Javier Hernandez | 2012/13 Performances

[Hannibal]

You talk about him being offside as though that's some poor part of his play? We want him playing the line and inevitably he will get caught on occasions. Totally bizarre criticism of a player like Hernandez.

Not just 2 goals and a win, 2 goals, 1 assist and a win. Excellent performance from him.

When a player like Hernandez gets caught offside as many as he does, the man in possession is often the culprit. Defenders are smarter these days and the moment Carrick/Scholes look up to measure their pass, the defenders move forward in unison to set the trap. However, if the pass is delivered a split second quicker then you can always trust Chicharito to pounce and score.

He's a really wonderful player to have in the squad. He's too effective especially when he starts from the bench when the opposition's defenders are very tired. His sheer pace and poaching ability is second to none in the league.

 

[Ruud10]

The man was hired to a particular job, a particular job which he does extremely well.

No complaints with his play can be justified.

 

[JP77]

You talk about him being offside as though that's some poor part of his play? We want him playing the line and inevitably he will get caught on occasions. Totally bizarre criticism of a player like Hernandez.

Not just 2 goals and a win, 2 goals, 1 assist and a win. Excellent performance from him.

Never understood why people get on at him about being offside alot. That's the way he plays, constantly on the shoulder and trying to break the offside trap. He may be offside three or four times in a row, but you can almost guarentee that eventually he'll get it right. And not only that, but he's constantly working the defence even when he hasn't got the ball. They've got to constantly be on their toes thinking "Do I step up?" or "Do I track him?", it constantly toys with them and keeps them working, which eventually tires them out and ultimately leads to them making a mistake.

The guys work on and off the ball is still underrated to this day. His overall play has improved massively yet you'll still get pathetic comments regarding his passing or link up play etc, despite him showing signs every single time that it's improving.

Represents the club amazingly, workaholic, busts his ass, scores on a regular basis, improves week by week and is just an all around top guy. Cant ask for much more. I'm still in disbelief that some of our own fans considered selling him not long ago

 

[Hannibal]

The man was hired to a particular job, a particular job which he does extremely well.
No complaints with his play can be justified.

He's a top professional....
If football was world politics, Hernandez would be that assassin with an ice-cold nerves. His goal/shot ratio is one of the best in the league. His goal/min ratio makes Andy Caroll look like a prodigal son.

 

[MrMojo]

I wondered why you were getting so much shit so I looked back and found this. You couldn't buy a clue if you genuinely believe that.

Couple of comments from the match day thread before he scored.

Hernandez' passing is so bad.

Has Hernandez found a red shirt yet? Abysmal passing so far.

I wouldn't use the opinion of others to justify my comments and I'm not doing here, but if you can be objective about it there's substance to what I'm saying.

Ultimately he does the business though and this makes having two different opinions on a player operating at the same time too much for some people's brains.

 

[Platato]

I think the most accurate observation about Hernandez's play outside the box is inconsistent. Earlier in the season, it was better but I like how he was looking to be involved today.

His attitude is phenomenal. No matter what, he just keeps going.

 

[I'm always right]

Couple of comments from the match day thread.

Stopped reading there.

You're desperate if you wanna use the most spastic thread on redcafe to help your argument. Some of the shit I've seen in those threads...

 

[MrMojo]

I think the most accurate observation about Hernandez's play outside the box is inconsistent. Earlier in the season, it was better but I like how he was looking to be involved today.

His attitude is phenomenal. No matter what, he just keeps going.

His attitude is excellent, Ronaldo type levels of desire.

The consistency of players is what separates them into different standards though. Watch any Championship game and you'll see moments or passages of play that you'll see in the Premiership, but they can't do it consistently because the technique just isn't sound enough.

Same goes at higher levels, Rooney can play at RVP's level, but he can't do it to that level consistently, because his technique just isn't as good.

 

[MrMojo]

Stopped reading there.

You're desperate if you wanna use the most spastic thread on redcafe to help your argument. Some of the shit I've seen in those threads...

Were those comments spastic though.(they were made within the first 20mins of the game)?

 

[Swaters16]

You talk about him being offside as though that's some poor part of his play? We want him playing the line and inevitably he will get caught on occasions. Totally bizarre criticism of a player like Hernandez.

Not just 2 goals and a win, 2 goals, 1 assist and a win. Excellent performance from him.

It is bad, regardless of his style. Being offside means we lose the ball and the attack is gone, not always his fault I know but that doesn't change the fact that he is offside a lot. I'm not saying because he was offside he can't have played well, he had a good game, scoring twice and apparently assisting one - I don't remember

 

[I'm always right]

Were those comments spastic though.(they were made within the first 20mins of the game)?

I've seen the same thing with Rooney after 20 mins on about 50 different occasions, people in the matchday thread are way too highly strung.

Rooney often takes a while to get into games and find his passing. Hernandez had a few early stray balls yesterday ball got miles better from there as he got more into the game.

And however much you debate it, comparing his play outside of his finishing to a Championship player is just clueless.

 

[I'm always right]

It is bad, regardless of his style. Being offside means we lose the ball and the attack is gone

Here's a man who seriously misunderstands football.

If he doesn't chance the offside trap and hope for the right timed ball, he'll never break the offside trap.

Would you prefer if we just played in circles all day?

 

[Fergus' son]

Great little pass to Rafael in the build to the final goal I thought, it's so so apparent that he just isn't 'championship level' outside of the box.

 

[Brightonian]

I've seen the same thing with Rooney after 20 mins on about 50 different occasions, people in the matchday thread are way too highly strung.

Rooney often take a while to get into games and find his passing. Hernandez had a few early stray balls yesterday ball got miles better from there as he got into the game.

And however much you debate it, comparing his play outside of his finishing to a Championship player is just clueless.

This. Often in the matchday thread, 'he's utter shit' could be fairly translated as 'that pass was bad.'

Hernandez' general play isn't brilliant, but it's much better than it was last season, it's improving all the time, and it's sure as hell not 'Championship level.'

 

[MrMojo]

Great little pass to Rafael in the build to the final goal I thought, it's so so apparent that he just isn't 'championship level' outside of the box.

I'm not allowed to use entire games where he's played poorly to prove my point(knee jerk apparently), so I can't let somebody use one pass to counter argue.

It's a consistency thing, of course there'll be good outside of the box work done by him, but there'll be just as much poor stuff that looks out of place in the Premiership.

 

[Dargonk]

He always seems to pop up where the ball falls in the box. Really is no one else in the team who I'd rather a half chance inside the box to fall to. What is really good to see is that even when things are not fully working out for him, he is still putting himself about and trying to get a goal. Last week he missed chances, but got the crucial goal in the end. It's that type of attitude I like to see. He doesn't just drift out of game or stop trying once it doesn't work for him the first few times.

Hopefully next game RVP and him will have the through ball timing down pack and he gets a couple more goals as against Wigan if they were just slightly better he could have easily had a hat trick.

 

[Fergus' son]

I'm not allowed to use entire games where he's played poorly to prove my point(knee jerk apparently), so I can't let somebody use one pass to counter argue.

It's a consistency thing, of course there'll be good outside of the box work done by him, but there'll be just as much poor stuff that looks out of place in the Premiership.

Did you notice much championship level play from him today outside of the box?

 

[I'm always right]

there'll be just as much poor stuff that looks out of place in the Premiership.

Really? or just out of place at United?

Now think about this for a while, this is the Premiership, home to Emil Heskey for many years, a place where Andy Carroll was bought for over 35 million quid, just think about the Premiership and players outside of Manchester United....

Do this, and you'll realise you're wrong.

 

[MrMojo]

Did you notice much championship level play from him today outside of the box?

Haven't watched the full game yet, only highlights.

 

[Swaters16]

Here's a man who seriously misunderstands football.

If he doesn't chance the offside trap and hope for the right timed ball, he'll never break the offside trap.

Would you prefer if we just played in circles all day?

uh no, he could play off the shoulder of the defender and be onside and then the offside trap would be broken and our attacks aren't stopped. You can expect Hernandez to be offside a few times a match at least because that's the way he plays but you can't ignore there existence. Should players go in with tackles on the last man because they have to chance not being red carded? Should a midfielder chance a 45 yard Hollywood ball for no reason? No, they shouldn't. Being offside is bad regardless of any reason, we don't want our players to be offside just like we don't want to give away stupid fouls, misplace passes, get red cards, flap at crosses, etc, etc. It is part of the game that damages our own team.

Clearly I just want out play to be back-passes to the keeper though because I'm unhappy with a certain aspect of a players match, you also have not defended Hernandez taking poor shots from bad positions either. The guy had a good game but he was far from perfect and deserves some criticism and some praise.

 

[MrMojo]

Really? or just out of place at United?

Now think about this for a while, this is the Premiership, home to Emil Heskey for many years, a place where Andy Carroll was bought for over 35 million quid, just think about the Premiership and players outside of Manchester United....

Do this, and you'll realise you're wrong.

Liverpool paying over the odds is relevant because?

 

[I'm always right]

Liverpool paying over the odds is relevant because?

Because he's shite and Hernandez is a better "footballer" than him. And why ignore the rest of the post? You don't think Hernandez is a better football than many of the players playing the Prem? I mean, fecking really?

 

[I'm always right]

uh no, he could play off the shoulder of the defender and be onside and then the offside trap would be broken and our attacks aren't stopped.

Wow. I'm honestly actually speechless.

 

[I'm always right]

List of Premiership players:

http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/players/index.html

 

[MrMojo]

Because he's shite and Hernandez is a better "footballer" than him. And why ignore the rest of the post? You don't think Hernandez is a better football than many of the players playing the Prem? I mean, fecking really?

Premiership standard isn't defined by Emile Heskey, by the end he clearly wasn't up to scratch and so left. The rest of your post was crap, you were lucky to get half a reply.

You don't judge the standard of a league by it's weakest player clearly.

 

[I'm always right]

Premiership standard isn't defined by Emile Heskey, by the end he clearly wasn't up to scratch and so left. The rest of your post was crap, you were lucky to get half a reply.

You don't judge the standard of a league by it's weakest player clearly.

Then judge it by the players above in the link I posted and have a look at any squad from 8th down, and besides, if you think Heskey was the Prem's worst player then you seriously need to open your eyes, he was far from it....

You'll find many many fecking miles worse players than Hernandez in every single aspect of the game. My post was "crap", well it's better than the retarded shite you served up and got rightly slated for.

Get a clue.

 

[Fergus' son]

Defoes link up play isn't much better than Hernandezs, but is certainly PL level.

Who are these strikers in the championship that have such great play outside of the box?

 

[Platato]

I'm not allowed to use entire games where he's played poorly to prove my point(knee jerk apparently), so I can't let somebody use one pass to counter argue.

It's a consistency thing, of course there'll be good outside of the box work done by him, but there'll be just as much poor stuff that looks out of place in the Premiership.

Not really mate. This has steadily decreased in the games he's played in this season.

I think saying it's Championship level is shocking to say the least. There's a pretty decent leap going from the Championship to the Premier League.

 

[MrMojo]

Then judge it by the players above in the link I posted and have a look at any squad from 8th down, and besides, if you think Heskey was the Prem's worst player then you seriously need to open your eyes, he was far from it....

You'll find many many fecking miles worse players than Hernandez in every single aspect of the game. My post was "shite", well it's better than the retarded shite you served up and got rightly slated for.

Get a clue.

You love the word 'clue'.

Your post was crap, not because of the opinion but for bringing up completely irrelevant points, like how much Liverpool payed for Carroll. It derails the debate, like this now.

 

[MrMojo]

Defoes link up play isn't much better than Hernandezs, but is certainly PL level.

Who are these strikers in the championship that have such great play outside of the box?

come off it, it's considerably better.

 

[Fergus' son]

It really isn't.

 

[I'm always right]

You're trying to derail it rather than actually responding to the point I'm making, so I'll simplify it...

Are you telling me that all the squads from say 8th down are full of players that are better in build up than Hernandez?

Or, and I think this is your real point, are you basing "Premiership level" on the standards set by the top 5-6 teams?

 

[Brwned]

come off it, it's considerably better.

It's clearly worse IMO.

 

[MrMojo]

It's clearly worse IMO.

Amazed at that, you really think Hernandez is better outside the box than Defoe?

Just take a look at some of the goals Defoe has scored this season, he can pick a ball up 30 yards from goal, beat players and finish. Hernandez just doesn't have the technique to do that.

 

[MrMojo]

You're trying to derail it rather than actually responding to the point I'm making, so I'll simplify it...

Are you telling me that all the squads from say 8th down are full of players that are better in build up than Hernandez?

Or, and I think this is your real point, are you basing "Premiership level" on the standards set by the top 5-6 teams?

I don't agree with how you're defining Premiership standard so I can't answer it. By your definition if Hernandez is better than just one other striker, he must be Premiership standard. Well I don't agree with that because what I'm saying about Hernandez is probably true of a few others.

 

[Swaters16]

Wow. I'm honestly actually speechless.

I'm not surprised. You seem to be struggling to grasp simple concepts.

Being offside = something bad

Hernandez being offside = something we don't want

Being onside = good

Hernandez timing run - with help from supporting players = very good

You may notice we scored 4 goals today from our players being onside, and 0 from Hernandez running offside. We all understand that's the way he plays and that he gambles on the defence not working as a unit to play the offside trap but that doesn't mean he can't be criticized for being offside.

Smalling is a wonderful player and I still criticise him for getting that yellow card. He's a defender so he has to stop goals but that doesn't mean we don't call him out for giving away fouls. Because, you know, fouls are bad.

 

[Swaters16]

Amazed at that, you really think Hernandez is better outside the box than Defoe?

Just take a look at some of the goals Defoe has scored this season, he can pick a ball up 30 yards from goal, beat players and finish. Hernandez just doesn't have the technique to do that.

Defoe can dribble but that's probably about the only thing he really does better than Hernandez outside the box, even if he can pass you'd never know because he's so damn selfish.

 

[I'm always right]

I don't agree with how you're defining Premiership standard so I can't answer it. By your definition if Hernandez is better than just one other striker, he must be Premiership standard. Well I don't agree with that because what I'm saying about Hernandez is probably true of a few others.

Of course you can't, because then your argued is smashed to pieces.

Hernandez isn't just a better player than one other in the Prem, he's better at build up, link up, everything, than the majority of players in squads in the Premier League. For example..

Stoke
West Ham
Norwich
Sunderland
Villa
Southampton
Wigan
Reading
QPR

How else can you define Premier League standard than the quality of player in the league?

 

[MrMojo]

Of course you can't, because then your argued is smashed to pieces.

Hernandez isn't just a better player than one other in the Prem, he's better at build up, link up, everything, than the majority of players in squads in the Premier League. For example..

Stoke
West Ham
Norwich
Sunderland
Villa
Southampton
Wigan
Reading
QPR

How else can you define Premier League standard than the quality of player in the league?

We're comparing to strikers, not every player in those squads. Rethink.

 

[I'm always right]

I'm not surprised. You seem to be struggling to grasp simple concepts.

Grasp this:

Playing on the shoulder means timing a run perfectly with the help of a perfectly timed ball, if the ball is half a second late, it's offside, if it's half a second earlier it's now a GREAT run.

So yeah, as I said all along, we want Hernandez to play on the shoulder and inevitably he'll be offside sometimes, it certainly isn't something to criticise him over, it's just the job he's asked to do. Stretch defences and put them on the back foot.