Lionel Messi

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He's quite comfortably the best of his generation. But, am among those that believe he has to prove himself on the national stage and guide argentina to a WC for me to consider him among the best ever.

I'd just like him to perform when he's outside his comfort zone.
 
Varun_Utd said:
He's quite comfortably the best of his generation. But, am among those that believe he has to prove himself on the national stage and guide argentina to a WC for me to consider him among the best ever.

I'd just like him to perform when he's outside his comfort zone.
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He's done it before, he'll do it again.
 
Boss said:
He's done it before, he'll do it again.
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He has time on his side. a lot of it. they have good players too, the argies. but with the quality of the spanish and german teams atm, messi has a task on his hand if he wants to win the WC.
 
Varun_Utd said:
He has time on his side. a lot of it. they have good players too, the argies. but with the quality of the spanish and german teams atm, messi has a task on his hand if he wants to win the WC.
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Indeed, but I think it could happen, I don't know how. There's just a certain inevitability about it imo.

Let's wait and see though.
 
Boss said:
Indeed, but I think it could happen, I don't know how. There's just a certain inevitability about it imo.

Let's wait and see though.
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They need to get to the SFs. anybody can win after than imo in a 1 legged KO tournament. It could happen but it'd surprise me.
 
Boss said:
Indeed, but I think it could happen, I don't know how. There's just a certain inevitability about it imo.

Let's wait and see though.
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Interesting, the way it's going, I'd say it's pretty much inevitable he'd be seen as the player who's amazing for Barca but just can't do it for his country.
 
Cal? said:
Interesting, the way it's going, I'd say it's pretty much inevitable he'd be seen as the player who's amazing for Barca but just can't do it for his country.
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That's what makes it inevitable imo When people think it's not going to happen he lights a match under their arse.

Also he's won more for his national team than your fave player tbf.
 
Boss said:
That's what makes it inevitable imo When people think it's not going to happen he lights a match under their arse.

Also he's won more for his national team than your fave player tbf.
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If you are talking about you-know-who, I think most people will agree that a Euro runners-up & WC semi means a lot more than the Olympics. :smirk:
 
Also, in the Messi v Maradona debate...

Maradona led the Napoli side he played for to 2 titles. These Napoli players were by no means anything close to the types of players Messi plays with day in-day out. Napoli were up against the Milan side of the late 80s (who themselves have been compared to this Barca team as best team ever etc)
 
Uzz said:
Also, in the Messi v Maradona debate...

Maradona led the Napoli side he played for to 2 titles. These Napoli players were by no means anything close to the types of players Messi plays with day in-day out. Napoli were up against the Milan side of the late 80s (who themselves have been compared to this Barca team as best team ever etc)
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If any set of defenders can deal with this Barca frontline, it'd have been that Milan defence from 89-90.

Baresi & Maldini are 2 players who'd almost definitely make an all time XI.
 
feck off Messi. He's becoming so good its beginning to annoy me.
 
I think the bbc live text mentioned that he has scored around 201 goals in 246 matches for barca. And that barca has scored 500 goals in 200 matches under pep.
 
7even said:
I like your posts!

Pacquiao vs. Mohammad Ali
Sports purists vs. Typical housewife's
Ali was a nutcase.
Jordan was more down to an amazing marketing campaign.

I couldn't agree more... Well almost.. This spoiler is for you. Enjoy.
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Messi is a phenomenal football player. I agree. His speed, control and skills is unique.

Well.. almost if we dismiss Maradona.
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They are way more physical with Maradona than Messi, and for me the king still Maradona :lol:
 
MaroonPondlife said:
BS. Sports purists don't think this way ... that is the way a typical housewife sees it. Pacquiao ain't got no 'personality' but I'd rather watch him than Ali.

The speed at which Messi operates has never been matched, not even close. Football has moved on ... Totally unique.
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:lol: :wenger:

You'd rather watch Pacquiao vs Ali? Seriously?

Rather watch an MLS match over United as well?
 
By the way, just for the record.. For the people who say Messi can't score without Xavi and Iniesta (before these games become forgotten)...

Messi has scored two hat-tricks (SIX goals) in the last two games, in which neither Xavi nor Iniesta played..

Barcelona line-up was: Against Mallorca: Valdés, Alves, Mascherano, Abidal, Adriano, Keita, Sergio, Thiago, Villa, Messi, Cuenca (Pique, Puyol, Deulofeu). And against Viktoria Plzen: Valdes, Dani Alves, Pique, Puyol, Abidal, Busquets, Thiago, Fabregas, Adriano, Messi, Cuenca (Keita, Maxwell, Sanchez).

Moving on to the next silly argument...
 
They played a no mark team today, you guys need to have a word with yourself. I would be embarrassed if posters on here started wanking over Rooney after scoring a hat trick against Otelul. Save the wanks for more worthy acts, ffs.
 
adexkola said:
They played a no mark team today, you guys need to have a word with yourself. I would be embarrassed if posters on here started wanking over Rooney after scoring a hat trick against Otelul. Save the wanks for more worthy acts, ffs.
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Yes. I mean its not like Messi has done well against any good opposition. Oh wait...
 
Yes I'm sure the wanking over Messi is due to the fact he scored a hat-trick today against an average team, nothing to do with his career and this season's tally.
 
adexkola said:
They played a no mark team today, you guys need to have a word with yourself. I would be embarrassed if posters on here started wanking over Rooney after scoring a hat trick against Otelul. Save the wanks for more worthy acts, ffs.
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The closest anyone's been to wanking over him after this game is Mac, and even then all he's said is:

MacMUFC said:
feck off Messi. He's becoming so good its beginning to annoy me.
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which is true, and appropriate given it seems like he scores a hattrick or a double every other week. He already has 4 hattricks and 4 doubles. This time last year he just scored 4 doubles.
 
I did love the comparison to Jordan/Ali....really did. I hope that was a hugely sarcastic comparison, considering both of them are Black AND from the marketing king of the world in America. No one in football comes close to them, and probably never will until it becomes a major sport in America, which it won't. Tiger is the only current sportsman that probably comes close.

Neither Pele or Maradona are their own brand like them 3 either, and speaking of comparisons to Pele and Maradona....you can't really condemn him for not doing what they have on the International Stage, for starters Pele was playing with his mates mostly, whereas Messi has to beat them, and well Maradona had a stellar team and management around him that worked to his advantage, Argentina right now haven't been able to work around Messis advantage, that's not exactly his fault.

Oh and Maradona never won a European Cup, so no, he didn't "do everything" at club level. I don't care if he played for a "weaker" Napoli...it's not like Steaua or Villa or Hamburg were that much better from around the same era.

For what it's worth, I don't think he'll win a World Cup, maybe a Copa America, but Germany and Spain and even Brazil are so far ahead of Argentina that the task would require a fair bit of luck and well a very good manager, maybe he'll win one as the old man of a new era of Argentine talent maybe.
 
Zen said:
I did love the comparison to Jordan/Ali....really did. I hope that was a hugely sarcastic comparison, considering both of them are Black AND from the marketing king of the world in America. No one in football comes close to them, and probably never will until it becomes a major sport in America, which it won't. Tiger is the only current sportsman that probably comes close.

Neither Pele or Maradona are their own brand like them 3 either, and speaking of comparisons to Pele and Maradona....you can't really condemn him for not doing what they have on the International Stage, for starters Pele was playing with his mates mostly, whereas Messi has to beat them, and well Maradona had a stellar team and management around him that worked to his advantage, Argentina right now haven't been able to work around Messis advantage, that's not exactly his fault.

Oh and Maradona never won a European Cup, so no, he didn't "do everything" at club level. I don't care if he played for a "weaker" Napoli...it's not like Steaua or Villa or Hamburg were that much better from around the same era.

For what it's worth, I don't think he'll win a World Cup, maybe a Copa America, but Germany and Spain and even Brazil are so far ahead of Argentina that the task would require a fair bit of luck and well a very good manager, maybe he'll win one as the old man of a new era of Argentine talent maybe.
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For Argentina? Not really.
 
Being old enough to follow both careers :cool:, there is no contest in my mind. Maradona was an exceptional player and the best of his generation. Messi is on a whole different level and by far the best player I have ever seen.

The difference for me is in their respective peers. Maradona was a great in a sport that hadn't fully embraced the science of athleticism and, as such, he played against some very mediocre players by today's standards.

Messi, barring injury, will eclipse Maradonas goals tally and shatter his goal average by the time he retires and, he will have done it all against much better opposition.

On another note, would we be talking about Maradona in this way if he hadn't of scored the "goal of the century" against England in the world cup. Would we be doing the same if he hadn't of used his hand to score a goal and blatantly cheat. Would he have won the world cup?

Finally, Maradona is a drug cheat that was caught and will ever be tainted with that fact.

Of my top three footballers Ive had the privilege to watch, I go this

Messi
Ronaldo Luís Nazário (for the sake of any confusion)
Maradona
 
2Bullish said:
Being old enough to follow both careers :cool:, there is no contest in my mind. Maradona was an exceptional player and the best of his generation. Messi is on a whole different level and by far the best player I have ever seen.

The difference for me is in their respective peers. Maradona was a great in a sport that hadn't fully embraced the science of athleticism and, as such, he played against some very mediocre players by today's standards.

Messi, barring injury, will eclipse Maradonas goals tally and shatter his goal average by the time he retires and, he will have done it all against much better opposition.

On another note, would we be talking about Maradona in this way if he hadn't of scored the "goal of the century" against England in the world cup. Would we be doing the same if he hadn't of used his hand to score a goal and blatantly cheat. Would he have won the world cup?

Finally, Maradona is a drug cheat that was caught and will ever be tainted with that fact.

Of my top three footballers Ive had the privilege to watch, I go this

Messi
Ronaldo Luís Nazário (for the sake of any confusion)
Maradona
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But Maradona wasn't a striker so that isn't really relevent here.
Messi isn't a conventional striker either as there is way more to his game, but he plays further forward so his higher productivity is to be expected.
Messi has also used his hand to score a goal before, so he isn't a saint in that regard.

Has to be said though, 22 goals and 11 assists in 2 months :lol:

World class players players like rooney, silva, van persie could have contributed that AT THE END of the season and it will be a fantastic return for them, crazy.​
 
2Bullish said:
Being old enough to follow both careers :cool:, there is no contest in my mind. Maradona was an exceptional player and the best of his generation. Messi is on a whole different level and by far the best player I have ever seen.

The difference for me is in their respective peers. Maradona was a great in a sport that hadn't fully embraced the science of athleticism and, as such, he played against some very mediocre players by today's standards.

Messi, barring injury, will eclipse Maradonas goals tally and shatter his goal average by the time he retires and, he will have done it all against much better opposition.

On another note, would we be talking about Maradona in this way if he hadn't of scored the "goal of the century" against England in the world cup. Would we be doing the same if he hadn't of used his hand to score a goal and blatantly cheat. Would he have won the world cup?

Finally, Maradona is a drug cheat that was caught and will ever be tainted with that fact.

Of my top three footballers Ive had the privilege to watch, I go this

Messi
Ronaldo Luís Nazário (for the sake of any confusion)
Maradona
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Like Baresi, Maldini etc?
 
He is passing into legendary status at the young age of 24. Providing he stays clear of injuries, why is it so hard to fathom that he quite could quite conceivably end up as the greatest player ever?
 
Inspectah deck said:
But Maradona wasn't a striker so that isn't really relevent here.
Messi isn't a conventional striker either as there is way more to his game, but he plays further forward so his higher productivity is to be expected.
Messi has also used his hand to score a goal before, so he isn't a saint in that regard.

Has to be said though, 22 goals and 11 assists in 2 months :lol:

World class players players like rooney, silva, van persie could have contributed that AT THE END of the season and it will be a fantastic return for them, crazy.​
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In all fairness though, he is the centrepoint of a team which completely dominates virtually every game they play, and has a monopoly on great central midfielders. His stats would be much better than the likes of Rooney and van Persie even if he was exactly as good as them.
 
kietotheworld said:
In all fairness though, he is the centrepoint of a team which completely dominates virtually every game they play, and has a monopoly on great central midfielders. His stats would be much better than the likes of Rooney and van Persie even if he was exactly as good as them.
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Perhaps, but he is usually one of the highest passers in the team after xavi, iniesta and busquets, so he is part of the reason they dominate so much. In the CL final for example I think only xavi, iniesta and busquets had more passes among the 22 players on the pitch.

EDIT: 3rd highest in the CL final: Xavi 148, Iniesta 115, messi 100, busquets 82, Rio 47, Rooney 40.
 
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