LVG Out Thread | BBC: Sacked!

Do you want LVG sacked?

  • Total voters
    1,419
Status
Not open for further replies.
No need to get on Chicharito's case in order to defend LVG. In my opinion we could have used him - you can always use a player like him. But it was a complicated situation. He wanted more minutes and we couldn't guarantee that.

It makes no sense to bring up his current performances for another team as proof that we were wrong to let him go - far too simplistic. But he wasn't a player we positively should have gotten rid of because he wasn't good enough. He was clearly good enough to play a certain role for us. The question is whether he wanted to play that role himself. And, yes - to a degree it's a question of LVG's judgments and priorities. But every manager has those. Not valuing a player highly enough, within your particular system, to hang on to him at all costs does not amount to dismissing his overall quality.
 
UnitedinRed said:
I don't think it does tbf. Hernandez attitude is/was the issue.

He stank the place up and made Rooney look competent. Revitalising his career after is Jo surprise. It only goes to show how poor his attide was here.
Click to expand...
His attitude? Anyone not given a chance will be annoyed about it. He never stopped working and he didn't exactly have an 'attitude' under Ferguson. Like I said before. It suggests he was mismanaged. In fact it's so obvious he was that it doesn't deserve debate.
 
Dr. Funkenstein said:
Must remind them of the 2011-2012 Champions League
Click to expand...

This sort of argument doesn't really work. "Bad things have happened before" is not a valid excuse for bad things happening again. It's similar to the "we played crap football under Fergie too" argument. So what? Fergie was in charge for 27 years. You'll find examples of most things happening during his uncommonly long reign.
 
this is getting like the moyes -"it's the players fault" - LVH isn't doing the players any favors and chich wasn't sharp in the beginning of the season but who was. based on that we'd have no one on the side. he stuck with falsecow for a fecking season because he was his boy. so we bring in a player (not the players fault) in nick powell who has no fecking chance of scoring. poor selections on who stays and who goes without regard to squad quality.
 
mu77 said:
the guy defending louis van holland drinks shit beer and he loves herrera more than LVH and says rooney's past it so why make him undroppable.
Click to expand...
Is the same guy who posted the videos. :lol:

At the end of the day his taste in bear is up to him.

My only problem With what Steve said is the way we are failing to score we don't look like finishing in the CL places. Hopefully the CL exit will give them the kick up the arse they need to become more attacking.
 
Fully Fledged said:
Is the same guy who posted the videos. :lol:

At the end of the day his taste in bear is up to him.

My only problem With what Steve said is the way we are failing to score we don't look like finishing in the CL places. Hopefully the CL exit will give them the kick up the arse they need to become more attacking.
Click to expand...

mine was his praise for players (i agree with) that LVH doesn't seem to want to play. and steve rightly points out rooney's past it FFS that's a poor defence. (Please don't tell me Steve is a barrister:))
the - "we have the ball how is that too defensive" it is if you have the players shit scared about movement. thin squad before the injuries and now no squad. a 19/20 yr old leading the , irrespective of how good he is or will be is inconsequential. our direct competitors have 3 striking options with the young kid being the 3rd option. he's our number one. new team new country , too much for a kid and he's done great. but he has enormous pressure on him to score.

still shit beer!:)
 
I'm sickened there's so many United fans that want him out so early. We are meant to be one of the "good-guy" clubs, that give managers a chance to prove their worth and to apply their teaching and principles to the club. We did that with Ferguson after a floundering start and thank Christ for that.

Here we have LvG, one of the most proven and decorated managers in the game today. A manager who has bought well (Martial and Blind have been our best performers this season, and most people didn't know who they were this time last season). A manager who has given youth a chance, giving a debut to countless players in our youth system - something 99% of managers would not have the balls to do at the highest level, but something that has been lauded for years as "the United way" (I guess "we can't win anything with kids"). A manager who has, in a relatively short space of time, shown that he can improve the side.

Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years. This is with Chris Smalling (who, before LvG was around, was a calamity of a player - let's not forget) playing out of his skin, Ashley Young, Messiah reincarnate with LvG's influence (need I say anything about his pre-LvG contributions), Blind being excellent and Luke Shaw being extremely unlucky.

Our one ray of sunshine in attack has been Martial, who LvG brought in despite WIDESPREAD criticism, for God sake.

I think it's sickening that United fans want a manager this experience out. I think it's really entitled, horrible and genuinely sickening, a symptom of the age that we are in. LvG took a poison chalice with taking managerial control of a club that was aging, wildly imbalanced, and had expectations far above their current level. He has made progress, and a lot of it - to get rid of him now when he has barely begun that process is an irrational, unfair product of this instant-gratification world. Removing him now is ultimately something that we would live to regret dearly.
 
Reapersoul20 said:
I'm sickened there's so many United fans that want him out so early. We are meant to be one of the "good-guy" clubs, that give managers a chance to prove their worth and to apply their teaching and principles to the club. We did that with Ferguson after a floundering start and thank Christ for that.

Here we have LvG, one of the most proven and decorated managers in the game today. A manager who has bought well (Martial and Blind have been our best performers this season, and most people didn't know who they were this time last season). A manager who has given youth a chance, giving a debut to countless players in our youth system - something 99% of managers would not have the balls to do at the highest level, but something that has been lauded for years as "the United way" (I guess "we can't win anything with kids"). A manager who has, in a relatively short space of time, shown that he can improve the side.

Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years. This is with Chris Smalling (who, before LvG was around, was a calamity of a player - let's not forget) playing out of his skin, Ashley Young, Messiah reincarnate with LvG's influence (need I say anything about his pre-LvG contributions), Blind being excellent and Luke Shaw being extremely unlucky.

Our one ray of sunshine in attack has been Martial, who LvG brought in despite WIDESPREAD criticism, for God sake.

I think it's sickening that United fans want a manager this experience out. I think it's really entitled, horrible and genuinely sickening, a symptom of the age that we are in. LvG took a poison chalice with taking managerial control of a club that was aging, wildly imbalanced, and had expectations far above their current level. He has made progress, and a lot of it - to get rid of him now when he has barely begun that process is an irrational, unfair product of this instant-gratification world. Removing him now is ultimately something that we would live to regret dearly.
Click to expand...

LVG isn't here for 6 years to turn it around. He's got another 18 months tops. When you only give yourself 3 years at a club you have to hit your straps from the offset. He set the time scale nobody else.
 
Reapersoul20 said:
LvG took a poison chalice...
Click to expand...

I don't agree with that at all. If anyone did that it was Moyes. After his utter failure, LVG had it relatively easy in his initial season in terms of expectations.

The main reason people have turned on him in this fashion isn't even results - it's his brand of football. If that is "entitlement" or fans being "plastic" I struggle to understand what these terms are supposed to mean. The vast majority of Caf members wouldn't be baying for blood if it weren't for the football. The results are not as good as they might have been, but they're clearly not the reason why people are in such a state.

Most fans on here aren't even horribly impatient. The full-scale animosity is recent. He's not been five minutes on the job, he's halfway through his contract.

I don't want him sacked, and many others don't want him sacked either. We're just tired of the football - and many of us fail to see why our performances are the inevitable byproduct of the rebuilding job he's in charge of. It's a matter of pointing out that he is failing in certain ways (ways that are important to many fans), not a matter of calling him a "fraud" or a "clown". Some posters on here do precisely that - and they're idiots or overly emotional. But they are not the only category of fans who are a bit fed up with LVG at the moment.
 
Reapersoul20 said:
I'm sickened there's so many United fans that want him out so early.

Here we have LvG, one of the most proven and decorated managers in the game today. A manager who has bought well (Martial and Blind have been our best performers this season, and most people didn't know who they were this time last season). A manager who has given youth a chance, giving a debut to countless players in our youth system - s. A manager who has, in a relatively short space of time, shown that he can improve the side.

Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years. This is with Chris Smalling (who, before LvG was around, was a calamity of a player - let's not forget) playing out of his skin, Ashley Young, Messiah reincarnate with LvG's influence (need I say anything about his pre-LvG contributions),

Our one ray of sunshine in attack has been Martial, who LvG brought in despite WIDESPREAD criticism, for God sake.
Click to expand...

so you were 100% behind moyes and didn't want him out?

He was proven many moons ago and unfortunately this is now a different world. Blind played for him in the WC so unless you didn't watch it you knew of him.

every mgr we've had has brought youth in , even moyes wit AJ. who LVH sent away on loan.

with two DMF in front of a back 4. simples. LVH does this even at home and could this be the reason we are so tight up top and fail to score?

why leave ashley young on the bench chasing goals and bring in nick powell?

who's to blame for one ray of sunshine? LVH is mate. the silly man made rooney capt and therefore in his own words undroppable. not good.
 
I am one of those that want him out in the summer so we can bring in Pep if he's available or Ancelotti. However, the Moyes debacle left quite an impression on me and so I think he has achieved the most important thing I wanted him to do.
He has brought stability and a fighting spirit back to the club.
People forget we were losing every other game under Moyes b, the confidence around the club was beyond shattered.
Now, I don't think he's the one to bring us future success but sacking him now is beyond stupid and an unnecessary risk.
 
Adisa said:
I am one of those that want him out in the summer so we can bring in Pep if he's available or Ancelotti. However, the Moyes debacle left quite an impression on me and so I think he has achieved the most important thing I wanted him to do.
He has brought stability and a fighting spirit back to the club.
People forget we were losing every other game under Moyes b, the confidence around the club was beyond shattered.
Now, I don't think he's the one to bring us future success but sacking him now is beyond stupid and an unnecessary risk.
Click to expand...
unless we have a replacement lined up already. (i.e. ancelotti)

agree with everything else you said though
 
Reapersoul20 said:
I'm sickened there's so many United fans that want him out so early. We are meant to be one of the "good-guy" clubs, that give managers a chance to prove their worth and to apply their teaching and principles to the club. We did that with Ferguson after a floundering start and thank Christ for that.

Here we have LvG, one of the most proven and decorated managers in the game today. A manager who has bought well (Martial and Blind have been our best performers this season, and most people didn't know who they were this time last season). A manager who has given youth a chance, giving a debut to countless players in our youth system - something 99% of managers would not have the balls to do at the highest level, but something that has been lauded for years as "the United way" (I guess "we can't win anything with kids"). A manager who has, in a relatively short space of time, shown that he can improve the side.

Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years. This is with Chris Smalling (who, before LvG was around, was a calamity of a player - let's not forget) playing out of his skin, Ashley Young, Messiah reincarnate with LvG's influence (need I say anything about his pre-LvG contributions), Blind being excellent and Luke Shaw being extremely unlucky.

Our one ray of sunshine in attack has been Martial, who LvG brought in despite WIDESPREAD criticism, for God sake.

I think it's sickening that United fans want a manager this experience out. I think it's really entitled, horrible and genuinely sickening, a symptom of the age that we are in. LvG took a poison chalice with taking managerial control of a club that was aging, wildly imbalanced, and had expectations far above their current level. He has made progress, and a lot of it - to get rid of him now when he has barely begun that process is an irrational, unfair product of this instant-gratification world. Removing him now is ultimately something that we would live to regret dearly.
Click to expand...

You're laying it on a bit thick wouldn't you say?

 
Last edited:
Reapersoul20 said:
Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years.
Click to expand...

This is obviously not true, though. Even if you were to only account for the league, where we have been admittedly impressive, there have been seasons in the past years years where we conceded less than we are currently on track to do. In the Champions League, we have conceded 7 or more on two other occasions in the last fifteen years. Both of those seasons we scored significantly more goals than this year and advanced from the group stages. Dour Moyes managed a goalscoring record of 12-3 in a group that was hardly any easier than this one.

I must ask, what is the ultimate goal here? Is it to concede as few goals as possible, or is it to win games? Even as impressive as our defensive effort is in the league, we're currently on track for the lowest number of goals scored in the last fifteen years. By a fair margin. Significantly less than Moyes managed to get sacked with (although that itself was a couple more than van Gaal managed last year, even if the Dutchman did manage to improve the goal difference as a whole by three goals).

By some miracle (Brendan Rodgers and Chelsea meltdown) we are actually still 4th and within touching distance of the leaders. Actually dropping out of 4th is nearly impossible, but nor do I think we'll make a serious challenge for the title.
 
acnumber9 said:
His attitude? Anyone not given a chance will be annoyed about it. He never stopped working and he didn't exactly have an 'attitude' under Ferguson. Like I said before. It suggests he was mismanaged. In fact it's so obvious he was that it doesn't deserve debate.
Click to expand...

Did he. Every chance he got he was by far the worst player on the pitch. And we had sone poor performers.

Fact is he didn't take the Fergie retirement well. Like many others. That's their issue and theirs alone.
 
UnitedinRed said:
Did he. Every chance he got he was by far the worst player on the pitch. And we had sone poor performers.

Fact is he didn't take the Fergie retirement well. Like many others. That's their issue and theirs alone.
Click to expand...

so why is rooney undroppable? he's been the worst player on the pitch as well. LVH made him captain of MUFC. management issues IMO. oh but rooney's attitude is fine because he's not getting loaned out or sat because he's shit. he still plays when healthy - makes LVH into a bit of a man who left his bollocks at his last job.

i missed what cheech said about LVH or the club on his departure.
 
mu77 said:
so why is rooney undroppable? he's been the worst player on the pitch as well. LVH made him captain of MUFC. management issues IMO. oh but rooney's attitude is fine because he's not getting loaned out or sat because he's shit. he still plays when healthy - makes LVH into a bit of a man who left his bollocks at his last job.

i missed what cheech said about LVH or the club on his departure.
Click to expand...

Took a while but Rooney's also been dropped. Hopefully long-term so that hungry, talented youngsters can come in.
 
UnitedinRed said:
Took a while but Rooney's also been dropped. Hopefully long-term so that hungry, talented youngsters can come in.
Click to expand...

the feck he has he's not fit. LVH fecked it up and you will defend him to the death. that's fine but don't make shit up. i can't wait to see the back of them both.
 
acnumber9 said:
His attitude? Anyone not given a chance will be annoyed about it. He never stopped working and he didn't exactly have an 'attitude' under Ferguson. Like I said before. It suggests he was mismanaged. In fact it's so obvious he was that it doesn't deserve debate.
Click to expand...
"Mismanaged" by 3 different managers?
 
mu77 said:
the feck he has he's not fit. LVH fecked it up and you will defend him to the death. that's fine but don't make shit up. i can't wait to see the back of them both.
Click to expand...

Is he? I don't work for the club so can only speculate.

Oh and I don't defend him. I am unbiased in my opinion. You ate not. Don't confuse the two very different situations.

Your final sentence explains why.
 
My prediction is that he will soon start to lose the players, one by one, and that will be the final nail in his coffin. The likes of Blind, who laugh at the suggestion we aren't entertaining, are his big allies but they're not big enough influences at this club to keep all the players and the fans on his side.
 
pocco said:
My prediction is that he will soon start to lose the players, one by one, and that will be the final nail in his coffin. The likes of Blind, who laugh at the suggestion we aren't entertaining, are his big allies but they're not big enough influences at this club to keep all the players and the fans on his side.
Click to expand...

I think the signs are there that he has already lost them.
 
I wish Hernandez had stayed but him doing well at Leverkuson doesn't necessarily mean that he would have done well at United. Plenty of people felt that he needed to go to a smaller club a good while back to play consistently and re-establish himself. He's done that and seems to be doing well. I'm happy for him. But it doesn't mean that he would have done well for us unde LVG either. Sometimes a change can be the right decision for a player.
 
Reapersoul20 said:
I'm sickened there's so many United fans that want him out so early. We are meant to be one of the "good-guy" clubs, that give managers a chance to prove their worth and to apply their teaching and principles to the club. We did that with Ferguson after a floundering start and thank Christ for that.

Here we have LvG, one of the most proven and decorated managers in the game today. A manager who has bought well (Martial and Blind have been our best performers this season, and most people didn't know who they were this time last season). A manager who has given youth a chance, giving a debut to countless players in our youth system - something 99% of managers would not have the balls to do at the highest level, but something that has been lauded for years as "the United way" (I guess "we can't win anything with kids"). A manager who has, in a relatively short space of time, shown that he can improve the side.

Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years. This is with Chris Smalling (who, before LvG was around, was a calamity of a player - let's not forget) playing out of his skin, Ashley Young, Messiah reincarnate with LvG's influence (need I say anything about his pre-LvG contributions), Blind being excellent and Luke Shaw being extremely unlucky.

Our one ray of sunshine in attack has been Martial, who LvG brought in despite WIDESPREAD criticism, for God sake.

I think it's sickening that United fans want a manager this experience out. I think it's really entitled, horrible and genuinely sickening, a symptom of the age that we are in. LvG took a poison chalice with taking managerial control of a club that was aging, wildly imbalanced, and had expectations far above their current level. He has made progress, and a lot of it - to get rid of him now when he has barely begun that process is an irrational, unfair product of this instant-gratification world. Removing him now is ultimately something that we would live to regret dearly.
Click to expand...
Its like we went back in time.

The Moyes apologist were saying exactly the same thing.

Now if you could just call anyone not in support of Van Gaal a plastic fan with no patience, and add that you wouldnt mind us losing in order to get rid of the plastics, you'll have nailed perfectly.
 
Rednotdead said:
"Mismanaged" by 3 different managers?
Click to expand...

He wasn't mismanaged by Ferguson. He was happy being 3rd/4th choice because Ferguson was good at rotating and giving him enough minutes to show what he could do. In 10/11 he was given 27 starts and in 11/12 and 12/13 he was given 22. That's whist the likes of Berbatov, Rooney, Welbeck and van Persie were all in the squad at various points.

And after scoring 18 goals in our title season how many starts does he get under Moyes? 12. Van Gaal loaned him out straight away and then decided he was no longer required after three games.
 
Reapersoul20 said:
I'm sickened there's so many United fans that want him out so early. We are meant to be one of the "good-guy" clubs, that give managers a chance to prove their worth and to apply their teaching and principles to the club. We did that with Ferguson after a floundering start and thank Christ for that.

Here we have LvG, one of the most proven and decorated managers in the game today. A manager who has bought well (Martial and Blind have been our best performers this season, and most people didn't know who they were this time last season). A manager who has given youth a chance, giving a debut to countless players in our youth system - something 99% of managers would not have the balls to do at the highest level, but something that has been lauded for years as "the United way" (I guess "we can't win anything with kids"). A manager who has, in a relatively short space of time, shown that he can improve the side.

Defensively we have performed at the highest level in about fifteen years. This is with Chris Smalling (who, before LvG was around, was a calamity of a player - let's not forget) playing out of his skin, Ashley Young, Messiah reincarnate with LvG's influence (need I say anything about his pre-LvG contributions), Blind being excellent and Luke Shaw being extremely unlucky.

Our one ray of sunshine in attack has been Martial, who LvG brought in despite WIDESPREAD criticism, for God sake.

I think it's sickening that United fans want a manager this experience out. I think it's really entitled, horrible and genuinely sickening, a symptom of the age that we are in. LvG took a poison chalice with taking managerial control of a club that was aging, wildly imbalanced, and had expectations far above their current level. He has made progress, and a lot of it - to get rid of him now when he has barely begun that process is an irrational, unfair product of this instant-gratification world. Removing him now is ultimately something that we would live to regret dearly.
Click to expand...

Refreshing to see that there are those out there still capable of rational thinking. People seem to have forgotten how mentally shot we were under Moyes and Van Gaal, despite his shortcomings, has restored some of that. Very good post.
 
UnitedinRed said:
Goalscoring records. My apologies you failed to understand...
Click to expand...

To be honest, I don't understand the link between Rooney not scoring goals and Hernandez re-becoming his old self goalscorer in a different environment.
 
UnitedinRed said:
Goalscoring records. My apologies you failed to understand...
Click to expand...
Ok. Hernandez had and continues to have a good scoring record. People pointing that out are accused of rewriting history. You then talk about Rooney for some reason. And I'm the one failing to understand? I don't think you have a single clue what point you're trying to make at all.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.