Nani, Valencia and Young are all fantastic players but if some weird hypothetical came about where we could only keep one I would choose Nani. It wouldn't even be a hard choice. Our most dangerous attacking player when on form IMO.
Luis Nani | 2011/12 Performances
- Thread starter Kelvin
- Start date
- Status
And let's be honest, if Barcelona were to take just one of our wingers, it wouldn't' be Young or Valencia would it.
Guardiola said Valencia was the best winger in the world....
I agree with those who say that he hasn't had as underwhelming a season as people like to say he has had. Admittedly, it wasn't as good as the 2010/2011 season, however he wasn't too much worse than Valencia to be honest. The difference between them was that the majority of Valencia's best performances came in the 2nd half of the season, while Nani's came in the earlier stages. Obviously Valencia did have a better overall season than him, but not by as much as some people would let you believe.
It's funny cause this was supposedly one of Young's main attributes when we signed him, but I've not been impressed with his crossing or set piece delivery much. I wouldn't call it outrageously dangerous for starters.
IMO, Young is the weakest out of the 3 wingers we have, which is not a slight on him given the quality of the other two.
Which is rather meaningless considering Guardiola is no longer the manager of Barcelona, though.
That was a mental statement to make though.
well done son
Can't disagree with any of that.
If Fergie let Nani off the leash he would be even more effective, however consistency has always been his biggest problem. He needs to bring it every game.
Are you saying that Nani does not do his defensive duties?
There are some games where Valencia hits 15 crosses before he finds his target yet every pass that goes astray from Nani is met with derision.
Nani was sensational last year and decent this year considering his injuries. Valencia had a better season than Nani this time round but I feel that Nani is a better player than Valencia and Young.
Fergie once said Raul was the best player in a team which consisted of legends such as Zidane, Figo and Ronaldo...
Yeah Fergie has also thought the likes of Miller, Djemba etc were united players when they clearly weren't even premier league players. No point basing your arguments on that.
Having said that if he's talking about throwback wingers who look to go one the outside, get to the byline etc then I think Valencia is up there with the best. In terms of wide players though, particularly modern wide players who are expected to have a bit of variety to their game then I think Nani is without a doubt our best winger and one of the best around.
I dunno what it is about him that has him splitting opinions. As others have said maybe it's because Valencia's power is a lot more obvious and Nani in some ways is like Giggs- high risk. He'll take the difficult option and sometimes it won't come off but when it does then you're likely to get a goal, or at least an opportunity.
Tbh I think Nani has been unfortunate this season. Overall injuries haven't helped but I also think he was unlucky in that he started the season brightly and when the rest of the attackers tailed off he was still playing well but because of the issues in the team such as defensive and midfield frailties due to injuries and the other attackers like Rooney being off form, it wasn't that obvious. Then when Nani did get injured around the new year we started to get a lot more stability in the back and slowly we picked up form.
Either way in terms of what he brings to the attack he offers a variety that Valencia can't match and a level of skill/technique that is above Young. I think the best way we can approve out attack is to add more variety and interplay amongst the front four, which is why I think we're interested in the players we've been linked too, and Nani will be a big player in that. Next season if he can stay fit and we get better luck with injuries/new signings then I think he'll show everyone how good he really is. People go on about final product but I don't think anyone has more assists then him in the last two yearrs and his goal return is good compared to others in his position and given his injuries.
Having said that if he's talking about throwback wingers who look to go one the outside, get to the byline etc then I think Valencia is up there with the best. In terms of wide players though, particularly modern wide players who are expected to have a bit of variety to their game then I think Nani is without a doubt our best winger and one of the best around.
I dunno what it is about him that has him splitting opinions. As others have said maybe it's because Valencia's power is a lot more obvious and Nani in some ways is like Giggs- high risk. He'll take the difficult option and sometimes it won't come off but when it does then you're likely to get a goal, or at least an opportunity.
Tbh I think Nani has been unfortunate this season. Overall injuries haven't helped but I also think he was unlucky in that he started the season brightly and when the rest of the attackers tailed off he was still playing well but because of the issues in the team such as defensive and midfield frailties due to injuries and the other attackers like Rooney being off form, it wasn't that obvious. Then when Nani did get injured around the new year we started to get a lot more stability in the back and slowly we picked up form.
Either way in terms of what he brings to the attack he offers a variety that Valencia can't match and a level of skill/technique that is above Young. I think the best way we can approve out attack is to add more variety and interplay amongst the front four, which is why I think we're interested in the players we've been linked too, and Nani will be a big player in that. Next season if he can stay fit and we get better luck with injuries/new signings then I think he'll show everyone how good he really is. People go on about final product but I don't think anyone has more assists then him in the last two yearrs and his goal return is good compared to others in his position and given his injuries.
Weren't Barca after Nani once when his stock was low? Think it was after a CL final, can't remember which one.
I was going to post the same thing. I'm 90% sure they bid for him and we rejected it. I guess that was a good few years before they bought Sanchez though, else they wouldn't have bothered, especially with people like Tello and Cuenca coming through - why would they want Nani?
He also added "at the moment". Which Valencia was at the time. But there's no way Barca would ever sign him... when would he ever get the chance in a match to go to the byeline to whip it in? Barca don't play like that. Unless he went as a right back.
Wow. Quite a standard there ramshock. I wonder what you think of Rooney
Nani is certainly the best winger at the club on paper. Despite the fact that Valencia is possibly more productive its quite clear Nani is better than him. If you were to assess Nani against Valencia or Young based purely on technical ability and what he's capable of with a football at his feet then Nani wins hands down.
Nani is burdened by the weight of expectation in a way other players at United aren't. Nobody expects Valencia to do what Nani can do. Don't get me wrong I actually like Valencia more than Nani simply because I have confidence that even when he's having just an average day at the office he'll create chances for the strikers. But it'd be foolish to suggest the fans expect as much from Tony as they do from Nani. If Tony doesn't use his left and shanks a shot to the corner flag we write it off, if Nani does it he gets slated because we all feel like with his talent that should be bread and butter for him.
Its unfortunate cos Nani probably doesn't get the credit he deserves for the good things he does because the fans' expectations of him are so monumental. He has, to my mind, always suffered from the next Ronaldo tag that he was lumbered with at Sporting. We, and I count myself, are guilty of sometimes wanting Nani to be a player he's not instead of judging him on his own merits.
Nani is burdened by the weight of expectation in a way other players at United aren't. Nobody expects Valencia to do what Nani can do. Don't get me wrong I actually like Valencia more than Nani simply because I have confidence that even when he's having just an average day at the office he'll create chances for the strikers. But it'd be foolish to suggest the fans expect as much from Tony as they do from Nani. If Tony doesn't use his left and shanks a shot to the corner flag we write it off, if Nani does it he gets slated because we all feel like with his talent that should be bread and butter for him.
Its unfortunate cos Nani probably doesn't get the credit he deserves for the good things he does because the fans' expectations of him are so monumental. He has, to my mind, always suffered from the next Ronaldo tag that he was lumbered with at Sporting. We, and I count myself, are guilty of sometimes wanting Nani to be a player he's not instead of judging him on his own merits.
Well actually 07, about that "productive" thing and the fact that you think Valencia will create even on an off day. As has already been posted in this thread, Nani produced more last year than Valencia, a year where Valencia was named POTY. That should tell you a lot about productivity.
Nani had more appearances than Valencia last season.
Re the bold, sorry I don't agree with that at all. Just because Valencia isn't the 'flair' player that Nani is doesn't mean his apparent consistency is down to a lack of ability to try anything else, he simple makes the right decision the vast majority of the time.
I really don't like these discussions, they inevitably end up with people putting down one of our players in order to big up the other. Both these guys are fantastic, I'm just delighted to have the different things they bring to our squad.
Nani 33 starts
Valencia 30 starts
Not a significant difference really.
What are the actual stats for goals/assists last season? (it must also be noted here that Valencia played about 5 games at RB).
You're missing the point. The problem with saying "Valencia makes the right decision the vast majority of the time" is that they don't have the same options to make decisions from because they play very different games. Nani often does something like: beat his man from a standing start and create space, even get into the box; curl the ball onto someone's head or into a teammate's path with weaker foot or right foot; cut in and take a shot with weaker foot or right foot; play centrally as a striker, etc. Valencia's options, on the other hand, are often something like: beat his man for pace and/or strength and whip it into the box; pass the ball backwards or sideways, etc.
Now, this is a bit of a simplification of the reality and it isn't intended to be an indictment of Valencia, its just pointing out the fact that Nani is more technical and therefore plays a game that is less safe. So saying Valencia is more consistent not because he produces on the pitch more regularly and reliably - which he doesn't - but because you think he "makes the right decision the vast majority of the time" is a very twisted piece of understanding.
As for your assertion that Nani's played more games than Valencia, that's not true. They've started the same amount of games in all competitions for United.
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/team/squad/_/id/360/league/all/manchester-united?cc=5901
Soccernet has them level at 32 starts with Nani having contributed to 22 goals vs Valencia's 21.
I counted each game individually on Stretford End Stats so I no doubt miscounted.
I counted the Comm Shield too meaning Nani had 1 more start but also 2 extra goals.
All in all though, similar stats all round then, although as I said, it must be noted that Valencia played 5 of those games at RB. Judging by the way some talk on here you'd think Valencia wiped the floor with Nani in terms of productivity.
2 cracking wingers
I counted each game individually on Stretford End Stats so I no doubt miscounted.
I counted the Comm Shield too meaning Nani had 1 more start but also 2 extra goals.
All in all though, similar stats all round then, although as I said, it must be noted that Valencia played 5 of those games at RB. Judging by the way some talk on here you'd think Valencia wiped the floor with Nani in terms of productivity.
2 cracking wingers
I know, two cracking wingers in their own right. The only thing is Nani's more productive on the right and so is Valencia. They've never really had to compete for the same spot long enough and I think its going to come down to that next season or at some point in the future. It will be interesting to see what the outcome of that will be.
I can't really see that unless we bring in two attacking players who aren't strikers but attacking midfielders/can play wide. If we bring in only one like Kagawa then I still see Nani and Valencia on each wing.
I am not saying Nani does not do his defensive duties but just not as well as Valencia. Nani has some attributes better than Valencia and Valencia has some attributes better than Nani but both top wingers. But my preference is for Valencia as he is relentless and straightforward at what he does where as Nani is more of a Maverick he does things in moments and his unpredictability is great and both frustrating to watch. I would love to see Nani off Rooney in the hole like he did against Aston Villa, ps not seen much of Hazard but if he's anywhere Nani standard then I'd go all out sign him today.
Agree. If we sign an attacking midfielder and striker then it should not affect Nani's opportunities to play and become a regular, left or right, but if we did sign 2 attack minded midfielders, e.g Hazard and Kagawa then it greatly enhances the competition between Valencia, Young and Nani, especially with Hazard being able to play from either flank. Valencia is very strong on the right and generally Fergie likes to have one flank covered by a wide player who is strong defensively, especially if the other flank is occupied by a flair player who offers less protection for the fullback. That's why I fear Nani may suffer more in terms of appearances, particularly starts. It depends on signing someone like Hazard though as there is very few people good enough to oust Nani as a first choice player, and there is no proof that Hazard can be that player in the premier league.
Why are you still posting in here? Everything you've said is total rubbish, give it a rest.
No need to be a dick. He's expressing an opinion and that last post seems reasonable. You may disagree but it's certainly not rubbish.
If you compare that with the posts he made earlier and in the Hazard thread then you'll see my point. Total contradiction on top of posting the same things over and over.
You really do hold a grudge, or as you would say "hate everything"
Buying Hazard and/or Kagawa could mean a shift towards 4-3-3, where the only player whom I would consider in danger then would be Valencia as he is clearly better suited in a 4-4-2 where he sticks out wide. He could be that lethal fullback though, Alvez style. Nani, Young and Hazard by the looks of things like to keep wide but also cut inside. Imo, it wouldn't hurt having all four, especially if we are not providing more backup for Rooney - both Young and Hazard could fill his role decently also.
I don't hold a grudge at all, I'll just argue against what I disagree with! If I held grudges I'd be constantly insulting Pogue
I agree about the 4-3-3, something we need to start using again.
I agree about the 4-3-3, something we need to start using again.
I don't hold a grudge at all, I'll just argue against what I disagree with! If I held grudges I'd be constantly insulting Pogue
I agree about the 4-3-3, something we need to start using again.
Cina to be fair Pogue has a point it is a forum let the guy have an opinion even if it is different to yours mate. If you don't agree or like it post your reply or not and move on.
Anyone else happy for our attacking player now that we haven't actually signed Hazard?
Nani is currently a better player than Hazard, theres no saying Hazard will fulfil his potential. Assuming we will sign Kagawa, and with Owen/Berba leaving, we will have the following attacking players:
Nani, Valencia, Young, Rooney, Kagawa, Welbeck, Hernandez
That's very strong to me.
Nani is currently a better player than Hazard, theres no saying Hazard will fulfil his potential. Assuming we will sign Kagawa, and with Owen/Berba leaving, we will have the following attacking players:
Nani, Valencia, Young, Rooney, Kagawa, Welbeck, Hernandez
That's very strong to me.
Yeah I was happy with it anyway, and with Kagawa truly able to play that advanced midfielder role I'll be delighted with it if once he signs.
Would've been nice to get Hazard, always great to buy potentially World Class players but he was never necessary.
Would've been nice to get Hazard, always great to buy potentially World Class players but he was never necessary.
I'm not happy for them no, competition is always good and I feel we could do with a bit more versatility and creativity up top.
I don't think he meant, "are you pleased for them". I think he meant, "are you happy WITH them", as in, are you happy with what we have in attack if just Kagawa joins our current crop of attackers.
I may be wrong though but that's how I read it.
Competition is not always good, too many cooks can spoil the broth. Yeah we need to add creativity, which Kagawa will provide.
I'm not happy in the sense that it wouldn't have mattered to Nani if he's as good as we think he is.He'd have been good enough to play regularly with Hazard
- Status