Jose Mourinho | 2017/18 Assessments | Poll Added

[amolbhatia50k]

Uhh.. what? When should he have made this decision? Every man and his dog has been crying out for Shaw to be given more chances. Mourinho obliged too but Luke has consistently failed to impress with his biggest issue being his lack of desire for the shirt. Had Mourinho gotten rid of Shaw earlier, there'd be mass hysteria on this site as to why we let a "promising" left back leave at the age of just 22.

How has he had a go at a lot our players? You failed to mention those he has constantly defended. Pogba, Fellaini, Mata, Sanchez, Rashford etc.

Uhh yes? Keeping Shaw for an additional 10 months, praising him for having sorted his mentality/deserving a new contract and then losing faith in him, is obviously not the ideal situation. We all wanted Shaw to be given a chance but if he finds him so incredibly unimpressive behind the scenes (when there's been nothing particularly bad on the pitch) then it's best to make the decision and stick with it. Not sure what has happened to flip flop on this one as he has. Either way were now two seasons into his United tenure without a LB he really rates. He could have signed one in addition to Shaw given he always doubted him.

The second paragraph tells me you haven't read his comments. He has spent the last few weeks lamenting much of what he has. Why should i mention him defending someone? Can you not consider a point without it being sugar coated to go easy on your hero Jose?

 

[#07]

Was looking at this again.
He complains about being aggressive and fast build up attacks.
He then says we've been training for two days.
Maybe that's the problem. The teams that do it well are good at it because they're constantly doing it.
It's become habitual for them. It again boils down to the problem of tactics and way of playing constantly changing.
Why don't we practice being aggressive and a faster build-up play constantly?
If you think about it, it's normal not to be good at something you don't do often.

Do you genuinely think that Jose tells them to get to the 18 yards box and lay it off constantly? This is not something any of his teams prior to United have done.

He has always, always demanded fast transitions and getting the ball forward quickly. This is the one constant through all his coaching. He doesn't mind direct passes even if they don't ultimately find a teammate, hence his lack of concern about possession.

Our players do lack personality. They get to the edge of the area and often don't shoot or smash their crosses into the first defender. There's a lack of willingness to get on the ball and actually force the situation. Our players would be comfortable passing it side to side in front of a mass defence all game. A lot of them do hide from the ball.

What we need is this:



Someone who'll just pick up the ball and take responsibility and make the difference. Instead we get see saw football until our moves break down. Its infuriating.

 

[roonster09]

Uhh.. what? When should he have made this decision? Every man and his dog has been crying out for Shaw to be given more chances. Mourinho obliged too but Luke has consistently failed to impress with his biggest issue being his lack of desire for the shirt. Had Mourinho gotten rid of Shaw earlier, there'd be mass hysteria on this site as to why we let a "promising" left back leave at the age of just 22.

How has he had a go at a lot our players? You failed to mention those he has constantly defended. Pogba, Fellaini, Mata, Sanchez, Rashford etc.

Not really. So many wanted Shaw to start over Young when Young returned as Shaw was playing well.

 

[SwSw]

Not really. So many wanted Shaw to start over Young when Young returned as Shaw was playing well.

Mata played well and was drop the next match. I don't see him putting up a shit show the next time he was chosen to play. Shaw's attitude has been diabolical.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Not really. So many wanted Shaw to start over Young when Young returned as Shaw was playing well.

He played OK but I can't think of a single performance that has been better than some of Young's.

From the left back position, Young scored two against Watford (one FK) and was simply brilliant throughout. He was then part of a very good attacking display at Arsenal. Recently, he pulled off an incredible defensive performance to completely neutralise Mo Salah (the most inform attacker in the league). Shaw, on the other hand, gets praise for pretty much getting the simple things right.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I also love people are complaining about the negativity when Mourinho has been spewing nothing but, negativity since the Sevilla match.

Absolutely. One rule for Jose.

 

[jackofalltrades]

Around this time last year I thought Mourinho was more intent on getting a trophy than playing attractive football in order to establish a strong link with the fans. I gave him credit for that thinking he'd change this season when it was more a team he'd created and with two trophies in the bank he'd feel justified in going for exciting football + trophies rather than boring football + trophies.

I don't remember his stints at Chelsea being this boring. So, what is it ?

 

[roonster09]

He played OK but I can't think of a single performance that has been better than some of Young's.

From the left back position, Young scored two against Watford (one FK) and was simply brilliant throughout. He was then part of a very good attacking display at Arsenal. Recently, he pulled off an incredible defensive performance to completely neutralise Mo Salah (the most inform attacker in the league). Shaw, on the other hand, gets praise for pretty much getting the simple things right.

I'm not downplaying Young here but saying Shaw didn't play well when given chances was wrong. It might not be as good as Young's was but he did more than good enough job.

This season Young played really well, so playing him over Shaw was sort of correct thing to do.

Btw Shaw was praised by Jose also.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

The answer to your first question is we cannot be like our neighbours that splashes 100 mil on fullbacks while concurrently upgrading our midfields and forwards. The squad Mourinho inherited, especially according to the Caf at that point in time, was the lack of proven striker (Rooney?) and a glaring absence of quality in midfield. Fullbacks were not a concern. You can't say Mourinho haven't addressed Caf's top most concern at that time. It is no coincidence that after upgrading these positions, we are sitting at second when LVG's team had us at 4th to 6th.

When we can splash 100mil on fullbacks, I will then judge Mourinho more harshly if not delivering a title. Because to be honest, if we are to think Pep is leaps and bounds better than Mourinho, then he wouldn't have the need to upgrade his fullbacks. Mourinho did not have the luxury.

Do we seriously think that Pep, or any other manager for that matter, would succeed in United as Pep is doing now in city if the budget is although huge, but constraint? I got a funny feeling if the tables are turn and we swapped manager after LVG we will still be in the same position, i.e. City 1st United 2nd. We have to be realistic on our expectations.

That would be like City claiming they can't win the CL until they sign a CM for the world record fee. The reality is that a lot of people here, particuarly those with a great deal of faith in Mourinho, would like us and our manager to hide behind our noisy neighbours and their spending.

A few points on this for you to consider:

• Manchester City spent a lot this past summer and it would be both convenient and ignorant for us to fall into the trap of thinking that their entire success is based around that. For anyone who has actually watched the quality of their football and been able to acknowledge it, how different would they really have been without Laporte, Danilo and Mendy? Fact is, they would still have improved, they'd still be far better than us and they'd still be better than us. Because they've found the right balance, rythme, style and cohesion i.e they're a well managed and sadly top class football team. If anything some of the signings they've made are aimed at the next 5 years and had little bearing on this season itself. So let's stop complaining about the spending they've done and focus on the improvement they've done.
• There's a limit to how much City can improve. They're not going to be this good in the league next season. At best, they are going to be a consistent 90 point team in this league. We have more scope for improvement and it's not going to take another 300 million to bridge it. Our incremental benefit for every right choice we make is greater than theirs. So again, hiding behind spending doesn't make sense. If we spend another 150 this summer we should challenge for big honours or win them. Waiting for the day we spend X amount of money doesn't add up, for me.
• Like I've said before I'm fine with Jose for one more year. But I can't indulge this sob story excuse making. Woodward has backed him. He has to produce. I like his identification of players but I have doubts about his coaching/tactics/system and how much it helps/hinders us.

 

[sincher]

That would be like City claiming they can't win the CL until they sign a CM for the world record fee. The reality is that a lot of people here, particuarly those with a great deal of faith in Mourinho, would like us and our manager to hide behind our noisy neighbours and their spending.

A few points on this for you to consider:

• Manchester City spent a lot this past summer and it would be both convenient and ignorant for us to fall into the trap of thinking that their entire success is based around that. For anyone who has actually watched the quality of their football and been able to acknowledge it, how different would they really have been without Laporte, Danilo and Mendy? Fact is, they would still have improved, they'd still be far better than us and they'd still be better than us. Because they've found the right balance, rythme, style and cohesion i.e they're a well managed and sadly top class football team. If anything some of the signings they've made are aimed at the next 5 years and had little bearing on this season itself. So let's stop complaining about the spending they've done and focus on the improvement they've done.
• There's a limit to how much City can improve. They're not going to be this good in the league next season. At best, they are going to be a consistent 90 point team in this league. We have more scope for improvement and it's not going to take another 300 million to bridge it. Our incremental benefit for every right choice we make is greater than theirs. So again, hiding behind spending doesn't make sense. If we spend another 150 this summer we should challenge for big honours or win them. Waiting for the day we spend X amount of money doesn't add up, for me.
• Like I've said before I'm fine with Jose for one more year. But I can't indulge this sob story excuse making. Woodward has backed him. He has to produce. I like his identification of players but I have doubts about his coaching/tactics/system and how much it helps/hinders us.

Good post and I agree entirely.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I think the larger point a lot of people are missing is that there appears to be an underlying lack of cohesion in this football team particularly in attack. Cohesion is that thing that when you lack makes you look like lesser than sum of your parts/restrains you from resching your potential. In the absence of that, you operate as individuals performing in their individual capacity, which is I reckon where we are today. That is what is disappointing (not the league position). That being shown up against a team like is Seville is disappointing (not the league position). That coupled with the manager bemoaning the way he has been is disappointing (not the league position). And that is the managers job, more than anything else.

 

[Smithy89]

Surprised by the number who still want him, that will probably be halved by christmas. A lot of people took their time to realise the same with LVG.

 

[Adisa]

That would be like City claiming they can't win the CL until they sign a CM for the world record fee. The reality is that a lot of people here, particuarly those with a great deal of faith in Mourinho, would like us and our manager to hide behind our noisy neighbours and their spending.

A few points on this for you to consider:

• Manchester City spent a lot this past summer and it would be both convenient and ignorant for us to fall into the trap of thinking that their entire success is based around that. For anyone who has actually watched the quality of their football and been able to acknowledge it, how different would they really have been without Laporte, Danilo and Mendy? Fact is, they would still have improved, they'd still be far better than us and they'd still be better than us. Because they've found the right balance, rythme, style and cohesion i.e they're a well managed and sadly top class football team. If anything some of the signings they've made are aimed at the next 5 years and had little bearing on this season itself. So let's stop complaining about the spending they've done and focus on the improvement they've done.
• There's a limit to how much City can improve. They're not going to be this good in the league next season. At best, they are going to be a consistent 90 point team in this league. We have more scope for improvement and it's not going to take another 300 million to bridge it. Our incremental benefit for every right choice we make is greater than theirs. So again, hiding behind spending doesn't make sense. If we spend another 150 this summer we should challenge for big honours or win them. Waiting for the day we spend X amount of money doesn't add up, for me.
• Like I've said before I'm fine with Jose for one more year. But I can't indulge this sob story excuse making. Woodward has backed him. He has to produce. I like his identification of players but I have doubts about his coaching/tactics/system and how much it helps/hinders us.

I'm tired of the "City have spent X amount " mantra.
Just watch them play?
Every single player is playing at their absolute maximum. Yes, money helps but the way they're playing has a lot more to do than money.

 

[pcaming]

Poll options are atrocious...

 

[shaky]

Surprised by the number who still want him, that will probably be halved by christmas. A lot of people took their time to realise the same with LVG.

LVG went backwards in his second season and missed top 4 completely. I'm surprised that you're surprised that a lot of Utd fans don't yet want rid of the manager who is currently leading us to our highest league finish in years.

 

[Womp]

Has done a good job, but no more excuses next season, for him or the squad. He'd have the team almost exactly where he wants it with one more window. Needs to start delivering now.

 

[zonaldefending]

Around this time last year I thought Mourinho was more intent on getting a trophy than playing attractive football in order to establish a strong link with the fans. I gave him credit for that thinking he'd change this season when it was more a team he'd created and with two trophies in the bank he'd feel justified in going for exciting football + trophies rather than boring football + trophies.

I don't remember his stints at Chelsea being this boring. So, what is it ?

The game has changed since Mourinho first went to Chelsea. When Mourinho came onto the scene in 2004 (?) his teams focused on transitions which seemed to create exciting football because the way he had them playing was relatively new. Playing to a target player (Drogba) wasn’t new but how fast the midfield supported that player and got into attacking positions was. With Duff and Robben on the wings and Lampard making those runs from midfield Mourinho was at the forefront of the game. He was also able to create an “us against the world” mentality within his squad which meant that the players put their bodies on the line and did whatever it took for them to win. This style was at it’s apex for Mourinho with his Inter team. They took it to another level and were able to beat Pep’s Barca which was at it’s peak.

The problem, I think, for Mourinho is that, not only has the game changed with the focus now more on possession and pattern attacking plays, which really is the antithesis of his compact defending/fast transitioning style, but the players have changed as well. You just don’t see team’s with players the likes of Lampard, Drogba, and Terry who will embrace the team culture that Mourinho created that requires sacrifice and hard work like his first Chelsea and Inter teams. Modern day players want to attack, they want the ball at their feet, but they also want to be the star of the show without sacrificing for the team and, probably the biggest change to just 10 years ago, they want a manager who is going to be more carrot then stick.

 

[Smithy89]

LVG went backwards in his second season and missed top 4 completely. I'm surprised that you're surprised that a lot of Utd fans don't yet want rid of the manager who is currently leading us to our highest league finish in years.

Defintely progress points wise in the league, can still easily finish below spurs and liverpool though. Agree there is progress in terms of points tally though, can't hide from that.

 

[jackofalltrades]

The game has changed since Mourinho first went to Chelsea. When Mourinho came onto the scene in 2004 (?) his teams focused on transitions which seemed to create exciting football because the way he had them playing was relatively new. Playing to a target player (Drogba) wasn’t new but how fast the midfield supported that player and got into attacking positions was. With Duff and Robben on the wings and Lampard making those runs from midfield Mourinho was at the forefront of the game. He was also able to create an “us against the world” mentality within his squad which meant that the players put their bodies on the line and did whatever it took for them to win. This style was at it’s apex for Mourinho with his Inter team. They took it to another level and were able to beat Pep’s Barca which was at it’s peak.

The problem, I think, for Mourinho is that, not only has the game changed with the focus now more on possession and pattern attacking plays, which really is the antithesis of his compact defending/fast transitioning style, but the players have changed as well. You just don’t see team’s with players the likes of Lampard, Drogba, and Terry who will embrace the team culture that Mourinho created that requires sacrifice and hard work like his first Chelsea and Inter teams. Modern day players want to attack, they want the ball at their feet, but they also want to be the star of the show without sacrificing for the team and, probably the biggest change to just 10 years ago, they want a manager who is going to be more carrot then stick.

That part doesn't sound right to me. I don't see such selfishness in City's team,for example..

 

[Red_toad]

Surprised by the number who still want him, that will probably be halved by christmas. A lot of people took their time to realise the same with LVG.

Doesn't really matter what the fans want anymore. Owners want reasonable success and a return on their ownership of the club. I'm a tad concerned about stuff being leaked to the press about Jose' treatment of certain players. Looks like we could be in for a bit of a revolt, like we saw at Chelsea. Looks like a few of our stars have downed tool and aren't putting in the hard yards. I wonder who's side the Glazers will choose.

 

[shaky]

Defintely progress points wise in the league, can still easily finish below spurs and liverpool though. Agree there is progress in terms of points tally though, can't hide from that.

For a lot of people, myself included, that's acceptable enough for now after a few seasons of kicking about 5th - 7th place. Obviously next season needs to be a step forward again, and the quality of play needs to improve, but it's way too early to consider yet another management change, given that results have generally been ok and the form of rival teams shouldn't really detract from that fact.

 

[AP88]

Can’t help but feels he’s doing his usual trick of making his position untenable and provoking the sack, and the huge payout that goes with it for him.

 

[Smithy89]

For a lot of people, myself included, that's acceptable enough for now after a few seasons of kicking about 5th - 7th place. Obviously next season needs to be a step forward again, and the quality of play needs to improve, but it's way too early to consider yet another management change, given that results have generally been ok and the form of rival teams shouldn't really detract from that fact.

The quality and standard of football has to be better next season, without a doubt. He'd have had 3 summers by then, so no excuses at all.

 

[RedPed]

Wow, the anti-Mourinho movement really is beginning to gather momentum. Seems like everyone is more open about their hatred for him on here now!

 

[Tony Clifton]

To Mou or not to Mou, Moubody knows

This isn't black or white. The poll isn't exactly expansive either, talk about limited options. By the way, aren't the last two options kinda the same? Same same but different. The entire poll breaks down to ~45% wanting Mourinho to stay and ~55% wanting Mourinho to go? Clear as day, just go for one or the other? I know it's just a poll, but come on.

Both scenarios pose risks. I still have no clue as to which one I'd prefer. It's a mess just thinking about it. I sure as hell wouldn't be able to write about it.

If Mourinho goes, who has the cojones and/or competence to take over?
If Mourinho stays, where will his cojones and/or competence lead us?

They're rhetorical questions. I definitely don't have the answers, and neither do you. Some of you might think you do as you're sipping your morning coffee and typing away at the keyboard going "righty then, this is what we should do and here's why". Really? Well done. Have you tried emailing eddiewoodie@manutd.com to make your opinions matter instead of wasting bandwidth here?

Being the manager of Manchester United carries a unique type of responsibility and pressure, one not found even at the fellow giant clubs, Real, Barca and Bayern.

There are nuances to every manager and Mourinho is no different. Good as bad.

I just hope we don't have a revelation-like meltdown next season, similar to the one Chelsea had in 15/16. Why, who, when, where and how are irrelevant. Then as now. A meltdown is a meltdown and I don't want that here. If it would happen and the club reacts accordingly, it could already be too late.

That's the only genuine concern I have, that I can define. It's the last damn thing we need in what has been an ongoing long rebuilding process since Fergie retired and it could be potentially devastating.

Mourinho's recent contract extension

I gladly want to vent about this though. I don't understand why we agreed to a new deal when there already was a deal in place, with what, one and a half year left on it. An existing three-year agreement, let's see it out before deciding on what to do? Or is that too logical, too reasonable?

The football industry presents one of the few working environments where extensions are handed out to employees before their current contracts have expired or even close to it, for both managers and players.

"X's contract is running out in 12 to 48 months and we haven't renewed it. Quickly everyone, let's panic and arrange for a new 5-10 year deal, effective immediately."

It's absurd. Modern football's contract circuses are pathetic and the media's interaction with them are farcical, taking impatience and misjudgements to new levels. And this is an industry sold and accepted as professional viable business. At times it's rather a joke, demonstrated by these so called contracts.

 

[Beachryan]

The biggest problem is that Jose sets himself up to be binary. He's a petty, nasty, small little man who happens to be an excellent football manager. Nothing about his personality is endearing. He sets up teams to play dour, passionless football which can be effective but is a chore to watch. Both of those choices - his choices - mean that he has very little good will generated to fall back on.

Basically, you only put up with him because he's a winner. As soon as he's not, there's absolutely no point, as he has no other redeeming qualities.

 

[Sky1981]

The biggest problem is that Jose sets himself up to be binary. He's a petty, nasty, small little man who happens to be an excellent football manager. Nothing about his personality is endearing. He sets up teams to play dour, passionless football which can be effective but is a chore to watch. Both of those choices - his choices - mean that he has very little good will generated to fall back on.

Basically, you only put up with him because he's a winner. As soon as he's not, there's absolutely no point, as he has no other redeeming qualities.

Saf won't be our darlings without the trophies.

 

[Yagami]

Wow, the anti-Mourinho movement really is beginning to gather momentum. Seems like everyone is more open about their hatred for him on here now!

Where's the Mr.Burns excellent gif when you need it? Still, you haven't seen anything yet. Wait until he's spent a couple of hundred more million in the summer and has his standard 3rd season meltdown.

 

[L1nk]

If he ends up getting rid of our future in Martial and Pogba and keep Fellaini and Young and so on just so he can satisfy his own ego and bring in some big short term workhorses he has absolutely no right to be at this club, kindly sod off. This Fellaini begging is becoming an absolute eyesore as well, if he really wants to get rid of the deadwood he can start with Fellaini, a guy who should never have been at this club in the first place, epitomises pretty much everything that went to pot in the post Fergie era and should never be the go to tactic for a club like us.

This whole situation has me so frustrated, he was banging on about how much he loved this squad for months, even when we lost he was rather forthcoming in his praise and stuck to his guns, thats because his method wasn't called into question, all of a sudden people aren't appreciating the shoddy negative performances on the pitch and they question him about how he's setting the team up after the likes of Sevilla and the first thing he does to protect himself (as he has done in the past) is go on a 12 minute rant, bangs on about Guardiola, City and their spending, possibly snide remakrs about thr club, belittles the legacy of SAF and gloriously throw our players under the bus calling into question everything about them, saying the players he inherited were crap, they are ignoring his attacking instructions and he needs more money to compete, despite the fact I agree Shaw isn't committed enough for us he absolutely humilates him for a 2nd (or 3rd) time when it was completely unwarranted and much more. The guy is toxic as shit and there's people here not only agreeing with him but defending this guy, actually defending him as if his agenda wasn't completely bloody obvious because not only does he have a track record of doing the exact same thing before but the fact he went from one end of the spectrum to the next pretty damn quickly should tell you all you need to know about his antics and why he's done this. Genuinely can't wait to be rid of this circus surrounding the club, it's a joke.

 

[Ace of Spades]

If he ends up getting rid of our future in Martial and Pogba and keep Fellaini and Young and so on just so he can satisfy his own ego and bring in some big short term workhorses he has absolutely no right to be at this club, kindly sod off. This Fellaini begging is becoming an absolute eyesore as well, if he really wants to get rid of the deadwood he can start with Fellaini, a guy who should never have been at this club in the first place, epitomises pretty much everything that went to pot in the post Fergie era and should never be the go to tactic for a club like us.

This whole situation has me so frustrated, he was banging on about how much he loved this squad for months, even when we lost he was rather forthcoming in his praise and stuck to his guns, thats because his method wasn't called into question, all of a sudden people aren't appreciating the shoddy negative performances on the pitch and they question him about how he's setting the team up after the likes of Sevilla and the first thing he does to protect himself (as he has done in the past) is go on a 12 minute rant, bangs on about Guardiola, City and their spending, possibly snide remakrs about thr club, belittles the legacy of SAF and gloriously throw our players under the bus calling into question everything about them, saying the players he inherited were crap, they are ignoring his attacking instructions and he needs more money to compete, despite the fact I agree Shaw isn't committed enough for us he absolutely humilates him for a 2nd (or 3rd) time when it was completely unwarranted and much more. The guy is toxic as shit and there's people here not only agreeing with him but defending this guy, actually defending him as if his agenda wasn't completely bloody obvious because not only does he have a track record of doing the exact same thing before but the fact he went from one end of the spectrum to the next pretty damn quickly should tell you all you need to know about his antics and why he's done this. Genuinely can't wait to be rid of this circus surrounding the club, it's a joke.

Exactly, I thought things were going well a week ago, and then a week later, the situation looks so toxic, and that is down to no one other than Jose. All he had to so was own up to a mistake, and then move on. That Sevilla game was not the end of our season, we still have the FA cup and 2nd position in the league to fight for. The wholw thing has just kept on escalating, all because he could not take some criticism.

 

[Data]

If he ends up getting rid of our future in Martial and Pogba and keep Fellaini and Young and so on just so he can satisfy his own ego and bring in some big short term workhorses he has absolutely no right to be at this club, kindly sod off. This Fellaini begging is becoming an absolute eyesore as well, if he really wants to get rid of the deadwood he can start with Fellaini, a guy who should never have been at this club in the first place, epitomises pretty much everything that went to pot in the post Fergie era and should never be the go to tactic for a club like us.

This whole situation has me so frustrated, he was banging on about how much he loved this squad for months, even when we lost he was rather forthcoming in his praise and stuck to his guns, thats because his method wasn't called into question, all of a sudden people aren't appreciating the shoddy negative performances on the pitch and they question him about how he's setting the team up after the likes of Sevilla and the first thing he does to protect himself (as he has done in the past) is go on a 12 minute rant, bangs on about Guardiola, City and their spending, possibly snide remakrs about thr club, belittles the legacy of SAF and gloriously throw our players under the bus calling into question everything about them, saying the players he inherited were crap, they are ignoring his attacking instructions and he needs more money to compete, despite the fact I agree Shaw isn't committed enough for us he absolutely humilates him for a 2nd (or 3rd) time when it was completely unwarranted and much more. The guy is toxic as shit and there's people here not only agreeing with him but defending this guy, actually defending him as if his agenda wasn't completely bloody obvious because not only does he have a track record of doing the exact same thing before but the fact he went from one end of the spectrum to the next pretty damn quickly should tell you all you need to know about his antics and why he's done this. Genuinely can't wait to be rid of this circus surrounding the club, it's a joke.

Agreed.

I really find it hard that some people seems to forgot the fact that he is Mourinho. Antics got him sacked in his last two clubs, he has started the antics again and yet, some seems to think a 55 years old man will suddenly change his ways to suit the club style. How can a 55 years old man rants and pick on a 22 years old Luke Shaw that much! If he thinks he is not good enough, then sell him without talking down to the lad. I remember reading somewhere when we signed Mourinho, someone said the guy will be a cancer to Man Utd with his toxic nature, well we can all see the symptoms.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

So you acknowledge that he does know how to coach simple attacking movement? Yes? If your answer is no, you are simply wrong and deluded. A manager of his stature obviously knows how to coach simple attacking movement. You were implying he couldn't. That is just flat out wrong and incorrect.

There is a pattern and movement with Mata on the right especially when teams sit deep against us at OT. Do you think Jesse's form at number 10 is just a coincidence? Do you not notice his runs into zones on the right hand side trying to pull defenders away with his movement? His link play in these areas? It is a result of attacking patterns worked on in training. When Rashford comes on against Palace and keeps width on the left to open space, do you not think we have plays for these situations? What do you think we really do on the training ground? Just work on defensive shape?

Turning last years draws into wins at OT is not just down to individuals. Suddenly everyone rates Mata when he has being doing this work all season on the right. People just choose to ignore it or didn't realise it. When I was saying he was offering balance to the team on that side I was laughed at.

You understand that our win against Liverpool was partly due to the fact that Liverpool sacrifice defence in order for their attack to work the way it does? Can not being a real DM not picking up danger with the long ball to Lukaku. Arnold positioning himself on the outside to get ready for an attack rather than defend Rashford? These subtle things matter at the highest level. A 'fluid' attack is not enough. All we did was defend with a narrow defence and we deleted their entire attack. We didn't allow them to win the ball with a higher press which is how a lot of their attacks are initiated.

Mourinho knows how high presses work, how low blocks work, how to win in both situations. We need to improve our transitions and counter attacks, I acknowledge that, especially away from home. He will fix it.

I sure hope he fixes it. You make very good points re: Lingard and the Liverpool game. In fact I did acknowledge to my posts to Listar that his pragmatism has helped us do well recently against the big teams. However, you cannot deny that by and large we have looked very laboured in offence. I also do not believe that Jose has no idea how to coach attacking football but I do believe he has neglected to coach simple mistakes out of Martial such as attacking the space when required instead of receiving the ball at his feet so much. We just aren't stretching teams enough with our movement.

Yep, just play progressive and we'll win what we want. Where can I donate to your cult of football theocracy?

How naive can someone be to think that there is only one way to play. In fact, arguably the best team in the world, Barcelona, play a very pragmatic style of football. They play nothing like Barcelona teams in the last 10 years. Juventus have been a far better team than us, playing classical Italian football.

There is being pragmatic when needed and there is approaching a season without a blueprint that allows us to take the initiative and resorting to percentage plays like hoof ball and crossing. If we play more progressively we will definitely be challenging for the title. Right now we are nowhere near City are are arguably the most progressive team in the league. I didn't say we will win whenever we want to but it will certainly bring us closer. Jose's reactionary nature will not allow us to dominate, and it certainly won't win us the league unless he starts playing to the strengths of our team.

 

[BigBebe]

If he ends up getting rid of our future in Martial and Pogba and keep Fellaini and Young and so on just so he can satisfy his own ego and bring in some big short term workhorses he has absolutely no right to be at this club, kindly sod off. This Fellaini begging is becoming an absolute eyesore as well, if he really wants to get rid of the deadwood he can start with Fellaini, a guy who should never have been at this club in the first place, epitomises pretty much everything that went to pot in the post Fergie era and should never be the go to tactic for a club like us.

This whole situation has me so frustrated, he was banging on about how much he loved this squad for months, even when we lost he was rather forthcoming in his praise and stuck to his guns, thats because his method wasn't called into question, all of a sudden people aren't appreciating the shoddy negative performances on the pitch and they question him about how he's setting the team up after the likes of Sevilla and the first thing he does to protect himself (as he has done in the past) is go on a 12 minute rant, bangs on about Guardiola, City and their spending, possibly snide remakrs about thr club, belittles the legacy of SAF and gloriously throw our players under the bus calling into question everything about them, saying the players he inherited were crap, they are ignoring his attacking instructions and he needs more money to compete, despite the fact I agree Shaw isn't committed enough for us he absolutely humilates him for a 2nd (or 3rd) time when it was completely unwarranted and much more. The guy is toxic as shit and there's people here not only agreeing with him but defending this guy, actually defending him as if his agenda wasn't completely bloody obvious because not only does he have a track record of doing the exact same thing before but the fact he went from one end of the spectrum to the next pretty damn quickly should tell you all you need to know about his antics and why he's done this. Genuinely can't wait to be rid of this circus surrounding the club, it's a joke.

You have summed things up there perfectly @L1nk.

And that word you used in the last sentence 'circus' is absolutely spot on - that is what he is making our club. #sirbobbyknew

 

[LeftyBlaster]

That would be like City claiming they can't win the CL until they sign a CM for the world record fee. The reality is that a lot of people here, particuarly those with a great deal of faith in Mourinho, would like us and our manager to hide behind our noisy neighbours and their spending.

A few points on this for you to consider:

• Manchester City spent a lot this past summer and it would be both convenient and ignorant for us to fall into the trap of thinking that their entire success is based around that. For anyone who has actually watched the quality of their football and been able to acknowledge it, how different would they really have been without Laporte, Danilo and Mendy? Fact is, they would still have improved, they'd still be far better than us and they'd still be better than us. Because they've found the right balance, rythme, style and cohesion i.e they're a well managed and sadly top class football team. If anything some of the signings they've made are aimed at the next 5 years and had little bearing on this season itself. So let's stop complaining about the spending they've done and focus on the improvement they've done.
• There's a limit to how much City can improve. They're not going to be this good in the league next season. At best, they are going to be a consistent 90 point team in this league. We have more scope for improvement and it's not going to take another 300 million to bridge it. Our incremental benefit for every right choice we make is greater than theirs. So again, hiding behind spending doesn't make sense. If we spend another 150 this summer we should challenge for big honours or win them. Waiting for the day we spend X amount of money doesn't add up, for me.
• Like I've said before I'm fine with Jose for one more year. But I can't indulge this sob story excuse making. Woodward has backed him. He has to produce. I like his identification of players but I have doubts about his coaching/tactics/system and how much it helps/hinders us.

Pulitzer Prize. So much truth in this. Specially the bolded bit.

 

[Speedicut75]

Only another 4 points and we've matched last season's final points tally, with 8 games left to play. Progress, no?

 

[Always7]

Jose knows alot more about his players than anyone, He will see their lifestyle, motivation, talent and under lying issues. I believe that if he is dropping Shaw it is for a reason. Shaw doesn't look as fit as he was so maybe isn't showing the motivation required to stay on the park and now when criticized everyone is blaming the manager. Shaw makes enough money regardless if he plays or not and maybe he is happy with that. Only seems to show enough effort to get back to first team football but then not to progress on the pitch once there.

I can see a lot of sense in what Mourinho is saying in regards to people listening to pundits and the media, So far today I have heard 3 stories from pundits claiming that he is wrong and that he is outdated and that he is not progressing United. All of them are grabbing a headline plain and simple, Trying to make a living creating headlines and stories. I am not saying that there is no issue at united and a well timed international break may settle the dust but the issue I don't think is half as big as the media suggests. We had a bad result against Sevilla, a bad performance yes. But a performance on a stage we would have not been in if it were not for the Europa League, Technically we were not good enough to make the Champions league the straightforward way. We found a back door and were there probably sooner than we should have expected based on consistent form. Now we go there next year with another transfer season under our belts another pre season and a run of more consistent form based on being second in the most competitive league on the planet. This is Football Heritage!!

There is progression and with the pressures placed on the team. The manager has chosen a player or players to put the spotlight on and create some pressure for them. Trouble is that the media in this country focus on one team and make that pressure 10x more. When last did you open Sky sports news page and not find a pundit speaking about united. We haven't played since Saturday and now on International break yet Chris Sutton is on Radio 1 this morning speaking about United.

 

[Stacks]

He played OK but I can't think of a single performance that has been better than some of Young's.

From the left back position, Young scored two against Watford (one FK) and was simply brilliant throughout. He was then part of a very good attacking display at Arsenal. Recently, he pulled off an incredible defensive performance to completely neutralise Mo Salah (the most inform attacker in the league). Shaw, on the other hand, gets praise for pretty much getting the simple things right.

fair points. Young must be there on merit and shutting out the unstoppable Salah was impressive. perhaps Shaw just needs to get better

 

[Shark]

Only another 4 points and we've matched last season's final points tally, with 8 games left to play. Progress, no?

I think Lukaku has definitely helped us in obtaining the points that we missed out on last season against the lower sides. I don't think our football has made significant progress though, especially going forward. I'd actually argue it's gotten slightly worse overall.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

fair points. Young must be there on merit and shutting out the unstoppable Salah was impressive. perhaps Shaw just needs to get better

That last line has been said for so many players. Time to get rid, imo.

 

[Vilev]

The main current Mourinho problem is this. Since he has little concept of coaching an attacking game, he must rely on flair players, ones that can decide on their own how to attack and invent the goal themselves.
But his rigidity and his coaching motivation methods always alienate these players and restrict them on the field. It happened with Hazard at Chelsea, here we have Pogba and our wingers in the same situation. Especially Martial.