José Mourinho | 2018/19 Performances

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Sarni said:
That’s pure nonsense, you just named basically everybody. Most of them are the same or better, Lukaku has actually made a significant progress (especially in his link up play) since arriving. Someone like Darmian was hopeless before he came. Sanchez has been here for 7 months. De Gea hasn’t regressed at all, he’s still amazing.

You said for every player that improved there are 2-3 that regressed. It’s completely wrong. Shaw is the only player I can honestly say has got worse over the last three years, noticeably worse. Many have not got better but it’s normal for players who were already 25-27 before he arrived to remain at a similar level.
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Yeah I know I've basically named everyone, this my point.

The maths stack up as well.
You named 4 players he improved (2 of which were very dubious) I said for everyone of those I could probably name 2 or 3 that haven't improved.
4x3= 12,
Yet I named about 17, so how is that wrong?

I was also careful to point out that I wasn't saying that it's all his fault.

I know the likes of Jones and Darmian are rubbish anyway but if he has somehow made them even worse then my point is still valid.
 
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King Kana said:
So? Is that your answer to every defeat? Sack every manager who loses to a small team? Are you a child?

Why is Klopp still at Liverpool when Burnley beat them 2-0 at the beginning of the season, same as Utd, season they finished outside the top 4? (16/17 i reckon?)

Why wasn’t Pep fired for losing 4-2 to Leicester or 4-0 to Everton?

You hate your manager, which is super weird for a Utd supporter, considering how SAF started his own reign (it was really shit for a while at the start iirc) and I see how that’s clouding your reasoning. Yes your football is dire at present but, tell me, just what do you think you were going to achieve with some of the dross in your squad who are still here after failing with 2 previous managers? Before you say, well why didn’t he get rid of them, do you not see what’s happening now? Clearly he isn’t in complete control of transfers and has to do as he’s told. Any blame whatsoever, in regards to transfers, should firmly lay at the foot of the V. Chairman.

Re attacking football; he’s changed his backroom, bringing in Carrick/Mckenna and, if he’s been playing defensive and is trying to switch, are they not going to have to go through growing pains to come to grips with whatever new system they employ? Besides, do you not realize they didn’t have a pre season to implement said changes? Are you not seeing the effects of same lack of pre season in how disjointed the players looked at Brighton, being unable to string 2 passes together? How do you explain Pogba’s utterly woeful performance? Or Fred?

If some of you, who hate the manager (fair enough) could try to apply a little sense here and there I think your team would be better for it. Last I checked, teams need their 12th man. The vitriol and attitude towards your club at the minute doesn’t resemble the “Utd way” most of us have come to admire and respect.

My $0.02.
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:lol::lol:Laughable post from a clownish newbie, who lets these idiots onto this forum??
 
It is getting to be like Moyes in charge. Moyes's press conference was so down right depressing and Jose is sounding exactly like him. At least with LVG it was interesting. I admit that I got fed up with LVG in the end but in hindsight I may have been wrong. He may have got us playing good football eventually. But now this is really depressing. It is not that we lose but the way we play is so depressing.
 
Haven't posted on here for ages but ill chip in with my view for what its worth.
It seems increasingly unlikely that we are in any sort of shape to be successful anytime soon under our current manager, with this set of players and the way we are run as a club. All three deserve their fair share of blame for the situation we are in at the moment but the manager is the one under the most pressure for obvious reasons. It feels like even if he manages to stop the bleeding and start pulling out some results and improves the mood, the best we can realistically hope for is a top four finish and maybe a good cup run. I think if we are honest with ourselves as fans we know we are a long way from being league winners and its hard to see how we can bridge the gap with what we have right now.
So what do we do? I highly doubt that when the board appointed jose as our manager they expected us to be this far away entering our 3rd year. There is a debate to be had over wether the people that run the club have done their part but right now all that matters is where we go from here. If there is truth in these rumours of unrest between Jose and the board/players then something has to give somewhere and the only losers will be us fans. The players will still get paid, jose will get his payoff and the money men will still be rich whilst we will have to go through yet another "rebuild" and potentiality lose further ground on our rivals. And even the best case scenario of a top 4 finish watching dour football isnt exactly something to look forward to. It seems either way that the immediate future is pretty dull.
Personally i just cant see jose being successful here. I was happy with his appointment and whilst i do think there has been some progress i cant see him making the necessary changes in order for us to get closer to winning major trophies, which is what equals success for this club.
So on that basis i believe it is time for a change. As a fan that lives on the other side of the world getting up at 3am to watch our games is getting harder and harder to justify. The reason i fell in love with the club was the exciting, fast paced football and i want to see it again. I would be happy for us to hire a manager that delivers this even if it were to mean we had to take a step back before we move forwards. 5 seasons of watching generally poor football has taken its toll on us as fans and i believe there has been a shift in expectations to an extent where all most of us want right now is some entertainment, which we know we will not see with our current manager.
Surely its time for the people in charge to realise that we are in danger of being left behind here. We need to make a change and we need to do it soon in my opinion
 
dove said:
I think people expecting that sacking him will solve everything are in for a shock. I am very convinced that our problems are much deeper than the manager. We have 4th best squad behind City, Liverpool and Chelsea. I don't understand how anyone can expect us to challenge City for the title, they are miles ahead of us and after this transfer window they are even further ahead. We have a good enough team to win ~80pts, no more.
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If Liverpool have a better squad than us - they don't but if - then that is on Mourinho. He and Klopp spent roughly the same amount but Klopp started from a worse position amd was forced to sell his best player.
 
Kerry Donaghy said:
Yeah I know I've basically named everyone, this my point.

The maths stack up as well.
You named 4 players he improved (2 of which were very dubious) I said for everyone of those I could probably name 2 or 3 that haven't improved.
4x3= 12,
Yet I named about 17, so how is that wrong?

I was also careful to point out that I wasn't saying that it's all his fault.

I know the likes of Jones and Darmian are rubbish anyway but if he has somehow made them even worse then my point is still valid.
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That’s wrong because you didn’t name players who regressed, you just named the squad.
 
Sarni said:
That’s wrong because you didn’t name players who regressed, you just named the squad.
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The point is very obvious, though. Compare the players Mourinho has improved/not improved Vs the ones Pep and Klopp have and the difference is stark.

Pogba, Martial, Sanchez, Lindelof, Bailly, Mkhitarian and Rashford have all been disappointing under Jose. All have either performed below expectations or as lesser versions of their former selves. It also holds true for a good portion of his own signings which is also bizarre. The ones he has genuinely improved - Fellaini, Young, Lingard, Lukaku (the exception I suppose) - are more of the grafter nature. The rest - DDG, Smalling, Jones, Matic and co are there or thereabouts with respect to their previous performance levels.

Pep on the other hand has nearly improved everyone barring the odd exception like Bravo. Same with Klopp.

Players we rated lower at these clubs are performing above that level. Whereas with us players we rate higher perform lower than that level.
 
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well he's gone n killed any hope n enthusiasm for the impending season before its even began. it was already a chore watching many of our games and it's only going to get worse but even if we sack him there's hardly a reasonable guarantee that we will do better after an initial bounce. I think we need a left field managerial appointment now, the blueprint we have tried to follow has not worked and it is going to be more of the same rinse repeat cycle. it's quite depressing to even think about honestly and feels like we are cursed or something where no manager we get is 'right' and the players we sign after the initial excitement has died down flatter to deceive and turn into deadwood because they don't fit into our plans/ we can't get the best out of them.
 
I am for sure one of those who want him gone, but the board is not blameless. How they changed the philosophy and the style of football from Classic British 442 wing playing football (David Moyes) to possession football (LVG) to the defensive mentality football (JM) in just 4 years is disastrous.
 
A win against Spurs and it'll be a different story and a lot on here will change their tune. The positivity was creeping back in after the Leicester game, and was only replaced due to a loss against Brighton.

Football fans are fickle, we just need a decent run of results. Should we not get the run of results, this place will get worse and worse and it'll be a long season as the Board will (rightly) give Jose time to make good.
 
King Kana said:
So? Is that your answer to every defeat? Sack every manager who loses to a small team? Are you a child?

Why is Klopp still at Liverpool when Burnley beat them 2-0 at the beginning of the season, same as Utd, season they finished outside the top 4? (16/17 i reckon?)

Why wasn’t Pep fired for losing 4-2 to Leicester or 4-0 to Everton?

You hate your manager, which is super weird for a Utd supporter, considering how SAF started his own reign (it was really shit for a while at the start iirc) and I see how that’s clouding your reasoning. Yes your football is dire at present but, tell me, just what do you think you were going to achieve with some of the dross in your squad who are still here after failing with 2 previous managers? Before you say, well why didn’t he get rid of them, do you not see what’s happening now? Clearly he isn’t in complete control of transfers and has to do as he’s told. Any blame whatsoever, in regards to transfers, should firmly lay at the foot of the V. Chairman.

Re attacking football; he’s changed his backroom, bringing in Carrick/Mckenna and, if he’s been playing defensive and is trying to switch, are they not going to have to go through growing pains to come to grips with whatever new system they employ? Besides, do you not realize they didn’t have a pre season to implement said changes? Are you not seeing the effects of same lack of pre season in how disjointed the players looked at Brighton, being unable to string 2 passes together? How do you explain Pogba’s utterly woeful performance? Or Fred?

If some of you, who hate the manager (fair enough) could try to apply a little sense here and there I think your team would be better for it. Last I checked, teams need their 12th man. The vitriol and attitude towards your club at the minute doesn’t resemble the “Utd way” most of us have come to admire and respect.

My $0.02.
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Unnecessary, don't do this.
 
steffyr2 said:
If he got 9 of 11, that's 82%. And then there's this summer where he wanted 5 and got 0....so now it's 9 of 16 over 5 trading windows. 56%

Seems like there are alot of fans who realize that there are holes in the team where replacements are needed. I guess you aren't one of those?
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Not sure where you got your figures from? 9 of 16? I 100% think think we could do with another winger on the right but my point was Jose has chosen most his players except in this window where he didn't get 2 he wanted.
 
pocco said:
Looks well reasoned to me. I'd promote him personally, he's one of the few that doesn't seem to be in complete meltdown.
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Why would he be in a meltdown if he isn't a United fan?
 
Siorac said:
If Liverpool have a better squad than us - they don't but if - then that is on Mourinho. He and Klopp spent roughly the same amount but Klopp started from a worse position amd was forced to sell his best player.
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Well maybe not better but about the same quality except that their squad is much more balanced than ours. Anyway yeah, Jose is to blame for some of our signings. Basically the only 2 signings that we can call a success are Lukaku and Matic. Lindelof not good enough yet, Bailly always injured and a bit overrated here, Mkhi is gone and Pogba splits opinions.
 
If some of you are right and he board is happy for us to stay in top 4, then surely the manager of Mourinho's credentials should be able to turn the situation to his advantage and since no one is really expecting of him to challenge City he can at least lay some foundations for the future.

He should get us playing attacking, exciting football because with the squad he has at his disposal, his past achievements so called "best manager in the world" ought to be able to makes us exciting to watch whilst staying in top 4.

Then who knows maybe the board will be curious what could happen if they decide to enable a bit more spending due to how he's turned the situation around.
 
M Bison said:
A win against Spurs and it'll be a different story and a lot on here will change their tune. The positivity was creeping back in after the Leicester game, and was only replaced due to a loss against Brighton.

Football fans are fickle, we just need a decent run of results. Should we not get the run of results, this place will get worse and worse and it'll be a long season as the Board will (rightly) give Jose time to make good.
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I believe it will be quite depending of the manner in which we win.
 
Not sure what's fact and fiction anymore. The problem I have is I'm relying on information from the bullshit media which we know most of the time it's based on lies, equally knowing that they often have an anti Utd/Jose agenda. The problem is our manager Isnt helping, neither is our style of football, neither are our best players, neither are our new signings, neither are the young players in the squad.......our biggest problem is our competitors that we hate the most appear to be the absolute polar opposite in every department.

In the past when we were struggling even when Chelsea and Arsenal were challenging us, those two weren't even in the picture. I get a sense that whoever is managing us, it's going to take years before these are truly resolved as the gap is widening with other teams getting closer to us also.
 
redNATION said:
The problem I have with pro-Mourinho arguments is that do you really need a world class 11 to beat Brighton? We lost to these small teams last season, and the argument that he needs more players doesnt stack up. Why can't we play cohesive attacking football against even small teams? How does a midfield of Pogba/Fred get dominated by nobodies? I appreciate to challenge City or Real/Barca we need better in defence and on the wings, but to routinely beat teams out of the top 6, surely our team is strong enough. That's where we're falling short, as last season showed (we had a very good record against the top 6).

We barely fashioned any chances against Brighton, who will probably lose 5-0 to liverpool tomorrow, and were lucky against Leicester. Meanwhile arsenal lost to chelsea, but carved them open almost at will and created chances for their strikers. It's got to be the tactics and instructions Jose's giving the players, I cant fathom how we cant even play football against shite teams, and it's been a constant problem under him since day 1.
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Rio Ferdinand and Gary Neville said that before games against obviously inferior sides SAF would simply say "lads, you're better than them, go and work out how to win".

If we're beating the better sides and losing to the worst sides then surely that shows we have a top tactical manager with the inconsistent players of questionnable mentality that Jose was trying to sort out this summer?
 
endless_wheelies said:
Rio Ferdinand and Gary Neville said that before games against obviously inferior sides SAF would simply say "lads, you're better than them, go and work out how to win".

If we're beating the better sides and losing to the worst sides then surely that shows we have a top tactical manager with the inconsistent players of questionnable mentality that Jose was trying to sort out this summer?
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Meh - if we don't have a RW then we should not use that formation. If we have an inconsistent LW- don't play him there. If we have a makeshift target man upfront who doesn't want to actually play like that then I'd say the manager is the one who is not all top tactical to get the best put of teams at his disposal.
 
The thread seems to have become more like the board vs Jose. Like it’s just one or the other at fault. Atleast to me, both should go as they are equally responsible.

A new manager with Ed deciding on which players to buy, won’t help. At the same time, I believe that even if we spend shitloads under Jose, he still will continue this tumescent football, maybe just maybe win the title, and leave.
 
bleedred said:
The thread seems to have become more like the board vs Jose. Like it’s just one or the other at fault. Atleast to me, both should go as they are equally responsible.

A new manager with Ed deciding on which players to buy, won’t help. At the same time, I believe that even if we spend shitloads under Jose, he still will continue this tumescent football, maybe just maybe win the title, and leave.
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Pretty much
 
endless_wheelies said:
Rio Ferdinand and Gary Neville said that before games against obviously inferior sides SAF would simply say "lads, you're better than them, go and work out how to win".

If we're beating the better sides and losing to the worst sides then surely that shows we have a top tactical manager with the inconsistent players of questionnable mentality that Jose was trying to sort out this summer?
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No that does not mean we have inconsistent players, it means we have very good players but a manager who fails to motivate them to play against the lesser sides. This was one of SAF best qualities, the hunger SAF put in his players to play against every small team is unbelievable.
 
Aloysius's Back 3 said:
Meh - if we don't have a RW then we should not use that formation. If we have an inconsistent LW- don't play him there. If we have a makeshift target man upfront who doesn't want to actually play like that then I'd say the manager is the one who is not all top tactical to get the best put of teams at his disposal.
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What formation are we supposed to play without a RW or marauding RB to overlap? Even the 3-5-2 we were supposedly buying Alderweireld for is hardly going to work without a leader when our 2 best centre backs are already bumping heads.

Giggsyking said:
No that does not mean we have inconsistent players, it means we have very good players but a manager who fails to motivate them to play against the lesser sides. This was one of SAF best qualities, the hunger SAF put in his players to play against every small team is unbelievable.
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It's the very definition of having inconsistent players with weak mentality if they can't motivate themselves to win a match. When you listen to ex-players they always talk about how when things were going badly the likes of Ferdinand, Keane, Neville would give them all a kick up the proverbial, it's not all about the manager. Jose is a multiple league winning manager, I don't think the variable is his lack of motivational ability.


Come to think of it is us having an appalling record against weaker sides actually a thing anyway? Are there stats to back up that we're notably worse than the other top 6 at this? I don't know but I'm suspicious the whingers are just cherry-picking results that always happen over 38 games anyway to service the agenda.
 
endless_wheelies said:
Rio Ferdinand and Gary Neville said that before games against obviously inferior sides SAF would simply say "lads, you're better than them, go and work out how to win".

If we're beating the better sides and losing to the worst sides then surely that shows we have a top tactical manager with the inconsistent players of questionnable mentality that Jose was trying to sort out this summer?
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:lol: it really depends on how you wanna twist it. You could easily say we have a manager who is clueless against the smaller tactically despite what he pulls off against the bigger.
 
The board is to blame for a terrible lack of strategic intent. No coherency to their managerial recruitment, and consequently a disjointed period of transition, after disjointed period of transition.

The manager is responsible for the terrible football being played on the field. He’s been backed to the tune of 400m, and is playing some of the most reductive and negative football in our history. This would be unacceptable at any of the other elite clubs we compare ourselves to. Real, Barca, Bayern.....none of them would accept what we are seeing. He needs to be fired, he deserves to be fired. End of.

Our standards should be much higher than this.
 
M Bison said:
A win against Spurs and it'll be a different story and a lot on here will change their tune. The positivity was creeping back in after the Leicester game, and was only replaced due to a loss against Brighton.

Football fans are fickle, we just need a decent run of results. Should we not get the run of results, this place will get worse and worse and it'll be a long season as the Board will (rightly) give Jose time to make good.
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I don't think it was at all.
 
At least Jose is no longer favourite to be first Premiership Manager to go. That honour now goes to former old boy Mark Hughes.
 
I swear every Liverpool goal that goes in breaks my resolve of waiting and seeing with him.

They don't press teams, they blitz them. All we do is jockey, hold and wait for teams to make a mistake. It is the most cowardly, boring, passive fecking bullshit to watch.

If he goes, we need a manager with a huge pressing gameplan. This shit we're doing went out with the dinosaurs.
 
Mou has caused great damage to an institution with Manchester United. The team today plays everything but English, is the best team in the history of English football that lost its way that has given us so many joys.
 
Seeing the Scousers cut through Brightons shite defence with ease like a hot knife through butter is rekindling my anger over last week's embarrassing display :mad:
 
Shane88 said:
I swear every Liverpool goal that goes in breaks my resolve of waiting and seeing with him.

They don't press teams, they blitz them. All we do is jockey, hold and wait for teams to make a mistake. It is the most cowardly, boring, passive fecking bullshit to watch.

If he goes, we need a manager with a huge pressing gameplan. This shit we're doing went out with the dinosaurs.
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That's a very bizarre way of thinking, no wonder so many here are in meltdown as soon as Pool/City play well.

Some of the question marks against him are valid but he's only part of the problem. Players slack in and out of matches, you don't see the same energy/commitment when we are up against lower sides than say versus Top 6. This is a problem which has been consistent under three different managers now. Look at the distance run for last few years and you'll see the common trend.

Fact that Darmian and Rojo are still here, Blind and Schweinsteiger collected 1 year wages between them, transfer mess of the current summer also means board aren't pulling their weight. Continuously sacking a manager will lead us no where unless some major changes are made to the structure at the club. Starting from the very top.
 
I've gotten quite used to us not competing for big trophies. My main gripe is the football. I don't expect title anymore but at least, let me enjoy watching this team play.
 
Adisa said:
I've gotten quite used to us not competing for big trophies. My main gripe is the football. I don't expect title anymore but at least, let me enjoy watching this team play.
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This is pretty much where I’m at too mate.

I’ve supported this club for over 30 years now and have witnessed unprecedented success in that time.

Like you, and many other United fans, I’m cool with not winning the title for a few years. But what I can’t and won’t tolerate is the shit on a stick football we play week in week out under Mourinho.

It goes against everything that this fine club has stood for, and most frustratingly it’s completely unnecessary with the squad of players we have.
 
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