Liverpool - 2017/18

2ndTouch said:
Lots of speculation, but no facts in this article. It's basically centred around Keita's foul on Demme, depicting it as a sign of Keita's lack of engagement in Training for what reason ever.
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Ah nothing then. And it wasn't even a foul. Anyone watching it in slow motion and stopping it at the moment of impact can see Keita actually got to the ball first !
 
Rafateria said:
Ah nothing then. And it wasn't even a foul. Anyone watching it in slow motion and stopping it at the moment of impact can see Keita actually got to the ball first !
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Nothing would have been said about the foul it if it hadn't been for the transfer speculation.
 
Can is only in it for the money and glory. He doesn't care shit about Liverpool or any other club for that matter. If I were you I'd be pleased to get rid of him.
 
dannyrhinos89 said:
If Liverpool do lose can and coutinho they'll struggle big time
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There's no doubting Can's potential but for me he's currently behind all our established CMs with Grujic and Ejaria queuing up behind, so not essential to the team. If Keita arrives that will push him down further as Keita is not only better defensively but scores more goals - something Klopp is looking for from midfield.

So 4th choice at both CM and possibly AM/point of diamond he's not going to get many games and maybe even miss out on the bench sometimes with the increasing depth of our squad. I can see why he's worried and probably sitting on the contract waiting to see who we buy and where that may leave him.

If we get a £30-40m offer I'd sell because even if we have to add £10m or so to that I think we could get a damn good midfielder in for that money.

As for Coutinho going .. just don't see it but if it happened many fans would lose all faith in the owners and maybe Klopp would too. However currently I just see the Spanish mouthpieces are at it again despite the fact that Coutinho is not unsettled in any way, in fact to the contrary, he loves living in Liverpool and loves the club and Klopp loves him and sees him as a player to build around. It could happen next Summer though if the pressure keeps building but it will take a massive fee (well over £100m. £120m perhaps) since he's on a newly signed 5 year contract without a release clause.
 
johnny boy said:
Nothing would have been said about the foul it if it hadn't been for the transfer speculation.
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Well there was obviously an issue with his team-mates. Quite possibly they are aware he wants out and this sparked the 'fracas' after his supposed 'bad tackle' even though it wasn't. Then the coach ended the session, possibly the wrong decision and that just ignited the media.
 
Rafateria said:
There's no doubting Can's potential but for me he's currently behind all our established CMs with Grujic and Ejaria queuing up behind, so not essential to the team. If Keita arrives that will push him down further as Keita is not only better defensively but scores more goals - something Klopp is looking for from midfield.

So 4th choice at both CM and possibly AM/point of diamond he's not going to get many games and maybe even miss out on the bench sometimes with the increasing depth of our squad. I can see why he's worried and probably sitting on the contract waiting to see who we buy and where that may leave him.

If we get a £30-40m offer I'd sell because even if we have to add £10m or so to that I think we could get a damn good midfielder in for that money.

As for Coutinho going .. just don't see it but if it happened many fans would lose all faith in the owners and maybe Klopp would too. However currently I just see the Spanish mouthpieces are at it again despite the fact that Coutinho is not unsettled in any way, in fact to the contrary, he loves living in Liverpool and loves the club and Klopp loves him and sees him as a player to build around. It could happen next Summer though if the pressure keeps building but it will take a massive fee (well over £100m. £120m perhaps) since he's on a newly signed 5 year contract without a release clause.
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Don't really get this. Can played 40 times last season - so basically featured in every game Liverpool played. Unless they sign Keita they haven't added anyone else in CM and should have more games this season. Don't really see why you think he wouldn't get many games.
 
rocks13 said:
Don't really get this. Can played 40 times last season - so basically featured in every game Liverpool played. Unless they sign Keita they haven't added anyone else in CM and should have more games this season. Don't really see why you think he wouldn't get many games.
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Henderson missed a ton of games and Can was his midfield replacement. He will be behind Keita (if), Henderson, Wijnaldum and possibly even Milner since undoubtedly he will become an option in CM since Robertson can play LB releasing him for other duties (though I expect Milner to start at LB). That pushes Can down to 3rd/4th but possibly even as low as 5th (depending on form) in the CM standings. Can is certainly not a 'starter' for most games and I don't think he will be too difficult to replace. We can't risk losing him if he doesn't sign the new contract he's been offered.
 
Rafateria said:
Henderson missed a ton of games and Can was his midfield replacement. He will be behind Keita (if), Henderson, Wijnaldum and possibly even Milner since undoubtedly he will become an option in CM since Robertson can play LB releasing him for other duties (though I expect Milner to start at LB). That pushes Can down to 3rd/4th but possibly even as low as 5th (depending on form) in the CM standings. Can is certainly not a 'starter' for most games and I don't think he will be too difficult to replace. We can't risk losing him if he doesn't sign the new contract he's been offered.
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Since you haven't actually signed Keita I'd say this makes Can currently first choice back-up/alternative to Henderson and Wijnaldum in central midfield.
 
Rafateria said:
There's no doubting Can's potential but for me he's currently behind all our established CMs with Grujic and Ejaria queuing up behind, so not essential to the team. If Keita arrives that will push him down further as Keita is not only better defensively but scores more goals - something Klopp is looking for from midfield.

So 4th choice at both CM and possibly AM/point of diamond he's not going to get many games and maybe even miss out on the bench sometimes with the increasing depth of our squad. I can see why he's worried and probably sitting on the contract waiting to see who we buy and where that may leave him.

If we get a £30-40m offer I'd sell because even if we have to add £10m or so to that I think we could get a damn good midfielder in for that money.

As for Coutinho going .. just don't see it but if it happened many fans would lose all faith in the owners and maybe Klopp would too. However currently I just see the Spanish mouthpieces are at it again despite the fact that Coutinho is not unsettled in any way, in fact to the contrary, he loves living in Liverpool and loves the club and Klopp loves him and sees him as a player to build around. It could happen next Summer though if the pressure keeps building but it will take a massive fee (well over £100m. £120m perhaps) since he's on a newly signed 5 year contract without a release clause.
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Rafateria said:
Henderson missed a ton of games and Can was his midfield replacement. He will be behind Keita (if), Henderson, Wijnaldum and possibly even Milner since undoubtedly he will become an option in CM since Robertson can play LB releasing him for other duties (though I expect Milner to start at LB). That pushes Can down to 3rd/4th but possibly even as low as 5th (depending on form) in the CM standings. Can is certainly not a 'starter' for most games and I don't think he will be too difficult to replace. We can't risk losing him if he doesn't sign the new contract he's been offered.
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Your first post above mentions that you'd sell Can for £30-40m, in the second quote you rank him behind Henderson, Wijnaldum and Milner.

Is the transfer market that nuts that you think you could get £40m for a player that you believe to be worse than those three?

Out of interest, how much do you see Henderson and Milner being worth if that's how you rank Can?

To me, Can is a max, very max, £20m player. He is undeniably limited.
 
Gee Male said:
Is the transfer market that nuts that you think you could get £40m for a player that you believe to be worse than those three?
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Yes it is, completely nuts. If Can does go when clearly the club don't want to sell it's likely to be for a higher fee to get the best possible price.
I am not sure what we all think a player is worth is relevant anymore.
 
Weakest squad of the top 6. Weakest manager in the top 6.

Will finish 6th.

I predict that without any bias or joke. That's genuinely where I think Liverpool will be at next season.

With Conte, Mourinho, and Pep all on their second campaigns and Poch and Wenger very comfortable with their squads...I can't see Liverpool finishing above any of em. However, what order those top 5 finish in is the real question. Liverpool hardly interest me this season...
 
TheBiggest said:
Weakest squad of the top 6. Weakest manager in the top 6.

Will finish 6th.

I predict that without any bias or joke. That's genuinely where I think Liverpool will be at next season.

With Conte, Mourinho, and Pep all on their second campaigns and Poch and Wenger very comfortable with their squads...I can't see Liverpool finishing above any of em. However, what order those top 5 finish in is the real question. Liverpool hardly interest me this season...
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Bet you said the exact same thing last season. I see very few facts or arguments in your post next to your (understandable) United biased opinion.
 
Rafateria said:
There's no doubting Can's potential but for me he's currently behind all our established CMs with Grujic and Ejaria queuing up behind, so not essential to the team. If Keita arrives that will push him down further as Keita is not only better defensively but scores more goals - something Klopp is looking for from midfield.

So 4th choice at both CM and possibly AM/point of diamond he's not going to get many games and maybe even miss out on the bench sometimes with the increasing depth of our squad. I can see why he's worried and probably sitting on the contract waiting to see who we buy and where that may leave him.

If we get a £30-40m offer I'd sell because even if we have to add £10m or so to that I think we could get a damn good midfielder in for that money.

As for Coutinho going .. just don't see it but if it happened many fans would lose all faith in the owners and maybe Klopp would too. However currently I just see the Spanish mouthpieces are at it again despite the fact that Coutinho is not unsettled in any way, in fact to the contrary, he loves living in Liverpool and loves the club and Klopp loves him and sees him as a player to build around. It could happen next Summer though if the pressure keeps building but it will take a massive fee (well over £100m. £120m perhaps) since he's on a newly signed 5 year contract without a release clause.
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€45m for Can while Juve scoffed at anything close to €40m for Matic... Keep dreaming. I think we should keep him, same for Coutinho. What good is money when we can't find or buy replacements? Especially if teams know we're sitting on £100m or so. Keeping Couts should be simple, "not for sale" and done. A far less established club is doing it with our #1 target who definitely wants to leave, we should simply do exactly the same as them.
 
RobinLFC said:
Bet you said the exact same thing last season. I see very few facts or arguments in your post next to your (understandable) United biased opinion.
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Why should you have to have facts in a prediction? Is that even possible?
 
Gee Male said:
Your first post above mentions that you'd sell Can for £30-40m, in the second quote you rank him behind Henderson, Wijnaldum and Milner.

Is the transfer market that nuts that you think you could get £40m for a player that you believe to be worse than those three?

Out of interest, how much do you see Henderson and Milner being worth if that's how you rank Can?

To me, Can is a max, very max, £20m player. He is undeniably limited.
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You are very au fait with the current market are you ?
 
RobinLFC said:
Bet you said the exact same thing last season. I see very few facts or arguments in your post next to your (understandable) United biased opinion.
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No, I didn't actually. Predicted Liverpool to finish 4th last year. Thought they'd handle an EPL campaign better than most, given that they weren't in Europe and United, City and Chelsea had new managers coming in.
 
RobinLFC said:
€45m for Can while Juve scoffed at anything close to €40m for Matic... Keep dreaming. I think we should keep him, same for Coutinho. What good is money when we can't find or buy replacements? Especially if teams know we're sitting on £100m or so. Keeping Couts should be simple, "not for sale" and done. A far less established club is doing it with our #1 target who definitely wants to leave, we should simply do exactly the same as them.
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The only issue against £30m+ for Can is he only has one year left on his contract. Otherwise in this market he is comfortably worth that. Whether Juve are willing to pay that is an entirely different question. I'm not advocating selling him .. unless he refuses to sign a new contract.
 
TheBiggest said:
No, I didn't actually. Predicted Liverpool to finish 4th last year. Thought they'd handle an EPL campaign better than most, given that they weren't in Europe and United, City and Chelsea had new managers coming in.
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I didn't fancy us for top 4 last year but we made it.

I don't think we can accurately predict yet for any of the top 6 contenders, City clearly are spending a lot of money but for others there is a month or so to improve yet.
Clearly our squad sill needs some quality, CM and CB in particular, but I wouldn't write us off just yet.

There will no doubt be a thread for predictions closer to the transfer window closing.
 
Rafateria said:
You are very au fait with the current market are you ?
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Of course not, I don't think anyone is.

I do try to cling to some sense of sensibility though, if that can even be said any more, and £40m for a player as limited as Emre Can is nonsense.
 
johnny boy said:
Yes it is, completely nuts. If Can does go when clearly the club don't want to sell it's likely to be for a higher fee to get the best possible price.
I am not sure what we all think a player is worth is relevant anymore.
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Sadly, you're right. Although that will never stop me being a crank about it, I refuse to give up my right to sneer at transfer fees.
 
Gee Male said:
Sadly, you're right. Although that will never stop me being a crank about it, I refuse to give up my right to sneer at transfer fees.
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I agree completely. We got over £20m for Ibe and Smith combined to Bournemouth last summer, and Smith had hardly played for our first team.
 
As much as I would love to bury my head in the sand r.e Coutinho, I have a feeling he's going this summer. I hope to god I'm wrong because he is on the verge of exploding and the Champions League qualifiers is where he can start to dominate for us in Europe. Anyone remembers that Gerrard performance in our first champions league qualifier under Rafa? Hopefully a similar game for Phil that night with him getting a brace and cup tied for Europe in case those ***** Barca come back in for him.
 
Gee Male said:
Sadly, you're right. Although that will never stop me being a crank about it, I refuse to give up my right to sneer at transfer fees.
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It's probably even more baffling for a non-brit like me. 45m for Gylfi? 54m for Walker? 75m + add-ons for Lukaku? Absolutely absurd sums for someone who doesn't primarily follow the PL. But in such an environment, 40m for Emre Can seem just about right, as crazy as this sounds
 
Looks like he wants the move. Cant see liverpool being able to keep him there and happy now. They will struggle to replace him even if they get the reported high fee.
 
Santi_Mesut_Alexis_87 said:
Coutinho is very good for Liverpool, but i think Mané is more important.
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I'm a huge Mane fan but he is clearly second behind Coutinho. He's been bailing us out of games for a couple seasons now, some of the goals and passes he produced last season were just brilliant. Don't get me wrong he has some games where he is anonymous but playing in the Champions League is going to motivate him to kick it up a notch, we will see. If he goes to Barca feck him though.
 
After watching a good chuck of their games...No amount of Keitas and VVDs is going to bail them out if Coutinho joins Barca, they would struggle big time IMO. Cracking player.
 
2ndTouch said:
It's probably even more baffling for a non-brit like me. 45m for Gylfi? 54m for Walker? 75m + add-ons for Lukaku? Absolutely absurd sums for someone who doesn't primarily follow the PL. But in such an environment, 40m for Emre Can seem just about right, as crazy as this sounds
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I just don't see that juve are going to pay 40m for Can. They usually don't just throw away money and there are many alternatives. Other top clubs won't be after Can either. Can won't be interested in joining an EPL midtable club, that are known for overpaying.
 
TheBiggest said:
Weakest squad of the top 6. Weakest manager in the top 6.

Will finish 6th.

I predict that without any bias or joke. That's genuinely where I think Liverpool will be at next season.

With Conte, Mourinho, and Pep all on their second campaigns and Poch and Wenger very comfortable with their squads...I can't see Liverpool finishing above any of em. However, what order those top 5 finish in is the real question. Liverpool hardly interest me this season...
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Way too early for bold predictions like this. Liverpool could yet sign Keita and VVD, and keep Coutinho. They'd look good next season if this was the case.
 
Gee Male said:
Your first post above mentions that you'd sell Can for £30-40m, in the second quote you rank him behind Henderson, Wijnaldum and Milner.

Is the transfer market that nuts that you think you could get £40m for a player that you believe to be worse than those three?

Out of interest, how much do you see Henderson and Milner being worth if that's how you rank Can?

To me, Can is a max, very max, £20m player. He is undeniably limited.
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Have you been following the transfer window? £20m? You can't buy a 14 year old reserve water boy for that. Can is comfortably in the £30m+ bracket. German international, mainstay in a top 4 side last season, capable of special moments (see Watford away). He's not the perfect player by any means, lacks pace and speed of thought, but he's better than most in the division so his price is high - that's how it works in 2017.
 
TheBiggest said:
Weakest squad of the top 6. Weakest manager in the top 6.

Will finish 6th.

I predict that without any bias or joke. That's genuinely where I think Liverpool will be at next season.

With Conte, Mourinho, and Pep all on their second campaigns and Poch and Wenger very comfortable with their squads...I can't see Liverpool finishing above any of em. However, what order those top 5 finish in is the real question. Liverpool hardly interest me this season...
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Did you copy and paste that from last summer?
 
I predict a very similar season for Liverpool as last, a good start with a new year drop off.

It could be good for them to sell Coutinho and spend the money on 3/4 players for squad depth as Klopp seems good at getting the right players for good prices. Worse case for them would be keeping a sulking Coutinho who wanted to leave.
 
lewwoo said:
Looks like he wants the move. Cant see liverpool being able to keep him there and happy now. They will struggle to replace him even if they get the reported high fee.
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Where is the source for him saying he wants the move?
 
TheReligion said:
I'm not sure that would work exactly given Conte, Pep and Jose were within their first season.
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There's zero certainty they'll do better in their second year than in their first though, so a strange argument to make imo.
 
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