Ivan Perisic

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cheeky_backheel said:
Willian is a better player than Perisic imo. You are free to think otherwise.

He is likely not the only signing but we also cant sign 25 new players.We are liely signing 4-6 players and given our current state, each of them has to count.

Better talent doesnt mean a better team, but sufficient talent is required. You cannot build a great team based on mediocrity. We dont have enough talent in our current squad and it is silly to be adding more mediocre players.

If he is playing for Inter at 28, after playing for Sochaux, Brugges, Dortmund and Wolfsburg, scream he is not some high caliber player. Top players to languish in mid table teams when they are at the peak of their career.

SAF, like most managers had his success and failures and making references to him does not make your argument any stronger.

Perisic is an average player imo and I dont think we can afford the luxury of overpaying for average players at this point. Put another way, his contributions (above the incumbent alternative) for the 2-3yrs he is likely to offer, is not worth 45m rumored price tag. That money can be spent on a better and/or younger player imo.
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Looks like you have never watched him and just going by some numbers or what team he is playing.

If you think he is mediocre player then there is no point taking this forward.

Btw go and check where Suarez was playing before moving to PL and Barca, if you rate players by where they are playing then Bebe must be rated very highly by you.
 
Maybe Perisic is our Griezmann alternative if the ban is not lifted :lol:, he plays at 10 a fair bit from what i've heard. This thread would be beautiful.
 
roonster09 said:
Why only attacking player? Where was Schmeichel playing when we signed him?
Bruce was also 27 year old playing for some midtable team or team that punched above it's weight when ManUtd signed him.
VDS was 35 year old playing for Fulham,
Irwin was 25 year old playing in second division,
31 year old Sheringham who was playing for team that finished 10th in PL,
Saha was 25-26 and was playing for Fulham that finished 13 and 14th
25 year old Vidic playing in Russian league
We signed Berbatov when he was 27 and from that team that finished 11th in the league.
Ashley young when he was 26-27 and from that team that finished 9th.


Bold part is your problem. Games are not won on the paper.
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Okay firstly nearly all the players you've mentioned were the best players in their team and had plenty of experience of playing in England. I say attacking players because to win leagues that in where you need the most quality.

As for the games not won on paper part I've already elaborated in my post that if Jose feels Perisic will improve the team then fair enough. But as of now until we see him play for us, all is hypothetical stuff and at this time to me he is an underwhelming signing. Hence, the term on paper as we can only judge him from evidence before us and that evidence to me doesn't suggest he's worth signing. But if Jose is convinced he's what we need then so be it. He's the manager so what he wants is what counts.
 
King7Eric said:
Young was easily the best player of that Villa side and he had been a consistently good player in the PL for 3-4 years before we signed him up. Neither of these apply to Perisic. Moreover I'm sure most at that time felt as well that Young was an underwhelming signing. He's not exactly pulled up many trees in his time here has he? He's a decent squad player and as I said maybe that's how Jose sees Perisic but the thing is at that time we were the PL champions with a good team and could sign such supplementary players. At this moment we need players that will take us up a level to make a title challenge.
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Perisic is a proven international who scored goals against the likes of Spain, Roma, Juventus etc. His stats are quite positive - 42 games, 11 goals and 12 assists.

I've yet to see Young dribble past two players.
 
King7Eric said:
Okay firstly nearly all the players you've mentioned were the best players in their team and had plenty of experience of playing in England. I say attacking players because to win leagues that in where you need the most quality.

As for the games not won on paper part I've already elaborated in my post that if Jose feels Perisic will improve the team then fair enough. But as of now until we see him play for us, all is hypothetical stuff and at this time to me he is an underwhelming signing. Hence, the term on paper as we can only judge him from evidence before us and that evidence to me doesn't suggest he's worth signing. But if Jose is convinced he's what we need then so be it. He's the manager so what he wants is what counts.
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How does it matter if they were the best player for 14th placed team or team that played in second division?

PL wasn't strong in 90s and we signed plenty of players from midtable and lower table teams. It might be underwhelming name but I would rather sign players who manager thinks can bring balance to the team than players who can't.
 
If it's true that Inter want more for Perisic than they're aiming to pay for James, we should tell them do 'ucking do one and move onto a new target. Tired of being shafted in the market.
 
roonster09 said:
Looks like you have never watched him and just going by some numbers or what team he is playing.

If you think he is mediocre player then there is no point taking this forward.

Btw go and check where Suarez was playing before moving to PL and Barca, if you rate players by where they are playing then Bebe must be rated very highly by you.
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I will humor you........

Suarez was a top talent before he joined Liverpool. Suarez moved to Liverpool at 24 from an Ajax team where is was the best and most talented player, having scored 81 goals in 110 games (35 goal in 33 league games in his previous full season). He was top scorer in the league and won dutch footballer of the year in same season. In his seasons with Ajax, they finished 3rd and second.
 
roonster09 said:
Why only attacking player? Where was Schmeichel playing when we signed him?
Bruce was also 27 year old playing for some midtable team or team that punched above it's weight when ManUtd signed him.
VDS was 35 year old playing for Fulham,
Irwin was 25 year old playing in second division,
31 year old Sheringham who was playing for team that finished 10th in PL,
Saha was 25-26 and was playing for Fulham that finished 13 and 14th
25 year old Vidic playing in Russian league
We signed Berbatov when he was 27 and from that team that finished 11th in the league.
Ashley young when he was 26-27 and from that team that finished 9th.


Bold part is your problem. Games are not won on the paper.
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RVP was 29
 
roonster09 said:
How does it matter if they were the best player for 14th placed team or team that played in second division?

PL wasn't strong in 90s and we signed plenty of players from midtable and lower table teams. It might be underwhelming name but I would rather sign players who manager thinks can bring balance to the team than players who can't.
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We are clearly not gonna agree on this so better leave it here. If we sign then it's moot anyway. He'll be one of us and we'll all back him to be a big success.
 
cheeky_backheel said:
I will humor you........

Suarez was a top talent before he joined Liverpool. Suarez moved to Liverpool at 24 from an Ajax team where is was the best and most talented player, having scored 81 goals in 110 games (35 goal in 33 league games in his previous full season). He was top scorer in the league and won dutch footballer of the year in same season. In his seasons with Ajax, they finished 3rd and second.
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But at 24, he was still playing in Dutch league, so he must be shit footballer?
 
devilish said:
Perisic is a proven international who scored goals against the likes of Spain, Roma, Juventus etc. His stats are quite positive - 42 games, 11 goals and 12 assists.

I've yet to see Young dribble past two players.
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Because Young was never gonna be that good for us, pretty much like how I feel Perisic will be. But if you think he is good then fair enough.
 
roonster09 said:
But at 24, he was still playing in Dutch league, so he must be shit footballer?
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If a teenager is the highest goal scorer in the championship, then he is worth a second look, but if a 28yr old did same then its nothing to boast about.

Perisic is 28. playing for midtable club in a lesser league and hasnt achieved anything of note!
 
King7Eric said:
Because Young was never gonna be that good for us, pretty much like how I feel Perisic will be. But if you think he is good then fair enough.
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I am not a big fan of Perisic myself but the gap between the two is so big that we should even care to debate it.
 
cheeky_backheel said:
If a teenager is the highest goal scorer in the championship, then he is worth a second look, but if a 28yr old did same then its nothing to boast about.

Perisic is 28. playing for midtable club in a lesser league and hasnt achieved anything of note!
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Willian and Fernandinho were 26 or 27 when they were signed from Ukranian clubs, like I said you can't rate players based on where they play. Imagine Madrid saying what a shit GK De Gea is, playing for a team that finished in 6th, 5th, 4th, 7th position in the last few years in third best league.

Check where Mandzukic, Dante played before signing for Bayern, they weren't even young players when Bayern signed them.
 
Devil may care said:
The guy on The United Stand mentioned it, it's from here - http://www.fcinter1908.it/ultimora/...-e-una-priorita-per-lo-united-a-quelle-cifre/
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Full translation:

"The news was circulated by the same people, perisic's entourage wants to put pressure on inter now that they don't even have a coach. I don't see him as a priority for United or Chelsea, especially not for those fees, €50-60M. I think he's the second or third option for united, not a priority."
 
Unlike City, we don't have unlimited amount of cash to splash around for the best in each position we needed in one go. Griezmann(100m), LB(40m+), CM(40-50m), CB(30m+), striker(50-60m) and him(40m?).

His goals and assists per min ratio is pretty good. A lot better than all our wide players.
 
Perisic is a very good player, probably one of the only 2-3 that managed to have a good season despite playing in the worst managed club in Italy. He was paid 15-18 mln Euro if I am not wrong.
I think it is one of the best wide options available on the market for a 433 or 4231 formation and up to 30-35 mln is probably still a good deal especially by MU standards and the amount of money you generally spend. At 29 he is at his peak and will probably have at least 3-4 very good years ahead of him. As I said in an earlier post I would not bother buying him if you decide to play 352 though
 
Is this a done deal?

I'm already seeing Perisic welcome to United videos popping up. :confused:
 
roonster09 said:
Why only attacking player? Where was Schmeichel playing when we signed him?
Bruce was also 27 year old playing for some midtable team or team that punched above it's weight when ManUtd signed him.
VDS was 35 year old playing for Fulham,
Irwin was 25 year old playing in second division,
31 year old Sheringham who was playing for team that finished 10th in PL,
Saha was 25-26 and was playing for Fulham that finished 13 and 14th
25 year old Vidic playing in Russian league
We signed Berbatov when he was 27 and from that team that finished 11th in the league.
Ashley young when he was 26-27 and from that team that finished 9th.


Bold part is your problem. Games are not won on the paper.
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Well said. Plus landing Perisic would bring in valuable experience to the side if Rooney does leave.
 
roonster09 said:
Willian and Fernandinho were 26 or 27 when they were signed from Ukranian clubs, like I said you can't rate players based on where they play. Imagine Madrid saying what a shit GK De Gea is, playing for a team that finished in 6th, 5th, 4th, 7th position in the last few years in third best league.

Check where Mandzukic, Dante played before signing for Bayern, they weren't even young players when Bayern signed them.
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Nobody is rating players purely on where they played, but if you look at Perisic's career over all the clubs he has played with, everything point to him being an average player.

An attacking player hits his prime window around 27yrs. Most talented players would be playing for a top team by then. In the case of Perisic, until our recent links to him, no other club seem to have recognize whatever hidden talent that Mou seems so appreciative of. Perisic is an average player at 28 and there is nothing to suggest otherwise.

If Perisic is an average player, should we then be spending 35m on him when our current squad lack quality and talent to compete with the top teams. Of course, if we are buying him for 20-25m, then its a different discussion. For comparison, one can see the quality and age of players Man City have signed or are linked with.

Its not about wanting to sign only superstars but that the team needs quality addition before role players. if we are paying 35m, we should be able to get a younger and/or better quality player, and even if we are getting Perisic, we should be able to get him for less than the rumored 35m.. Average players are sby definition more abundant.
 
giorno said:
"The news was circulated by the same people, perisic's entourage wants to put pressure on inter now that they don't even have a coach. I don't see him as a priority for United or Chelsea, especially not for those fees, €50-60M. I think he's the second or third option for united, not a priority."
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I've seen a lot of similar statements over the last couple of days. Assuming they are true then I wonder who the #1 or #2 target would be. A hard working, quick, left winger makes me dream of Sanchez but I'm sure there are tons of others who fit that profile. Has Willian ever played on the left?
 
cheeky_backheel said:
Nobody is rating players purely on where they played, but if you look at Perisic's career over all the clubs he has played with, everything point to him being an average player.
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So you are looking at the clubs he played to conclude he is average player.

An attacking player hits his prime window around 27yrs. Most talented players would be playing for a top team by then. In the case of Perisic, until our recent links to him, no other club seem to have recognize whatever hidden talent that Mou seems so appreciative of. Perisic is an average player at 28 and there is nothing to suggest otherwise.

If Perisic is an average player, should we then be spending 35m on him when our current squad lack quality and talent to compete with the top teams. Of course, if we are buying him for 20-25m, then its a different discussion. For comparison, one can see the quality and age of players Man City have signed or are linked with.

Its not about wanting to sign only superstars but that the team needs quality addition before role players. if we are paying 35m, we should be able to get a younger and/or better quality player, and even if we are getting Perisic, we should be able to get him for less than the rumored 35m.. Average players are sby definition more abundant.
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I have given plenty of examples where players played for smaller clubs in their mid 20s, you just ignored it. Just look at Mandzukic career, he was playing for average clubs till he was 26-27, then played for Bayern, Atletico and Juventus. He isn't star player at Juventus and wasn't at Atletico and Bayern but he was integral part of the team.

Obviously we can get more talented player than Perisic but Perisic isn't bad player at all. He brings something to the table that Jose likes.

Btw if ManUtd sign Perisic then in his peak years he will be playing for top club. Your whole argument falls flat the day after he is signed for ManUtd or Chelsea.
 
roonster09 said:
So you are looking at the clubs he played to conclude he is average player.
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No, you look at the clubs he has played and the level he has performed at said clubs. He moved from Dortmund>Wolfsburg>Inter, each a lower club than the previous or do you think the rest of the football world is blind?

I have given plenty of examples where players played for smaller clubs in their mid 20s, you just ignored it. Just look at Mandzukic career, he was playing for average clubs till he was 26-27, then played for Bayern, Atletico and Juventus. He isn't star player at Juventus and wasn't at Atletico and Bayern but he was integral part of the team.
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Before Bayern, he was at Wolfsburg. Going to Bayern at 26 was a step up and since then he has been playing at top clubs in Atletico and Juve
Obviously we can get more talented player than Perisic but Perisic isn't bad player at all. He brings something to the table that Jose likes.
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What he will bring is yet to be seen, but the more important question is that is it worth the price and opportunity cost for getting him and not a younger or more talented player. I dont think we can afford the luxury of signing a Quaresma.
Btw if ManUtd sign Perisic then in his peak years he will be playing for top club. Your whole argument falls flat the day after he is signed for ManUtd or Chelsea.
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No it wont, cos at 28 he was playing for Inter not Utd. Quality players are usually signed by top clubs by the time they are 27. Perisic will be 29 next season and for a winger that relies on pace, is soon on the downside of his career
 
cheeky_backheel said:
No, you look at the clubs he has played and the level he has performed at said clubs. He moved from Dortmund>Wolfsburg>Inter, each a lower club than the previous or do you think the rest of the football world is blind?

Before Bayern, he was at Wolfsburg. Going to Bayern at 26 was a step up and since then he has been playing at top clubs in Atletico and Juve
What he will bring is yet to be seen, but the more important question is that is it worth the price and opportunity cost for getting him and not a younger or more talented player. I dont think we can afford the luxury of signing a Quaresma.
No it wont, cos at 28 he was playing for Inter not Utd. Quality players are usually signed by top clubs by the time they are 27. Perisic will be 29 next season and for a winger that relies on pace, is soon on the downside of his career
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From Inter>ManUtd is a step up. So his career trajectory will change.

But Mandzukic, at 26 he was still playing for average team, so he wasn't good enough going by your logic.

So what Perisic brings to the table is yet to be seen but you already think it's not worth the price, how does that work? Quaresham? FFS, Quaresham is your typical talented player you keep on talking about.

So quality players are signed by the time they are 27 :lol: Where is this rule book? I must have missed it. How do you know 28 is Perisic's peak year? Do you think real life works exactly like FM where from 29 physical attributes started going down? FYI, he will be 28 next season and for more than half of the season.

Btw Juventus signed Barzagli when he was 30 and he was quality for them.
Lichtsteiner when he was 27

Red Cafe's wet dream Nainggolan was playing for mid table team in Serie A when he was 26.
Matic was playnig in Portuguese league at 26
Diego Costa was playing in Ukrain league at 25

Btw you should check Diego Milito and how his career turned around when he was signed by Inter when he was 30, won them treble.

Also Motta who was signed by Inter when he was 26-27, his career went from Barca to Atletico to Genoa. Inter picked him from Genoa, won treble and sold him to PSG.
 
If Jose thinks he is good enough, I would be very comfortable with this signing.
 
I don't think we're seriously in for him. If we were that would all over the news here.
It was only mentioned as a side note.
 
Ban said:
I don't think we're seriously in for him. If we were that would all over the news here.
It was only mentioned as a side note.
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Oh no, wasted so many posts in this thread.
 
Marcus said:
Look at who he signed and how they have done for United.
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Mkhitaryan hasn't been that good. Every manager would sign Ibra and Pogba given the chance. Bailly is a good signing, I'll give him credit for that.

Many of his signings at Chelsea failed so I don't necessarily trust him
 
roonster09 said:
From Inter>ManUtd is a step up. So his career trajectory will change.

But Mandzukic, at 26 he was still playing for average team, so he wasn't good enough going by your logic.

So what Perisic brings to the table is yet to be seen but you already think it's not worth the price, how does that work? Quaresham? FFS, Quaresham is your typical talented player you keep on talking about.

So quality players are signed by the time they are 27 :lol: Where is this rule book? I must have missed it. How do you know 28 is Perisic's peak year? Do you think real life works exactly like FM where from 29 physical attributes started going down? FYI, he will be 28 next season and for more than half of the season.

Btw Juventus signed Barzagli when he was 30 and he was quality for them.
Lichtsteiner when he was 27

Red Cafe's wet dream Nainggolan was playing for mid table team in Serie A when he was 26.
Matic was playnig in Portuguese league at 26
Diego Costa was playing in Ukrain league at 25

Btw you should check Diego Milito and how his career turned around when he was signed by Inter when he was 30, won them treble.

Also Motta who was signed by Inter when he was 26-27, his career went from Barca to Atletico to Genoa. Inter picked him from Genoa, won treble and sold him to PSG.
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All the attacking players you listed, except Milito, moved to top clubs at a younger age than Perisic currently is, so I dont see what your point is. As for Milito, Inter got him on the cheap for €13m + 2 players that were never going to make it at Inter, and not the kind of number rumored for Perisic. Motta ended up at Genoa cos of injury problems not playing ability.

Quaresma had failed to live up to expectation but Mourinho insisted on signing him (costing more than Sneijder). When he failed as was predicted by many, Mourinho said the player disappointed him, but then what did he expect from quaresma in the first place

I really dont get what you are trying to prove. Are you saying Perisic is a great player and/or that we should pay whatever inter is demanding simply cos Mourinho supposedly wants him?
 
cheeky_backheel said:
All the attacking players you listed, except Milito, moved to top clubs at a younger age than Perisic currently is, so I dont see what your point is. As for Milito, Inter got him on the cheap for €13m + 2 players that were never going to make it at Inter, and not the kind of number rumored for Perisic. Motta ended up at Genoa cos of injury problems not playing ability.

Quaresma had failed to live up to expectation but Mourinho insisted on signing him (costing more than Sneijder). When he failed as was predicted by many, Mourinho said the player disappointed him, but then what did he expect from quaresma in the first place

I really dont get what you are trying to prove. Are you saying Perisic is a great player and/or that we should pay whatever inter is demanding simply cos Mourinho supposedly wants him?
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So Milito was a quality player not playing at top club when he was 27, your initial point. If going by your logic, Inter shouldn't have signed him.

Motta moved from Barca to Atletico, significant drop in level, then to Genoa, even more drop. Then there are players like Dante who moved to Bayern when they were 28.

All the players might have moved at younger age than Perisic but still they played for average clubs when they were in mid 20s, using your logic they are always average players and not good enough.

Quareshma transfer sort of proves my point, it's not just about talent. You need players who work hard, something Quareshma never did at Inter, something perisic has in abundance.

My point is simple, Perisic isn't great player but good enough player to play for ManUtd. He is a winger something we don't have. Is he worth the money? Who cares, that's for money men to deal along with manager. If Woodward thinks it won't have any impact on other transfers then he will pay, otherwise he will tell Inter to do one.
 
Is it possible that Perisic has.. perhaps improved?

He wasn't a bad player at Dortmund either, but players often mature and get better. He might not be a Neymar or Bale but sometimes you need a few Chiefs and Indians.
 
Arthur Friedenreich said:
It will be decided today...imagine the meltdown here is the ban is not lifted, Atletico can't sign players and refuse to sell Griezmann:lol:
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They can't really refuse though. The problem would be if he decides on his own to stay not to cause them headaches because of him leaving with no replacement. Which is very likely.
 
roonster09 said:
So Milito was a quality player not playing at top club when he was 27, your initial point. If going by your logic, Inter shouldn't have signed him.

Motta moved from Barca to Atletico, significant drop in level, then to Genoa, even more drop. Then there are players like Dante who moved to Bayern when they were 28.

All the players might have moved at younger age than Perisic but still they played for average clubs when they were in mid 20s, using your logic they are always average players and not good enough.

Quareshma transfer sort of proves my point, it's not just about talent. You need players who work hard, something Quareshma never did at Inter, something perisic has in abundance.

My point is simple, Perisic isn't great player but good enough player to play for ManUtd. He is a winger something we don't have. Is he worth the money? Who cares, that's for money men to deal along with manager. If Woodward thinks it won't have any impact on other transfers then he will pay, otherwise he will tell Inter to do one.
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Milito wanted to return to Genoa when Zaragoza was relegated even though he had interests from Valencia and Spurs. Motta was so often injured that he signed only a 1yr deal with Atletico. Dante was never a top quality player.

Quaresma is an example of Mou wanting a player which history predicted was more likely to fail than succeed at Inter. Yet he got him at a steep price.

The problem is that Perisic is still playing at an average club at 28, so why do you compare him to players that have moved to a top club at a younger age? He is at an average club and he is not setting the world on fire.

It matters if Perisic is worth the money or not, otherwise we can pay 100m to buy every average player that is good enough to play for United. If was coming for less or even free then there is less of an issue.

It is even worse if you dont care about money, because shouldnt we then get the better players if money is not a concern e.g. we can just buyout Carrasco for 100m. Carrasco is 23 and already a better player than Perisic.

We are only getting 4-6 players in a transfer window, and we have to make them count so that we can be competitive next season. The team lacks quality players but have abundance of average ones, so we cannot afford to add more mediocre players before addressing the lack of quality. Players like Perisic are what you add to fill in the holes of a team with an established core.
 
Adam-Utd said:
Is it possible that Perisic has.. perhaps improved?

He wasn't a bad player at Dortmund either, but players often mature and get better. He might not be a Neymar or Bale but sometimes you need a few Chiefs and Indians.
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He wasn't stellar in 2015/16 and wasn't good enough for Dortmund. Not sure how one good season, makes him good enough for us, let alone pay the money that is being rumoured.
 
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