Liverpool 2014/15 | WARNING: Contains strong amounts of Scouse nonsense

Alex99 said:
Aside from all the other talking points today, for all the plaudits Can's been getting, I thought he was nothing short of shambolic in defence for them today.
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He is the weak link back there. He's just not a defender.

He was miles too deep for Mata's second goal, not that it mattered given his run was timed perfectly. It's just an example of basic defensive positional play.

He's also poor in the air for his size and I believe it was him who misjudged the ball Di Maria ran onto when we should have made it 3-0. I'm surprised more teams haven't targeted him more.

EDIT: Just watched it again and it was Skrtel who misjudged it, so he can be let off that one :D
 
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I was stunned at how flat Liverpool were. No doubt we kept the ball well and made their pressing a lot more difficult but they were still lacking intensity. They couldn't retain possession in that first half. Tough to see them getting top 4 now, though the F.A. Cup is still on I guess.
 
Tarrou said:
I chuckle every time I see someone say "Barney's alright" or some other such nonsense. He was a cnut. He lacked any kind of intelligence or charm that might sometimes afford a cnut a bit of leeway in life. Contributed absolutely nothing other than sliming around the scouse threads and generally acting like a butthurt school kid, unless you count the fact it was mildly funny to observe his dimwitted attempts at WUMing. I don't remember him once contributing to a thread where someone asked for help, or him posting something funny or interesting or worthwhile, ever.
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Agreed.

He's not in the master league of WUM occupied by the likes of @peterstorey.
 
soapythecat said:
Funny how the resident Dippers are straight on here at the sign of anything going against United but today……nada!
I know lots of Scousers and they wouldn't dream of coming on here, and why would they? I can't think of a bigger waste of my time than going and posting on RAWK. I just don't get why you would post on a rivals website. Some of them have thousands of posts. Clowns.
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I was at the game and came on afterwards - I even said the best team won.

There are quite a few United fans on RAWK. What's wrong with debating football on a rival forum?
I admit you need a thick skin and sometimes you have to keep your feelings in check a little.
 
haha I love it. Usually this thread is bubbling with gloating kopites, what happened? :lol:

So is the 3-4-3 are a long term plan for Rodgers or is he just using it for this season? I think Liverpool could do with a couple of new defenders and definitely a top class midfielder to fill in when slippy goes. I rate Can but he looked totally out of his depth yesterday and Moreno is shocking.
 
Chorley1974 said:
Barney has long been a joke that became unfunny
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I was in thee newbs with him. Someone called it right when they described him a sliming around the scouse threads. He was a WUM with nothing to say. I imagine he's about 17 yrs old and his dad is a bitter who can't let go of the olden days, and this bitterness he has passed on to his offsrping. It's bordering child abuse to bring your son up as a LFC supporter.
 
Barney did come across as quite young. Who really knows though, maybe he was just an immature pleb in his 30's/40's.
 
Pretty pleased how we well we contained Liverpool's attacking players. Coutinho has been very good but couldn't get in the game and Sterling and Sturridge also struggled to get involved. Lallana is Lallana. I was quite impressed with Sakho for a change who I thought had Rooney in his pocket and was pretty composed all game.
 
Gee Male said:
He's also done all this while not being picked in your starting line-up for some of your biggest CL games, being left out for all three away CL fixtures, and also left out of the deciding fixture against Basel at Anfield.

Why do you think he wasn't trusted in those games? Most expensive signing in the squad and an unqualified success in your eyes, but not good enough to be included when it really counts? Something doesn't add up.
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My above post was re Lallana. I would just add to the above him getting subbed at half time (after doing literally nothing other than missing a sitter in the first half) against United at home to the above list.

Can't see him being a long term success at Liverpool at this rate. An effective player against lower league opposition so basically a good squad player, but definitely not worth £25m.

Second most expensive signing in the club's history.
 
Thought Rodgers 3-4-3 showed its limitations yesterday. Its done well for them so I can see why he continued, but putting Sterling and Moreno on the wings, was a poor move. We were constantly causing them problems down each wing.

Rodgers was probably hoping that it meant he could overload Carrick's position with his attacking trio, but it was one of those cases where the problems we caused them meant they couldnt cause us any problems.
 
shaggy said:
Pretty pleased how we well we contained Liverpool's attacking players. Coutinho has been very good but couldn't get in the game and Sterling and Sturridge also struggled to get involved.
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Sturridge hasn't really found his game since he came back. He's got a few goals, including yesterday of course, so we're not talking crisis. But his all round play has been mediocre whenever I've watched him, more like the Sturridge of Chelsea - the odd tidy goal mixed in with wild selfish efforts and extended periods where he's not involved.
 
Salfordlad70 said:
I was in thee newbs with him. Someone called it right when they described him a sliming around the scouse threads. He was a WUM with nothing to say. I imagine he's about 17 yrs old and his dad is a bitter who can't let go of the olden days, and this bitterness he has passed on to his offsrping. It's bordering child abuse to bring your son up as a LFC supporter.
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It's hilarious really that some on here are saying he was good value. The majority of his arguments in discussion were 'No he isn't.' 'That's not true.' 'You're wrong.' etc. Cracking insight that. Good riddance to the cnut.
 
johnny boy said:
I was at the game and came on afterwards - I even said the best team won.

There are quite a few United fans on RAWK. What's wrong with debating football on a rival forum?
I admit you need a thick skin and sometimes you have to keep your feelings in check a little.
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I think the forum is a much more interesting place with a good few oppo fans and folk from around the world.
 
ZDwyr said:
I was stunned at how flat Liverpool were. No doubt we kept the ball well and made their pressing a lot more difficult but they were still lacking intensity. They couldn't retain possession in that first half. Tough to see them getting top 4 now, though the F.A. Cup is still on I guess.
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Louis van Gaal predicted before the match the team that beats the pressure will win, he trained his team to prevent Liverpool's pressing and trained them to press high up the pitch to force Liverpool into mistakes.

In the first half he said they did it but in the second after the sending off the players got complacent and didn't press.

I'm not sure what Rodgers' prediction was before the match but he did touch upon the importance of being high intensity, it's possible he thought it was a case of Liverpool pressing and passing with that high intensity and United simply wouldn't cope.

For Louis van Gaal it was easy, he knew what Rodgers was going to do but for Rodgers not so much, he had only the Spurs game as a reference but prior to that all indications were that United would be slow, hesitant and nervous in possession of the ball and so Liverpool's pressure would force them into many mistakes.

In the end I think it came down to preparation, United knew exactly what to do to counter Liverpool but Liverpool were surprised at how United played and had not been prepared for it. It's not that they lacked intensity but United prevented them from implementing that game, I also think when in possession they panicked because United were clever, they as usual tried to move the ball quickly but United cut off the spaces they could attack which mean't their pass was only going to be intercepted.

In truth Swansea put a lot of pressure on Liverpool and they caused problems, it's public knowledge Louis van Gaal will exploit any weakness possible therefore this should have been practiced in training. Rodgers in his post match press conference expressed disappointment Liverpool didn't press well in the first half and stated this was because the players were too deep however I would argue Liverpool were forced deep because they didn't know how to counter United. They started the first half 3-4-3 but as the minutes went on Coutinho and Lallana dropped making a 3-6-1, United forced them deep.

I honestly think it was not a lack of intensity that lost them the game but a lack of preparation. In his post match press conference Louis van Gaal said 'we beat them with their own weapons', for Rodgers it was a tactical surprise, nobody expected Liverpool to be beaten in the pressing game but if it happens then it's upto the players to figure out a solution on the field, I think this is why Louis van Gaal is determined to make the players think and not rely on instinct, he has said numerous times the players need to coach each other when on the field and his job is only to prepare them.

Rodgers probably knew on the touchline what they could do to make things more difficult for United and get themselves back into the match in the first half but he can't get the message to the players. This is the consequence of wanting every player in the team to be incredibly hardworking, Louis van Gaal said "Running is for animals. You need a brain and a ball for football.", he wants every player in the team to be intelligent first and foremost.

I mean look at how Liverpool press and look at how we did it, we had elegance and control, when they press they just run at maximum speed to harass the player, they're like a bunch of wild animals, they sprint, all of them sprint, it's a million miles an hour with them and Rodgers selects for traits like Stamina, survive or perish, if you don't have it you're not in the team, it really was animals vs humans. Think back to the Mourinho game, it was a little different then, they had a wild vampire and the humans really had to be careful, they were defensive but it was a simple strategy, give them the bait and they'll take it then just exploit all that space they leave behind and the crazy thing is they needed only a draw but look at how they played, like a bunch of barbarians.
 
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For the first time here I agree with Empire. All but the last paragraph. The way Blind pressed Sterling (intelligently rather than with force) epitomised that. Lots of learning to do yet for our young players. This experience should help them and a young Rodgers.

#gloryglorymanutd
 
Gee Male said:
My above post was re Lallana. I would just add to the above him getting subbed at half time (after doing literally nothing other than missing a sitter in the first half) against United at home to the above list.

Can't see him being a long term success at Liverpool at this rate. An effective player against lower league opposition so basically a good squad player, but definitely not worth £25m.

Second most expensive signing in the club's history.
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He was taken off because of an injury, or as a caution for one. Maybe that clash with Jones had something to do with it.

Of course we overpaid for Lallana, there was too much of a hype around him in the summer and that cost us quite a few extra millions. If everyone's available I don't see him in my ideal starting eleven but he's a very good squad player to have and fits Rodgers' philosophy. And I know, "you don't splash £25m on a squad player", but you're always going to pay a lot more for a (relatively) young English player who has had a good season.
 
Empire said:
Louis van Gaal predicted before the match the team that beats the pressure will win, he trained his team to prevent Liverpool's pressing and trained them to press high up the pitch to force Liverpool into mistakes.

In the first half he said they did it but in the second after the sending off the players got complacent and didn't press.

I'm not sure what Rodgers' prediction was before the match but he did touch upon the importance of being high intensity, it's possible he thought it was a case of Liverpool pressing and passing with that high intensity and United simply wouldn't cope.

For Louis van Gaal it was easy, he knew what Rodgers was going to do but for Rodgers not so much, he had only the Spurs game as a reference but prior to that all indications were that United would be slow, hesitant and nervous in possession of the ball and so Liverpool's pressure would force them into many mistakes.

In the end I think it came down to preparation, United knew exactly what to do to counter Liverpool but Liverpool were surprised at how United played and had not been prepared for it. It's not that they lacked intensity but United prevented them from implementing that game, I also think when in possession they panicked because United were clever, they as usual tried to move the ball quickly but United cut off the spaces they could attack which mean't their pass was only going to be intercepted.

In truth Swansea put a lot of pressure on Liverpool and they caused problems, it's public knowledge Louis van Gaal will exploit any weakness possible therefore this should have been practiced in training. Rodgers in his post match press conference expressed disappointment Liverpool didn't press well in the first half and stated this was because the players were too deep however I would argue Liverpool were forced deep because they didn't know how to counter United. They started the first half 3-4-3 but as the minutes went on Coutinho and Lallana dropped making a 3-6-1, United forced them deep.

I honestly think it was not a lack of intensity that lost them the game but a lack of preparation. In his post match press conference Louis van Gaal said 'we beat them with their own weapons', for Rodgers it was a tactical surprise, nobody expected Liverpool to be beaten in the pressing game but if it happens then it's upto the players to figure out a solution on the field, I think this is why Louis van Gaal is determined to make the players think and not rely on instinct, he has said numerous times the players need to coach each other when on the field and his job is only to prepare them.

Rodgers probably knew on the touchline what they could do to make things more difficult for United and get themselves back into the match in the first half but he can't get the message to the players. This is the consequence of wanting every player in the team to be incredibly hardworking, Louis van Gaal said "Running is for animals. You need a brain and a ball for football.", he wants every player in the team to be intelligent first and foremost.

I mean look at how Liverpool press and look at how we did it, we had elegance and control, when they press they just run at maximum speed to harass the player, they're like a bunch of wild animals, they sprint, all of them sprint, it's a million miles an hour with them and Rodgers selects for traits like Stamina, survive or perish, if you don't have it you're not in the team, it really was animals vs humans. Think back to the Mourinho game, it was a little different then, they had a wild vampire and the humans really had to be careful, they were defensive but it was a simple strategy, give them the bait and they'll take it then just exploit all that space they leave behind and the crazy thing is they needed only a draw but look at how they played, like a bunch of barbarians.
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Yet another excellent post Empire. Brilliant analysis. I thought Rodgers was naive and arrogant in his approach.
 
Empire said:
Louis van Gaal predicted before the match the team that beats the pressure will win, he trained his team to prevent Liverpool's pressing and trained them to press high up the pitch to force Liverpool into mistakes.

In the first half he said they did it but in the second after the sending off the players got complacent and didn't press.

I'm not sure what Rodgers' prediction was before the match but he did touch upon the importance of being high intensity, it's possible he thought it was a case of Liverpool pressing and passing with that high intensity and United simply wouldn't cope.

For Louis van Gaal it was easy, he knew what Rodgers was going to do but for Rodgers not so much, he had only the Spurs game as a reference but prior to that all indications were that United would be slow, hesitant and nervous in possession of the ball and so Liverpool's pressure would force them into many mistakes.

In the end I think it came down to preparation, United knew exactly what to do to counter Liverpool but Liverpool were surprised at how United played and had not been prepared for it. It's not that they lacked intensity but United prevented them from implementing that game, I also think when in possession they panicked because United were clever, they as usual tried to move the ball quickly but United cut off the spaces they could attack which mean't their pass was only going to be intercepted.

In truth Swansea put a lot of pressure on Liverpool and they caused problems, it's public knowledge Louis van Gaal will exploit any weakness possible therefore this should have been practiced in training. Rodgers in his post match press conference expressed disappointment Liverpool didn't press well in the first half and stated this was because the players were too deep however I would argue Liverpool were forced deep because they didn't know how to counter United. They started the first half 3-4-3 but as the minutes went on Coutinho and Lallana dropped making a 3-6-1, United forced them deep.

I honestly think it was not a lack of intensity that lost them the game but a lack of preparation. In his post match press conference Louis van Gaal said 'we beat them with their own weapons', for Rodgers it was a tactical surprise, nobody expected Liverpool to be beaten in the pressing game but if it happens then it's upto the players to figure out a solution on the field, I think this is why Louis van Gaal is determined to make the players think and not rely on instinct, he has said numerous times the players need to coach each other when on the field and his job is only to prepare them.

Rodgers probably knew on the touchline what they could do to make things more difficult for United and get themselves back into the match in the first half but he can't get the message to the players. This is the consequence of wanting every player in the team to be incredibly hardworking, Louis van Gaal said "Running is for animals. You need a brain and a ball for football.", he wants every player in the team to be intelligent first and foremost.

I mean look at how Liverpool press and look at how we did it, we had elegance and control, when they press they just run at maximum speed to harass the player, they're like a bunch of wild animals, they sprint, all of them sprint, it's a million miles an hour with them and Rodgers selects for traits like Stamina, survive or perish, if you don't have it you're not in the team, it really was animals vs humans. Think back to the Mourinho game, it was a little different then, they had a wild vampire and the humans really had to be careful, they were defensive but it was a simple strategy, give them the bait and they'll take it then just exploit all that space they leave behind and the crazy thing is they needed only a draw but look at how they played, like a bunch of barbarians.
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Good post, unusual to read from someone who actually listens to what LVG says rather than the press interpretation
 
@Empire good post. Chelsea were so successful their last season because Mourinho knew exactly what Rodgers was going to do, too. He's an incredibly predictable manager, and I'm surprised more teams haven't either sucked the life out of the match, or played them at their own game.
 
Empire said:
I honestly think it was not a lack of intensity that lost them the game but a lack of preparation. In his post match press conference Louis van Gaal said 'we beat them with their own weapons', for Rodgers it was a tactical surprise, nobody expected Liverpool to be beaten in the pressing game but if it happens then it's upto the players to figure out a solution on the field, I think this is why Louis van Gaal is determined to make the players think and not rely on instinct, he has said numerous times the players need to coach each other when on the field and his job is only to prepare them.
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Agree completely; Liverpool were employing their usual pressing game, but for them they were chasing shadows. The ultimate counter to that type of pressing is the ability to play quick, incisive, intelligent passes across the pitch. I said during the first half that Liverpool wouldn't be able to keep up their pressing for 90 minutes and once this happened we'd start seeing more gaps in behind and more chances. Obviously the sending off meant United slowed everything down, which in my opinion actually cost us a more decisive win (than if we played as we did in the first half).

Their pressing games thrives on hesitance, poor first touches and slow play. That's why they absolutely battered Moyes' United last year where our M.O. was to dawdle on the ball before launching it out wide.
 
RobinLFC said:
He was taken off because of an injury, or as a caution for one. Maybe that clash with Jones had something to do with it.

Of course we overpaid for Lallana, there was too much of a hype around him in the summer and that cost us quite a few extra millions. If everyone's available I don't see him in my ideal starting eleven but he's a very good squad player to have and fits Rodgers' philosophy. And I know, "you don't splash £25m on a squad player", but you're always going to pay a lot more for a (relatively) young English player who has had a good season.
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Lallana wasn't a relatively young English player though. He was 26 when you signed him, and he'll be 27 before the season is through.
 
Empire said:
Louis van Gaal predicted before the match the team that beats the pressure will win, he trained his team to prevent Liverpool's pressing and trained them to press high up the pitch to force Liverpool into mistakes.
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Great post, from the beggining we were incredibly cautious with the ball, Liverpool had no idea how to press us because we were not really forcing it forward at all cost. Need to pass it back to DDG? That's what we're going to do, feck y'all. I think that we did the best pressing job in two sectors of the field, sectors around their LCB/RCB and the pressing was done by Blind, Young and Fellaini on one side and Herrera, Mata and Valencia on the other side, Rooney was balancing between those two and pressing Mignolet into those stands-kicks and Carrick was anchoring behind Fellaini and Herrera in case there'd be some rebounds.

Due to the fact that we've made a lot of tackles (7 from Herrera, 4 from Fellaini, 6 from Blind, 3 from Valencia) we've kept cutting Liverpool open and force them into either stretching or changing positions (thus the great assist from Herrera and great run by Mata for the first goal), they couldn't really cope with that. Add aerial dominance thanks to great play from our CBs, Carrick and Fellaini, being incredibly cautious with ball retention and running around 10 kms more overall than Liverpool and you can see how much Brenton was, again, outplayed by LVG.

For that reason I don't think that starting ADM was a viable tactic, he tends to dribble too much and lose possession which we couldn't really afford in the first half.
 
Alex99 said:
Lallana wasn't a relatively young English player though. He was 26 when you signed him, and he'll be 27 before the season is through.
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I know, but most people (or Liverpool fans at least) seem to think of him that way because he only broke through two seasons ago and still seems to have some margin of growth to his game.
 
RobinLFC said:
I know, but most people (or Liverpool fans at least) seem to think of him that way because he only broke through two seasons ago and still seems to have some margin of growth to his game.
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He didn't break through two seasons ago either, he played over 40 games in the 2008/09 season when Southampton were in the Championship, and played 30+ ever since. He's done well to be similarly effective in the PL as he was in League 1 and the Championship, but it seems very unlikely that he's got much of a margin of growth, if he even has one at all.
 
Salfordlad70 said:
I was in thee newbs with him. Someone called it right when they described him a sliming around the scouse threads. He was a WUM with nothing to say. I imagine he's about 17 yrs old and his dad is a bitter who can't let go of the olden days, and this bitterness he has passed on to his offsrping. It's bordering child abuse to bring your son up as a LFC supporter.
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I don't mind barney to be fair, but he can go amiss after a bad result!
 
This international break has come at just the right time imho. Enough time to lick our wounds, get over our disappointment and now that Gerrard is out again have no fears of disrupting the team. Ibe was supposed to return end of March, not sure where we are on that, but another two weeks to allow that to happen is also good.

Lallana being injured means Sterling playing next to Coutinho again, so giving Sturridge better support. The only concern is if Lovren will take Skrtel's place or Sakho in the middle with Lovren on the left. Arsenal will love either scenario.

#gloryglorymanutd
 
shaggy said:
Pretty pleased how we well we contained Liverpool's attacking players. Coutinho has been very good but couldn't get in the game and Sterling and Sturridge also struggled to get involved. Lallana is Lallana. I was quite impressed with Sakho for a change who I thought had Rooney in his pocket and was pretty composed all game.
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Yeah I was quite impressed with your pressing and how you crowded us out in that 1st half considering how yous had played this season up untill then. Sakho was the only positive from that game for me, he was pretty solid and passed the ball well.
 
Rooney in Dublin said:
Lallana has no margin of growth. What you have is very much the finished article.
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I think so too. I was just pointing out that there was some sort of general consensus amongst our fans that he'd be able to grow at Liverpool, like a "he will play better and have a higher efficiency at a bigger club which plays better football" kind of thing. Probably a misconception because he only appeared on the big stage when Southampton got promoted to the Premier League. I'm not his biggest fan, he does everything a tad too slow imo, but he's been a good addition to our squad if you disregard his price tag.
 
RobinLFC said:
I think so too. I was just pointing out that there was some sort of general consensus amongst our fans that he'd be able to grow at Liverpool, like a "he will play better and have a higher efficiency at a bigger club which plays better football" kind of thing. Probably a misconception because he only appeared on the big stage when Southampton got promoted to the Premier League. I'm not his biggest fan, he does everything a tad too slow imo, but he's been a good addition to our squad if you disregard his price tag.
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Yep fair enough. I think most of us on here would agree he's a handy player to have in the squad, no doubt.
 
Salfordlad70 said:
I was in thee newbs with him. Someone called it right when they described him a sliming around the scouse threads. He was a WUM with nothing to say. I imagine he's about 17 yrs old and his dad is a bitter who can't let go of the olden days, and this bitterness he has passed on to his offsrping. It's bordering child abuse to bring your son up as a LFC supporter.
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Barney in general forums was a very decent guy. There was something cnutish to his ff posting though and more so after Stevie slip.
Oh, and he is not 17, he has kids as well. Anyway, we move on, we go again.
 
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