Jurgen Klopp Sack Watch

One thing I don't agree with people here is that Liverpool's form has everything to do with them being tired from all the pressing they did earlier in the season. While that might have contributed, it's by no means the most important factor.

Their demise started with injury to Coutinho. Followed soon by injury to Matip, Mane heading to AFCON and Firmino getting himself involved in drinking and driving(plus his home being robbed and all). We must understand that these things had a real effect on them as all of those players were key players for them at the start of the season.

This is also the reason why I don't think that them having one game a week is going to sort all their problems out. They need inspiration right now, but it's not coming from anywhere. Their manager hasn't proven anything in the league, doubts would be creeping in. Klopp's best bet would be to stay in the cup comps and beat lower league fodder to at least build some confidence.
 
RedCurry said:
One thing I don't agree with people here is that Liverpool's form has everything to do with them being tired from all the pressing they did earlier in the season. While that might have contributed, it's by no means the most important factor.

Their demise started with injury to Coutinho. Followed soon by injury to Matip, Mane heading to AFCON and Firmino getting himself involved in drinking and driving(plus his home being robbed and all). We must understand that these things had a real effect on them as all of those players were key players for them at the start of the season.

This is also the reason why I don't think that them having one game a week is going to sort all their problems out. They need inspiration right now, but it's not coming from anywhere. Their manager hasn't proven anything in the league, doubts would be creeping in. Klopp's best bet would be to stay in the cup comps and beat lower league fodder to at least build some confidence.
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goes with the territory....
 
RedCurry said:
One thing I don't agree with people here is that Liverpool's form has everything to do with them being tired from all the pressing they did earlier in the season. While that might have contributed, it's by no means the most important factor.

Their demise started with injury to Coutinho. Followed soon by injury to Matip, Mane heading to AFCON and Firmino getting himself involved in drinking and driving(plus his home being robbed and all). We must understand that these things had a real effect on them as all of those players were key players for them at the start of the season.

This is also the reason why I don't think that them having one game a week is going to sort all their problems out. They need inspiration right now, but it's not coming from anywhere. Their manager hasn't proven anything in the league, doubts would be creeping in. Klopp's best bet would be to stay in the cup comps and beat lower league fodder to at least build some confidence.
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Agree. This idea of "Klopp didnt have a winter break", "They cant keep this up all season" Its all absolute horse shit.
The most ill agree on, is that during the winter period our form will drop, and it did. But after that, when the schedule clears up again why should it affect our play?

This idea of we'll get tired, its like people think we're playing prem games one day after another. They get a freaking weeks rest. What do you mean they cant keep it up all season?

The injury to Coutinho, Matip's absence and Mané absence has disrupted our performances. BUT. Im not going to make excuses and say thats all it is.
Our inability to break down teams that sit back and concede possession is abysmal, we lack creativity. Now whether thats, at the moment, down to lack of confidence I dont know. Because one thing for sure is that earlier on in the season we had players like Wijnaldum and Lallana running from deep to get beyond the defence, now they aren't as much. That might be due to us thinking we're weak at the back, so they dont take risks.

Whatever it is. It needs to be adressed quickly.

Also. Can we buy a freaking defensive midfielder. PLEASE! The last one I remember us having is Mascherano. Yeah.... its been that long.
 
Samid said:


Ex-players already turning on him.
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Although I agree with what he's saying, I wouldn't give too much credit to him as a pundit, as recently he's said that UTD should have signed Rafa as manager before Mou ( with no apparent understanding of conext ); and then, 3 months ago, on Talksport, shared his insight with the nation when he spoke about sacking Jose if UTD were not challenging for top four by Christmas, and replacing him with SAF!
 
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I had been saying even when they were on red hot streak that their players are no where good enough for a title challenge as they are just in form, and they will eventually drop off. All I get was being mocked for being salty. The tactics that Klopp uses ATM is being found out that's for sure, but IMO it's more on the players simply not being good enough. Try and compare the players between Liverpool and the other teams in the top 6 and you will realize how poor they are. It gets worse when you look at their bench options. Klopp was deluded when he said his squad is good enough.
 
dasty said:
I had been saying even when they were on red hot streak that their players are no where good enough for a title challenge as they are just in form, and they will eventually drop off. All I get was being mocked for being salty. The tactics that Klopp uses ATM is being found out that's for sure, but IMO it's more on the players simply not being good enough. Try and compare the players between Liverpool and the other teams in the top 6 and you will realize how poor they are. It gets worse when you look at their bench options. Klopp was deluded when he said his squad is good enough.
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I keep saying similar. Great players do it week in, week out, season after season. Liverpool generally buy flash-in-the-pan players, like Charlie Adam, who have a good half a season or something, and pay for them at their peak price. Their squad is always littered with these kinds of players, who can go on a good run of games and look good, but who can't sustain it.
 
TheBiggest said:
I'd consider myself a mature, professional guy - so I don't want this to sound bizarrely sweeping.

But there is something inearth in anybody associated with Liverpool, there's a really bizarre delusion that because they were hip in the 80s, their time will come again soon. All LFC fans seem to have this strange chip on their shoulder and they get carried away by a little uplift in form. You can see it in ex-players too when they are acting as pundits, the likes of Houghton, Aldridge is a very odd one, Phil Thompson etc, they get too giddy when the team has a short run of wins. So their fans, their ex-players and now their board members all seem to have the same rush of blood to the head which is the reason boom boost cycles appear. It must be absolutely soul-destroying to be a fan or member of Liverpool - the amount of false dawns they set themselves up for is so crazy. And the strangest thing is; they NEVER learn.

They must be brain drained from all the disappointments they go through on an annual basis.

The facts remain that Liverpool have won 1 trophy (a League Cup) in the past 11 seasons and in the past 8 seasons they have finished 7th, 6th, 8th, 7th, 2nd, 6th, 8th and look most likely to finish 6th again this year.

Where do they get their positivity from? It's so strange.
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You already answered that question.

Delusion.
 
In all honesty, a-lot of the players are pretty shit. I also think Coutinho is one of the most overrated players that I've ever seen.
 
Robbie Boy said:
In all honesty, a-lot of the players are pretty shit. I also think Coutinho is one of the most overrated players that I've ever seen.
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He's been awful since coming back from injury. I don't think they are rubbish, but they mostly aren't good enough to get us where we want to go.

Some of them like Mignolet for example are genuinely awful players. I've got no idea why Klopp thought it was worth signing him to a 5 year contract.
 
Klopper76 said:
He's been awful since coming back from injury. I don't think they are rubbish, but they mostly aren't good enough to get us where we want to go.

Some of them like Mignolet for example are genuinely awful players. I've got no idea why Klopp thought it was worth signing him to a 5 year contract.
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Do you think you'll turn it around now your schedule is massively reduced? Honest thoughts on final league position?
 
I don't think it has anything to do with their pressing game catching up with them. They lost a few of their better players and it's now become a confidence thing. They had momentum and the belief that comes with it and now they don't...and when it comes down to it, their players aren't actually that good.

I mean, Mane is a good player, Coutinho is a good player...but they're good players. At any of the other top six teams they would just be players who played in that team. Can you imagine Coutinho being key to a Chelsea team, or a City team? It wouldn't happen. At Liverpool they're the two best players. The rest of their team is average to decent.

When you take momentum and confidence/belief away from a group of average to decent players, they play like average/decent players. Klopp isn't a miracle worker. You can manage the team well, motivate them well, have a good mind for tactics, etc...but at the end of the day James Milner is still James Milner, and if James Milner is one of your most dependable players, you will get a level of performance/quality to reflect that.

Klopp doesn't seem to handle it all that well either. He doesn't seem to want to accept that his team are ever doing anything wrong or could be doing anything better. So they keep making the same errors...although in fairness you could apply this just the same to Mourinho, Wenger and Pep.
 
Klopper76 said:
He's been awful since coming back from injury. I don't think they are rubbish, but they mostly aren't good enough to get us where we want to go.

Some of them like Mignolet for example are genuinely awful players. I've got no idea why Klopp thought it was worth signing him to a 5 year contract.
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Klopper76 said:
He's been awful since coming back from injury. I don't think they are rubbish, but they mostly aren't good enough to get us where we want to go.

Some of them like Mignolet for example are genuinely awful players. I've got no idea why Klopp thought it was worth signing him to a 5 year contract.
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Totally agree about Mignolet , he is no where near good enough and the whole defense suffers from his shakiness . A keeper like Forster or Hart would make a huge difference .
 
noodlehair said:
I don't think it has anything to do with their pressing game catching up with them. They lost a few of their better players and it's now become a confidence thing. They had momentum and the belief that comes with it and now they don't...and when it comes down to it, their players aren't actually that good.

I mean, Mane is a good player, Coutinho is a good player...but they're good players. At any of the other top six teams they would just be players who played in that team. Can you imagine Coutinho being key to a Chelsea team, or a City team? It wouldn't happen. At Liverpool they're the two best players. The rest of their team is average to decent.

When you take momentum and confidence/belief away from a group of average to decent players, they play like average/decent players. Klopp isn't a miracle worker. You can manage the team well, motivate them well, have a good mind for tactics, etc...but at the end of the day James Milner is still James Milner, and if James Milner is one of your most dependable players, you will get a level of performance/quality to reflect that.

Klopp doesn't seem to handle it all that well either. He doesn't seem to want to accept that his team are ever doing anything wrong or could be doing anything better. So they keep making the same errors...although in fairness you could apply this just the same to Mourinho, Wenger and Pep.
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Good point about momentum , just take a look at Leicester .
 
Klopper76 said:
That 'easier' run of nine games to finish the season looks very difficult all of a sudden. Banana skins everywhere.
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I'm starting to fear it a little myself now. However, if those nine teams are out of relegation trouble and nowhere near Europe then you can only hope their concentration levels drop (impending summer holidays, etc).

Could do with teams starting to roll over for us instead of turning up with cup final mentality every single week.
 
LuisNaniencia said:
Do you think you'll turn it around now your schedule is massively reduced? Honest thoughts on final league position?
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I don't know at the moment. It's hard to call without seeing us play one game a week. What's clear to me is that out of all of the top six sides we have the least quality.

Right now I think we'll end up 6th.
 
Klopper76 said:
He's been awful since coming back from injury. I don't think they are rubbish, but they mostly aren't good enough to get us where we want to go.

Some of them like Mignolet for example are genuinely awful players. I've got no idea why Klopp thought it was worth signing him to a 5 year contract.
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Honestly, I think Mane & Coutinho are by far your two best players while Lovern, Matip, Lallana, Firmino, Clyne and maybe Henderson are decent enough players. Origi has shown promise but seems way off the pace lately. The likes of Wijnaldum, Can, Klaven and Moreno can easily be disposed of and upgraded . Sturridge is a good player - well at least he was - but injury problems have definitely taken their toll and he doesn't fit into a Klopp system.

Coutinho, for me, has never been the player that he's been made out to be. On his day he's a very good talent, but 'his day' isn't anywhere near frequent enough for him to be classed as a really top player.
 
Klopper76 said:
Right now I think we'll end up 6th.
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:eek:

That will be the end of Klopp I believe. Another year with Europa will not only drain your players, but you will not be able to attract top ones (which Klopp also failed to do this year by the way). Unless he can do miracle then it's the end of the road for him (since I don't believe he can turn thing around with Europa football getting in the way).
 
Mick Quinn was gobbing off on Talksport this morning about how the owners have decided to go out and buy 6 high profile players in the summer.

Even if this is true, that many new faces in one go rarely works out so well at any club straight away. For evidence, see United over the last 3-4 seasons.
 
Cantona_Forever said:
:eek:

That will be the end of Klopp I believe. Another year with Europa will not only drain your players, but you will not be able to attract top ones (which Klopp also failed to do this year by the way). Unless he can do miracle then it's the end of the road for him (since I don't believe he can turn thing around with Europa football getting in the way).
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He will get one more year to fix things imo and if no significant improvement by this time next year, he will be gone.
 
EyeInTheSky said:
Can't argue with that. He is getting credit for them finishing in top 4 as apposed to 4-6 consistently. But people are forgetting that Tottenham were the only team ever to finish 3rd in a 2 horse race...
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Loving the totally unnecessary and out of context Spurs dig. :P Notice the difference between the fawning from the media with Klopp/Liverpool possibly getting into top 4 vs the much more subdued and almost non-existant coverage Spurs gets for doing the same thing (in comparison).
 
balaks said:
Loving the totally unnecessary and out of context Spurs dig. :P Notice the difference between the fawning from the media with Klopp/Liverpool possibly getting into top 4 vs the much more subdued and almost non-existant coverage Spurs gets for doing the same thing (in comparison).
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The fawning over Klopp since his arrival has been cringy. It does seem to thankfully be dying down, though.
 
balaks said:
He will get one more year to fix things imo and if no significant improvement by this time next year, he will be gone.
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Yes, he will. Apology if my point isn't clear. He will be there next season but the clock will start ticking down. He should pray for either 4th or 7th this year to be safe.
 
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GaryLifo said:
Mick Quinn was gobbing off on Talksport this morning about how the owners have decided to go out and buy 6 high profile players in the summer.

Even if this is true, that many new faces in one go rarely works out so well at any club straight away. For evidence, see United over the last 3-4 seasons.
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That bloke talks utter bobbins all of the time.

As if he knows who Pool are signing. It's not the FSG way either - they pay £30m per player and hope he becomes a worldy.
 
LuisNaniencia said:
Do you think you'll turn it around now your schedule is massively reduced? Honest thoughts on final league position?
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It's weird that we've reached our middle ground and people are really seeing it for what it is. Back in October fans (mainly all Utd) had us down as winning the league whereas I was just happy nut (points) collecting for hibernation.

Now that winter has kicked in we have just about enough to nibble on and survive until spring. I predicted 4th when we were top of the league and I'm predicting 4th now we're zero league wins in the last however many.
 
Dumbstar said:
It's weird that we've reached our middle ground and people are really seeing it for what it is. Back in October fans (mainly all Utd) had us down as winning the league whereas I was just happy nut (points) collecting for hibernation.

Now that winter has kicked in we have just about enough to nibble on and survive until spring. I predicted 4th when we were top of the league and I'm predicting 4th now we're zero league wins in the last however many.
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The form your team is in 5 or 6th is much more likely and giving the first half of the season that's a disaster. Although I get that preseason that would have been acceptable the first half of the season raised expectations to a very high level but you are now in relegation form.
 
Liverpool are basically back to a game a week now, it's a huge advantage, but it depends on the mental strength of the players to pick themselves up from this terrible run. They also need a bit of luck in front of their own goal. They aren't out of it yet, no matter how ahit the team is, the extra preparation and rest will shorten the quality gap.
 
noodlehair said:
I don't think it has anything to do with their pressing game catching up with them. They lost a few of their better players and it's now become a confidence thing. They had momentum and the belief that comes with it and now they don't...and when it comes down to it, their players aren't actually that good.

I mean, Mane is a good player, Coutinho is a good player...but they're good players. At any of the other top six teams they would just be players who played in that team. Can you imagine Coutinho being key to a Chelsea team, or a City team? It wouldn't happen. At Liverpool they're the two best players. The rest of their team is average to decent.

When you take momentum and confidence/belief away from a group of average to decent players, they play like average/decent players. Klopp isn't a miracle worker. You can manage the team well, motivate them well, have a good mind for tactics, etc...but at the end of the day James Milner is still James Milner, and if James Milner is one of your most dependable players, you will get a level of performance/quality to reflect that.

Klopp doesn't seem to handle it all that well either. He doesn't seem to want to accept that his team are ever doing anything wrong or could be doing anything better. So they keep making the same errors...although in fairness you could apply this just the same to Mourinho, Wenger and Pep.
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Yeah; agree with this.

I said this in an earlier thread;

In the first half of the season, Liverpool were an average squad playing with great confidence.

Now they're just an average squad, playing.
 
Klopper76 said:
Is this a good idea or a bad one?
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It's not going to help you develop a plan b that's for sure. Teams will still concede possession to you to nullify your high pressing and your ability to win the ball high up with space to exploit and they'll still pack the middle and force you to play down the flanks. You'll still be putting in cross after cross even though you're playing with a false fecking 9.
Who am I to say anything but if Klopp is putting this down to tiredness then it's a good thing for the rest of the top 6
 
cyberman said:
It's not going to help you develop a plan b that's for sure. Teams will still concede possession to you to nullify your high pressing and your ability to win the ball high up with space to exploit and they'll still pack the middle and force you to play down the flanks. You'll still be putting in cross after cross even though you're playing with a false fecking 9.
Who am I to say anything but if Klopp is putting this down to tiredness then it's a good thing for the rest of the top 6
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Adrian Durham nailed this point last night on Talksport. He's obviously used to having a winter break. And he hasn't got a good enough squad to rotate every week and be confident of a result. But his target (now the League is out of reach) is qualifying for Europe next season. So assuming they don't fall at the qualifiers that's another 6 games minimum.
Therefore this is a problem I can't see going away. To play the way he wants, with that intensity is ok for a certain amount of time but certainly if I was a scouser the lack of a plan B would concern me.
 
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