Moyes managed 57 points from 34 games. LvG is currently on 56 from 33 games. There's barely anything between them in terms of results.
LVG Out Thread | BBC: Sacked!
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He's worse than Moyes with this constant, senile garbage. I guess we should go easy on the players as it's so fecking difficult for them to "perform". It's not like they're professional footballers on massive wages.
This is just another example of him lowering the expectations, but he's already lowered them to ridiculous levels and he keeps trying to lower them with this bullshit, resulting in such idiotic quotes. I don't give a feck about his English skills - he should know better. I'm not sure his senile brain realises that he's managing Manchester United, not some Sunday league team that could be excused for struggling to string two passes together.
This is just another example of him lowering the expectations, but he's already lowered them to ridiculous levels and he keeps trying to lower them with this bullshit, resulting in such idiotic quotes. I don't give a feck about his English skills - he should know better. I'm not sure his senile brain realises that he's managing Manchester United, not some Sunday league team that could be excused for struggling to string two passes together.
He just hasn't got to grips with away games in the Premier League. He's won just 12 of 36 away games.
He actually has the best home record in the league since he arrived, 78/105 points taken at Old Trafford (City have 79/108 so LVG just ahead on a points per game basis). I can't understand how he's managed this, as you would think the way LVG sets up his teams we'd be better when teams open up against us.
He actually has the best home record in the league since he arrived, 78/105 points taken at Old Trafford (City have 79/108 so LVG just ahead on a points per game basis). I can't understand how he's managed this, as you would think the way LVG sets up his teams we'd be better when teams open up against us.
The guy is a clown. I'm speechless ffs.
That Wenger thread was started in 2009... we'll catch them soon enough.
The sad thing is the guy is able to produce no end of bullshit to cover his ineptitude, yet people (the decision makers at the club included) still accept it.
Just to show the how much of a great manager LVG is, i got this from an article on barcelona: "the last time the team only picked up one point in 12, Louis van Gaal was the manager and Leo Messi was only 15".
The guy has been a shit manager took over some real footballing powerhouses, and ran them to the ground
The guy has been a shit manager took over some real footballing powerhouses, and ran them to the ground
But....but...he built the foundations and every trophy won by Ajax, Bayern and Barca since his tenure, should be attributed to him.
Walking football is a growing and popular sport with the over 50s. Maybe we're being short-sighted and Louis is actually priming the team into making a code-switch soon and we will soon be the FC Barcelona of that sport.
I said a long time ago that I thought we'd see the benefits of Van Gaal's work after he left. And I stand by that. I am quite sure that the players will have learned a lot tactically, and technically from him. There's no doubting his deep knowledge and experience of the game. The passion he brings to his discipline is quite remarkable. But Van Gaal's biggest weakness is himself, his dogmatic dedication to rigid structures, which just makes his approach ineffective in a real world environment. I am unequivocal in the fact he has to go, but in the long haul, I am sure the players will have gotten something out of this experience. Especially the young ones.
I think everyone agrees we'll see the benefit once he leaves.
i'm not so sure. the young players are playing with instinct and haven't had the football coached out of them yet, as far as i'm concerned. credit is more likely to fall to the youth team set up, rather than LVG.
Well seeing as the only way is up after Van Gaal (unless Giggs takes over) then I'd say of course we will see better after his gone.
The point I am trying to make, is that Van Gaal is right when he says that football is a mental game. The English game has failed in this regard for a long time. Players don't think enough about their roles on the pitch. Again, I don't agree with his application of this theory, which is static, pedestrian football. But the underlying principles, of getting players to use their heads more, to think about the game more; is good training for all the players.
Football fans obviously have an extremely emotive relationship with the clubs they support. And none of this is to make an argument for Van Gaal's continuance. I want him gone desperately, and have for a long time. But, I believe we will find that Van Gaal will have added to the key competencies of our players; something which they will be able apply more effectively under a different coaching team that allows them to couple their new knowledge with a more creative, instinctive approach to the game.
Football fans obviously have an extremely emotive relationship with the clubs they support. And none of this is to make an argument for Van Gaal's continuance. I want him gone desperately, and have for a long time. But, I believe we will find that Van Gaal will have added to the key competencies of our players; something which they will be able apply more effectively under a different coaching team that allows them to couple their new knowledge with a more creative, instinctive approach to the game.
Learned what exactly? How to score and attack? 40 bloody goals in 33 games and with relegation level attacking stats in chance creation and shots on goal. How to defend? We tend to fall apart the minute we go up against any half decent attack and have been saved a ridiculous amount of times by De Gea playing out of his skin. Not to mention some of the embarrassing displays where we were completely torn apart by the likes of Wolfsburg, Newcastle(LOL), Arsenal and Spurs. I suppose he taught them how to aimlessly pass the ball and to bore the shite out of the OT crowd consistently.
This idea that LVG will leave some grand imprint on the club is bizarre, his brand of death by possession will be hastily discarded as soon as he leaves, namely because A.it utterly failed during his reign B.was horrendous to watch and has become the bane of most United fans and C. the managers most likely to take over from him play nothing close to his style.
Not to mention the fact that so many of our more exciting, attacking players have gradually looked worse and worse with far less focus on creativity and instinctive decision making as they play more games under Van Gaal.
Trying to credit Van Gaal with future success is just plain disingenuous, one particular Kinder Bueno fan tried to incessantly peddle this line of thought and it was consistently rubbished every time, he didn't create the current Bayern and Barca dynasties during a collective two year managerial spell, both occasions of which where he was unceremoniously sacked for failing to deliver and was criticized by several players/coaches/fans for his stubbornness and restrictive style. At the very least I can only hope to christ that he doesn't leave any 'legacy' here because we've already seen the fruit of his great 'work' during the last two seasons and most United fans want to never have to consistently endure that play style and performance level again in the near future.
I also believe or at least i hope that his time with us will have positive influence on our future. Sadly people here wants to take everything positive ( even if its only thing) away from him.
Some might ask what so positive about scoring low amount of goals,where he demands we score from 1 or 2 chances created. Well i cant be arsed to check but doesnt that mean we have high conversion rate? So if the team were forced to have high conversion rate,imagine them under manager with style of football,where we create a lot more chances etc.
When it comes to defending,we have 2nd best defense (if you go by amount of conceded goals).Some might say "yea thanks to DDG",yea and what about that? Isnt he part of team,part of defending or attacking?
Trying to stay away from this thread in general.When it comes to LvG,doubt there is anyone defending him.After all whats there to defend,style of play is boring,there are other issue too but in same time player need to get some stick too.Last couple of months people using almost everything as negative hammer vs LvG,some things arent even true.
I hope we can benefit from some of LvGs work and become great again under Mourinho. I think its safe to say that we will see something else next season.
fixed.
I have seen nothing from his tenure here to call progress, not even potential progress. The football is awful, we have players playing out of position all over the place, academy players are getting games out of necessity owing to injuries, not by design, bar Jesse. He is full of crap, he has consistently contradicted everything positive he ever said. I'm not into stats, what you can see from game to game, in match situations, setting up to attack or in his case to nullify the opposition, going a goal up or a goal down against certain teams and how we react is a proper way to judge things imo, however as a reinforcement, even the stats are poxy.
The sort of blinkered, hyperbolic reaction to my post I was expecting. Unsurprisingly, drawing your own conclusions and putting words in my mouth. Here's the follow up post I made on the issue:
Good post. Of course it carries no correlation to what I said, but don't let that stop you.
Good fix to be fair.
Blinkered and hyperbolic? Yeah, sure. My post was addressing this idea of LVG leaving some positive type of legacy, something that has been argued before and you were proposing and I was contesting it. The idea that a manager can wholly fail at a club, be sacked but then be credited for another, more competent manager succeeding in the future because the more competent manager could apply certain things that the sacked manager failed to do is just rubbish IMO. Football is a simple game where managers hold an immediate influence on a team's success. Tiny Tim doesn't deserve any credit for Pochettino's success this season, one has failed, the other hasn't.
Your second post has you changing your point from having our players 'learning tactically and technically' to learning to 'think about the game more', what does that even mean? Learning to use their heads? Sorry if this comes across as aggressive but that sounds nonsensical. You talk about how LVG is instilling worthwhile values and 'competencies', but how exactly do you know this? It certainly hasn't manifested in our performances, and you said yourself that his application has been poor, so how can you have knowledge of such benefits from his tenure?
This is what LVG is doing:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-Manchester-United-fan-bursts-tears-lost.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-Manchester-United-fan-bursts-tears-lost.html
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We can't know for sure what he has managed to impart, but he does fancy himself a “teacher” and he does insist – systematically – on certain tenets, the “think before you kick” principle being one of them.
Personally, I don't think the players will suffer any longterm effects from his so-called philosophy: It's even conceivable that they'll benefit from parts of it (under a new manager). When looking at his overall stint at United, this is obviously a minor detail, and only WUMs and genuine madmen will try to credit him with any future success we may enjoy – but still, I don't think it's entirely irrelevant to bring it up as a (possible) positive.
Personally, I don't think the players will suffer any longterm effects from his so-called philosophy: It's even conceivable that they'll benefit from parts of it (under a new manager). When looking at his overall stint at United, this is obviously a minor detail, and only WUMs and genuine madmen will try to credit him with any future success we may enjoy – but still, I don't think it's entirely irrelevant to bring it up as a (possible) positive.
Benefits? the players will need to be exorcised after he is gone.
A lot of the players who are new to the club seem wound up like a spring. I think they will spring out once LVG leaves. Darmian, Schneiderlin and Herrera are examples of that. I am sure there are some good things he's imparted but I still feel he's not really come to grips with the fact that the PL is played in between structure. Structure isn't supposed to govern the way your team plays, it is supposed to keep it disciplined and allow chief operators to operate outside the construct. But it seems our system is governed entirely by the construct and that anything that exists outside it is quickly extinguished tactically by how the system operates. (The whole thing gives me a headache trying to comprehend sometimes..)
I feel that how the system this season has started to shrivel up and reduce us to barely having shots and scoring goals is as a result of the culture shock he is experiencing in trying to control the game.
The Spurs victory last night against Stoke exposes our so called transition as an utter failure. At the start of the season they gave us a game and were perhaps unlucky. They struggled with this season, injuries and form but worked to a plan of flowing and attacking football. Then their run in clicked and the points difference between us exposes a more serious problem. We simply dont create chances to score four goals in a game. They play to the end and move on to the next game with little fuss. We go into press cons of mind numbing nonsense about red zones and other gobbledegook.
We have not progressed and FA semis are not testament to any great lasting success. Villa and Spurs games highlight how far we have fallen behind. We are reduced to producing a handfull of chances and a goal or 2. The goal differences are dramatic: Spurs 64 goals to our 40 further illustrates just how poor we really are, because only Southampton at 45 are close, everyone else is in the 50s. Thats a wapping 24 games on our present levels of peformance.
During the same season Spurs have generated quality from their youngish squad. We have one or two individuals but on the whole we look pretty average. The massive changes in players have not done anything to raise our game. Instead we look like those silly squads in the past with massive player turnover, no change in performance, and mid table mediocrity. These factors point to woeful leadership and below average strategies.
The philosophy is utter nonsense. Doesnt matter how many years or players this guy is given he simply cannot produce a side like Spurs or even motivate us into a side like Leicester. Two years on and we are virtually in the same place he started but at the cost of players and money. The fans didnt show up against Villa, they know its going to be poor. Another season of this and I really do fear for our future.
We have not progressed and FA semis are not testament to any great lasting success. Villa and Spurs games highlight how far we have fallen behind. We are reduced to producing a handfull of chances and a goal or 2. The goal differences are dramatic: Spurs 64 goals to our 40 further illustrates just how poor we really are, because only Southampton at 45 are close, everyone else is in the 50s. Thats a wapping 24 games on our present levels of peformance.
During the same season Spurs have generated quality from their youngish squad. We have one or two individuals but on the whole we look pretty average. The massive changes in players have not done anything to raise our game. Instead we look like those silly squads in the past with massive player turnover, no change in performance, and mid table mediocrity. These factors point to woeful leadership and below average strategies.
The philosophy is utter nonsense. Doesnt matter how many years or players this guy is given he simply cannot produce a side like Spurs or even motivate us into a side like Leicester. Two years on and we are virtually in the same place he started but at the cost of players and money. The fans didnt show up against Villa, they know its going to be poor. Another season of this and I really do fear for our future.
Some very good points and an excellent post overall.
Sums us up perfectly. We're just pissing around in no man's land while other teams are decisively moving forward or have made solid preparation to do so.
Well said.
I'm always going to remember that Leicester 5-3 United match as the death of Louis van Gaal
We started that match sparkling as we had been for the last few weeks. Herrera shining in his advanced midfield role, di Maria tearing teams apart coming from deep with his pace and unpredictablity. After our third I smiled thinking about how great things were now under LvG.
Then, when the collapse came, LvG decided he had to change everything. Di Maria moved position needlessly and never recovered. Herrera had to sit deeper and hasn't looked the same since. LvG went from positive to negative and has never recovered.
We started that match sparkling as we had been for the last few weeks. Herrera shining in his advanced midfield role, di Maria tearing teams apart coming from deep with his pace and unpredictablity. After our third I smiled thinking about how great things were now under LvG.
Then, when the collapse came, LvG decided he had to change everything. Di Maria moved position needlessly and never recovered. Herrera had to sit deeper and hasn't looked the same since. LvG went from positive to negative and has never recovered.
Some sort of reprogramming will be needed if the reports of his insistence on only being allowed pass/shoot in specific situations (or face the post-game analysis verbal beating) is true.
I think there's something in that and van Gaal basically crapped himself about playing attacking football after that game. For all he, or anybody else knows, United's capitulation that day might have been a one off. You could count on one hand how often United has played attacking football since that match.
Personally I'll credit Moyes for setting the foundations for LvG to build upon. If we ever win a trophy again it's because of Moyes.
Hail Moyes, the underestimated One
The only credentials the man seems to have is a gift for stifling football players and lowering expectations. If we get any success in the coming years its because the weight has been lifted on what are / were in previous years very expensive signings and promising and gifted individuals.
He should have been sacked months ago.
He should have been sacked months ago.
Looks like no one wants to see united. Look how far LVG has brought us, from the chant "youve only come to see united" to no one wants to see united.
There is the semi-final to contend with at the weekend. I've passed on my tickets for tomorrow mainly for this reason but I will admit I'm not gutted about not going.
Are you a season ticket holder? would you renew if LVG stays?
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