Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

Worth reminding people -
After those attacks, the Biden administration called for open "humanitarian corridors" for Palestinians to leave for Egypt's Sinai Desert, while insisting that it did not want a permanent expulsion.

"We believe that people should be able to stay in Gaza, their home," then–Secretary of State Antony Blinken told reporters on October 15, 2023. "But we also want to make sure that they're out of harm's way and that they're getting the assistance they need."

Blinken's suggestion may have come with a serious financial offer behind closed doors. On October 14, 2023, The Economist alluded to diplomatic discussions about paying off Egypt's debt in exchange for taking in refugees. That following day, the independent Egyptian news outlet Mada Masr reported that Egypt was "coming under pressure from western countries who are also offering economic incentives in an effort to come to a deal" over Palestinian refugees.

Josh Paul, a former State Department official who resigned in protest of Biden's approach to Gaza, says that Trump's approach "remains an outsourcing of U.S. policy to [Israeli Prime Minister] Benjamin Netanyahu." Netanyahu's goal, Paul adds, is to empty out Gaza, whether "through killing, forced deportations, or simply making it unlivable and then creating an exit route for those who are in urgent need."

https://reason.com/2025/01/27/trump-revives-bidens-failed-proposal-to-remove-palestinians-from-gaza/

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Trump is openly touting the US illegally occupying Gaza along with ethnic cleansing, and you want to waste your time talking about Harris.

literally the post i was replying to
Stunning that there were "Pro Palestinian" people on here would would argue all day that Trump and Biden/Harris were two sides of the same coin.
 
From the 1937 Peel Commission recommendations, the first internationally-sanctioned proposal for population ‘transfer’ as an appropriate solution to the problem of Jewish-Arab violence in Palestine:

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Stunning that you still want to make the argument that Trump and Harris are practically the same after yesterday's press conference.

What are you trying to do here? It's so nakedly transparent that you have to know people see through your act, so what's the point? Here is what you've done so far:

1. Start off with comparing Trump to Biden and Harris.
2. When people respond to you, ignore their points, say that focusing on other people than Trump right now doesn't make sense.
3. When it's pointed out that you're the one who started the comparisons, pivot to a stupid oneliner while pretending that earlier comments don't exist.

You are, obviously, suddenly ok with comparisons again. So, what someone who isn't like you would do is to go back and respond properly to the comments you ignored while you pretended comparisons were irrelevant.

You're the most empty shell of a poster I have ever seen, it's quite incredible.
 
forget doing anything as vp or potential prez. kamala couldn't even fecking pander. not just evil. deeply evil. but fecking incompetent. political malpractice.





 
Stunning that you still want to make the argument that Trump and Harris are practically the same after yesterday's press conference.
you don’t give two shits about palestine or stopping the ongoing genocide. let’s not kid ourselves here. you’re just pissed she lost and struggling to cope with it.
 
What are you trying to do here? It's so nakedly transparent that you have to know people see through your act, so what's the point? Here is what you've done so far:

1. Start off with comparing Trump to Biden and Harris.
2. When people respond to you, ignore their points, say that focusing on other people than Trump right now doesn't make sense.
3. When it's pointed out that you're the one who started the comparisons, pivot to a stupid oneliner while pretending that earlier comments don't exist.

You are, obviously, suddenly ok with comparisons again. So, what someone who isn't like you would do is to go back and respond properly to the comments you ignored while you pretended comparisons were irrelevant.

You're the most empty shell of a poster I have ever seen, it's quite incredible.

1. No one is talking to you.
2. If you want to talk about "ignoring points" there were equally as many that i made that were ignored by the other poster.
 
Many got what they wished for. Trump is in office and his stated policy is for the US to "own Gaza".

Not allowed to discuss that though because Harris did not allow some pro Palestinian protesters into the DNC.

Because the two things are basically the same.

From October 7th 2023 until the end of Joe Biden's reign, USA has actively participated in Israel's genocide of Gaza. Kamala Harris was on team Biden. So, what exactly are you trying to tell us?
 
Many got what they wished for. Trump is in office and his stated policy is for the US to "own Gaza".

Not allowed to discuss that though because Harris did not allow some pro Palestinian protesters into the DNC.

Because the two things are basically the same.

This is what gaffs refers to by "Not allowed to discuss that though because Harris did not allow some pro Palestinian protesters into the DNC.":

What part of this was she lying about, and what would be material to the outcome in Palestine?
- Continue weapons supplies during a genocide
- Continue a failed ceasefire negotiation strategy which yielded no results for 14 months
- Continue a decades-long failed process towards a half-state with no rights (the mythical "two-state solution")

Why hasn't she explained - even for purely cynical reasons - after her defeat, what miracle she would have brought about? Can you explain why the same strategy would have yielded a different outcome when she executed it instead of Biden? Can you explain what incentive Bibi had to end the slaughter when there was continuing support from the US government and Israeli people? Can you explain why she sent the most pro-Israeli representative, Ritchie Torres to Michigan? Can you explain why she sent Bill Clinton to assert Israel's Biblical legitimacy to the Holy Land when campaigning in Michigan? Can you explain why she refused to allow a Palestinian supporter of hers at the DNC? Do you think these are the actions of a woman who thinks pro-Palestinian votes matter?

Trump seems about ready to eliminate my job. Almost certainly he will affect my life directly more than yours. I'm able to see past myself though. You should try it. It's a pretty fundamental part of being human.

Once again - the Biden/Harris strategy FAILED. Of course, the pertinent question is if the ceasefire strategy failed or it was a sham, given that every lay person, even my relative who watches only Morning Joe, could see that Bibi was stringing them along for his personal benefit. We had dozens of resignations from within State and other departments saying how the administration was lying about its own role, about its own compliance with US law, and about the Israeli role in the conflict and in negotiations.
60000+ people died with American weapons supplied by the Biden administration. (The numbers Trump cites for his ethnic cleansing seem to suggest that upto 400000 people might be dead btw).

And I'm sorry - among the many actions and inactions related to Palestine during her brief campaign, refusing to meet with Bibi once pales in comparison to explicitly backing the failed negotiation strategy, and arms shipments, and very explicitly and clearly opposing ANY leverage she might have used during negotiations as president. I notice you didn't mention any of these in your reply. I'm applying Occam's Razor here - something that has failed before will fail again. And there's no logic or evidence that there was going to be a change in strategy or that it was going to produce different results.

In the same way, negotiations for a "two-state solution" have been going on since before I was born. Israel benefits from the status quo, Israel benefits from a complete cleansing, but Israel loses if there is any increase in Palestinian autonomy. Why would Israel negotiate away the gains they have made over seven decades, if no US administration since George HW Bush has been willing to use its leverage over them? Quite simply, they won't! And haven't!
Now, I'm going to suggest a possible second reason why Biden and Harris would talk about the two state solution. The highest foreign policy priority of the Biden administration was Israel-Saudi normalisation. This has been confirmed in dozens of reports about Brett McGurk and Jake Sullivan, who ran Israel policy from the White House. The Saudis have made it clear that it is publicly humiliating for them to make a deal with Israel if Palestine continues to not exist. I am going to be bold and suggest that the two-state solution rhetoric is lip service from an administration that aided Palestinian genocide and prioritised Saudi normalisation.

I see that you haven't defended her use of "it's Judea and Samaria" Bill, or the lack of a Palestinian speaker at the DNC. About Ritchie - if you send a murderous bigot like him, you might alienate the community he's bigoted against. A very basic and important part of politics is managing and prioritising bits of your coalition that might be in conflict with each other. She made a clear choice with her actions including sending Ritchie to the one state where everyone knew Arab voters had a decisive proportion.

Please look at how Trump built his odious, winning, coalition. He went to the Libertarian Party conference, got booed, asked for their vote. He went to RFK Jr, looked weak and desparate, made him promises, asked for his backing, and it likely proved decisive, given the margins involved and his polling support. He went to Dearborn, found the highest-level sucker who would fall for his schtick, and had a mayor and an imam at his rally. He went to his old friend Adelson, made some dark promise, and got a hundred million dollars from her. He humiliated and debased himself, he lied and he spoke vague half-truths, and he won. That is politics. Kamala spoke her lies and half-truths in an even less convincing way, she and her party prefer to humiliate rather than court third-party voters. Going out to your voters - all potential voters - and telling them what they want to hear.


Finally, sure, I magically obtained US citizenship and voted for the guy who was promising to fire and/or deport me because I thought his genocide would be better than the existing genocide.

I'll leave you with these - DNC delegates hearing the names of dead Palestinians, and the most prominent national Democrat this week:
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Feb 2 2025: House Dem leader Hakeem Jeffries: “Sinwar is gone. Sinwar is gone. And Hamas is on the run... and Iran is at one of its weakest points in decades. “We can't take our foot off the gas pedal until Iran is brought to its knees — for the good of the world.“


ps - that candidate lost 3 months ago, during which thousands of Palestinians died. Any moment since was a good moment to speak about the genocide she is complicit in. She has chosen not to.

Ignoring multiple points, mentioning a small one, and lying by pretending that anyone is favoring Trump over Harris because of this. I haven't seen such a combination of brazen lies and stupidity on Redcafe before.