headhunting firm twice before Christmas - Nolan Partners https://nolanpartners.com/ no relation to Kevin Nolan
- The impression was that United didn't quite know what the DOF figure should be and United gave the impression they didn't really know what they were looking for
- Ed Woodward earlier this season told someone that it could be years before that appointment could be made
In their view, the sporting director should oversee the recruitment side (identifying the players) and delivering the players (negotiating and bringing in the players, at the right price, paying the right agent commission and also selling well). Absent a DOF, United faces for the 4th time since Fergie left a situation where Woodward asks the manager "who do you want"? Implication being, once that manager is gone, the process of "who do you want" starts again with the new manager. There's no cohesion and United are the only major club in the world (except Real Madrid who've been an anomaly) with no one doing that job (aka overseeing the recruitment, the academy, the delivering of transfer targets and selling well).
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast...sodeGuid=9fbf04aa-c3bb-4906-94df-2d7c499fe356
Absolutely 100% agree that Mike Phelan should be given the responsibility of a DOF per se.
He can be the middle man between the scouting network and the manager. I would imagine he'd be pretty ruthless in who he recommends. One of our biggest issues in the transfer market recently is signing players on a whim and not necessarily looking into the players background/personality (Di Maria comes to mind here).
I think Mike could ensure that we are playing a particular brand of football from grass roots up. He could also have the responsibility of staff recruitment. For example, rather than offloading a loyal player (such as Valencia), make them become a part of the coaching team for youth players.
He could be the main observer, making sure that all departments are working like a well oiled machine whilst providing feedback to the manager.
Maybe this is already the case, who knows?
He can be the middle man between the scouting network and the manager. I would imagine he'd be pretty ruthless in who he recommends. One of our biggest issues in the transfer market recently is signing players on a whim and not necessarily looking into the players background/personality (Di Maria comes to mind here).
I think Mike could ensure that we are playing a particular brand of football from grass roots up. He could also have the responsibility of staff recruitment. For example, rather than offloading a loyal player (such as Valencia), make them become a part of the coaching team for youth players.
He could be the main observer, making sure that all departments are working like a well oiled machine whilst providing feedback to the manager.
Maybe this is already the case, who knows?
Don't forget a squad with a number of overpaid players on long contracts that we will not be able to sell, or get anything for. Which will be a problem for us in the coming years.
https://ir.manutd.com/corporate-governance/board-of-directors.aspx
BOARD:
Avram Glazer
Joel Glazer
Ed Woodward
Richard Arnold
Cliff Baty (CFO)
Kevin Glazer
Bryan Glazer
Darcie Glazer-Kassiewitz
Edward Glazer
Robert Leitao (M&A Banker at Rothschild)
Man Utd Sawhney (Media guy)
John Hooks (Luxury fashion)
It's clear the board is a joke - it's Ed, Richard Arnold and a bunch of Glazers who know sweet FA about sawccerr.
Too much negativity. Ole's at the wheel and he's the next SAF. Just believe, because Woodward does.Agreed, this is a big issue too. We need some sort of age/experience related wage cap. If players don't want to sign for us due to not accepting a wage cap then it's simple - we dont want you here unless you want to be here.
Sanchez is stuck with us now... I'm just praying that he can find his 16/17 form but I'm not entirely optimistic.
We want to make sure that players earn their wages (as inflated as they are) rather than giving the players more power.
Under Mourinho/LVG and Moyes you sensed that the team missed some "togetherness". Ole seems to if brought that back and you can only hope that this will help players sign new contracts without being too concerned about a massive wage increase. Then again fecking agents are likely to persuade players to ask for a much higher salary.
Massively odd and naive that people think we don't need a DOF now just because we're going to focus on younger talent. There's much more to it than that.
And the non-Glazers are all people who went to school with them.
Can't find it right now but I remember an article (or another post?) describing the relations.
You're on crack mate.
(quoting from another thread):
Rory Smith and Gab Marcotti make some interesting points about United, Solkjaear, and the search for a DOF. Starts at 6:40
Highlights for those concerned:
- "The Board" is a misnomer. There is no board in the corporate sense. "The board" is Ed Woodward, Richard Arnold and a couple of Glazers occasionally weighing in.
- Solskjaer's success should get him the job, but maybe has convinced United's hierarchy that there was nothing wrong with the club structure all along.
- United met with a headhunting firm twice before Christmas - Nolan Partners https://nolanpartners.com/ no relation to Kevin Nolan
- The impression was that United didn't quite know what the DOF figure should be and United gave the impression they didn't really know what they were looking for
- Ed Woodward earlier this season told someone that it could be years before that appointment could be made
In their view, the sporting director should oversee the recruitment side (identifying the players) and delivering the players (negotiating and bringing in the players, at the right price, paying the right agent commission and also selling well). Absent a DOF, United faces for the 4th time since Fergie left a situation where Woodward asks the manager "who do you want"? Implication being, once that manager is gone, the process of "who do you want" starts again with the new manager. There's no cohesion and United are the only major club in the world (except Real Madrid who've been an anomaly) with no one doing that job (aka overseeing the recruitment, the academy, the delivering of transfer targets and selling well).
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast...sodeGuid=9fbf04aa-c3bb-4906-94df-2d7c499fe356
Although I do think we need to make a sporting director hire, I think it has been said plenty of times that our recruitment process does not actually involve Woodward asking the manager "who do you want" we have a committee including the head scout and head of recruitment, who recommend/validate players after a budget sign off from Woodward.
That's the corporate board; none of them make decisions on the day-to-day running of the club.
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