Liverpool : General discussion

montpelier said:
Re: consistency

This is since Xmas (lot of Cup games) is interesting

WWL W DDL WW LDLDL WDWDWWW

The 1st bad patch is a bit of a red herring, Exeter draw (kids), Arsenal, undeserved loss to Utd (a these thing happen loss)

Stoke-WestHam-Leics-Sunderland-WestHam comprises the 5 non-wins after the 5-4 win at Norwich, seeing a decline in form (loss of confidence conceding 4 or triggered some changes whatever)
Getting there, though according to that, & 7 unbeaten atm

edit - (think that's right, haven't super-checked for accuracy)
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It's no coincidence that we've improved since Coutinho and Sturridge have returned to fitness. There was a period where we played Firmino up top but had players like Milner, Lallana (much improved now), Henderson and Ibe to play around him and we didn't really have enough going forward. You could see from the United game in the league that we could play well but didn't have the creativity to worry you enough.

We're also benefiting from not playing three games a week now. Klopp didn't have that until February so he hasn't had as much time to work with the players. He's also had to adjust to the league which hasn't always been easy for him. We've been out fought by several sides like Palace at home, and West Ham and Watford away. We're definitely better than we were a couple of months ago but there's still lots of room for improvement.
 
montpelier said:
Re: consistency

This is since Xmas (lot of Cup games) is interesting

WWL W DDL WW LDLDL WDWDWWW

The 1st bad patch is a bit of a red herring, Exeter draw (kids), Arsenal, undeserved loss to Utd (a these thing happen loss)

Stoke-WestHam-Leics-Sunderland-WestHam comprises the 5 non-wins after the 5-4 win at Norwich, seeing a decline in form (loss of confidence conceding 4 or triggered some changes whatever)

Getting there, though according to that, & 7 unbeaten atm

edit - (think that's right, haven't super-checked for accuracy)
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Those last seven are very interesting. Our CBs are always getting slammed but the defence has only conceded 2 goals in that last 7.33 matches (City x2, Augsberg x2, Villa(A) , Palace(A), United).
 
Seeing Lovren playing well is shocking to say the least. Long may it continue!
 
Scholes said: “I hadn’t been sure about Firmino but this last week he has convinced me. He’s been brilliant.

“[Anfield] is the hardest place to come as a United player by a million miles. You can go 90 minutes without touching the ball and still win 1-0. That’s the way it is.

“If you do that, it is just about acceptable. But when you saw the gulf in quality here, it was just incredible. Look at the forward players Liverpool had: Coutinho, Firmino, Sturridge. They’ve got goals.

“Lallana had a quiet period but he looks like a real player. Before the Liverpool versus Manchester City game, which I worked at, I was thinking, ‘Klopp might only keep two or three of this team’. “But what is he building now? They need to go on from here. They can go on from here. They could even finish in the top four in the Premier League this year if it carries on.”
 
Ian Ayre to step down as LFC CEO in May 2017.

 
Liverpool are still pretty awful.

Congrats on being a slightly lighter shade of shit.
 
I think their front line is pretty good, significantly better than ours. They have a few gems in Coutinho and Sturridge already, Firmino looks decent too.
 
Minimalist said:
Liverpool are still pretty awful.

Congrats on being a slightly lighter shade of shit.
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I think we were pretty poor on the night to be fair. The last twenty were fairly comfortable but some of our link up play was poor. Lovren and Sakho were excellent with the latter shading it for MOTM.

I think Sturridge needs to go. I don't like his attitude at all since he came back from injury.
 
Borys said:
I think their front line is pretty good, significantly better than ours. They have a few gems in Coutinho and Sturridge already, Firmino looks decent too.
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Sturridge is a big concern right now. Injury prone and badly out of form (at best...at worst the injuries have stripped him of ability).
 
We'd have battered them with a Fergie team tonight, they were quite average. We almost did it with incompetent Lvg if it wasn't for Coutinho.
 
Has Sturridge scored since he returned? Maybe he just needs a goal to get some confidence. Did look a bit flat.
 
ZDwyr said:
Has Sturridge scored since he returned? Maybe he just needs a goal to get some confidence. Did look a bit flat.
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Yeah a penalty against you last week and a goal against Villa but I don't like the way he leads the line. You could see the difference Origi made when he came on. Sturridge doesn't have the work rate needed for me. There is a possibility that the injuries have reduced his pace somewhat.
 
Who are we signing in the summer then?

Personal opinion... Keeper, box to box mid, winger, and maybe a striker/LB. Don't think we're in dire need of an overhaul, honestly.
 
Tommy said:
Who are we signing in the summer then?

Personal opinion... Keeper, box to box mid, winger, and maybe a striker/LB. Don't think we're in dire need of an overhaul, honestly.
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A keeper and a striker. Right now I'd keep Benteke and sell Sturridge, and if Gotze is available and wants to come we should go for it. A defensive midfielder might be a possibility but I'm starting to think that Can has that position locked down, with Lucas as back up. We're fine at full back, with Clyne/Flanagan for RB and Moreno/Smith for LB with Joe Gomez as a back up for either position. We've got Matip already coming in as a CB too so we're fairly well stocked there.

Toure, Sturridge and Allen should all be moved on if you ask me. Ibe should be loaned out. Markovic is coming back from loan so he's another option.
 
Klopper76 said:
Yeah a penalty against you last week and a goal against Villa but I don't like the way he leads the line. You could see the difference Origi made when he came on. Sturridge doesn't have the work rate needed for me. There is a possibility that the injuries have reduced his pace somewhat.
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:lol: can't believe I forgot the penalty. Maybe it isn't the goal thing then.
 
ZDwyr said:
:lol: can't believe I forgot the penalty. Maybe it isn't the goal thing then.
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It looks like he's slowed down loads. He can't beat a man at the minute and doesn't seem to be able to run in behind.
 
Tommy said:
Who are we signing in the summer then?

Personal opinion... Keeper, box to box mid, winger, and maybe a striker/LB. Don't think we're in dire need of an overhaul, honestly.
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Any idea on how much Klopp will have to spend?
 
Klopper76 said:
It looks like he's slowed down loads. He can't beat a man at the minute and doesn't seem to be able to run in behind.
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He definitely didn't look as quick as Origi. Although I am not sure if Origi was faster than him to begin with.

Quick question, do you know why Rodgers was determined to play Can as a central defender? Looks perfectly suited to that midfield role. He didn't impress me when he played in defence for Leverkusen either. Don't really see what Rodgers was thinking there.
 
ZDwyr said:
He definitely didn't look as quick as Origi. Although I am not sure if Origi was faster than him to begin with.

Quick question, do you know why Rodgers was determined to play Can as a central defender? Looks perfectly suited to that midfield role. He didn't impress me when he played in defence for Leverkusen either. Don't really see what Rodgers was thinking there.
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I think it was more about Rodgers wanting to play three at the back whilst still maintaining a passing game. If you're going to do that you have to have at least one CB who will be able to play out from the back and Can was decent enough on the ball and had some decent performances there. He definitely got found out as time went on and it was a failed experiment in the end. The 6-1 against Stoke was an absolute nightmare game for him.

I have no idea why Can wasn't preferred as a midfielder under Rodgers though as it's clear that he's suited to that role. Like a few of our signings I get the impression that Rodgers didn't know how to utilize him effectively. He's been great since the Capitol One Cup final against City.
 
Truedevil said:
We'd have battered them with a Fergie team tonight, they were quite average. We almost did it with incompetent Lvg if it wasn't for Coutinho.
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That sounds very sour. The sooner you let go of the Fergie thing, the better
 
Klopper76 said:
I have no idea why Can wasn't preferred as a midfielder under Rodgers though as it's clear that he's suited to that role. Like a few of our signings I get the impression that Rodgers didn't know how to utilize him effectively. He's been great since the Capitol One Cup final against City.
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Can is where I am really seeing the Klopp effect. Before he came on board, he was a player with all the right attributes and little in the way of positional sense, movement or workrate to be a good midfielder. He was decent but flawed under Klopp to begin with, but it's coming together for him now. He's really growing defensively, getting in the way of things, winning balls and generally cutting out the periods of lacking concentration that marred him earlier. And on the ball, he is starting to grow into a player that could control games. He's becoming a genuine midfielder. Going to be top notch if he keeps this up.

Lovren is obviously another. I want to say Sakho since, when it works for him it works much better for him under Klopp, but I am not sure he has cut out the fever periods yet. Or if he will.

Either way, I think Rodgers must have run some sort of psychiatric experiment on his defenders. It's crazy how he managed to feck them all up.
 
Truedevil said:
We'd have battered them with a Fergie team tonight, they were quite average. We almost did it with incompetent Lvg if it wasn't for Coutinho.
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Yeah. You came real close to battering us. It was nail biting.
 
I haven't seen Sturridge lately, but yesterday his overall game wasn't good. Didn't seem to make the proper decisions, maybe lacking in confidence so far. Most of all, is he afraid that he will get injured again?
Coutinho was a pleasure to watch, really good player you have there. Lallana seem to have improved under Klopp.
 
B20 said:
Can is where I am really seeing the Klopp effect. Before he came on board, he was a player with all the right attributes and little in the way of positional sense, movement or workrate to be a good midfielder. He was decent but flawed under Klopp to begin with, but it's coming together for him now. He's really growing defensively, getting in the way of things, winning balls and generally cutting out the periods of lacking concentration that marred him earlier. And on the ball, he is starting to grow into a player that could control games. He's becoming a genuine midfielder. Going to be top notch if he keeps this up.

Lovren is obviously another. I want to say Sakho since, when it works for him it works much better for him under Klopp, but I am not sure he has cut out the fever periods yet. Or if he will.

Either way, I think Rodgers must have run some sort of psychiatric experiment on his defenders. It's crazy how he managed to feck them all up.
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Lallana too if the last few games are anything to go by. Too early to say it's not just a good spell of form though, as he had a poor few months under Klopp initially.

For the first time since he joined I think he's actually strung a number of games that hint at him actually being good enough to be a regular, it's good to see - hopefully it lasts.
 
I don't think Lallana will ever become a solid player, he's too 'style over substance' and is largely ineffective. Can has looked very good though.

Overall though, I'm not sure I'd be confident as a Liverpool fan after yesterday's game, I thought you guys were quite mediocre (just less shit than our awful side). It didn't even feel like you were 'managing' the game due to the result last week, just not an overall good game (except towards the end when you were comfortable and our players had given up).

It'll depend on the draw of course, but I don't see you getting past BVB or one of the Spanish teams.
 
B20 said:
Can is where I am really seeing the Klopp effect. Before he came on board, he was a player with all the right attributes and little in the way of positional sense, movement or workrate to be a good midfielder. He was decent but flawed under Klopp to begin with, but it's coming together for him now. He's really growing defensively, getting in the way of things, winning balls and generally cutting out the periods of lacking concentration that marred him earlier. And on the ball, he is starting to grow into a player that could control games. He's becoming a genuine midfielder. Going to be top notch if he keeps this up.

Lovren is obviously another. I want to say Sakho since, when it works for him it works much better for him under Klopp, but I am not sure he has cut out the fever periods yet. Or if he will.

Either way, I think Rodgers must have run some sort of psychiatric experiment on his defenders. It's crazy how he managed to feck them all up.
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Didn't you just win a game 4-3 or something?

Liverpool are headed in the right direction. How far they reach in that direction is another matter but the direction and intent being right is at least the first necessary step.
 
I don't think your team is that much better than ours. But I do like Klopp alot. He at least can inspire and get players to play for him. Love the passion.
 
Rooney in Paris said:
I don't think Lallana will ever become a solid player, he's too 'style over substance' and is largely ineffective. Can has looked very good though.

Overall though, I'm not sure I'd be confident as a Liverpool fan after yesterday's game, I thought you guys were quite mediocre (just less shit than our awful side). It didn't even feel like you were 'managing' the game due to the result last week, just not an overall good game (except towards the end when you were comfortable and our players had given up).

It'll depend on the draw of course, but I don't see you getting past BVB or one of the Spanish teams.
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Agree on Lallana. I think the best he can hope for is to be a welcome squad player.

We were quite poor on the ball in the first half, although we defended well enough imo. Second half, I think we played quite well.

Over the course of the two games, I think we showed a level where I'd fancy our chances against most of the teams left. Dortmund will still rip us a new one and Sevilla might be too good for us as well. But we still have time to keep working and improve. I think we are on an upward curve at the moment.

Of course, we are not so upward that I think us incapable of a collective 90 minute rick here and there, but hopefully we're past that.
 
There are still some stutters with Liverpool but the results trend is good and that's what counts. Klopp has them upwardly mobile at the moment and they could well nick 4th spot.

If they do some reasonable business in the summer then I would say that top 3 would be a serious reality for them. Especially when the Premiership is so mediocre right now.
 
Rooney in Paris said:
I don't think Lallana will ever become a solid player, he's too 'style over substance' and is largely ineffective. Can has looked very good though.

Overall though, I'm not sure I'd be confident as a Liverpool fan after yesterday's game, I thought you guys were quite mediocre (just less shit than our awful side). It didn't even feel like you were 'managing' the game due to the result last week, just not an overall good game (except towards the end when you were comfortable and our players had given up).

It'll depend on the draw of course, but I don't see you getting past BVB or one of the Spanish teams.
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I think everyone here knows what I think of Lallana but he has genuinely played really well over the past month (less so last night).

He's been a bit less style over substance, but you're right that it's the main problem he has. He's been a lot quicker to release the ball too which is a big plus.

Overall though you're probably right, I wouldn't be betting on him delivering consistent performances...but it's still good to see the improvement.
 
it's good to see he puts in the effort and is generally positive in possession - Means he can do a job. Can't see him making the difference often enough to get a starting place though.

Assumes we get in someone who will make that difference, obviously.
 
Crap team played us at our possible lowest ebb, well done for beating a team low on confidence strung together with our youth team.

Once Jose is at the helm, wave goodbye to incapacity benefit give-away's like the last two games, prepare to endure more misery at our hands, season upon season.

Nearly 900 million spent since prem started, you have still yet to win the league, even with goofy biter and slippy G.

Wait til Klopp gets to the summer and the usual delusion takes over, he has yet to experience a summer of expectation and a season of perpetual failings, cant wait to see his mad grin wiped from his floppy fringe topped bonce, schadenfreuder awaits herr Flopp.
 
SirBobbysCombover said:
Crap team played us at our possible lowest ebb, well done for beating a team low on confidence strung together with our youth team.

Once Jose is at the helm, wave goodbye to incapacity benefit give-away's like the last two games, prepare to endure more misery at our hands, season upon season.

Nearly 900 million spent since prem started, you have still yet to win the league, even with goofy biter and slippy G.

Wait til Klopp gets to the summer and the usual delusion takes over, he has yet to experience a summer of expectation and a season of perpetual failings, cant wait to see his mad grin wiped from his floppy fringe topped bonce, schadenfreuder awaits herr Flopp.
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The delusion is strong in this post. Mourinho isn't going to suddenly turn you into world beaters.
 
SirBobbysCombover said:
Crap team played us at our possible lowest ebb, well done for beating a team low on confidence strung together with our youth team.

Once Jose is at the helm, wave goodbye to incapacity benefit give-away's like the last two games, prepare to endure more misery at our hands, season upon season.

Nearly 900 million spent since prem started, you have still yet to win the league, even with goofy biter and slippy G.

Wait til Klopp gets to the summer and the usual delusion takes over, he has yet to experience a summer of expectation and a season of perpetual failings, cant wait to see his mad grin wiped from his floppy fringe topped bonce, schadenfreuder awaits herr Flopp.
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lol. fiesty.
 
Sturridge had the darkest, sourest expression I've ever seen outside of a non-wronged six year old when he was taken off last night. Bad egg, I reckon.
 
Attila said:
Any idea on how much Klopp will have to spend?
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Rodgers always got around 40-60m net, so I'd expect Klopp to get at least that & perhaps more with the new TV deals kicking in.

Klopper76 said:
A keeper and a striker. Right now I'd keep Benteke and sell Sturridge, and if Gotze is available and wants to come we should go for it. A defensive midfielder might be a possibility but I'm starting to think that Can has that position locked down, with Lucas as back up. We're fine at full back, with Clyne/Flanagan for RB and Moreno/Smith for LB with Joe Gomez as a back up for either position. We've got Matip already coming in as a CB too so we're fairly well stocked there.

Toure, Sturridge and Allen should all be moved on if you ask me. Ibe should be loaned out. Markovic is coming back from loan so he's another option.
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Do we really need Gotze when we have Firmino & Coutinho? Not saying Gotze isn't a class player, but we've more pressing issues.

Not sure I want Moreno as my first choice LB either.
 
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