Kurt Zouma / 180 hours community service + banned from keeping cats for 5 years

I am always intrigued when someone suggests that others should educate themselves. What is it that you think you know that others have missed?
I don't have time or the inclination, it's up to those making the claims to make sure they have the knowledge to support those claims.
 
The fact that some people are using the 'intent' defence is baffling...

If he kicked the cat out of rage, I would be appalled but you can argue that it could have been an isolated incident and he can get help with anger management issues etc. People do crazy things in a fit of rage, we know this for a fact.

The fact that people are saying he was only playing around makes me feel like he's even more of a psychopath. Who thinks it's fun to kick an animal across a room? Unless said person also likes being kicked across a room themselves... which I doubt Zouma does...

I love the cafe and am always in the opinion that everyone should have their own say on matters but this isn't really a grey area... it's just wrong and some of the people in this thread have really confused me.
 
He said animal abuse is worse than racism. He is also blocking anybody on Twitter that is questioning what he said. You can very easily condemn what Zouma did, and do it without bringing racism into it.

This sums it up.
Let’s take some actual examples instead and compare whether the FA’s action is proportionate.

Calling your white friend negrito in a friendly conversation = ban

Kicking a cat while filming and laughing = no action.

As far as the statement of animal abuse being worse than racism, then it’s obvious you can’t compare those two and the statement is nonsense. The worst act of racism is always going to be worse than the worst act of animal abuse, but the worst case of animal abuse is obviously worse than the least harmful act of racism.
 
The fact that some people are using the 'intent' defence is baffling...

If he kicked the cat out of rage, I would be appalled but you can argue that it could have been an isolated incident and he can get help with anger management issues etc. People do crazy things in a fit of rage, we know this for a fact.

The fact that people are saying he was only playing around makes me feel like he's even more of a psychopath. Who thinks it's fun to kick an animal across a room? Unless said person also likes being kicked across a room themselves... which I doubt Zouma does...

I love the cafe and am always in the opinion that everyone should have their own say on matters but this isn't really a grey area... it's just wrong and some of the people in this thread have really confused me.
Hmm, not sure your opinion is valid with a username like that. Do you eat meat?
 
He said animal abuse is worse than racism. He is also blocking anybody on Twitter that is questioning what he said. You can very easily condemn what Zouma did, and do it without bringing racism into it.

This sums it up.
I don't want to go in "what is bigger evil" comparism. All i know that he is right. He tried to show how some bad things are tolerated and some are not.
Evil shit is evil shit and this deserved a ban. From WH and FA. Pathetic reaction from both of them.
 
The coverage this has got is unbelievable. Yet 95% of these very same people kicking up a fuss EAT animals every single day that have been battered by human workers in slaughter houses. The hypocrisy is hilarious.
of course because we have chosen Cats and Dogs as our "treasured friends" just like people stupidly getting mad about dog meat industry when they eat other animals
I lost my cat to a chronic disease a few weeks ago, really want someone to punch Zouma in the face, but how am I even complaining about it when I got my cat's testicles chopped off and I'm eating animals 4 times a week.
Weird battle I'm fighting with myself.
thank you for your honesty
This asshole shouldn't just be fired, he should be prosecuted as well.

Also, I'm vegan, but I think it's perfectly fine to criticize this even if you eat meat. There's a big difference between indirect responsibility and this kind of psychopatic behaviour.

Everybody is appalled about (child) abuse, yet a lot of people wear sneakers made in terrible circumstances.
paying someone to do a hit is the same as doing the hit.
I wasn't expecting to be judged for eating meat when I condemned somebody kicking a cat.
Welcome to the funhouse
Well you are paying someone to do worse to other animals.. if you stopped to think about it for a second
yep. far, far worse
So what you're saying is, as long as you haven't got blood on your own hands, it's all okay? Gotcha.
seems to be the mantra.
I see the “whataboutism” had begun. Eating meat and kicking a cat across the room are not even close to related ffs.
Nope they are not. The meat eating business is a far more brutal a practice than a kick. The cat even walked off without a limp. Don't even think he ran away. If you open those cages at farms they would try their best to escape. terrified, sick, uncomfortable, children being taken away and killed, rape, all goes down on those farm
 
Let’s take some actual examples instead and compare whether the FA’s action is proportionate.

Calling your white friend negrito in a friendly conversation = ban

Kicking a cat while filming and laughing = no action.

As far as the statement of animal abuse being worse than racism, then it’s obvious you can’t compare those two and the statement is nonsense. The worst act of racism is always going to be worse than the worst act of animal abuse, but the worst case of animal abuse is obviously worse than the least harmful act of racism.
I'm not saying that the FA has handled either case well. My only issue is the direct statement that he made. Animal abuse is obviously very bad, but he has downplayed racism by saying what he said. Plenty of people are trying to explain to him why what he said isn't okay, and they're being blocked.

I don't want to go in "what is bigger evil" comparism. All i know that he is right. He tried to show how some bad things are tolerated and some are not.
Evil shit is evil shit and this deserved a ban. From WH and FA. Pathetic reaction from both of them.
No. I fully disagree that animal abuse is worse than racism. This statement is absurd and disgusting to read as a black person.
 
My first thread ever which i am putting on ignore. Some of you are pathetic. Just like West Ham are:
"We have spoken to Kurt and will be dealing with the matter internally, but we would like to make it clear that we in no way condone cruelty towards animals.”
Then ban Zouma if you condone cruelty you fecking liars!
 
He's probably gone him and attacked the poor thing again for almost damaging his career, such are the egos of these players.
 
The people doing that were trying to excuse the animal abuse and make excuses and equally bad. But those coming in and chiming on about how this is exactly the same as the meat industry are equally damaging. I'll say it again, kicking a cat across a room s nothing to do with the meat industry so why not leave that whataboutery for another debate.

Yea I agree there's no equivalence between being against kicking a cat and eating meat.

This should be judged by itself, my opinion is that it is not serious enough to warrant him losing his place at the club (I'm going to do the 'but I have black friends' line but I have had cats as pets my whole life so it's not as if I don't care about animals). To each his/her own though.
 
He isn't comparing it to racism, he's saying if this was a perceived racist incident (see Cavani) this would get a ban in days even if it wasn't racist. The FA have taken a ridiculous approach to anti-racism without tackling the real issues and now they are just ignoring yet another real issue, animal abuse.
So basically the FA like most of society, doesn't give a feck about animals. Go figure
 
He isn't comparing it to racism, he's saying if this was a perceived racist incident (see Cavani) this would get a ban in days even if it wasn't racist. The FA have taken a ridiculous approach to anti-racism without tackling the real issues and now they are just ignoring yet another real issue, animal abuse.
What you’ve just done is compare animal cruelty to racism. You people love to expose yourselves. If Zouma was a white man racism would never be brought up. It’s a case of apple and oranges. You just don’t compare animals to human beings ever.
 
feck me this thread has taken a bizarre twist.

Certain posters need to educate themselves about the meat industry and go and visit some organic pastoral farmers before denouncing all meat as bad and all meat production as evil.
Is there a humane way of murder? Murdering an animal who wants to live is worst than kicking one once no? His cats fate is better than any animal slaughtered for food I am sure
 
Some of the takes in this thread are truly mind-boggling. If you can't see a difference between eating meat for sustinence and kicking shite out of a pet cat for amusement, then you're a lost cause.
 
What you’ve just done is compare animal cruelty to racism. You people love to expose yourselves. If Zouma was a white man racism would never be brought up. It’s a case of apple and oranges.
I don't that has anything to do with it. It's probably more that racism is taken very seriously as it should, in football. But this issue which is far worse than a racial slur being hurled like Suarez did (which is just using a small example, there can be hate crimes which are worse).


What you’ve just done is compare animal cruelty to racism. You people love to expose yourselves. If Zouma was a white man racism would never be brought up. It’s a case of apple and oranges. You just don’t compare animals to human beings ever.
Maybe you don't. I and many others do. Not so much compare but feel the same compassion regardless. feck our species bloated sense of self importance. Animal cruelty can be worse than racism, racism can be worse than animal cruelty. Depends on the specific cases.
 
Some of the takes in this thread are truly mind-boggling. If you can't see a difference between eating meat for sustinence and kicking shite out of a pet cat for amusement, then you're a lost cause.
When we're hoarding terrified animals into gas houses and slitting their throats, we must remember to tell them that it's all in the name of eating meat, nothing personal, and they should count themselves lucky they aren't a pet cat getting kicked! That'll make them feel better.
 
I don't that has anything to do with it. It's probably more that racism is taken very seriously as it should, in football. But this issue which is far worse than a racial slur being hurled like Suarez did (which is just using a small example, there can be hate crimes which are worse).



Maybe you don't. I and many others do. Not so much compare but feel the same compassion regardless. feck our species bloated sense of self importance. Animal cruelty can be worse than racism, racism can be worse than animal cruelty. Depends on the specific cases.
Agree 100%.
 
I still don't understand the eating meat debate...

So if I'm at home, eating my chicken salad and see my neighbor kicking the shit out of his cat in the garden... I'm not allowed to intervene because I'm eating a chicken salad?

Have I got that right?

feck this... I'm not coming back in this thread, I can have a more meaningful debate with my 1 year old :lol:
 
When we're hoarding terrified animals into gas houses and slitting their throats, we must remember to tell them that it's all in the name of eating meat, nothing personal, and they should count themselves lucky they aren't a pet cat getting kicked! That'll make them feel better.

The only way your argument would make any sense would be if Zouma had a pet cow and recorded himself slitting his pet cow's throat. How can you not see the difference between someone being the actual perpetrator of animal abuse and someone else indirectly contributing towards the meat industry?
 
I still don't understand the eating meat debate...

So if I'm at home, eating my chicken salad and see my neighbor kicking the shit out of his cat in the garden... I'm not allowed to intervene because I'm eating a chicken salad?

Have I got that right?

feck this... I'm not coming back in this thread, I can have a more meaningful debate with my 1 year old :lol:
It all depends whether the cat eats meat. If it is vegan, then you should intervene. If not, then it is a hypocritical cat.
 
The only way your argument would make any sense would be if Zouma had a pet cow and recorded himself slitting his pet cow's throat. How can you not see the difference between someone being the actual perpetrator of animal abuse and someone else indirectly contributing towards the meat industry?

"Indirectly contributing" sounds so benign. It's not. If you eat meat that isn't ethically sourced, then you directly enable the horrible practices that go on in the meat industry.

There are several degrees of separation but still, it's ethically not sound practice.

I'm not saying meat eaters can't criticize Zouma. I'm not saying if you're a meat eater you're as bad as Zouma. But yeah, there's a nugget of truth amidst the whataboutery going on.

Disclaimer: I eat meat (nh)
 
If you found out your favourite takeaway place is using cat meat would you stop eating it?
 
They’ve taken the cat off him
 
Going by logic of some in this thread, the cat deserved rough treatment as cats eat mice... or should we make cats vegans?
 
I really don't give a crap about the eating meat debate. You should never ever abuse an animal even by kicking it across a room. If you own a pet you should love and respect it. There is a key difference between this rubbish of indirectly contributing to the meat industry and abusing a pet. When you have a pet, you are responsible for it and are obliged to give it a loving home. Last time I checked you didn't own or were responsible for that animal that was killed for that chicken you were eating. I have lived with a cat for 4 years while I was living at home and I adored her and she would even hop up and rest on my shoulder. Since I have left home I have lived with a cat previsouly and am currently living with one which I have grown fond of. The one that I am living with at the moment even hopped on my bed and licked my face. I adore him and treat him with kindness and respect.
 
If you found out your favourite takeaway place is using cat meat would you stop eating it?

Speaking as someone whose - not favourite...but conveniently located takeaway place that I used to stagger into at 4 AM on a regular basis...was closed down on the suspicion of having used...not cat meat but something else (substitute the first letter)...I can honestly say: yes, yes I would-

(I may shamelessly flaunt my produced-by-starving cats sneakers with built-in iPhone in public, but I do have some standards).
 
Animal charity the RSPCA has taken West Ham defender Kurt Zouma's two pet cats away after videos emerged on social media of him kicking and slapping one of them