Israeli - Palestinian Conflict

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20552391

Israel has authorised the construction of 3,000 more housing units in occupied East Jerusalem and the West Bank, according to Israeli officials.

It is also speeding up the processing of 1,000 planning permissions

As I said Israel is not interested in a two state solution. It doesn't need to be. It's strategy has worked. It's only issue is what to do with the millions of Palestinians.
 
Revan said:
What's your opinion about the newest authorisation of Israel to build another 3000 houses?
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They would have been built anyway, but they have probably accelerated them and publicised it in order to test the UN's balls, and to frustrate the Palestinians further.

The Palestinians with make a complaint through the UN given their new non member status, and it will be ignored like always.

It's good politics, but that doesn't make it any less cnutish.
 
Drainy said:
They would have been built anyway, but they have probably accelerated them and publicised it in order to test the UN's balls, and to frustrate the Palestinians further.

The Palestinians with make a complaint through the UN given their new non member status, and it will be ignored like always.

It's good politics, but that doesn't make it any less cnutish.
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Yeah yeah, I understand it. I was asking for holyland personal view on it, unlike that Israeli poster who was banned, holyland is much more constructive so just asking if he likes it.
 
Fearless wasn't even Israeli, just a batshit crazy gimp from London with openly racist views. HR and Amir are the resident caf Israelis I know of (theres also SANF and Ihabx7 but they seldom frequent the CE forum)
 
Kaos said:
Fearless wasn't even Israeli, just a batshit crazy gimp from London with openly racist views. HR and Amir are the resident caf Israelis I know of (theres also SANF and Ihabx7 but they seldom frequent the CE forum)
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Really? I thought that he was a racist right wing Israeli.

HR and Amir are pretty objective and contructive.
 
He was certainly right-wing, but he was also definitely a Londoner. I think he might have had some family in Israel but thats all I know really.
 
It was only a temp ban. Of course if he had your multiple pages of infractions it could've easily been a perm.
 
Kaos said:
Fearless wasn't even Israeli, just a batshit crazy gimp from London with openly racist views. HR and Amir are the resident caf Israelis I know of (theres also SANF and Ihabx7 but they seldom frequent the CE forum)
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Where's Cremboman thesedays? Good poster from what I can recall.
 
Revan said:
What's your opinion about the newest authorisation of Israel to build another 3000 houses?
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tit-for-tat, with neither step being a significant enough step to make any real difference.

Abbas preferred going to the UN to get less than Olmert had offered him in the past. This will not help the Palestinian cause at all, and I'd expect their European supporters to understand this. Oh well...

On the other hand, the new construction is going to be in areas that all sensible parties on both sides understand will remain under Israeli control. There are not new settlements that will change future maps. As I've argued before, if a will for true peace exists territory exchange should be the easy part in reaching an agreement. If it doesn't then the settlements are hardly a stumbling block, are they?
 
holyland red said:
tit-for-tat, with neither step being a significant enough step to make any real difference.

Abbas preferred going to the UN to get less than Olmert had offered him in the past. This will not help the Palestinian cause at all, and I'd expect their European supporters to understand this. Oh well...
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Hasn't Olmert said that there's no reason to oppose the UN resolution?

and also how is it tit-for-tat? one side goes through a legal process to gain international recognition.. the other builds on land they don't own in violation of international law
 
it's all fecked up as usual. tit for tat.
those homes were going to be built anyway, the israelis were just waiting for a good time to announce it.
 
Drainy said:
Hasn't Olmert said that there's no reason to oppose the UN resolution?
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He has. In a democracy he has a right to express his opinion. Most Israelis are alarmed that Abbas chose the UN after rejecting Olmert's proposal though, and soon they'll express their opinion too.

Drainy said:
and also how is it tit-for-tat? one side goes through a legal process to gain international recognition.. the other builds on land they don't own in violation of international law
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The Oslo agreements clearly stated that any progress towards peace would be based on bilateral agreements and not unilateral measures. The latter work both ways.
 
McLovin said:
The answer is yes. Microscopic US bitches.
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Not exactly.

The 41 nations that abstained are: Albania, Andorra, Australia, Bahamas, Barbados, Bosnia/Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Cameroon, Colombia, Croatia, Dem. Rep. of Congo, Estonia, Fiji, Germany, Guatemala, Haiti, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Malawi, Monaco, Mongolia, Montenegro, Netherlands, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Poland, Korea, Moldova, Romania, Rwanda, Samoa, San Marino, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Togo, Tonga, United Kingdom, Vanuatu.

Some yes but not most of them.
 
Revan said:
Not exactly.

The 41 nations that abstained are: Albania, Andorra, Australia, Bahamas, Barbados, Bosnia/Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Cameroon, Colombia, Croatia, Dem. Rep. of Congo, Estonia, Fiji, Germany, Guatemala, Haiti, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Malawi, Monaco, Mongolia, Montenegro, Netherlands, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Poland, Korea, Moldova, Romania, Rwanda, Samoa, San Marino, Singapore, Slovakia, Slovenia, Macedonia, Togo, Tonga, United Kingdom, Vanuatu.

Some yes but not most of them.
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http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/s...stars-declaring-support-for-palestine?cc=5739
 
holyland red said:
He plays in China, doesn't he?
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i went back through the thread to see your response to my query about if caf israelis/jews think those that went to the US made a better choice than zionists who moved to israel.

Was not expecting you to say 'yes' to that.

just curious, how long ago/where did your family come from before israel? Or were they in the levant for hundreds of years?
 
Neutral said:
Hope the Palestinians are happy with their 'win' because Israel just declared it'll put up 3000 new homes in occupied east Jerusalem & the WB

Some win :lol:
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Did you mean to come across so insufferably in that post?
 
VoetbalWizard said:
i went back through the thread to see your response to my query about if caf israelis/jews think those that went to the US made a better choice than zionists who moved to israel.

Was not expecting you to say 'yes' to that.

just curious, how long ago/where did your family come from before israel? Or were they in the levant for hundreds of years?
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My grandparents came here in the 1930's.
 
Israel to withhold tax revenues from Palestinian Authority


Israel said today it was withholding this month's transfer of tax revenues to the Palestinian Authority, after the United Nations' de facto recognition of a Palestinian state.

Under interim peace deals, which Israel says the Palestinians violated by unilaterally seeking an upgrade of their status at the United Nations, it collects about $100m a month in duties on behalf of the authority.
But, Israeli officials said, the authority owes about $200m to the Israel Electric Corporation, and that money will now be deducted from the tax transfers.

The cash-strapped authority, which exercises limited self-rule in the occupied West Bank, largely depends on the tax money to pay civil servants' salaries.
Yasser Abed Rabbo, a senior Palestinian official, said Israel was guilty of "piracy and theft" by refusing to hand over the funds.

Israel has previously frozen payments to the body during times of heightened security and diplomatic tensions, provoking strong international criticism, such as when the UN cultural body UNESCO granted the Palestinians full membership a year ago.

"I do not intend this month to transfer the funds to the Palestinians. In the coming period I intend to use the money to deduct debts the Palestinian Authority owes to the Israel Electric Corporation and other bodies," Finance Minister Yuval Steinitz said on Israel Radio.

The UN victory for the Palestinians was a diplomatic setback for the United States and Israel, which were joined by only a handful of countries in voting against upgrading the Palestinians' observer status at the UN to "non-member state", like the Vatican, from "entity".

Hours after the UN vote, Israel said it was authorising 3,000 new settler homes in the West Bank and East Jerusalem and expediting planning work for thousands more dwellings in a geographically sensitive area close to Jerusalem, which critics said would kill off Palestinian hopes of a viable state.
The United States said the expansion plan, which also drew strong European criticism, was counterproductive to the resumption of Israeli-Palestinian peace talks frozen since 2010.
 
PJ said:
Did you mean to come across so insufferably in that post?
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:lol: :(

No, I'm just really disappointed with the Palestinians pushing through with the vote. I think we can all agree long term, this does NOTHING. It is window dressing, and I find it to be counter-productive.

The Israeli response was oh so predictable too...so this really was a case of the Palestinians 'cutting off the nose to spite the face'...

I have divided loyalties when it comes to this issue and have seen the suffering of both sides 1st hand.

Most of my 'sarcasm' is simply my way of expressing my anger with the whole process without getting banned.
 
Neutral said:
:lol: :(

No, I'm just really disappointed with the Palestinians pushing through with the vote. I think we can all agree long term, this does NOTHING. It is window dressing, and I find it to be counter-productive.

The Israeli response was oh so predictable too...so this really was a case of the Palestinians 'cutting off the nose to spite the face'...

I have divided loyalties when it comes to this issue and have seen the suffering of both sides 1st hand.

Most of my 'sarcasm' is simply my way of expressing my anger with the whole process without getting banned.
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Why are you disappointed with them pursuing the UN avenue? Do you genuinely think the best way they can achieve just statehood is by bi-lateral agreements?
 
Kaos said:
Why are you disappointed with them pursuing the UN avenue? Do you genuinely think the best way they can achieve just statehood is by bi-lateral agreements?
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That's actually an excellent way to not resolve anything given that there can be no solution without Israel's participation in it.
 
^what he said. Whether we like it or not, there is no viable Palestinian state unless Israel agrees to it(that might not sound fair, but it is the reality) so doing something that resembles a symbolic win short term, but does more harm on the long term, seems stupid to me.

Of course you can point out 1001 things Israel has done unilaterally or that most would deem counter productive to the peace process...but who has time on their side here? Which side gets stronger after every 'incident'?
 
Except that bi-lateral agreements have proved futile at best.

What makes you so sure Netanyahu is actually interested in peace?
 
Kaos said:
Except that bi-lateral agreements have proved futile at best.

What makes you so sure Netanyahu is actually interested in peace?
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The Israelis are incentivized to seek an agreement if their security dilemma is satisfied. As are the Palestinian for that matter, but the fact that they are politically fractured into moderate and extreme wings is what is stalling the process from moving forward. The greater the chances of the Palestinian side speaking from a unified, moderate voice, the more the Israelis will be incentivized to approach the issue from a moderate position, as there will be more international pressure (as well as from the US) to resolve differences through negotiations.
 
Kaos said:
Except that bi-lateral agreements have proved futile at best.

What makes you so sure Netanyahu is actually interested in peace?
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Easier to blame it on that "Netanyahu", isn't it? The Palestinians never gave up on terror or expressed willingness to recognize a Jewish Israel, be it under Rabin, Peres, Netanyahu, Barak, Olmert or Netanyahu again.

The bi-lateral agreements have proved to be futile because so far the Palestinians haven't been asked to give anything back. The thing with a final agreement is that you have to hand something back. That's where the Palestinians have trouble, which explains why they went to the UN. Independence could have been reached bilaterally (at a cost), but by handing a free-of-charge slice of the cake the international community made sure Abbas enjoys his last term without giving up on his people's "historic rights".

Then come construction of homes, cutting olive trees, barrage of rockets, checkpoints, demonstrations outside embassies and threads on the caf.
 
Neutral said:
:lol: :(

No, I'm just really disappointed with the Palestinians pushing through with the vote. I think we can all agree long term, this does NOTHING. It is window dressing, and I find it to be counter-productive.

The Israeli response was oh so predictable too...so this really was a case of the Palestinians 'cutting off the nose to spite the face'...

I have divided loyalties when it comes to this issue and have seen the suffering of both sides 1st hand.

Most of my 'sarcasm' is simply my way of expressing my anger with the whole process without getting banned.
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would you say the suffering of both sides is equivalent?
 
Raoul said:
That's actually an excellent way to not resolve anything given that there can be no solution without Israel's participation in it.
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Israel has been taking Unilateral actions in building settlements and it's working.

Anyone who thinks there will be a two state solution is deluded or simply echoing rhetoric.

The only solution is where the Palestinians can go and live.
 
holyland red said:
Easier to blame it on that "Netanyahu", isn't it? The Palestinians never gave up on terror or expressed willingness to recognize a Jewish Israel, be it under Rabin, Peres, Netanyahu, Barak, Olmert or Netanyahu again.

The bi-lateral agreements have proved to be futile because so far the Palestinians haven't been asked to give anything back. The thing with a final agreement is that you have to hand something back. That's where the Palestinians have trouble, which explains why they went to the UN. Independence could have been reached bilaterally (at a cost), but by handing a free-of-charge slice of the cake the international community made sure Abbas enjoys his last term without giving up on his people's "historic rights".

Then come construction of homes, cutting olive trees, barrage of rockets, checkpoints, demonstrations outside embassies and threads on the caf.
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What exactly do you expect them to give back?
 
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