He's turned us into Arsenal, in more ways than one. It's insulting.
LVG Out Thread | BBC: Sacked!
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Wish I was a kid! Are you planning to come to a game? If so, wait till LvG is out of the club.
Without the lovely attacking football though.
I agree to a point but we have to be realistic, 2nd from here would be a decent achievement. Tho of course it depends on how far behind 1st we are.
I fail to see any similarities.
Agreed. I could accept top 4 last season given the circumstances. This season we really should be aiming higher.
He's already jizzed away a quarter of a billion pounds. Players like Di Maria cost a fortune and were just shite. He sells RVP and Hernandez and Falcao aswell yet the only attacking signing he makes is a last minute panic for Martial for a stupid fee. Martial is the kind of buy we should be bringing in to play under a world class established player, maybe even a loan back scenario. We are currently reliant on him. Even the good signings like Herrera are being held back by his awful, negative shite.
At least with Moyes he was just out of his depth, Van Gaal has this arrogance despite not being fit to tie Ferguson's laces. I guess that's the problem.
At least with Moyes he was just out of his depth, Van Gaal has this arrogance despite not being fit to tie Ferguson's laces. I guess that's the problem.
I was talking in general. Not particularly this season. Even the club had written minimum 4th finish in Moyes' contract.
Yea, maybe I should have stipulated 'specifically the Arsenal of a few years ago'.
- Just make 4th to qualify for CL
- Get knocked out in the CL early
- Just make 4th to qualify for CL
- Pointless possession football without any real purpose or penetration
- 'the youth, the youth'
- Belligerent / stubborn manager, out of touch with modern football
- Sticking with sub-par players (Rooney / Gallas)
- Awkward and desperate press conferences
Edit: just wanna say that Wenger has adapted and changed his methodology this season / last season and I'm not hating for the sake of hating.
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Well in general I think aiming for fourth or above is far more defensible, actually.
I mean, of course as fans (or as owners or senior management for that matter) we should be disappointed with anything other than winning the league. But should we expect to win it every year? Should we be looking to fire a manager for the crime of not winning the league? Surely that would be absurd.
You make top 4 a contractual obligation because it gets you into the CL which is important financially and in terms of exposure. And because, ultimately, while we can all hope for the best, and be disappointed when we dont get it, we are not entitled to it. There are other very strong teams in this league as well. But I think you can make a much stronger case that we are "entitled" to CL football, given our profile and what we spend on players and salaries. And if we dont get it then you have to say there is a problem and someone else should probably come in and sort things out.
It isnt about settling for 2nd (or 4th) best, it is about aiming high but recognising that we are in a very competitive league and that winning every season is not possible, while setting a floor a little below that supreme achievement and saying anything less than that lower level is not acceptable. Nobody is expecting street parties among fans for coming 4th. Or for coming 2nd. But for 4th you expect some relief that we have qualified for the CL, thus creating possibilities for the following season. And a qualitative assessment of the season and the circumstances surrounding the result. This season, for example, I dont think 4th would really be acceptable, while last season it was. To finish 2nd would be disappointing, given we had failed to win the league, but it would be evidence of progress from last season. Again, its hard to attribute a particular emotion to the number without knowing the circumstances: did we go ona really good run in the second half of the season but just fall a point or two short of an also strong City? Or did we come out just ahead of a tight pack of 3 or 4 teams contesting second, but 15 points behind first?
Mostly agreed. However, it's the constant defence of LvG in achieving a fourth finish last season as if it was a great achievement.
That's not Arsenal or Arsène.
His target was to improve on 4th and if he doesn't he'll be sacked. Only question is whether Utd would pull the plug on him sooner than the end of the season if it looks like he's not going to improve on 4th. I think they will give him money in January but if he fails to improve the performances, results and position he goes at the end of the season.
Shame really as I think we can predict the play won't improve due to his tactics limiting performances.
Shame really as I think we can predict the play won't improve due to his tactics limiting performances.
Lots of chatter that mutually agreed to end term. Reports from Holland.
Odds were 14/1 yday and now evens!
Maybe crap, but worth keeping an eye on
Odds were 14/1 yday and now evens!
Maybe crap, but worth keeping an eye on
The possession football / pretty football without any results is what I was getting at. He was pretty possession heavy in the latter part of the last decade, early 10s.
And he was out of touch with modern football, but he has improved in recent seasons.
There was some fake stuff on Twitter about this earlier. Would seem out of character for van Gaal to just walk away I think.
Yeah also my first instinct.
The pretty football doesn't have results because Wenger is stubborn and refuses to spend on a top striker, it's not because of the esthetic of the style.
Another constant. He is leaving a platform for the next manager to achieve greatness.
All the kids played except Martial and Memphis had been here prior to his coming to the club. Even they seem to be regressing.
Shaw was scouted by the club before he arrived.
All the kids played except Martial and Memphis had been here prior to his coming to the club. Even they seem to be regressing.
Shaw was scouted by the club before he arrived.
He resigned from AZ, so it's not exactly out of character. But like you said it was an hoax.
Even when he had a top striker it wasn't bearing results. Look at when RvP was there, and Henry (before he left for Barca). He emphasised the pretty side of it and compromised the direct nature of football. It's why we (under SAF) were so effective against them and others. We were adaptable. Direct and cut throat when we needed to be, but we did play some attractive football too.
I did not know that. Under similar circumstances though?
Just feck him off at the end of the season. I've had enough.
The best fans in the wurld wanting him out while being in the top 3 the majority of the season. 
Even then, it wasn't about style but SAF being a better manager with a better and bigger team, Mourinho had more money and better players. The main problem for Arsenal has always been the little roster and a huge adversity.
It was about style - say what you want about Mou's footy but he guarantees you results (not this season obv.). This season aside, could you ever see Wenger give up his principles just for the result? That's my point. He wasn't adaptable, and he was stubborn to the point where it was detrimental for the team. This season he has played more counter attacking. Against us, against City and he's given up the possession football for the result.
Ideally, everyone would play great footy and win trophies. In reality, it doesn't work like that (unless you're Barca and Bayern).
It is not just the position. It is the tumescent style of play while getting kicked out of two cup competitions already.The best fans in the wurld wanting him out while being in the top 3 the majority of the season.
They were having a terrible season and he tried to resign but the players convinced him to stay. But I can't remember when he gave his resignation letter, during or after the season.
The best fans in the wurld wanting him out while being in the top 3 the majority of the season.
I'd say that's a poor argument.
Position in the table is largely irrelevant for the first half of the season... it's how you're shaping up/if you'll be challenging come the end of the season. Leicester are top of the league, do you expect them to be challenging for the title come May?
Also, the Premier League isn't/wasn't our only major competition of the year.
Also... who said we're the best fans in the world?
But they don't play great footy, they just play footy, there is nothing special about it. And they have the same possession stats than in the last 4 seasons.
Edit: In the last 4 seasons City consistently had more possession than Arsenal and Arsenal are the second most creative team in the league.
Again, I agree this idea that he leaves a foundation for others to build on is a bit of a cliche. But I think there is a grain of truth in it. Not that he has built a great squad from his acumen in the transfer market. But because all the players at the club will likely be technically better than they were before they worked with him. They may not be able to make much use of it right now because of his other deficiencies as a manager. But when someone else comes in they will have a group of players who are more comfortable in possession, and have at least had some exposure to a different way of thinking about the game. Given that managers that have come after him at a number of other clubs have managed to turn things around and build successful teams I dont think it is outlandish to be reasonably confident the same could happen here. Not that it definitely will, that we should take it for granted. But history does seem to imply there is a good chance of it.
I think he is good on the technical side of things - I always assumed he would be strong on the tactical side as well though there has been less evidence of that. I think he struggles to really inspire this group of players, and maybe that has been the problem elsewhere as well. If someone comes along and does a better job of motivating the group, maybe the work he has done developing their technical ability will pay off.
Sod it, that is one of the few things we have to hold onto at the moment, one of the few reasons for optimism, so I am not willing to let go of that for now. Otherwise we are left with the possibility that the last two (one and a half) seasons have been as much of a waste of time as the one before that.
Louis, about 1000 times per interview/speech
And he largely talks nonsense, so there you go.
Who Arsenal?
Yes, Arsenal.
Its a matter of opinion. You find this style of play horrible, others dont. Most of us will agree this style has little "excitement" but not all will agree (maybe on here they will) that this style isn't better for the current situation.
I found the last few years of SAF the worst shit I've ever seen up to the point i was praying for him to retire. I felt ashamed week in week out seeing us hoofing it from defense to offense or spraying and praying from the right wing non stop.
The difference between SAF and LVG? An inform striker who carries the team.
If LVG had a striker (which is also his own mistake for not buying one, and selling RVP while keeping Rooney) combined with our general domination everyone would blow confetti out of their asses. But without one, everyone will complain about no end product.
Last few matches we saw plenty of chance creation, less possession. It was basically Man United of SAF's last years without any decent players/in form players. What happened? Our "solid" defense got more holes then swiss cheese. Louis is doing the same thing he did at the WC. He knows the weaknesses and starts from the defense. He sacrifices entertainment, attacking play for control and simply not conceding. Which is in his position the best and safest thing to do to meet his goals.
Defense solid? -> Midfield solid? -> Forwards solid? -> 3 year plan complete.
The only thing i personally blame on LVG is his investments/sales. As there is no place here for Rooney, Valencia, Fellaini. While there is a HUGE need for Nani, RvP and Januzaj in our current state.
Yea, I think recently they've abandoned their purist principles. But you can't deny previously they emphasised that part of their game? And it was based on possession. They were called Barca-lite for a reason.
So you think it will take three seasons for a manager at our club, with unlimited resources, to actually get us playing well? Also, the reason we have been so open at the back the last two games is because of injuries. If LVG had his way, we would still be trying to bore teams into a 0-0 draw from the first whistle.
As for your point about the style of play during Fergie's last years, I don't think anyone would disagree that we were woeful. However, he got us the results. Right now, our results and our play is absolutely shite. After spending so much, and trimming the squad according to his wish, LVG has nowhere to hide. I cannot believe people are defending him here.
They have never played like Barcelona, they have technical players playing to their strength, that's it. Arsenal transition pretty fast, it has almost always be the case in the last 10 years, sometimes they missed their runners through injuries and couldn't be that fast.
They tried playing like Barca, that's my point. Even Barca's transitions were pretty quick, and their final 3rd play was quick. All one touch passing and runners from deep.
Anyway, I think it's best to just agree to disagree!
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