Joao Felix / on loan to Chelsea

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Leaving Gakpo aside, the stories about us having zero money to spend in January could be posturing to stop us getting bent over by any club we talk to. The world and his wife watched the very public fallout between United and Ronaldo, and everyone knows we desperately need a striker so we are not starting from a position of power in any negotiations. A player like Felix that is being pushed out by his club, or someone like Thuram who's contract is up, are the only kinds of deal where we as the buyer hold any of the cards but given our position, the seller is still likely going to push for everything they can.

I think this might be us maneuvering ourselves into a position where we are able to go into negotiations for certain players and still have a hard line we can threaten to fall back on and walk away. I can't see us not trying for a replacement at all and talk of being 'unable to afford a loan fee' sounds like bs. At very least, we were expecting to pay Ronaldo's wages for the next few months so that money is going spare now.

I am sceptical about Felix but I reckon we'll see someone come in, even if it is a stop-gap loan to get us to the summer.
 
Great player but why do we need him? To stop Arsenal or Chelsea getting him?
 
Someone who can offer something in the final third,yes he isn't that striker but gives us another attacking option.

Yeah, and honestly, regardless of how smart they are, how good vision and instincts they have, Eriksen and Bruno’s ability to deliver the final ball is not world class. Neither are Shaw or Dalot. Not during play and especially not on set pieces. A team like City has a big advantage there with KDBs extremely accurate passing. Felix is almost at the same level when delivering those passes into the penalty area
 
He is bit of a Havertz type of a forward. I will be happy to have him on a loan but not too sure about him in the long run.
 
What's his actual best position?

That's the problem. Arguably second striker/ no.10....more like a 9.5

Some United fans like me see his technique/skill and are hopeful of being able to try him as a nominal no.9 / false 9. Particularly as we desperately need another attacker. And as someone else said he has great potential to be elite. And this loan is a great way to try him out and if it works out a great way to get an elite player.
 
I think he's very skilled and has a high ceiling. He'll need time to adjust to the league and his teammates IMO so I don't believe he'll be one of those who can hit the ground running. It'll be best if we ease him into the team when Martial needs a break at first and slowly increase his minutes as he gets up to speed. A loan with an option to buy would be a nice deal I reckon.
 
When we signed Antony the media said we spent circa £100m of next summers budget, and Murtough said something to the effect of our spending being a one off. So that, in addition to our outgoing owners, make me think that we're not going to be doing anything this January.

But with Ronaldo off the wage bill, we do have spare capacity to loan Felix.
 
Free role, like Ozil had. Needs the team to be built around him to shine otherwise will always remain a square peg in a round hole.

He is more hardworking and braver than Ozil and will track back. Also, he is a good header of the ball.

Although he is similar to Ozil just a little bit more direct with similar technical abilities just not a refined position.
 
He is more hardworking and braver than Ozil and will track back. Also, he is a good header of the ball.

Although he is similar to Ozil just a little bit more direct with similar technical abilities just not a refined position.
Ozil played at the highest level in Real Madrid and won the world cup with Germany. At this moment Felix has nothing to compare with Ozil. They have nothing in common.
 
Besides isn't the Ozil position supposedly anachronistic in modern football?
Ozil had a clear defined role in real Madrid, in Germany, and also in arsenal under Wenger. In Felix's career so far he never showcased the same creativity, or play making ability that Ozil had.

That real Madrid team were not built around Ozil either. It was CR7. Also Germany 2014 was not "built around" Ozil either.
 
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Ozil had a clear defined role in real Madrid, in Germany, and also in arsenal under Wenger. In Felix's career so far he never showcased the same creativity, or play making ability that Ozil had.

That real Madrid team were not built around Ozil either. It was CR7. Also Germany 2014 was not "built around" Ozil either.

Yeah he ended up shunted out as a winger with Reus injured
 
"Manchester United will not be getting involved in the battle to sign Joao Felix because of Atletico Madrid's demands for a loan fee and 100 per cent wage contribution, totalling £16m" (The Times) - not any point in giving the link because most of it is behind a firewall, but Metro says wages are about £250k a week.

Last night showed (yet again) how much we need a top-class finisher. One-on-one misses will star to cost us when we aren't three up against the likes of Forest...
 
:lol: :lol: :lol: 40m? Come on, he's going to go for at least 80m.

If someone is crazy enough to offer 80M for Joao Felix, yeah, he will go for that amount. In fact, I'm hoping someone like Arsenal or Chelsea drop 100M on him. I will drive him to London myself. But that doesn't mean he is worth that much. Nowhere near, actually. A 40-50M player.
 
If someone is crazy enough to offer 80M for Joao Felix, yeah, he will go for that amount. In fact, I'm hoping someone like Arsenal or Chelsea drop 100M on him. I will drive him to London myself. But that doesn't mean he is worth that much. Nowhere near, actually. A 40-50M player.

In a world where Wesley Fofana goes for £70m, Felix is worth £80m imo.

40-50m gets you a prem level player these days, or a squad rotation player at a top 4 club. You rarely get a player for peanuts.

Felix is 23, won La Liga, just not playing in a system or role that suits him. I think he's not worth much more than 80 though.

He looked sharp in the WC, moments of real class too and that obviously will be the case when the handcuffs are off him like at Atleti under Simeone, they are a team that basically has workhorses to get results.
 
Imagining Felix in the side last night warms my heart and other areas. Don't want to get my hopes up but I do want to believe.

I can't help but think, positive results makes signings less likely though. It's Glazer logic.
 
Who knew that the Glazers taking over £1 billion out of the club and not spending any of their own money would come back to bite us…parasites
 
In a world where Wesley Fofana goes for £70m, Felix is worth £80m imo

Fofana was a player on an upward trajectory already playing in the Premier League. And Chelsea were desperate for a defender. And they were buying from another Premier League team. They definitely overpaid, but not by much, given the circumstances.

Felix is a player who has not done anything at all in La Liga for the past 3 years:
  • 129 games - 33 goals and 18 assists
  • 16% conversion, ~0.2 goals per game, scoring once every ~211 minutes
  • Key passes per game - ~0.7

These are absolutely awful stats in an arguably somewhat weaker league for someone who is supposedly "an exceptional talent". He will be even worse in the PL, given his weak frame and lack of technique to compensate.

For comparison, Bruno Fernandes since he arrived here:
  • 148 games - 53 goals and 42 assists
  • 13% conversion , ~0.4 goals per game, scoring once ~316 minutes.
  • Key passes per game - ~2.7

Bruno's stats are also massively brought down by last year's diabolical season. As I've said before in this thread, Joao Felix is quite possibly the most overrated player of this generation. I don't understand where this myth started, about him being this "generational and exceptional talent". Perhaps his YouTube highlight reels where he does a few flashy stuff. A perhaps slightly above average player, but looking at these stats now, I'm considering reevaluating his position to just average. He has proved absolutely nothing, despite being given the chance in an above average club. His stats for the national team are even worse. You'd have to be insane to pay a cent over 50M for him.
 



Setting up camp in this thread then.


Could really hurt us this season. Expect pretty much all our rivals for top 4 to strengthen this window, and we have effectively weakened our squad since the WC with the loss of Ronaldo and Sancho. Any injury to an attacking first XI player and our drop off is huge.
 
Anyone thinking we get Felix for less than 50m is kidding themselves. Now to what his true worth is and what we should pay I would like to see him on loan, maybe with an option to buy at 70. If he can come in and turn it around then he would be a great option
 
Anyone thinking we get Felix for less than 50m is kidding themselves. Now to what his true worth is and what we should pay I would like to see him on loan, maybe with an option to buy at 70. If he can come in and turn it around then he would be a great option
Nobody wants him at any of these prices though. Doesn’t that tell us all we need to know?
 
Nobody wants him at any of these prices though. Doesn’t that tell us all we need to know?
Thats not true though is it? The problem is athletico want a £8mil loan fee, plus loaning club pay felix wages in full £5mil. Then there is no option to buy the player. So £13mil outlay for a 6 month loan.

Atletico will have to soften thier stance as a few outlets have reported today.
 
Leaving Gakpo aside, the stories about us having zero money to spend in January could be posturing to stop us getting bent over by any club we talk to. The world and his wife watched the very public fallout between United and Ronaldo, and everyone knows we desperately need a striker so we are not starting from a position of power in any negotiations. A player like Felix that is being pushed out by his club, or someone like Thuram who's contract is up, are the only kinds of deal where we as the buyer hold any of the cards but given our position, the seller is still likely going to push for everything they can.

I think this might be us maneuvering ourselves into a position where we are able to go into negotiations for certain players and still have a hard line we can threaten to fall back on and walk away. I can't see us not trying for a replacement at all and talk of being 'unable to afford a loan fee' sounds like bs. At very least, we were expecting to pay Ronaldo's wages for the next few months so that money is going spare now.

I am sceptical about Felix but I reckon we'll see someone come in, even if it is a stop-gap loan to get us to the summer.

If we do have zero money, that isnt even for me something to level at the owners but our reruitment overall. It was a decent window but we way over spent on pretty much every deal we did. Appreciate seeling clubs can ask what they want and may not even want players to go, but Antony in particular was a ridiculous fee (this isnt even based on performances since arriving) as Martinez I feel was also way over wht he should have cost.

But the main reason we may have zero money with our net spend is sales, or complete lack of them. We barely bought in over £10m in sales from two players, fortunately let a few go on contrats (half of which should have been sold a year or two ago).....but yet our squad is still bloated in areas with....

Henderson, Bailly, Jones, Williams, Telles, Tuanzabe, VDB.....all players 100% either dont really want to be here or really shouldnt now. I know there are wages, but our inability to not sell any of them is staggering. Dont want to talk figures as there is always srutiny, but there is decent money from those.

Then there are others with question marks Lindelof, Maguire, AWB, Amad, Fred, McTominay, Martial, ELanga........There should have been a couple of fairly big sales amongst these players. We had a net spend of way over £200m (forgetting contrat salaries) over the summer buying four players, selling two and releasing 5/6.

When you look at it like that, it was a poor summer. Our purchases should have been nearer £180m and our sales should have been nearer £100m and wed only be a regular starter or two shorter than we have been.....and we have witnessed the likes of Shaw can play centre back and others other positions.

Our net spend in the summer for me was about £120-130m higher than it should have been and that would have bought an Enzo Fernandez or an Osimhen, Vlahovic or 2/3 quality signings like a Lukeba, Sesko etc etc.

As for Felix, I dont see him as a striker really, think his best position is Fernandes as is Eriksens as is Hannibal, so long term the signing doesnt really make sense even though he is good enough to start ahead of any of them with his ability at least.....but as a stop gap if there is no money, £9m for Felix and 6months to see him playing there as a false number 9 I think is better than other stop gap options, not that I like stop gap options
 
Can see arsenal or Chelsea get him and he thrives. Think he’ll do well under ETH for us. Will give us another option and different style of player… only if the moneys right though.
 
Anyone thinking we get Felix for less than 50m is kidding themselves. Now to what his true worth is and what we should pay I would like to see him on loan, maybe with an option to buy at 70. If he can come in and turn it around then he would be a great option

We shouldn't be getting him at all is my point, not just for 50M, even if he was available for that much. Maybe on a cheap loan with an option to buy. Maybe. But it doesn't sound like Atletico would agree to that. And even if they did, I would still look for a traditional 9 before that, though there seems to be a distinct lack of those. He is neither what we need nor is he good enough. A false 9-ish that doesn't score and doesn't create much.
 
Can see arsenal or Chelsea get him and he thrives. Think he’ll do well under ETH for us. Will give us another option and different style of player… only if the moneys right though.
I don't see either of them going for him to be honest. Arsenal will spend their money on Mudryk and Chelsea seem to be the ones going for Fernandez.
 
16mil till the end of the season. Even if we don’t buy him after it, if he helps us get CL footy next season then surely it’s worth it. He’ll definitely score goals in our side.
 
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