Lionel Messi

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marchi-91 said:
If Ronaldo can sustain his level of excellence for another couple of years, you can rate him in that kind of bracket, but at the moment, Its Zidane > everybody else.

What I find humorous is that people are touting Messi as the messiah, but he's failed to sustain his form for a long period of time. It was really only last year 'and shades in 05/06' that he was one of the most promising in the world. Not as influential in 06/07-07/08 as people would like to think, but still enough to keep the punters guessing.

For me its Iniesta > Messi. Just look at the CL final. Iniesta & Xabi ran that game, not Messi.
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:wenger:

what level? you were the one few pages back alleged Ronaldo nodding in Rooneys cross against Inter from 6 yards was superior goal compared to Messi goal on the same week when he took on players, played a one-two followed by a great finish.

Last season Ronaldo wasnt even the best player at United, Rooney, Vidic, Fletcher have all had better seasons than him. Iniesta > Messi is more like Rooney > Ronaldo. Both are comparable and it could hold true some matches, but never a theory that would work out among fans and critics along in a season as a whole.

Overall it was a Gerrardesque 08/09 season for Ronaldo in all standards, he should only be rated sligthly better than Gerrard.

If Ronaldo regains his 06/08 form for one or two more seasons he would be rated better than Henry or Ronaldinho, from then on it would take some doing to reach the level of Zidane or Fat Ronaldo. Delivering and dominating in big matches, winnng world cups etc...

Watch the CL final again, Messi was drifting in the middle with his back t wards the net. He forced our defence to play a bit upfield and him occupying our defenders enabled Xavi and Iniesta to move the ball around, else we would've murdered Barcelona like Chelsea almost undid them in the second leg. Messi was the one who was able to maintain his foothold and pass the ball to his team mates whilst the through balls of Xavi, Iniesta and shite of Alves all hitting rent boys, if not for Messi playing in the middle the same trend would've been repeated in the final.
 
Boss said:
Ah, got ya, so add 'match fit' to your original post as well. By the way, Just curious, was Messi Man of the match in both legs against Chelsea last season? Also when Chelsea played Barca in the group stages of the Cl, home and away in 2006/07 was Messi man of the match?

You know, where Drogba ran riot at Stamford Bridge and scored that brilliant goal or at the Camp Nou where Lampard scored that audacious chip, I remember it slightly different
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Messi was certainly Barcas best player in the second leg, Iniesta scored a goal set up by Messi but passing of both Iniesta and Xavi was awful, it was for the reason Barca were unable to penetrate much.In the first leg, there was hardly any player to be in contention for MOTM.

In the previous season when Mourinho thumped Barcelona Messi never played in the match. Once in 05/06 he was the MOTM against them at SB in the first leg, whilst he was running them ragged for the thirty minutes he played against them at Nou Camp before being replaced due to hamstring strain.
 
Young Leo is a Mozart in cleats, a prodigy in full bloom of his skill, and still young enough that the realization now is that perhaps he is capable of another level yet, a gear as yet unseen in the sport.

In the meantime, the present magic is enchanting enough, the sort that sends kids out the door with the ball at their feet, eager to try to master a trick, or to practice a shot. Who knows if one of the thousands of children watching Messi live on this U.S. tour and newly enamored of the sport of soccer hasn't made a fateful decision to leave aside baseball or basketball, and chase the rolling ball on the grass instead, trying to follow in Messi's footsteps? Who knows what talent that might produce?

Whether in converting new fans or the next generation of players, Messi's play is as attractive and addictive as the Pied Piper's music, even to those who know little about soccer. His signature moves and techniques may one day bear his name, just as Cruyff's did.

One thing I am sure of, is that someday, I'll reminisce about being one of the ones lucky enough to see Messi play in person.

Messi = Jesus

If Ineista > Messi then Iniesta > Jesus which conflicts the basic number theory in mathematics.
 
marchi-91 said:
If Ronaldo can sustain his level of excellence for another couple of years, you can rate him in that kind of bracket, but at the moment, Its Zidane > everybody else.

What I find humorous is that people are touting Messi as the messiah, but he's failed to sustain his form for a long period of time. It was really only last year 'and shades in 05/06' that he was one of the most promising in the world. Not as influential in 06/07-07/08 as people would like to think, but still enough to keep the punters guessing.

For me its Iniesta > Messi. Just look at the CL final. Iniesta & Xabi ran that game, not Messi.
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:wenger:
 
Barca fans said he was better than Ronaldinho when he (Ronaldinho) was actually playing well...

Which other player has achieved what he has at such a young age. Only THE Ronaldo was on that level at such a young age and his injury troubles didn't come until later. When Messi is fit he's the best and has been for a number of years.

We are talking about a very special player, a once in a generation or more player. I sincerely believe that.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
Barca fans said he was better than Ronaldinho when he (Ronaldinho) was actually playing well...

Which other player has achieved what he has at such a young age. Only THE Ronaldo was on that level at such a young age and his injury troubles didn't come until later. When Messi is fit he's the best and has been for a number of years.

We are talking about a very special player, a once in a generation or more player. I sincerely believe that.
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He is defintely not the best young player ever nor the best player ever as you constantly attempt to say.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
You just cant fathom that a player can influence a match and be MOTM without scoring a goal :lol:
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Just as pointed out earlier, he was not MotM in any of those matches against Liverpool, Chelsea (except that group stage match) or United (07/08).
 
FranklyVulgar said:
Barca fans said he was better than Ronaldinho when he (Ronaldinho) was actually playing well...

Which other player has achieved what he has at such a young age. Only THE Ronaldo was on that level at such a young age and his injury troubles didn't come until later. When Messi is fit he's the best and has been for a number of years.

We are talking about a very special player, a once in a generation or more player. I sincerely believe that.
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:boring: You go on and on about the same thing it's getting very boring...

Messi had a great 08/09, that we can agree on.

Before 08/09, he's never been the best player in the world and only shown in patches what he managed in 08/09.
 
How can two Messi dickriders such as Vijay and Frankly not even know his nickname is Leo, not Lio, who the feck is Lio! Anyway I get it, You guys Pm each other asking each other to spout the biggest bollox as a wind up
 
Boss said:
How can two Messi dickriders such as Vijay and Frankly not even know his nickname is Leo, not Lio, who the feck is Lio! Anyway I get it, You guys Pm each other asking each other to spout the biggest bollox as a wind up
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kontrapunkt_lio.jpg


Look about right to be honest.
 
marchi-91 said:
So let me get this right. Because Iniesta can't run at players like Messi and doesn't score 39 goals 'what ever it was', he's less of a player......


Right......
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Iniesta is a fantastic player, world class. He was the only player in the world who was comparable to Messi and even then it was only for a few months.

He is actually the 2nd best dribbler in world football in my opinion and his eye for a pass is 2nd to none. He's added shooting more to his all round game and his versatility is astonishing.

Iniesta is a joy to watch and has matured magnificently as a player but still have Messi ahead for a number of reasons.
 
vijay said:
Messi was certainly Barcas best player in the second leg, Iniesta scored a goal set up by Messi but passing of both Iniesta and Xavi was awful, it was for the reason Barca were unable to penetrate much.In the first leg, there was hardly any player to be in contention for MOTM.

In the previous season when Mourinho thumped Barcelona Messi never played in the match. Once in 05/06 he was the MOTM against them at SB in the first leg, whilst he was running them ragged for the thirty minutes he played against them at Nou Camp before being replaced due to hamstring strain.
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Sigh Vijay, you really have failed to answer my question by quite a long shot as I've caught you out again. I never even asked about 05/06 at SB, you said everytime he played English teams and I gave you a few matches and you completely sidestepped them. 06/07 group stages???? against Chelsea?? Anybody?? The first leg against Chelsea last year? Messi motd again?

By the way everybody in the world knows Iniesta was Barca's best player at SB last year, he was the only person trying to makes things happen with hi constant dibbles and attempts to get toward the goal. I know you 're on a wind up for sure. By the way Vijay you said Messi was always Motd, not Barca's Motd or is that the latest stipulation? An Motd for one side?

Also I asked about both legs, why you only mention the second leg? You said everytime he plays English teams or was he not 'match fit' in the first leg. Look Messi is probably the best in the world but it does not give people the right to spout false bollox to prove it, his own talents does that and at the end of the day you only make Messi look bad. Try do something which is extremely rare on the Cafe and admit you was wrong about this.
 
marchi-91 said:
So let me get this right. Because Iniesta can't run at players like Messi and doesn't score 39 goals 'what ever it was', he's less of a player......


Right......
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I wasn't actually responding to that part of the post, but yeh...

Iniesta's an amazing dribbler, by the way. Best player in the world for the last few months of the season.
 
Boss said:
How can two Messi dickriders such as Vijay and Frankly not even know his nickname is Leo, not Lio, who the feck is Lio! Anyway I get it, You guys Pm each other asking each other to spout the biggest bollox as a wind up
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Sorry I didn’t realize you were such a fan that you would care so much about his nicknames... :lol:

Considering his name is Lionel, i thought his nickname would be Lio rather than Leo, shoot me now Boss if you care that much.

Nice to see the "I’m objectionable" facade you put on doesn’t take much to take down.

dickriders? nice to see you resort to petty insults rather than actually question the supposed bollocks I spout as a “wind up”.

What did i say about Messi that was so farfetched? That he's the best, been the best, will be the best?

This very thread was started to discuss the potential for Messi to go down as one of the greatest to ever play the game, along with the likes of Maradona, Pele, Cruyff and the rest. Of course I’m sure you're aware of that or did you just come to moan about people talking about Messi or mentioning Ronaldo?

I can't decide which is your supposed purpose here.
 
Boss said:
Since when on a Man United forum does SAF opinions get laughed at? The greatest manager of all time .Or was it always like this?
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Since when was his opinion the only thing in football that mattered about anything?

anyone who doesnt take the words of SAF with a pinch of salt is a mug, end of story. I say this as a fan of the guy, he is the greatest manager of all time and i love his interviews and the way he conducts himself but a saint and a teller of all truths he certainly is not. If he was either of these things he would never be the greatest manager of all time...

besides if you cant see i'm laughing at cal? rather than SAF then you need to open your eyes a bit and stop seeing what you want to see and start seeing what is in fact being said.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
Sorry I didn’t realize you were such a fan that you would care so much about his nicknames... :lol:

Considering his name is Lionel, i thought his nickname would be Lio rather than Leo, shoot me now Boss if you care that much.

Nice to see the "I’m objectionable" facade you put on doesn’t take much to take down.

dickriders? nice to see you resort to petty insults rather than actually question the supposed bollocks I spout as a “wind up”.

What did i say about Messi that was so farfetched? That he's the best, been the best, will be the best?

This very thread was started to discuss the potential for Messi to go down as one of the greatest to ever play the game, along with the likes of Maradona, Pele, Cruyff and the rest. Of course I’m sure you're aware of that or did you just come to moan about people talking about Messi or mentioning Ronaldo?

I can't decide which is your supposed purpose here.
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Que Pasa?! Nah, it's just you have admitted in the past to being a serial wanker over Messi and I can quote you on this so I at least expect you to get some basic facts right.

Messi is one of my favorite players,anybody can see that. I only have problems when posters say complete bollox like Vijay bullshitting his way through his 'motd against english teams' speech or people laughing at SAF for having a different opinion. When did it ever come to that?

Nobody even said anything about Ronaldo, so there you go, bringing him up again without any provocation contradicting yourself as usual. Sorry for thinking somebody who has said in the past that he is 'entitled to wum' logs into the Cafe on a United forum to do just that.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
Since when was his opinion the only thing in football that mattered about anything?

anyone who doesnt take the words of SAF with a pinch of salt is a mug, end of story. I say this as a fan of the guy, he is the greatest manager of all time and i love his interviews and the way he conducts himself but a saint and a teller of all truths he certainly is not. If he was either of these things he would never be the greatest manager of all time...

besides if you cant see i'm laughing at cal? rather than SAF then you need to open your eyes a bit and stop seeing what you want to see and start seeing what is in fact being said.
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So you're basically calling him a Liar because he does not agree with you on one subject? Your arrogance is quite astounding I must say. You now have to take his opinions with a pinch of salt when it comes to this? You ever stop to think maybe this is what he actually believes?
 
Boss said:
So you're basically calling him a Liar because he does not agree with you on one subject? Your arrogance is quite astounding I must say. You now have to take his opinions with a pinch of salt when it comes to this? You ever stop to think maybe this is what he actually believes?
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Maybe he is but do i think everything he says is true? absolutely not.

The only thing i think when i listen to SAF is that he says things for a reason and 100% of what he says is to benifit Manchester United.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
Maybe he is but do i think everything he says is true? absolutely not.

The only thing i think when i listen to SAF is that he says things for a reason and 100% of what he says is to benifit Manchester United.
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Maybe he is? Saf is saying what he believes in, don't question it only because it differentiates from your opinion on a subject as Petty as this one. It's insulting
 
Boss said:
Que Pasa?! Nah, it's just you have admitted in the past to being a serial wanker over Messi and I can quote you on this so I at least expect you to get some basic facts right.

Messi is one of my favorite players,anybody can see that. I only have problems when posters say complete bollox like Vijay bullshitting his way through his 'motd against english teams' speech or people laughing at SAF for having a different opinion. When did it ever come to that?

Nobody even said anything about Ronaldo, so there you go, bringing him up again without any provocation contradicting yourself as usual. Sorry for thinking somebody who has said in the past that he is 'entitled to wum' logs into the Cafe on a United forum to do just that.
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I'm laughing at Cal for using the words of SAF as his only defense. Like because one guy who has a father/son relationship with the player in question is the only source of opinion worth noting :wenger:

I've barely once used a person who has worked with or played with messi as a means to big him up because even if i do think that is their honest opinions (which i do) it doesnt take away from the fact they have an agenda when saying them. Much like SAF, he is leaving the door open for Ronaldo. But no i expect him to say "Ronaldo was enver the best, i just said it cos he played for United" yeah that'll happen...

yeah i said i wanked over him in jest... i guess humour isn't permitted in football discussion. Here is another thing you can quote me on in future as a means to talk me down.

I think Messi is the cutest boy in the world and i love him more than my own boyfriend!

lap it up boss.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
I'm laughing at Cal for using the words of SAF as his only defense. Like because one guy who has a father/son relationship with the player in question is the only source of opinion worth noting :wenger:

I've barely once used a person who has worked with or played with messi as a means to big him up because even if i do think that is their honest opinions (which i do) it doesnt take away from the fact they have an agenda when saying them. Much like SAF, he is leaving the door open for Ronaldo. But no i expect him to say "Ronaldo was enver the best, i just said it cos he played for United" yeah that'll happen...

yeah i said i wanked over him in jest... i guess humour isn't permitted in football discussion. Here is another thing you can quote me on in future as a means to talk me down.
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Ah!! You were cracking a joke, My bad. So saying you masturbate over Lionel Messi and Zlatan Ibrahimovic was a joke. Fair enough Frankly, point well taken.

kedd7l.gif








Comedy is just not what it once was, sigh. By the way it's such a weak excuse to justify that you believe SAF is telling lies only because it differentiates from your opinion on a subject. Lame, should never result to that over this.
 
FranklyVulgar said:
I'm laughing at Cal for using the words of SAF as his only defense. Like because one guy who has a father/son relationship with the player in question is the only source of opinion worth noting :wenger:

I've barely once used a person who has worked with or played with messi as a means to big him up because even if i do think that is their honest opinions (which i do) it doesnt take away from the fact they have an agenda when saying them. Much like SAF, he is leaving the door open for Ronaldo. But no i expect him to say "Ronaldo was enver the best, i just said it cos he played for United" yeah that'll happen...

yeah i said i wanked over him in jest... i guess humour isn't permitted in football discussion. Here is another thing you can quote me on in future as a means to talk me down.

I think Messi is the cutest boy in the world and i love him more than my own boyfriend!

lap it up boss.
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Clearly, that's why this thread was more than 100 pages long BEFORE Sir Alex made that comment. I'm actually his script writer, hence I predicted he'd say that after selling Ronaldo... :wenger:

Sir Alex could easily have left the door open if he said "Ronaldo is the best player in the world in the last few seasons." He didn't need to say Ronaldo was STREETS ahead of Messi & Kaka, the only reason he said so, was, imo, he believed so.
 
Cal? said:
Clearly, that's why this thread was more than 100 pages long BEFORE Sir Alex made that comment. I'm actually his script writer, hence I predicted he'd say that after selling Ronaldo... :wenger:

Sir Alex could easily have left the door open if he said "Ronaldo is the best player in the world in the last few seasons." He didn't need to say Ronaldo was STREETS ahead of Messi & Kaka, the only reason he said so, was, imo, he believed so.
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You're dragging this same shite again once in every three pages although you got your replies long back.

Fergie said, Stam was finished when he left us, he also predicted a great future for Veron at United. This has been repeated umpteen times that even top managers have their prejudices and reservations in rating a player, only a fool would bother taking them as the gospel.

I shagged a Romanian prozy thrice last night but still found time to log in between and talk about Messi...It explains about the genius of young Leo
 
FranklyVulgar said:
Sorry I didn’t realize you were such a fan that you would care so much about his nicknames... :lol:

Considering his name is Lionel, i thought his nickname would be Lio rather than Leo, shoot me now Boss if you care that much.

Nice to see the "I’m objectionable" facade you put on doesn’t take much to take down.

dickriders? nice to see you resort to petty insults rather than actually question the supposed bollocks I spout as a “wind up”.

What did i say about Messi that was so farfetched? That he's the best, been the best, will be the best?

This very thread was started to discuss the potential for Messi to go down as one of the greatest to ever play the game, along with the likes of Maradona, Pele, Cruyff and the rest. Of course I’m sure you're aware of that or did you just come to moan about people talking about Messi or mentioning Ronaldo?

I can't decide which is your supposed purpose here.
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Dont get upset mate. Though many of your points are lucid and brilliantly written posts I cannot deny that your credibility got hit because of your constant Messi-Maradona comparisons along with the "Battle of Retards" debate you lost out to Rubberman few pages back.

I agree your posts scare the shite out of irrational Ronaldo fanbois basically protestant Christians trying to derail this highly sensitive thread yet your points are lucid, easily understood rather than the vague, meandering cookie cutter prattlings posted by Ronaldo fanbois like Cal and his cronies.
 
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber said:
He is defintely not the best young player ever nor the best player ever as you constantly attempt to say.
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May be not.

but that wasnt Frankly point either.

Fat Ronaldo was the most explosive player after Maradona

Messi is the most explosive footballer after Fat Ronaldo.

His form last season was almost up there with Ronaldo of preinjury times, one more great season and if Argentina manages to win the WC, I dont see any reason why Messi cannot be rated on par with the Brazilian.
 
vijay said:
May be not.

but that wasnt Frankly point either.

Fat Ronaldo was the most explosive player after Maradona

Messi is the most explosive footballer after Fat Ronaldo.

His form last season was almost up there with Ronaldo of preinjury times, one more great season and if Argentina manages to win the WC, I dont see any reason why Messi cannot be rated on par with the Brazilian.
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True.
 
Cal? said:
Clearly, that's why this thread was more than 100 pages long BEFORE Sir Alex made that comment. I'm actually his script writer, hence I predicted he'd say that after selling Ronaldo... :wenger:

Sir Alex could easily have left the door open if he said "Ronaldo is the best player in the world in the last few seasons." He didn't need to say Ronaldo was STREETS ahead of Messi & Kaka, the only reason he said so, was, imo, he believed so.
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And therein the pinch of salt lies for anyone with any rationality...
 
Cal? said:
Clearly, that's why this thread was more than 100 pages long BEFORE Sir Alex made that comment. I'm actually his script writer, hence I predicted he'd say that after selling Ronaldo... :wenger:

Sir Alex could easily have left the door open if he said "Ronaldo is the best player in the world in the last few seasons." He didn't need to say Ronaldo was STREETS ahead of Messi & Kaka, the only reason he said so, was, imo, he believed so.
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Yeah 100 pages of you coming across as the single most retarded poster witnessed by anyone bored enough to read 100 pages.

You prattled on about one "fact" to big up your man, that got squashed by the first season Messi was fit (Yet you inconcievably argue that Ronaldos best was better than Messis....) so now you use Ronaldos footballing father to justify all the claims you yourself make. Genius,

if you ever made a point through actually watching football i'd maybe take what you say seriously from time to time, well in reality even if you did you would no doubt spout more trollip for everyone to laugh at.
 
vijay said:
May be not.
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Maybe doesn't come into it. He just isn't.

vijay said:
but that wasnt Frankly point either.
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In the post I chided him for it definitely was. He is prone to hyperbole on the topic of Messi.


vijay said:
Fat Ronaldo was the most explosive player after Maradona

Messi is the most explosive footballer after Fat Ronaldo.
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That is not in dispute.

vijay said:
His form last season was almost up there with Ronaldo of preinjury times, one more great season and if Argentina manages to win the WC, I dont see any reason why Messi cannot be rated on par with the Brazilian.
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Clearly.
 
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